What do u guys think of new 2008 Lexus LS600?
#151
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e55amg w210
There always are some exeptions. Gates doesn't have to care about his reputation anymore
I've seen picture of reachest man in Russia (mr. Abramovich, owner of Chelsea (London) btw), on that pic he was wearing chinese quarz watch. Does it make it equal to Rolex?
#153
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E550 4MATIC
Why do people always start quoting what some ultra-rich person or celeb drives? Leonard Di Caprio drives only Toyota Priuises because he is very environmentally conscience. Does that mean we should all run out and buy one? I don't care what Bill Gates, Leonardo, rieger, or anyone drives. I love MB, and I love my MB. The engine could fall out tomorrow I would still love it.
Don't even get me started on the hybrid discussion...
Don't even get me started on the hybrid discussion...
#154
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E-ZGO 53hp., 1999 E 430 sport, 2004 E 55, 2008 Tahoe LTZ on 24"s
Hate to burst your bubble, but the richest man in the world, Bill Gates, had / has a Lexus ES300
In my garage, there is a 1995 Jag XJ6, 1995 Lexus LS400, 2004 Lexus RX330, and a 2001 MB W210 E430 that I purchased this week, in mint condition with only 37,000 miles (my 5th Benz).
I sure a hell am not going to say anything bad about Lexus, and my E430 is too new to pass judgement yet (although first impressions are favourable).
I'm also not going to get involved in the whole "Lexus sucks !" argument either....each to his/her own. But I will say I'm definitely not a fan of the W221 - the rear is just an ugly Bangle 7 Series rip off, and those pumped out wheelarches look ridiculous. (The front end though is nice).
In my garage, there is a 1995 Jag XJ6, 1995 Lexus LS400, 2004 Lexus RX330, and a 2001 MB W210 E430 that I purchased this week, in mint condition with only 37,000 miles (my 5th Benz).
I sure a hell am not going to say anything bad about Lexus, and my E430 is too new to pass judgement yet (although first impressions are favourable).
I'm also not going to get involved in the whole "Lexus sucks !" argument either....each to his/her own. But I will say I'm definitely not a fan of the W221 - the rear is just an ugly Bangle 7 Series rip off, and those pumped out wheelarches look ridiculous. (The front end though is nice).
I checked your claim and sure enough you are right. Now show me a pic of him in that car. You may never find it. And I don't say Lexus sucks. They started out with the best copy of a Mercedes S class in the world. The Ls 400 and raised the bar down form there. Cheaper knock off, is it better? yes. Will it last as long? I am sure it will. The Lexus marque appeals to people that don't understand how they can produce a car like that so cheap. I personally try to avoid buying Japanese products, as I view Japans fishing fleet to be raping the worlds oceans. I won't go in to it.
Congrats on the 430 I have on too, a 99 26k mi and never had any problems.
If you ever get the chance to drive a E55 do so you may sell all your cars for one.
#155
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2007 E63
Not saying MB is the only one to have recalls but there recalls are for major components such as BRAKE SYSTEM Failure in E-class, radiator and tranny in E-class and other component such as the ones mentioned in the article and 1.3million cars is a big ratio compared to how many MB sells. Toyota and lexus has recalls also but the ratio of recalls to cars sold is considerable less hence the the everyone is looking at MB's problems.
Also, did you even bother to read the links I provided? Toyota recalled the mechanism that allows seat belts to be pulled so people can buckle up. Wouldn't you say that's a pretty important thing? They also recalled the CPS, and in the RX/Highlander some clips in the floor could cause the accelerator to become stuck in the floor.
#156
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2007 E63
First, off if you bothered to read my post I clearly stated that brake failures from regular users were far and few between, not that they didn't happen period. Not sure how you missed that. Again, what is your point here? We all know Mercedes has had their problems. No it isn't a fair statment to say that the W221 will likely be unreliable because of the W220, because the W221 is an all-new car, not based on anything W220. Again, you're ill-informed and totally factless. It seems to me that you're another clueless MB basher that really needs to get a life or at least some knowledge beyond Consumer Reports and JD Powers. You found 2 cases out of millions of cars with SBC on the road, applause please. Lets strike up the band.
Again, who here said MB didn't have problems? Who? What is your purpose for being here other than to make youself look incredibly stupid?
Lastly, if you had read my post you would have clearly seen where I stated that it was in high-mileage/usage German taxicabs that SBC failed first and prompted the recall.
M
Again, who here said MB didn't have problems? Who? What is your purpose for being here other than to make youself look incredibly stupid?
Lastly, if you had read my post you would have clearly seen where I stated that it was in high-mileage/usage German taxicabs that SBC failed first and prompted the recall.
M
For someone who likes to talk about facts, and showing them, he doesn't do much to look over what he gives us and look into it further to be an informed basher/disgruntled former owner.
#157
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2001 W210 E430 Elegance
Why do people always start quoting what some ultra-rich person or celeb drives? Leonard Di Caprio drives only Toyota Priuises because he is very environmentally conscience. Does that mean we should all run out and buy one? I don't care what Bill Gates, Leonardo, rieger, or anyone drives. I love MB, and I love my MB. The engine could fall out tomorrow I would still love it.
Don't even get me started on the hybrid discussion...
Don't even get me started on the hybrid discussion...
The point was raised because someone questioned if anyone famous drives a Lexus. And some time ago here in Oz, there was a doco on Gates, and yes, they did show him driving to work in his ES300
I'm not sure why people are using the "It's only a Toyota" line either - as a 5 time Benz owner, I could very easily bring out the "It''s only an overpriced German taxi cab" line for MB. Similarly, I could easily say Audis are only overpriced Volkswagens Does it really matter if people like the end result ? Anything else is just pointless snobbery.
And your damn right the first LS400 raised the bar for other lluxury vehicles.
And as I said, I'm rapt with my E430, but I can tell you right now with certainty that the quality of the interior plastics and leather, and general interior ambience, is nowhere near my Jag, or my other Lexus.
Regardless of who came up with the current S Class rear end (Bangle or Merc), the similarities remain, and both are butt ugly (pardon the pun).
#158
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2001 W210 E430 Elegance
That's a crazy argument You're right, Japanese tuna fishing in the Pacific is a concern.....yet you and I both drive cars made in a country that had a well known and shocking reputation during the 1930s and 1940s. Are you going to sell you German car because of it ?
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E-ZGO 53hp., 1999 E 430 sport, 2004 E 55, 2008 Tahoe LTZ on 24"s
So the guy that put your Lexus together is eating YOUR fish from YOUR Great Barrier Reef.
Worth a quick look
http://www.smh.com.au/news/whale-wat...266591669.html
You will love the last line in the link above:
2007 the whalers will start hunting humpbacks which migrate along the Australian coast in winter, with a self-allocated quota of 50.
http://darwin.bio.uci.edu/~pjbryant/.../archipel.html
Last edited by Yacht Master; 04-27-2007 at 09:05 PM.
#160
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W220 M113K
Why do people always start quoting what some ultra-rich person or celeb drives? Leonard Di Caprio drives only Toyota Priuises because he is very environmentally conscience. Does that mean we should all run out and buy one? I don't care what Bill Gates, Leonardo, rieger, or anyone drives. I love MB, and I love my MB. The engine could fall out tomorrow I would still love it.
Don't even get me started on the hybrid discussion...
Don't even get me started on the hybrid discussion...
#161
You're funny!! The only retort I get from is facts this, facts that. I have yet to see any links to an article where someone, who has the VERY LAST say in these subjective matters, explicitly states that "MB produced vehicles from the late 90's onward are POSs".
EDIT/ADD: I've also stated that I agree MB has had reliability issues. What I disagree on is that you imply MB as a whole is a POS.
I guess you've also missed the vehicle listed in my profile...and it has no problems.
EDIT/ADD: I've also stated that I agree MB has had reliability issues. What I disagree on is that you imply MB as a whole is a POS.
I guess you've also missed the vehicle listed in my profile...and it has no problems.
You tell me in what industry is there a person that has the very last say. Your arguments are ridiculous.
Never said Toyota doesn't have recalls moron but if you looked at the number of vehicles Toyota sells compared to MB then the ratio is significantly lower than MB's.
#162
When a recall is issued, it means the company is admitting it's mistakes, and is trying to solve the problem. MB isn't giving us the cold shoulder or anything.
If you think MB was trying to solve the problem hence the recall then you are more naive then I thought. Usually it is caused by government agency investigating the problem and then pushing or telling the manufacturer to do so, or the threat of future lawsuits. They probably did the math on it and was cheaper for them to do the recall than to pay out class action lawsuits. They say that they came about this problem when they were checking high mileage taxicabs but there has been incidents with low mileage E-class and S-class W220 brakes failing due to all types of failures. So I don't believe for one minute that they never came across the problem earlier. So when this is brought to light they are forced to deal with it and not because they want to solve the problem. To solve the problem would to be put a whole new system in really. The SBC was not a well thought out product. Not only does it not work as well as the hydraulic systems it is also noisy.
If you think MB was trying to solve the problem hence the recall then you are more naive then I thought. Usually it is caused by government agency investigating the problem and then pushing or telling the manufacturer to do so, or the threat of future lawsuits. They probably did the math on it and was cheaper for them to do the recall than to pay out class action lawsuits. They say that they came about this problem when they were checking high mileage taxicabs but there has been incidents with low mileage E-class and S-class W220 brakes failing due to all types of failures. So I don't believe for one minute that they never came across the problem earlier. So when this is brought to light they are forced to deal with it and not because they want to solve the problem. To solve the problem would to be put a whole new system in really. The SBC was not a well thought out product. Not only does it not work as well as the hydraulic systems it is also noisy.
#163
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2007 E63
Originally Posted by rieger
So if you think when I say MB is a POS that I meant that every single car that MB makes is a lemon than you are a total idiot and don't understand the argument at all.
"That said the Benz's that have been produced after 2000 are total garbage."
Originally Posted by rieger
You tell me in what industry is there a person that has the very last say.
Originally Posted by rieger
Your arguments are ridiculous.
Originally Posted by rieger
Never said Toyota doesn't have recalls moron but if you looked at the number of vehicles Toyota sells compared to MB then the ratio is significantly lower than MB's.
I'll give the recalled cars : manufactured cars ratio thing. But hear this, there were that big a number recalled for SBC, etc. because during the production period of that particular model, they were using the same parts, for the same system. If they to recall one part, then they'd have to recall that one part on every single car they built and sold. Make sense?
Oh yeah, you can't blame Mercedes as a company and manufacturer entirely. You have to blame the companies that produce the parts too.
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2007 E63
When a recall is issued, it means the company is admitting it's mistakes, and is trying to solve the problem. MB isn't giving us the cold shoulder or anything.
If you think MB was trying to solve the problem hence the recall then you are more naive then I thought. Usually it is caused by government agency investigating the problem and then pushing or telling the manufacturer to do so, or the threat of future lawsuits. They probably did the math on it and was cheaper for them to do the recall than to pay out class action lawsuits. They say that they came about this problem when they were checking high mileage taxicabs but there has been incidents with low mileage E-class and S-class W220 brakes failing due to all types of failures. So I don't believe for one minute that they never came across the problem earlier. So when this is brought to light they are forced to deal with it and not because they want to solve the problem. To solve the problem would to be put a whole new system in really. The SBC was not a well thought out product. Not only does it not work as well as the hydraulic systems it is also noisy.
If you think MB was trying to solve the problem hence the recall then you are more naive then I thought. Usually it is caused by government agency investigating the problem and then pushing or telling the manufacturer to do so, or the threat of future lawsuits. They probably did the math on it and was cheaper for them to do the recall than to pay out class action lawsuits. They say that they came about this problem when they were checking high mileage taxicabs but there has been incidents with low mileage E-class and S-class W220 brakes failing due to all types of failures. So I don't believe for one minute that they never came across the problem earlier. So when this is brought to light they are forced to deal with it and not because they want to solve the problem. To solve the problem would to be put a whole new system in really. The SBC was not a well thought out product. Not only does it not work as well as the hydraulic systems it is also noisy.
I am not naive. The threat of lawsuits is something we go over every single day of the week in my Business Law class...you can thank the threat of lawsuits for most, if not all, of the decisions companies (and perhaps the government) make. Especially in sue happy America. If there's one thing Canada has that the U.S. doesn't, it's a better legal system in regards to civil law. The way I understand it, if you sue, and you lose, you pay the other party's legal fees.
#166
" Ouch! You know a once civil debate is going downhill when it resorts to name calling. Remember this? "
Then do you remember this " Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt. "
Abraham Lincoln
So basically you called me a fool here. And don't try to tell me this was not directed at me since I was the only one arguing at the time being before others joined on.
I did say I will defend myself and be happy to play along with name calling if others do so first. You went first I retaliate.
Then do you remember this " Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt. "
Abraham Lincoln
So basically you called me a fool here. And don't try to tell me this was not directed at me since I was the only one arguing at the time being before others joined on.
I did say I will defend myself and be happy to play along with name calling if others do so first. You went first I retaliate.
#167
Which is why it is discontinued.
I am not naive. The threat of lawsuits is something we go over every single day of the week in my Business Law class...you can thank the threat of lawsuits for most, if not all, of the decisions companies (and perhaps the government) make. Especially in sue happy America. If there's one thing Canada has that the U.S. doesn't, it's a better legal system in regards to civil law. The way I understand it, if you sue, and you lose, you pay the other party's legal fees.
I am not naive. The threat of lawsuits is something we go over every single day of the week in my Business Law class...you can thank the threat of lawsuits for most, if not all, of the decisions companies (and perhaps the government) make. Especially in sue happy America. If there's one thing Canada has that the U.S. doesn't, it's a better legal system in regards to civil law. The way I understand it, if you sue, and you lose, you pay the other party's legal fees.
#168
Yes those were first year cars but they were still having the problems up until the last update i believe which was 2005 or 2006 not sure which year was the update. And still not sure if it is really fixed or a band aid solution.
#169
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2007 E63
" Ouch! You know a once civil debate is going downhill when it resorts to name calling. Remember this? "
Then do you remember this " Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt. "
Abraham Lincoln
So basically you called me a fool here. And don't try to tell me this was not directed at me since I was the only one arguing at the time being before others joined on.
I did say I will defend myself and be happy to play along with name calling if others do so first. You went first I retaliate.
Then do you remember this " Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt. "
Abraham Lincoln
So basically you called me a fool here. And don't try to tell me this was not directed at me since I was the only one arguing at the time being before others joined on.
I did say I will defend myself and be happy to play along with name calling if others do so first. You went first I retaliate.
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2007 E63
That is not what you initially insinuated. As a lawyer you are trying to take both sides of the argument. Is it recalled because you believe that MB is doing it because of them wanting to take care of their mistake or because they are being forced to take care of their mistake? I say the latter reason while you initially said the former now you believe in which one?
Last edited by AsianML; 04-28-2007 at 12:57 AM.
#172
Could have fooled me. You came off pretty strongly here:
"That said the Benz's that have been produced after 2000 are total garbage."
I guess you need to get a handle on the english language. This is a figure of speech saying that in general MB's are not reliable and does not mean every single car produced is a lemon.
I mean if you want to take it that I mean every single car produced is a lemon than you go right ahead and argue on with yourself because that is not what I mean. If you want me to put it more accurately then here it is :
" MB has reliability problems "
See it is not me who wants to harp back at this point it is people like asianml who brings me back to defending this point. buy taking it out of context.
"That said the Benz's that have been produced after 2000 are total garbage."
I guess you need to get a handle on the english language. This is a figure of speech saying that in general MB's are not reliable and does not mean every single car produced is a lemon.
I mean if you want to take it that I mean every single car produced is a lemon than you go right ahead and argue on with yourself because that is not what I mean. If you want me to put it more accurately then here it is :
" MB has reliability problems "
See it is not me who wants to harp back at this point it is people like asianml who brings me back to defending this point. buy taking it out of context.
#173
I agree that the TSB are MB initiated but we were talking about recalls which more often than not are not manufacturer initiated even though they say it is because when it comes to be Nhtsa initiated and stated as such it is very embarrassing to the manufacturer so usually the manufacturer is given a chance to initiate the recall first.
Last edited by rieger; 04-28-2007 at 01:04 AM.
#174
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2007 E63
Could have fooled me. You came off pretty strongly here:
"That said the Benz's that have been produced after 2000 are total garbage."
I guess you need to get a handle on the english language. This is a figure of speech saying that in general MB's are not reliable and does not mean every single car produced is a lemon.
I mean if you want to take it that I mean every single car produced is a lemon than you go right ahead and argue on with yourself because that is not what I mean. If you want me to put it more accurately then here it is :
" MB has reliability problems "
See it is not me who wants to harp back at this point it is people like asianml who brings me back to defending this point. buy taking it out of context.
"That said the Benz's that have been produced after 2000 are total garbage."
I guess you need to get a handle on the english language. This is a figure of speech saying that in general MB's are not reliable and does not mean every single car produced is a lemon.
I mean if you want to take it that I mean every single car produced is a lemon than you go right ahead and argue on with yourself because that is not what I mean. If you want me to put it more accurately then here it is :
" MB has reliability problems "
See it is not me who wants to harp back at this point it is people like asianml who brings me back to defending this point. buy taking it out of context.