skrontz

Totally forgot to mention Night Vision, but you've essentially spelled it out: it causes more damage than benefit. You get dizzy and disoriented by trying to keep your eyes on the screen and on the road; until they introduce some audible notification (or -- better yet -- some form of windshield projection), it's dead on arrival.

MBZFAN55

I was somewhat surprised to see the discounts & trunk money begin to approach the numbers from last year when the 2010 facelift was a relatively noticeable change on the S-Class. I am sure the soft economy is a factor but I think the larger issue could be the newer models of the BMW 7 and the Audi A8 being potential threats to 2011 S-Class sales coupled with both vehicles being priced lower than the S-Class. The current S has been out since 2006 and is heading toward the end of it's manufacturing cycle. At this point in time each incremental sale is probably very profitable for Mercedes even with what we consider to be "large" discounts.

NYCAVS

I understand the general lack of pressure to move the new cars but still would be interested to hear what a fair selling price (% off sticker or amount above/below invoice) one can expect early in the 2011 S550 cycle for a car that is basically identical to the 2010 S550 produced just months before. Does it have to do withhow long it sits at the dealer? 22K off the sticker for 2010 S550 likely means they are trying to cut their losses?

epasc

In Southern California at the right dealers, 7% off is almost a given. You might not get beyond that for a few months.

The last two I bought were both 10% off - a 2010 GL350 last October and a 2010 S550 in March.

skrontz

I think their sales numbers are still hurting from the downturn (something they had never seen coming when they established pricing on W221), so they're probably still undersold right now. I think you get a lot more bang for the buck with an S Class than either the 7 Series or A8 (which looks aged beyond belief with essentially the same body as 10+ years ago). They still haven't released S Class pricing for the US market, so I would not be surprised by a slight price bump for MY2011 to adjust for inflation. We'll see in a few weeks, I guess.

$22K off the MSRP means two things:

1. The car doesn't have the best options and has been sitting on the lot for way too long. I would run the VIN to check the production date.

2. You're buying a one year old car, considering that MY2010 hit the showrooms in 08/2009. MY2010 and MY2011 vehicles may be just a few months apart in terms of production dates, but the gap on the books is 1 year.

JayGold

The production date was 4/2010 and I am still interested in the car but would like something more like 28 to 30k off. Dealer claims they are not making any money on the car but they all say that

skrontz

Considering that pre-owned MY2009 cars are still going for mid- to high-70s, this expectation does not appear reasonable. Good luck, though.

epasc

I agree. $22,000 off sounds like a good number. I guess it can't hurt to ask for more, but my guess is that you are near the threshold there. Unless the car has lots of demo miles on it. Does it?

IDriveAnM5

On the brighter side, you are getting very close to the end of September. That means the October trunk money is right around the corner, and my guess is that it will be more than in September. We had the same situation last year, and M-B released an additional $5,000 of dealer cash to spur sales into October for MY 2010 cars. I'm waiting until October, unless one of the dealers I have talked to will give me the deal I want before then. Anyway, my schedule is booked for the rest of the month and I don't have time to waste on car negotiations...

The 2010 S550's are heavily incentivized toward cash buyer sales, as opposed to leases right now - I've had two dealers turn down my lease deal so far, even though I know of a friend on this board who got the deal I want already this month in my region.

I spoke to another dealer today who fed me the usual schtick - October will mean the end of trunk money - buy now, buy today, buy one for a friend! She was exactly wrong about this same situation last year when I was in the market. There will be more cash in October, I see that as being fairly certain. Even at the discounts we're seeing today, supply and demand are still not balanced. Supply is still greater than demand.

In terms of equipment, I guess if you've never had ABC (because you're a 4Matic driver), then you might not know what you're missing. Personally, I think the handling prowess of the S550 is set up correct - it isn't a sports car. If I want that sort of response, I'll go drive my M5. Distronic is not on my radar, as I said, I found it a distraction. Blind Spot Assist can be negated if you adjust your mirrors in a certain manner. Night vision is a bit silly, especially for a guy like me who drives at night maybe once every 3 months.

SL2003driver

I would want the 4matic, right you can't have 4matic and ABC, but I would not want ABC, just a major problem waiting to happen. I would never want 20 inch rims with the skinny tires, just asking for bent rims and flat tires. JMHO

NYCAVS

I think you are right. I'm going to try for invoice... hopefully with good leasing terms.

IDriveAnM5

I don't think it's totally unreasonable. But, be prepared maybe to pay a little over invoice. A friend of mine orders a new M-B about every year and he pays between $500 and $1,000 over invoice for the privilege. The dealer makes good money that way!!!

The lease terms should be pretty good with the advantage of a good residual. Good luck. I'm still gunning for a 2010.

NYCAVS

Thanks. When I got my early-cycle 2008 E350 3 years ago, that was almost exactly what I got... just above invoice. Hopefully the leasing terms will be good. Good luck on your 2010 plans!

transferred

No, they're not "going for" that. Some dealers may ask for that but asking and getting are two totally different things.

skrontz

You may want to check autotrader.com. Every 2009 S550 with less than 8000 miles is priced from 75K and higher. The well-optioned cars with less than 5000 miles are in the 80s. I understand that there's some room for negotiations, but the supply is not that great to discount more than $5K off the asking prices. Expecting a brand new MY2010 S550 with fairly good options to be discounted from $106K to $76K is unrealistic at this point.

derrick_lui

Word. Once again, look at what he drives...a 2010 S550...of course he's not going to agree with you said.

skrontz

Wow, such a strong argument -- I'm clearly defeated.

I've been driving the car for a year already, and I'm all for people getting great deals right now. However, some people may miss out on good deals while waiting for an impossible deal.

transferred

Again, dealer asking prices on used units are worthless. A friend of mine recently paid 61k for an 8,000mile AMG when the dealer was advertising it at 79,000. Dealers can attach any tag they want, on the chance they get the one in one hundred person (generally an old grandma) will pay it. Countless other examples exist. The rest of us see this scam for what is and offer what a dealer may claim is a lowball but is actually market value.

btw, I unfortunately can't see any "global recovery"for at least three years. Hope i'm wrong but this is as deep of a mess as there's been in a long time...

-Rob

skrontz

The asking price is the starting point for negotiations. When one dealer raises the price above market value, it's one thing. When all the supply on the market is priced at a certain level, it's completely different. If the dealer started to advertise the car at $79K a year before it was purchased at $61K, it makes sense.

The global recovery is slowly taking hold with some dips expected along the way, but a typical S Class buyer is not among those most affected by this downturn.

emilner

Good luck getting $30k off a brand new S. $22k sounds like a pretty good deal since there are no worthwhile changes from '10 to '11.

I feel like we are back at the Manheim logic. You know, you can get a mint condition CPO S550 at auction for a #2 value meal and a case of Corona...

transferred

Please provide evidence of the bolded portion.

Looking at the amount of S-Classes repo'd, It could be said the "typical S-class buyer" is living beyond their means.

The dealer had had the car in question for 5 weeks.

The 2010 S550 owners are banding together I see. With dealers offering a 22k discount off the bat, another $5k would hardly be groundbreaking but believe what ever makes you feel better...

skrontz

Please refer to the FOMC statement released yesterday for a brief summary. From there, you can look at the particular statistics and compare them to the levels we had seen during the past two years.

Now it's my turn to ask for evidence. What percentage of the W221 sold in the US is repossessed?

Sure. And then another $5K is just a few phone calls away. And then another $20K thrown in by Santa because you were such a good boy. Then Tooth Fairy and Boogieman pitch in to give you a really great deal. Long story short, you'll drive away in the new car and the dealer would owe you money. Oh well, time to wake up now.

I feel just the same whether you or anyone else buys the car or not at any given price; if I was concerned about depreciation, I won't be buying a brand new car at the beginning of the model year. Once you get it at the $30K discount, let us know and we'll be happy for you together.

transferred

I tried to be polite, but it seems Derrick had the read on you from the get-go. The smartass remarks are unnecessary, it's been widely discussed by moderators and long time members that discounts of up to 30k are available on 100k MBs at the end of their model year. But I guess if you keep negotiating around MSRP and you'll remain the most popular guy on the lot.

Trusting the federal blurb just like you trust a car saleman's asking price it seems. Good luck to you, you'll need it.

skrontz

Sure, let's trust anecdotal evidence instead of the available market data. By all means, I encourage you go to and try buying a car at this discount today.

If you prefer to believe in conspiracy theories as opposed to trusting independently collected statistics to judge the state of the economy, we cannot have an intelligent and objective discussion on this topic.

I'm happy with my level of luck, and I can afford my cars without the imaginary discounts.

Carl Lassiter

Whatever your professed wealth, it appears you're jealous of those who have been able to get better deals than you. Sad. Mercedes were freely offering $25,000 off new 2010 E63s, SLs and S-Classes earlier in the month. Maybe these didn't reach the desert but the old cliche of a fool and their money being easily parted may apply.