justinmorrison

So there's what appears to be a complete B&O speaker system on eBay at the moment and I'm seriously tempted.

Does anyone know if it's plug and play, or would new wiring need to be run? If it's just a matter of swapping out the speakers and amp I may go for it...

Mike5215

Not plug and play. Different amp and different COMAND firmware. Different wiring (two tweets in the B pillars that aren't in the HK, all tweets illuminated) . Possible swap but a big job.

Better off getting a nice DSP amp (I used the Prima 8.9 by Audison) and upgrading a few key speakers.)

justinmorrison

Thanks Mike, I had a feeling that was the case. Looking at the auction:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/262363747440?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AITThe amp is included, but I didn't consider the necessary COMAND update. Actually, it doesn't appear that the B pillar tweeters are included, unless I'm missing something in the pictures. I'll likely go your route, although those illuminated tweeters sure are pretty...

Mike5215

Yeah the tweets are major eye candy, but if you look close they're made from a conventional silk dome tweeter mounted horizontal with a little cone diffuser over it.

xpl0sive

you would need b&o door panels too I think. Chris the Swede has done the B&O conversion, he will know for sure what needs to the done.

xpl0sive

it also seems that the ebay kit is missing the rear tweeters that go on the B pillars

xpl0sive

there was a listing on German ebay that included the B pillar trim and tweeters. that system sold for 1300 euro

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Mercedes-Benz...p2047675.l2557

MrRat

Or just buy it already installed:
http://drivenauto-sales.ebizautos.mo...-13988882.html

Mike5215

The door modules are different but they mount into the door the same way. The rear deck sub module with the rear surrounds would also drop in. The B&O set up is an improvement over the H/K, but for the money not a lot of bang for the buck. Those tweets are pretty awesome looking though.

MrRat

These are typically "branded" systems, not that they don't represent an improvement, but they use the name and the electronics and speakers are built to a modest price point.

Mark Levinson gear is very pricey and an amp can easily cost $60k, per channel. Similarly, Burmester has mostly super high end products as well ( Burmester 909 amp is $73,000, Burmester B100 speakers are $94,000 per pair)No car manufacturer is putting 15 channels of amplification in their cars at $60k per channel.

Mike5215

Exactly. For better or worse. Before Bose whored their name out to Chevy they did the standard (and only) system in the W220 and it was a great sounding car. If the 221 had sounded that good I wouldn't have touched it.

DaveW68

MrRat

Bose is a cheap *****, Burmester and Levinson are high class ******, I guess sometimes the cheap ****** get the job done.

Mike5215

I own some Bose stuff. Their QC15 headphones are nice. I use mine all the time. I have a Cinemate TV amp/speaker thing in the bedroom where I don't want a lot of surround gear. The Bose in the 220 was universally acclaimed. Probably the most neutral, natural sounding OEM system I've owned.

DaveW68

The best system I ever had in a car was the stock Mark Levinson in my 2001 Lexus LS430. Definitely far from a booming Bose system, but you could hear more instruments with true highs & lows without any kind of manufactured sound rigging like so many car audio system have. Live music recordings sounded like you were actually there. That system was better than the ML in my 2008 LS460. I'm guessing that Lexus tightened their budget with later models and gave up some of the sound quality. I can't imagine that there has been a more pure music stock system than what Lexus put in the LS in the early 2000's, including the B&O system in the new Benzes.

Mike5215

Yeah, that Levinson system is widely acclaimed. Maybe back when Lexus was working hard to earn their luxury car status they went a little overboard.

I was just reading about an instrumented (and audiophile listening) test of high end OEM audio in modern luxury cars and was surprised to see the 222 Burmester (standard) system coming in mid pack for over processing and soundstage issues. I believe Range Rover's Meridian took top honors and Lincoln's new Revel system (by HK) did well too.

mercedesbenzs55

HK does sound a bit tacky. Less tacky if my driver bass wasn't blown.

DaveW68

That's because the previous owner probably purposely destroyed the sub after he was done kicking in those rear quarter panels to make sure the insurance company would total his car. He probably also put some junk in the gas tank so the car would throw a bunch of false codes. Smart!

mercedesbenzs55

Lmao!

MrRat

I had a G37 coupe with the Bose "studio" system in it. I thought it was fun with good bass extension, decent and enjoyable. My Volt has a Bose system as well and it's ok. I've never heard the Bose in the 220 but I believe you when you said it's better than the HK in the 221. I like the HK, but I would think the Bose in the G was better in most respects, with less flabby bass, without so large a mid bass hump, and less harsh more extended top end.

On the other hand, if you checked a out home Burmester setup, it would shame a way cheaper Bose system. It would also cost as much as a small home.

SteveE400

I have to agree with those who mentioned how good the ML system in the 2001 LS430 sounded. I had mine for almost 15 years, and to date, it is the best car audio I've had. Of course, I don't plan to spend mega-bucks to modify the system in a car that is still nearly brand new.


One thing I've noticed about the HK system (in a W212) is that the frequency response seems to change dramatically as the volume is turned up. At lower listening levels, the sound is fairly "full" with plenty of highs and bass. Once the volume is up more than half way, the system seems to roll off the bass very noticeably. I have no audio test gear (any more), so I can't tell if this is due to built-in compensation (Fletcher-Munson curve?) or just the sub-woofer amp running out of steam.


As I noticed in my W201, and as the sales advisor back then told me, "People who purchase Mercedes automobiles don't buy them to listen to the radio." The sound systems are what they are, and it is very complicated and expensive to augment them.

Mike5215

It's factory EQ taking the bass out at higher volume. Those HK speakers can handle a lot more than they get.

SteveE400

I'm guessing that although the OEM speakers may be able to handle more power, the amp doesn't have it.


When I had the LS430, once the OEM sub dried out and failed, I installed an aftermarket sub with a 500-watt class D amp just for the sub. This install was nearly invisible (looked totally stock) and made enough difference to be fun. No big box in the trunk, just more bass without distortion.


The rear package shelf in the W212 doesn't look like it would be an easy job to substitute a different sub in the stock locations, so any speaker change would either be a custom enclosure or a box in the trunk. I'm not ready for that. . . yet.

mercedesbenzs55

Haha!