Wolfman

I also prefer if the new C Class would have looked a bit less similar, but it neither diminishes the brand nor peoples opinion of the S-Class.
That whole conversation only seems to play out in the heads of a few people here

K-A

I disagree. Mercedes and the S Class are still in many ways status/braggart brands to portions of their clientele. You see people talk about the S in an empowering/emotional way, therefore a C Class looking exactly like it (or it looking exactly like a C Class, which is how I see it and how commoners will when C's outnumber S' 100-1) can be a real bummer. To me, the W221's move to try and appear more bespoke so as to compete closer with cars out of its price range (Bentley's/RR's of the time) has been kind of undone in an EXTERIOR way by the W222 who gets a lower priced Sedan looking literally identical to it.

It won't affect many, but it will some, in terms of perception.

My prediction: We revisit this thread in a few years when the W222 has lost much of its status/presence because it looks like a blown up C Class (or vice versa). We'll see I guess.

Tjdehya

I didn't claim to "know" anything. I was simply speculating on the obvious direction that Mercedes is going.
But anyway here you go http://www.caranddriver.com/news/201...-photos-news-2

Germancar1

A rear window doesn't prove anything, again guesswork 101. Until the next E shows up you don't know much, if anything about it.

M

Germancar1

Exactly. I agree. It isn't going to matter one bit. Only people worried about this are non buyers. People at this level will judge the S on its on and buy it. If they don't it won't be because Mercedes made another Mercedes look just like it.

I'm still trying to figure out how we measure a car's prestige or status and where these measurements are done. Looks like the only one harping about this has their mind made up. Defies all common sense to think that considering the S will have been out a year before the C. Just really dumb logic for those who don't know what prestige is.

M

LETO

C & S class customers are not cross shopping. S Class customers are not cross shopping with an E either.

So, the whole "mini S" takes away absolutely nothing from the S.

It's nice to have a C class with all the bells and whistles. Having the CLA & GLA before it's launch, the C is not entry level any more either

K-A

I think anyone who thinks this wouldn't potentially deter S buyers don't know many S buyers, or are themselves of a unique perspective being S buyers. The S is a status car to many, a functional tool to many others, and a little bit of both to many. To the first segment listed, this will be in an issue in the coming years when there are so many W205's on the road being leased for $200 a month that their S design has no interesting attributes about it anymore, based on complete commonality.

Having a cheaper car look identical to a much more expensive car will deter the presence and "specialness" of the more expensive one. It's just common logic. BMW and Audi have been getting criticized for this for eons.... but now M-B does it tenfold with the C/S copy/paste jobs and it's all good.... of course, lol.

Germancar1

Yet BMW and Audi are breaking sales records left and right. Whatever problem exists with their cars looking alike isn't turning up where it matters, in sales. Seems to me its all made up bull****. YAWN.

M

K-A

M-B is far more dependent on prestige. People speak about the "majestic" S Class in ways BMW drivers don't about the 7 Series.

Fact is, having a large-C Class look will diminish the desirability of the S aesthetic in due time. Yes, right now you'll deny that because both designs are so new we barely even have one on the streets. But give it 2-3+ years and the S' novelty will have worn down due to wearing an IDENTICAL exterior to a C, just blown up.

Germancar1

In your opinion, not a fact. Period.

People with common sense know that the S came out first, not the other way around.

Novelty wears off cars 2-3 years later anyway. Nothing stays new forever. Yet the car will still be selling just like the W221 did through its 7+ year run. All matterless bull**** you're talking. Period.


M

LovinMercedes

How would you know this? I wouldn't state opinions as facts.

Quadcammer

my opinion:

Most s-class buyers couldn't care less. They buy the car because its an S-class. They get out of their 221 lease, and go in to the 222 lease with nary a concern. Its the new s-class...its what you get...period. What the C-class looks like is a complete non-issue.

For those that enjoy the driving experience of a full size luxury sedan will buy the S-class because of how it drives.

Those ridiculous people that spend hours of their life considering automotive design will agonize this forever while never actually buying one. You know who you are...ahem.

The car looks nice and the interior is a nice step up...wtf is the problem.

Germancar1

Exactly!

M

K-A

I think it'll actually typically be the permanent M-B fans, namely ones who AREN'T on the market for an S Class, who'd delude themselves into thinking that a car that is priced 3-4x higher than a C Class and looks *IDENTICAL* to one isn't an issue to a very high priced, flagship model (people are pricing W222's at $120K easy), not the other way around. This forum has a tiny fraction of S Class buyers and being enthusiasts enough to come to an S Class board, I don't think the "blown up C Class" effect might effect them.... yet at least. However, the average S Class buyer I think will find it bothersome in a few years when their cars looks identical to the gazillions of $200 a month C's.

I think it goes without saying these are opinions, only children would need to keep reiterating that fact. I just think mine is the most logical.

Or do we need to pull up the endless posts on this forum of people saying they wouldn't buy a competitors car because "they all look alike". Now M-B has taken that to the next level.

Germancar1

Yawn. Your opinion is no more "logical" than anyone else, but keep trying to delude yourself into thinking that. It remains nothing but an opinion and ill advised one at that. Saying it is more logical is a feeble attempt to put it over everyone elses opinion. Won't work.

Facts are that even though Audi and BMW do the cut-n-paste with their designs, they still sell very well, and that trumps some made up bull**** about what these imaginary buyers are going to be put off by. It is really stupid to think someone about to spend 100K+ on a S550 actually cares what a 35K C-Class looks like. It doesn't hinder BMW or Audi, now why would it hinder Mercedes? Especially when BOTH cars are knockouts or appear to be in the case of the C-Class. Which will also have a sport front end as an option to differentiate it from the S-Class. The majority of the C-Classes sold are sports with the star inside the grille, not the traditional grille like EVERY S-Class has.


Posting on a mesg board doesn't make you an enthusiast either, clearly it doesn't. These are S-Class buyers here posting and the clear majority of them aren't put off by it.

M

K-A

With Audi it totally affected the A8. This generation A8 has been a yawn fest, not to mention Audi is a far less "prestigious" brand than M-B, i.e they're known more for their sportier, smaller cars and intentions.

With BMW, it's a bit different as the F01 came out a couple of years before its first "lookalike" did, which is the F10 5. IMO the 5 Series really impacted the desirability of this generations 7, though the design language is so flawless, as you find the S/C Classes to be now, it's harder to get "mad at them" for it, I'll give you that. And that's a 5 Series. Here, the S and C launch at almost the same time, and this is a *C* Class. It just ruins the presence of the S Class on the roads. Yes, the S will always be notable for its sheer size, but the design is no longer in any way special from the rest of the brand. Even the W220 stood apart from the W203 more than these two do.

Ok, so it has the Star grille, the ONLY visual distinction from the S Class.... however the front of the new C looks identical to the current E Class, so it's kind of a mashup in that effect.

When someone goes to a dealer to cross shop a C and S and they have copy/paste exteriors, one with a $35K price tag and the other with a $110K price tag, there is absolutely no doubt that it will deter the S, it's human nature, simple logic. Assuming otherwise is being in denial, IMO.

The fact that this is such a prevalent discussion on various boards and topics, with people having to keep defending M-B's copy/paste job shows that it already has become an issue.

Germancar1

You gotta make up your mind. Either Audi is doing good or aren't they.

Audi will always likely be a less prestigious brand than Mercedes-Benz, so what is your point?

They are in that position because of (previously) poor quality, reliability and various scandals that happened to them over the years. Not to mention the fact that they didn't start selling cars in the U.S. until the early 80's. It has very little with them all looking more or less alike. Clearly their 34 month streak of increasing sales says they aren't having a problem. Worldwide Audi is much closer to Mercedes in prestige than they are here and you know this.

The BMW 7-Series in truth has never been a major player in this end of the market. The S has lead it from day one. Sure it is sportier, but that isn't what people look for here. BMW even goes far as to copy and past the same exact interior from the 5,6,7 all to the same car. At lease Mercedes doesn't. It works in the 5 and 6, but in the 7 it doesn't vs the A8 and S-Class as those interiors blow the 7 away.

You keep saying that the C and S are launching at the same time. WHY? I mean man really, are you just going to keep repeating something blatantly wrong just because it sounds good? A year apart is not the same time.

Anyone with a brain will know which car came out first, if they care about such things.

Hardly No ONE is cross shopping a C and a S-Class. If they say that they are likely lying about their finances. One of the 2 cars never stood a chance of being bought, likely the more expensive one.

Who is defending their strategy? You're the only that seems to have a problem with the 2 cars looking alike. Buyers who are lined up don't. It is only "prevalent" because you keep talking about, reaching for something no one is bothered about, but you.

You keep saying the 5 impacted the 7? HOW? Where is the harm done to BMW's bottom line? Where do we measure this impact? How do we measure it? Please give specifics on how the 5 looking like the 7 or vice versa since the 7 came out 2 years before the 5 did, hurt the 7-Series.

Clearly Audi and BMW aren't hurting because of it, if they are show how.

M

Quadcammer

no kidding. I almost hurt myself laughing when he said that.

No one walks into a dealer and goes...hmm, lets see, a $35k damn near compact entry level sedan or a top of the line S-class full size luxury sedan for $120k.

This does not happen.

K-A

Someone's got reading comprehension problems (amongst other problems).

I never said CROSS shopping. I said see it sitting next to a much more expensive car, being much cheaper, and looking IDENTICAL.

MBNUT1

KA so hows does it work in your mind? A guy who wants the best car in the world and has the wherewithal to buy an S Class walks into a Mercedes dealership and falls in love with it's beautiful design and then looks over and sees a C class which looks like a scaled version of it. Does he say to himself, "Damn I guess I'm going to have to buy a fugly seven series or A8"

Just admit it. You can't handle the fact that the W222 S class and upcoming C render the rest of the competition unattractive and graceless in comparison.

Quadcammer

really? Gee, can't imagine where I would have come up with that then.

K-A

My bad, that was just lazy writing on my part. I didn't mean to say cross shop a C and S. I meant if someone goes to an M-B dealer to cross shop an *S* (let's say someone wanting an upper scale premium large car but not set on one yet), then sees a C looking copy/paste of it....

Avoiding the fanboy jabber about design (which is kind of a stretch.... I don't think either design is anything to write home about, and I wouldn't call such discordant lines "graceful", to each their own.... of course).

Yes, I think that's exactly what will happen in a few years. The C is a regular car, and has the same design as a very prestigious car. The S will look identical to the C, not the other way around. C's will be all over the roads wearing this "regular" design, and the S' design won't be remotely more special on the outside. This doesn't bode well for a six figure car. Therefore, this "prestigiously magical design" you speak of won't be so fitting for a 6 figure car when it's populated by a $200 a month car. Being attractive is one thing, but the more premium model should always have things about its design that separate itself from the "commoner" models.

You just like every M-B fan here have been yapping for years about how M-B having such a "diversified design" lineup render BMW and Audi "copy/paste" designs less enticing when it comes to validating the prices of the more expensive models. Yet naturally, once M-B does it, even MORE than BMW or Audi ever have between a bottom and top rung Sedan, it's the best thing since sliced bread.

Face it, M-B is in a terrible identity crisis, has the most discordant lineup out there, and now are once again copying their competitors' practices, who have surpassed them so heavily in recent years, by trying to overcompensate for their lateness once again... this time by being even MORE copy/paste than we've seen from said competitors.

MBNUT1

I don't get that. I was in an Audi dealer yesterday and btw I've owned my Audi for over 14 years and put 170k miles on it. It was the first A4 design and which looks good to this day so if I am any fanboy it would be an Audi fanboy but the front end design on the current A8 is one only a blind fanboy could love. The interior space on the other hand is a very nice place to spend time. I'm still not getting why an S class guy would buy one because of the way the C class looks.

Germancar1

Forget it, its just dumb hater talk. The S looks like the C even though the S is out a year before the C. It isn't common sense.


M

ImInPA

Perhaps a moment of silence is in order to honor the death of Mercedes Benz. It is hard to believe that in just a few short years we will all be lamenting disappearance of the S-Class due to the C-Class's design. I am guessing the CLA will wipe out any chance the CLS has as well. The SL will likely die a similar death due to the similarity in design of the SLK. Truly tragic. The good news is that it is not even remotely possible.