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2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Need brakes installed on 2018 S450
My new to me 2018 S450 4Matic 32k miles with air suspension needs new brakes. I had it checked out by an Indy who said the car is in terrific condition but needs brakes soon as they are down to 4 and at 3 the brake sensors will go off.
The quote to replace the front was $1351 and the rear was $1093. Ummm… 😳 That’s OEM pads of course.
I am looking at RockAuto’s price for Power Stop ceramic pads for front and back and wear sensors and the total is under $100.
Is this a difficult job? I’m having trouble understanding. I am also a little intimidated by the air suspension.
I’m including what I have at RockAuto. Maybe I’m not picking out the correct platinum coated ceramic pads? Also is that front brake wear sensor not going to work?
Check YouTube. It’s easier than any other brakes you’ve done before (if swapping pads only). Remove 1 center bolt, punch out 2 pins, push pads back, pull old pads, insert new pads, pins, replace center bolt and voila. If pads only, you’ll spend more time jacking up the car than changing the pads.
If you’re changing rotors, then it’s the same as any other car - remove the caliper, remove the rotor, install new rotors, swap pads and done.
Online videos document every tool and step.
And if your wear sensors haven’t tripped, they can be reused.
2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Originally Posted by dmatre
Check YouTube.
If you’re changing rotors, then it’s the same as any other car - remove the caliper, remove the rotor, install new rotors, swap pads and done.
Online videos document every tool and step.
And if your wear sensors haven’t tripped, they can be reused.
I just watched one video and it seems pretty simple. Anything I should be aware of with the Airmatic suspension? The wear sensors are so cheap I may as well replace them I think.
I just did the front brakes on my wife's GLS580, using Powerstop, as parts are apparently on a national back order, and the GLS was more difficult than doing the S Class, which as others have said, is not a difficult process (if you are mechanically inclined!)
One question that I have to those using non-OEM brake pads (such as Powerstop), what are your experiences with using the Driver Assistance features after swapping from OEM parts?
I came across one review that suggested if you have these features, you should stick with OEM, as the systems are designed with specific parts in place/use, logically this makes sense. However, I used Powerstop for the wife's car, as I can't currently find any OEM pads, and they needed doing!
I’ve had one ‘test’ of the autonomous emergency braking since installing the Powerstops. It was on the highway, at speed.
Admittedly, the first millisecond wasn’t as abrupt as with the OEM (Brembo), but it did apply full braking for a few seconds, and we were able to avoid an accident. By the way, in this event, the seatbelts retract QUICKLY, and the passenger seat moves rearward and upright during the ‘event’.
It seems that the Brembos did hit harder in the first millisecond, but the Powerstops reached the ABS threshold, so I don’t know how it’s possible to be better than that.
One piece of advice, do a good job cleaning inside the calipers and lubricate the areas where the pads move in and out as the brakes are applied. That and a little bit of 'brake quiet' on the back of the pads where they contact the pistons will ensure they operate smoothly and quietly.
If you feel uncomfortable doing it you could find a good independent shop to put on your pads for you. Most don't have a problem with using your parts especially if a brand name and in a sealed box. I did the power stop Z23s and the power stop Rotors front and back and have been very happy with the results. Car stops great and no more black brake dust. Not sure how long they will hold up but so far they are great. Just make sure to bed them in properly and do some hard stops after installed so the break in properly. That is important.
I’ve had one ‘test’ of the autonomous emergency braking since installing the Powerstops. It was on the highway, at speed.
Admittedly, the first millisecond wasn’t as abrupt as with the OEM (Brembo), but it did apply full braking for a few seconds, and we were able to avoid an accident. By the way, in this event, the seatbelts retract QUICKLY, and the passenger seat moves rearward and upright during the ‘event’.
It seems that the Brembos did hit harder in the first millisecond, but the Powerstops reached the ABS threshold, so I don’t know how it’s possible to be better than that.
2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Originally Posted by will_atl
One question that I have to those using non-OEM brake pads (such as Powerstop), what are your experiences with using the Driver Assistance features after swapping from OEM parts?
I came across one review that suggested if you have these features, you should stick with OEM, as the systems are designed with specific parts in place/use, logically this makes sense.
THIS RIGHT HERE got my attention. This makes a lot of sense. The “lane keeping TRONIC+” (can’t keep the names straight) uses the brakes to control the car. I’m not sure I want to mess too much with that, so I may be going with OEM for the brakes.
BUT, it does look pretty so I think I will try to do this myself with my older sons. 🤞
2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Originally Posted by 2012 merc amg
I did the power stop Z23s and the power stop Rotors front and back
I see a lot of the videos do the rotors. Why did you choose to do that? Were you having an issue or is there an advantage that makes it worth it?
I’m still weary of the driver aids not performing exactly as MB intended due to different braking power. Seems like at some point this would be thrown off, and what is that point?
2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Originally Posted by dmatre
OEM (Brembo)
That is fantastic insight to share. Did you have two events, one with PowerStop and one with OEM?
After the car did that with the seats but avoided the crash did it return to normal and drivable condition on its own?
Also, does Brembo make all the OEM brake pads for W222? Would it make any difference at all if I bought Brembo pads or OEM pads? Someone mentioned a shortage, and I don’t know if that’s even possible or if Brembo sells them for the W222. Just thinking out loud as I know so very little about this. I haven’t changed brakes since I was probably 25 and fighting off dinosaurs.
Last thing - is everyone replacing the rotors? I’ve only ever done that when I have some wobble in the steering wheel when braking. If it’s switching to PowerStop then I guess I can see that as they may be a good match - pad to rotor. Would that be needed for OEM or Brembo pads if the rotors are clean?
So much to learn… so much. But I will say this… it’s a great diversion from CANCER CANCER CANCER all the time. 👍😁
I really do appreciate all you guys and your advice and thoughts.
THIS RIGHT HERE got my attention. This makes a lot of sense. The “lane keeping TRONIC+” (can’t keep the names straight) uses the brakes to control the car. I’m not sure I want to mess too much with that, so I may be going with OEM for the brakes.
BUT, it does look pretty so I think I will try to do this myself with my older sons. 🤞
Anyone disagree? I can wash the wheels.
I’ve not had any problems with lane-keeping, etc.
Keep in mind: brake pad friction coefficient is only one part of a complex chain between your chassis and the ground. Tire compound/tread, road construction (asphalt/concrete/patched disaster), ambient conditions (temperature, rain/snow/dry), geometry (cresting a hill, compressing in a dip), etc all combine to affect the slowing of a tire when applying the brakes.
Such a slight change in the pad friction is surely minimal compared to all of the other factors which can affect brake performance.
If you’re still concerned, start a thread asking those who’ve gone to ceramic pads for their experiences. I have no regrets.
That is fantastic insight to share. Did you have two events, one with PowerStop and one with OEM?
After the car did that with the seats but avoided the crash did it return to normal and drivable condition on its own?
Also, does Brembo make all the OEM brake pads for W222? Would it make any difference at all if I bought Brembo pads or OEM pads? Someone mentioned a shortage, and I don’t know if that’s even possible or if Brembo sells them for the W222. Just thinking out loud as I know so very little about this. I haven’t changed brakes since I was probably 25 and fighting off dinosaurs.
Last thing - is everyone replacing the rotors? I’ve only ever done that when I have some wobble in the steering wheel when braking. If it’s switching to PowerStop then I guess I can see that as they may be a good match - pad to rotor. Would that be needed for OEM or Brembo pads if the rotors are clean?
So much to learn… so much. But I will say this… it’s a great diversion from CANCER CANCER CANCER all the time. 👍😁
I really do appreciate all you guys and your advice and thoughts.
My replies:
1) had two ‘events’ with Brembo, both were much slower (<40mph), and initial bite in those events was almost violent- but that could also be related to <40 versus >80 mph with the Powerstops.
2) after the highway event, the seat did not automatically return to the preset position- my son had to push the seat memory button to return to position.
Most car manufacturers have multiple vendors for parts like brake pads. While mine were Brembo, I can’t say whether all W222s came with same.
I did not replace the rotors because they were not below the wear limit, and they were true (no warping or vibration/oscillation during braking). Some folks say you MUST replace rotors with pads. I’ve been doing brakes on my cars since the early 1980’s, including my race cars in the 80’s and 90’s. I typically won’t change rotors unless there is an underlying reason to do so.
The pad/rotor match is achieved during the bed-in process with the new pads. During this time, the ‘new’ friction material is embedded into the face of the rotors, and the old material is removed/replaced. Unless you’re using carbon/ceramic rotors, there is no incompatibility between iron rotors and organic/semi-metallic/ceramic/carbon pads.
Enjoy your ride!
Adding some videos for your entertainment/information:
Best one:
2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Originally Posted by dmatre
I’ve not had any problems with lane-keeping, etc.
Keep in mind: brake pad friction coefficient is only one part of a complex chain between your chassis and the ground. Tire compound/tread, road construction (asphalt/concrete/patched disaster), ambient conditions (temperature, rain/snow/dry), geometry (cresting a hill, compressing in a dip), etc all combine to affect the slowing of a tire when applying the brakes.
Such a slight change in the pad friction is surely minimal compared to all of the other factors which can affect brake performance.
Damn you made some fantastic points there u hadn’t considered. Thanks! 👍
2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Originally Posted by dmatre
The pad/rotor match is achieved during the bed-in process with the new pads. During this time, the ‘new’ friction material is embedded into the face of the rotors, and the old material is removed/replaced. Unless you’re using carbon/ceramic rotors, there is no incompatibility between iron rotors and organic/semi-metallic/ceramic/carbon pads.
That’s great! Thanks for spending the time to share all that and the videos I’m about to watch.
I didn’t realize that about the bed-in process. Back in the day my dad told me to do that so I did it. Makes sense.
New question… if I switch to ceramic pads, sounds like I should switch to rotors that better match that material, right? Otherwise I’m with you and only switch those if they aren’t true.
You know - it’s really amazing how much you good people are saving me. Without the help I’d almost certainly be handing out cash left and right, and this is not the best time to be doing any more of that. Yearly max out of pocket just reset today, and I will hit that yearly max again within a week. 😬
New question… if I switch to ceramic pads, sounds like I should switch to rotors that better match that material, right? Otherwise I’m with you and only switch those if they aren’t
Answer: I did not change the rotors, on the Benz or my other cars, only because of a change in pad construction. However, I urge you to do your research and make your decisions. Trusting people on the internet without verifying facts/truth is not advised.
Clarification: there is no single type of iron rotor which is more or less suited to a specific pad. That is only in the case of carbon/ceramic rotors. For our cars, any rotor which fits will work with any pad that fits.
We can debate on the best rotors based on weight, drilled/slotted, 1-pc/2-pc, etc. But none of that affects the pad/rotor interface
2018 S450 4Matic, 2021 Toyota Tundra, 2010 GL350 (sold)
Originally Posted by dmatre
However, I urge you to do your research and make your decisions. Trusting people on the internet without verifying facts/truth is not advised.
Very true. Good advice for sure.
The more I contemplate all of this the more I think OEM is the way to go. I also got some solid advice from @BenzNinja about brakes this morning which really made me more certain of OEM and replacing rotors only if needed. The brake dust is not a big deal to me. This is primarily our “going to Houston for cancer surgery and scans” car after all. We don’t drive much otherwise - 5k a year maybe between us… BEFORE getting cancer anyway.
I’ve quickly become a fan of @BenzNinja and that membership he offers. He’s a helpful, accommodating, and extremely knowledgeable guy. I’m going to write up a review of my experience working with him soon, but I’m still working with him. He gives you a LOT!
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