SL/R230: Vario Roof (Top) won't open or close all the way
12-26-2012, 07:24 PM
#1
Vario Roof (Top) won't open or close all the way
My purpose for starting this thread is to provide a thread that deals with Vario Roof Problems and Repairs and that puts all the information at the beginning of the thread so people won’t have to read two pages of posts to find the information they need.
What has prompted me to do this is: I’ve had two problems with my roof and because of those problems I ended up doing hours of online research and in doing all that research I also realized that tons of people have had problems with their vario roofs. Because of that, and another guy’s thread that I found, I thought it would be a good idea to do a thread that summarizes information solely related to the Vario Roof (Kinda like a One Stop Shop).
Additionally, I have built a Web Page (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vario.html) that basically replicates this post, but it may be easier to follow because it has the pictures next to the paragraph that it applies to, which is something I am unable to reproduce here.
Also, the Safari Browser doesn't like my web page.
1) The Top will not Open or Close all the way
If this happens you are limited to four more consecutive attempts to open or close it. If after those five attempts (one of which includes the initial attempt when you realized the problem) the system will automatically be inactivated and you’ll need to wait 10 minutes before it reactivates itself to allow five more attempts (this information is available in the Vehicle's Owners Manual).
Additionally, if the roof won’t open or close all the way you should look at the two flaps that are located on the underside of the truck lid, towards the passenger compartment end, to see if either side’s flap is hanging down from the underside of the trunk lid. If one is hanging lower then it is most likely the cause of the problem and what worked for me when I had the problem was that I lifted the low hanging flap up (I may have used a twig to hold it in place) while my wife operated the manual control switch to close the roof.
A Mercedes’ Service Manager also said that shaking the roof back and forth while someone is operating the roof’s manual control switch will sometimes free up the roof. However, it didn’t work for me.
There is a way to close the roof manually. Follow the link that follows for info and bear in mind that you’ll need the tools called out in these instructions.
http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/R230_technician/318%20Mod%203-3%20Manual%20Closing%20Vario%20Roof%20(WFF)%2001-22-02.pdf
Note: The guy that put the website (http://www.mercedestechstore.com) together is an awesome guy. I say awesome because he’s put a lot of time into building the site, I believe he helps people via email and he provides a lot of technical information for many Mercedes Models, which helps all of us Mercedes Owners.
When you go to his site click on “Access Our Training Print Files” to see a list of all the technical and repair information he provides.
2) Flap/s not tight against Underside of Truck Lid
If one or both of the above mentioned Flaps is/are hanging down from the underside of the truck lid and it has caused a problem before then it should be fixed with the repair kit because it will eventually cause a problem again if it hasn’t already.
So you know what is causing the problem, this picture
(http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vgap.jpg) shows the defective piece the repair kit will replace. The gap the arrow points to shows the bend that causes the problem. This gap is a little under 1/16 inch wide. This gap allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two on the cable pawl which cause the pad to hang down.
In other words, the gap is almost 1/16" within two inches, which is half the length of the piece that is being replaced, and it allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two.
Mercedes has manufactured a repair kit for the hanging flap problem. The Repair Kit Part Number is “A 230 750 01 11”. When you get this kit and compare the replacement parts to the old ones you will see that the replacement parts are superior in strength.
You can get the repair kit online and, although you can probably get the repair kit from several places the link that follows takes you to one site with a picture of the kit to give you an idea of what’s in it:
http://www.rmeuropean.com/Part-Number/Repair-Kit-Convertible-Top-Flap-__2307500111_GEN_5C1313F8.aspx
3) Installing the Repair Kit
Before you get started I strongly suggest you click on the below link, which will take you to a thread where a guy with the User Name “NikleinR6” put together an outstanding instructional “How To” thread with pictures that will give you an excellent overview of what you’re up against when you install the repair kit and it will also build your confidence.
Here is the link: https://mbworld.org/forums/sl-class-r230/364149-vario-roof-not-working-might-your-trunk-flap-easy-fix-diy.html .
As for NikleinR6’s Thread, he said it took him 20 minutes to install the repair part on the first side and that it took 10 minutes to do the second side. Whereas I have no reason to doubt him, for me it took about four hours to do both sides and I’ve been playing with cars as a gearhead for over 50 years so, when you do the repair, plan for four hours and hope it only takes 30 minutes.
The other thing he mentioned was the adjusting nuts, which I had to use on both sides, and they worked fine for the final pad adjustments.
Here is another link that takes you to a webpage that also provides the Mercedes WIS Instructions for removing and replacing the defective part:
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadrepair.jpg
Here is a list of tools you will need and some notes that will be helpful.
1) A 10 mm socket or wrench
2) A number 10 Torx Driver or Bit
3) A number 30 Torx Driver or bit
4) A Flat-Blade Screwdriver
In the repair kit there are two screw holes in each replacement part and four self-tapping screws. Because the screw holes don’t have threads I strongly recommend that use the self-tapping screws on the correct side of the part to start some threads before you start putting things back together. It just makes the job easier and prevents misalignment of the threads in the screw holes and once you have screwed the self-tapping screws into the replacement part only screw them in part way to hold things together. When you begin to screw the replacement part onto the gear drive the screws should to be left in a high enough position so that the separation between the two parts is enough to allow the pawl to move so the pad’s hinged arm can be pulled up into what would be the closed position (tight against the truck lid). Once you have the hinged arm pulled up enough and you've made sure the gear teeth are in proper alignment with the pawl teeth then go ahead and tighten the #30 torx screws and if the pads end up being too high, making reinstallation difficult, then loosen the screws again so the hinged arm can be repositioned lower and retighten the them.
So you understand what the above paragraph is about, when the #30 torx screws are loose enough it allows enough space between the drive gear and pawl so the pad’s arm can be moved.
There is one more thing you should be aware of: When you remove the defective part and install the repair kit’s replacement part the hole the cable goes through in the replacement part is slightly smaller that the defective part’s hole so getting the cable’s plastic bushing far enough into the hole is difficult. As can be seen in this picture (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpry.jpg) I used a screw driver to pry the bushing in far enough.
The small clamp (orange clamp pads) you see is there to keep the pawl in place so it doesn’t fall out and become detached from the cable. However, this is not a necessity.
Also, on the driver’s side there is a switch that controls the flap movement. It is the black plastic thing, which some wires are connected to, that needs to be removed with the number 10 Torx Driver as you are removing the defective part. There are two small spring-metal contacts that stick out of the switch. During removal and reinstallation of the pads be careful you don’t bend these two contacts. I say that because I did bend one of them and had to reshape it to match the good one, which was a pain.
4) Adjusting the Flaps:
After I finished reinstalling the flaps I opened and closed the roof. I then opened the trunk and found the flaps were hanging down a little bit so I loosened the counter nuts (lock nuts) and used the adjusting nuts to pull the flaps up enough so they were snug against the underside of the truck lid.
In order to loosen the counter nuts you’ll need a 17 mm open end wrench. You will also need a 12 mm open end wrench for the adjusting nut and if the counter nuts are too tight to break the two nuts apart you’ll need a 12 mm open end wrench that is thinner than normal , used in combination with the 17 mm wrench, to break the them apart.
With mine I was able to break apart the two nuts with the 17 mm wrench while holding the drive gear mechanism with channel locks.
To make the flap fit tighter against the trunk lid when it is all the way up you must turn the adjusting nut clockwise and visa versa to make it looser.
When you adjust the flaps make sure they are snug against the underside of the trunk lid to prevent noises and vibrations.
After I adjusted the pads, which worked fine, I found out the Mercedes shop manual says to do it differently. If you click on the following link you can see what the Mercedes WIS Program says.
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadadjust.jpg
5) Notes
At the http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/index.htm web page you will find eight Vario Roof PFDs dealing with such subjects as Vario Roof Diagnosis, Vario Roof Familiarization, Vario Roof (55 page overview of the Vario Roof), etc. In all there are eight PDFs related to the Vario Roof that cover just about anything you’d ever want to know about the Vario Roof. And, there's also many other PDFs that cover a lot of other information that's applicable to many Mercedes Models.
If you use this post as a reference for installing the Repair Kit and have suggestions for improving it please post your suggestions.
What has prompted me to do this is: I’ve had two problems with my roof and because of those problems I ended up doing hours of online research and in doing all that research I also realized that tons of people have had problems with their vario roofs. Because of that, and another guy’s thread that I found, I thought it would be a good idea to do a thread that summarizes information solely related to the Vario Roof (Kinda like a One Stop Shop).
Additionally, I have built a Web Page (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vario.html) that basically replicates this post, but it may be easier to follow because it has the pictures next to the paragraph that it applies to, which is something I am unable to reproduce here.
Also, the Safari Browser doesn't like my web page.
1) The Top will not Open or Close all the way
If this happens you are limited to four more consecutive attempts to open or close it. If after those five attempts (one of which includes the initial attempt when you realized the problem) the system will automatically be inactivated and you’ll need to wait 10 minutes before it reactivates itself to allow five more attempts (this information is available in the Vehicle's Owners Manual).
Additionally, if the roof won’t open or close all the way you should look at the two flaps that are located on the underside of the truck lid, towards the passenger compartment end, to see if either side’s flap is hanging down from the underside of the trunk lid. If one is hanging lower then it is most likely the cause of the problem and what worked for me when I had the problem was that I lifted the low hanging flap up (I may have used a twig to hold it in place) while my wife operated the manual control switch to close the roof.
A Mercedes’ Service Manager also said that shaking the roof back and forth while someone is operating the roof’s manual control switch will sometimes free up the roof. However, it didn’t work for me.
There is a way to close the roof manually. Follow the link that follows for info and bear in mind that you’ll need the tools called out in these instructions.
http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/R230_technician/318%20Mod%203-3%20Manual%20Closing%20Vario%20Roof%20(WFF)%2001-22-02.pdf
Note: The guy that put the website (http://www.mercedestechstore.com) together is an awesome guy. I say awesome because he’s put a lot of time into building the site, I believe he helps people via email and he provides a lot of technical information for many Mercedes Models, which helps all of us Mercedes Owners.
When you go to his site click on “Access Our Training Print Files” to see a list of all the technical and repair information he provides.
2) Flap/s not tight against Underside of Truck Lid
If one or both of the above mentioned Flaps is/are hanging down from the underside of the truck lid and it has caused a problem before then it should be fixed with the repair kit because it will eventually cause a problem again if it hasn’t already.
So you know what is causing the problem, this picture
(http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vgap.jpg) shows the defective piece the repair kit will replace. The gap the arrow points to shows the bend that causes the problem. This gap is a little under 1/16 inch wide. This gap allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two on the cable pawl which cause the pad to hang down.
In other words, the gap is almost 1/16" within two inches, which is half the length of the piece that is being replaced, and it allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two.
Mercedes has manufactured a repair kit for the hanging flap problem. The Repair Kit Part Number is “A 230 750 01 11”. When you get this kit and compare the replacement parts to the old ones you will see that the replacement parts are superior in strength.
You can get the repair kit online and, although you can probably get the repair kit from several places the link that follows takes you to one site with a picture of the kit to give you an idea of what’s in it:
http://www.rmeuropean.com/Part-Number/Repair-Kit-Convertible-Top-Flap-__2307500111_GEN_5C1313F8.aspx
3) Installing the Repair Kit
Before you get started I strongly suggest you click on the below link, which will take you to a thread where a guy with the User Name “NikleinR6” put together an outstanding instructional “How To” thread with pictures that will give you an excellent overview of what you’re up against when you install the repair kit and it will also build your confidence.
Here is the link: https://mbworld.org/forums/sl-class-r230/364149-vario-roof-not-working-might-your-trunk-flap-easy-fix-diy.html .
As for NikleinR6’s Thread, he said it took him 20 minutes to install the repair part on the first side and that it took 10 minutes to do the second side. Whereas I have no reason to doubt him, for me it took about four hours to do both sides and I’ve been playing with cars as a gearhead for over 50 years so, when you do the repair, plan for four hours and hope it only takes 30 minutes.
The other thing he mentioned was the adjusting nuts, which I had to use on both sides, and they worked fine for the final pad adjustments.
Here is another link that takes you to a webpage that also provides the Mercedes WIS Instructions for removing and replacing the defective part:
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadrepair.jpg
Here is a list of tools you will need and some notes that will be helpful.
1) A 10 mm socket or wrench
2) A number 10 Torx Driver or Bit
3) A number 30 Torx Driver or bit
4) A Flat-Blade Screwdriver
In the repair kit there are two screw holes in each replacement part and four self-tapping screws. Because the screw holes don’t have threads I strongly recommend that use the self-tapping screws on the correct side of the part to start some threads before you start putting things back together. It just makes the job easier and prevents misalignment of the threads in the screw holes and once you have screwed the self-tapping screws into the replacement part only screw them in part way to hold things together. When you begin to screw the replacement part onto the gear drive the screws should to be left in a high enough position so that the separation between the two parts is enough to allow the pawl to move so the pad’s hinged arm can be pulled up into what would be the closed position (tight against the truck lid). Once you have the hinged arm pulled up enough and you've made sure the gear teeth are in proper alignment with the pawl teeth then go ahead and tighten the #30 torx screws and if the pads end up being too high, making reinstallation difficult, then loosen the screws again so the hinged arm can be repositioned lower and retighten the them.
So you understand what the above paragraph is about, when the #30 torx screws are loose enough it allows enough space between the drive gear and pawl so the pad’s arm can be moved.
There is one more thing you should be aware of: When you remove the defective part and install the repair kit’s replacement part the hole the cable goes through in the replacement part is slightly smaller that the defective part’s hole so getting the cable’s plastic bushing far enough into the hole is difficult. As can be seen in this picture (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpry.jpg) I used a screw driver to pry the bushing in far enough.
The small clamp (orange clamp pads) you see is there to keep the pawl in place so it doesn’t fall out and become detached from the cable. However, this is not a necessity.
Also, on the driver’s side there is a switch that controls the flap movement. It is the black plastic thing, which some wires are connected to, that needs to be removed with the number 10 Torx Driver as you are removing the defective part. There are two small spring-metal contacts that stick out of the switch. During removal and reinstallation of the pads be careful you don’t bend these two contacts. I say that because I did bend one of them and had to reshape it to match the good one, which was a pain.
4) Adjusting the Flaps:
After I finished reinstalling the flaps I opened and closed the roof. I then opened the trunk and found the flaps were hanging down a little bit so I loosened the counter nuts (lock nuts) and used the adjusting nuts to pull the flaps up enough so they were snug against the underside of the truck lid.
In order to loosen the counter nuts you’ll need a 17 mm open end wrench. You will also need a 12 mm open end wrench for the adjusting nut and if the counter nuts are too tight to break the two nuts apart you’ll need a 12 mm open end wrench that is thinner than normal , used in combination with the 17 mm wrench, to break the them apart.
With mine I was able to break apart the two nuts with the 17 mm wrench while holding the drive gear mechanism with channel locks.
To make the flap fit tighter against the trunk lid when it is all the way up you must turn the adjusting nut clockwise and visa versa to make it looser.
When you adjust the flaps make sure they are snug against the underside of the trunk lid to prevent noises and vibrations.
After I adjusted the pads, which worked fine, I found out the Mercedes shop manual says to do it differently. If you click on the following link you can see what the Mercedes WIS Program says.
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadadjust.jpg
5) Notes
At the http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/index.htm web page you will find eight Vario Roof PFDs dealing with such subjects as Vario Roof Diagnosis, Vario Roof Familiarization, Vario Roof (55 page overview of the Vario Roof), etc. In all there are eight PDFs related to the Vario Roof that cover just about anything you’d ever want to know about the Vario Roof. And, there's also many other PDFs that cover a lot of other information that's applicable to many Mercedes Models.
If you use this post as a reference for installing the Repair Kit and have suggestions for improving it please post your suggestions.
Last edited by hooperdoski; 01-01-2013 at 10:51 PM. Reason: Add line about Safari Browser
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kiwigirl (04-24-2016)
03-24-2013, 07:01 AM
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GL 350
I appreciate you guys for your efforts in making the forum's worth. I am having a problem with a vehicle I am currently working on and need full technical video and full description on how to go about this repair.
Car Model: Mercedes Benz SLK 300 (Model R171)
Problem: Vario roof not working.
Using a scan tool gives
DTC 9010: The supply voltage of the control unit is too low (undervoltage). The voltage was less tha 8.5V during 5sec;
9910: S118 (Tubular frame open limit switch), S119 (Tubular frame open limit switch): switching status not plausible Both directions might be operated;
9927: The Limit switch states indicate an invalid Vario roof position.
Using Data Monitoring mode, the following where displayed:
008: Rear left power window blocking not recognized
009: Rear Left power window position down not recognized
010: Rear left power window position up not recorgnized
033: Position and function of limit switch are OK the value state NO.
036: Vario roof position not defined
Channe no. 150 to 155 does not show any value
039: Locked end position not recognize.
142: Vario roof open not recognize
145: CAN front power window down: Not recognize
146: Luggaged compactement division not closed
148: Pump Temparature 40 degC (104 deg F) *
150: Hydraulic close.......
151 Hydraulic Open........
152: Backup transistor........
153: Solenoid Valve A7/5y1......
154: Actuation of hydraulic in close direction.......
155: Actuation of hydraulic in open direction........
* Please what is the expected Temparature
Car Model: Mercedes Benz SLK 300 (Model R171)
Problem: Vario roof not working.
Using a scan tool gives
DTC 9010: The supply voltage of the control unit is too low (undervoltage). The voltage was less tha 8.5V during 5sec;
9910: S118 (Tubular frame open limit switch), S119 (Tubular frame open limit switch): switching status not plausible Both directions might be operated;
9927: The Limit switch states indicate an invalid Vario roof position.
Using Data Monitoring mode, the following where displayed:
008: Rear left power window blocking not recognized
009: Rear Left power window position down not recognized
010: Rear left power window position up not recorgnized
033: Position and function of limit switch are OK the value state NO.
036: Vario roof position not defined
Channe no. 150 to 155 does not show any value
039: Locked end position not recognize.
142: Vario roof open not recognize
145: CAN front power window down: Not recognize
146: Luggaged compactement division not closed
148: Pump Temparature 40 degC (104 deg F) *
150: Hydraulic close.......
151 Hydraulic Open........
152: Backup transistor........
153: Solenoid Valve A7/5y1......
154: Actuation of hydraulic in close direction.......
155: Actuation of hydraulic in open direction........
* Please what is the expected Temparature
06-02-2014, 05:13 PM
#3
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Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1
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SL500 R230
Simpler than it may seem
Greetings, friends from over the pond.
I bought an R230 less than 2 weeks ago, knowing very well that such a beautiful piece of engineering as the Vario Roof was likely to be the most immediate source of problems. I didn't expect to be proven correct so quickly, but here we are about 10 days into ownership and the roof would neither close nor open fully - it was almost all the way there in both directions, but one side of the boot (sorry, "trunk") lid would not close fully, which also meant that the last of the "close" operations - the closing of the rear windows - would not happen.
Interestingly, most threads and MB advice are long on side flaps, actuators, sensors etc., but try as I might I am struggling to find what I really need; a source for a replacement gudgeon pin to replace the item that has apparently turned to grey dust in the right-hand (that's offside, for UK drivers) pawl operation that closes boot/trunk lid after opening or closing the Vario Roof. Everything else is operating perfectly - it's just that one of the hydraulic lifters no longer connects with its linkage to the roof operation, so the pawl won't close properly and therefore the <<lid>> will not close fully.
Temporary fix? A piece of plastic dowel from an old kitchen refurbishment, cut to length and drifted into place using the flat of a knife and mole grips. Won't last forever, but allowed the various bits to move around as intended and the lid to drop sufficiently into place so I could lock my new pride and joy.
I'll try to post photos of the fix, in case it's useful - in all fairness I had no idea what was up and, had I had access to Google a while earlier, I would probably have just limped to an MB main dealer, safe in the knowledge that sensors, circuits and side flaps were almost certainly to blame. I don't know if anyone else has had the same problem, perhaps mine is the first of more to come?
Cheers all, enjoy your 230s; my last "blaster" was a Jaguar XKR, so now having daily fun comparing two entirely separate, but similarly fun, approaches to wide-grin motoring!
Yours aye,
Risk
PS may have to re-enact the fix for photos, as it took place by the side of the road without camera accompaniment; don't ask me why I had a plastic kitchen cabinet dowel, but no power for my 'phone camera!
I bought an R230 less than 2 weeks ago, knowing very well that such a beautiful piece of engineering as the Vario Roof was likely to be the most immediate source of problems. I didn't expect to be proven correct so quickly, but here we are about 10 days into ownership and the roof would neither close nor open fully - it was almost all the way there in both directions, but one side of the boot (sorry, "trunk") lid would not close fully, which also meant that the last of the "close" operations - the closing of the rear windows - would not happen.
Interestingly, most threads and MB advice are long on side flaps, actuators, sensors etc., but try as I might I am struggling to find what I really need; a source for a replacement gudgeon pin to replace the item that has apparently turned to grey dust in the right-hand (that's offside, for UK drivers) pawl operation that closes boot/trunk lid after opening or closing the Vario Roof. Everything else is operating perfectly - it's just that one of the hydraulic lifters no longer connects with its linkage to the roof operation, so the pawl won't close properly and therefore the <<lid>> will not close fully.
Temporary fix? A piece of plastic dowel from an old kitchen refurbishment, cut to length and drifted into place using the flat of a knife and mole grips. Won't last forever, but allowed the various bits to move around as intended and the lid to drop sufficiently into place so I could lock my new pride and joy.
I'll try to post photos of the fix, in case it's useful - in all fairness I had no idea what was up and, had I had access to Google a while earlier, I would probably have just limped to an MB main dealer, safe in the knowledge that sensors, circuits and side flaps were almost certainly to blame. I don't know if anyone else has had the same problem, perhaps mine is the first of more to come?
Cheers all, enjoy your 230s; my last "blaster" was a Jaguar XKR, so now having daily fun comparing two entirely separate, but similarly fun, approaches to wide-grin motoring!
Yours aye,
Risk
PS may have to re-enact the fix for photos, as it took place by the side of the road without camera accompaniment; don't ask me why I had a plastic kitchen cabinet dowel, but no power for my 'phone camera!
07-23-2014, 05:11 PM
#4
Newbie
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 8
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SL500
Greetings, friends from over the pond.
I bought an R230 less than 2 weeks ago, knowing very well that such a beautiful piece of engineering as the Vario Roof was likely to be the most immediate source of problems. I didn't expect to be proven correct so quickly, but here we are about 10 days into ownership and the roof would neither close nor open fully - it was almost all the way there in both directions, but one side of the boot (sorry, "trunk") lid would not close fully, which also meant that the last of the "close" operations - the closing of the rear windows - would not happen.
Interestingly, most threads and MB advice are long on side flaps, actuators, sensors etc., but try as I might I am struggling to find what I really need; a source for a replacement gudgeon pin to replace the item that has apparently turned to grey dust in the right-hand (that's offside, for UK drivers) pawl operation that closes boot/trunk lid after opening or closing the Vario Roof. Everything else is operating perfectly - it's just that one of the hydraulic lifters no longer connects with its linkage to the roof operation, so the pawl won't close properly and therefore the <<lid>> will not close fully.
Temporary fix? A piece of plastic dowel from an old kitchen refurbishment, cut to length and drifted into place using the flat of a knife and mole grips. Won't last forever, but allowed the various bits to move around as intended and the lid to drop sufficiently into place so I could lock my new pride and joy.
I'll try to post photos of the fix, in case it's useful - in all fairness I had no idea what was up and, had I had access to Google a while earlier, I would probably have just limped to an MB main dealer, safe in the knowledge that sensors, circuits and side flaps were almost certainly to blame. I don't know if anyone else has had the same problem, perhaps mine is the first of more to come?
Cheers all, enjoy your 230s; my last "blaster" was a Jaguar XKR, so now having daily fun comparing two entirely separate, but similarly fun, approaches to wide-grin motoring!
Yours aye,
Risk
PS may have to re-enact the fix for photos, as it took place by the side of the road without camera accompaniment; don't ask me why I had a plastic kitchen cabinet dowel, but no power for my 'phone camera!
I bought an R230 less than 2 weeks ago, knowing very well that such a beautiful piece of engineering as the Vario Roof was likely to be the most immediate source of problems. I didn't expect to be proven correct so quickly, but here we are about 10 days into ownership and the roof would neither close nor open fully - it was almost all the way there in both directions, but one side of the boot (sorry, "trunk") lid would not close fully, which also meant that the last of the "close" operations - the closing of the rear windows - would not happen.
Interestingly, most threads and MB advice are long on side flaps, actuators, sensors etc., but try as I might I am struggling to find what I really need; a source for a replacement gudgeon pin to replace the item that has apparently turned to grey dust in the right-hand (that's offside, for UK drivers) pawl operation that closes boot/trunk lid after opening or closing the Vario Roof. Everything else is operating perfectly - it's just that one of the hydraulic lifters no longer connects with its linkage to the roof operation, so the pawl won't close properly and therefore the <<lid>> will not close fully.
Temporary fix? A piece of plastic dowel from an old kitchen refurbishment, cut to length and drifted into place using the flat of a knife and mole grips. Won't last forever, but allowed the various bits to move around as intended and the lid to drop sufficiently into place so I could lock my new pride and joy.
I'll try to post photos of the fix, in case it's useful - in all fairness I had no idea what was up and, had I had access to Google a while earlier, I would probably have just limped to an MB main dealer, safe in the knowledge that sensors, circuits and side flaps were almost certainly to blame. I don't know if anyone else has had the same problem, perhaps mine is the first of more to come?
Cheers all, enjoy your 230s; my last "blaster" was a Jaguar XKR, so now having daily fun comparing two entirely separate, but similarly fun, approaches to wide-grin motoring!
Yours aye,
Risk
PS may have to re-enact the fix for photos, as it took place by the side of the road without camera accompaniment; don't ask me why I had a plastic kitchen cabinet dowel, but no power for my 'phone camera!
I hope you haven't forgotten about this post...I'm in the very same boat, however my fastener simply backed out and I was able to replace it.
Now, of course, the ram seems to be acting up and the trunk will still not close fully.
Up until this morning everything was working perfectly. It wasn't until I attempted to close the roof that I noticed that the "Roof Closed" message did not appear on the dash and the trunk lid would not go all the way down on the right side.
I'm guessing that it has something to do with the hydraulic ram extending farther than it usually does.
Would that cause the ram to go bad? There are no leaks that I can find after removing trim. Everything is clean.
Roof goes up and down, windows function as they should when opening and closing roof. Flaps are working - nice and tight.
Tried topping off and bleeding the pump. Didn't help.
The only message diagnostics found was Low Power Steering Fluid. I topped that off. Still the same.
Going to unbolt and tilt pump to see if maybe there is a bubble in there.
What next?
08-13-2014, 07:08 PM
#5
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SL500
As a follow-up to my post, once I was able to close the trunk by pushing down with all my weight on the front right corner of the trunk, I got the "Roof Closed" message and could drive the car without worrying about the trunk flying open.
But the problem remains. The roof goes up and down just fine, but the trunk will not follow and completely close and lock on its own - I need to push it closed.
From what I've read and been told, the Star diagnostic system might be able to reset the vario roof so that it works properly.
Any thoughts?
Thanks!
But the problem remains. The roof goes up and down just fine, but the trunk will not follow and completely close and lock on its own - I need to push it closed.
From what I've read and been told, the Star diagnostic system might be able to reset the vario roof so that it works properly.
Any thoughts?
Thanks!
04-24-2016, 12:17 AM
#6
Junior Member
My purpose for starting this thread is to provide a thread that deals with Vario Roof Problems and Repairs and that puts all the information at the beginning of the thread so people won’t have to read two pages of posts to find the information they need.
What has prompted me to do this is: I’ve had two problems with my roof and because of those problems I ended up doing hours of online research and in doing all that research I also realized that tons of people have had problems with their vario roofs. Because of that, and another guy’s thread that I found, I thought it would be a good idea to do a thread that summarizes information solely related to the Vario Roof (Kinda like a One Stop Shop).
Additionally, I have built a Web Page (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vario.html) that basically replicates this post, but it may be easier to follow because it has the pictures next to the paragraph that it applies to, which is something I am unable to reproduce here.
Also, the Safari Browser doesn't like my web page.
1) The Top will not Open or Close all the way
If this happens you are limited to four more consecutive attempts to open or close it. If after those five attempts (one of which includes the initial attempt when you realized the problem) the system will automatically be inactivated and you’ll need to wait 10 minutes before it reactivates itself to allow five more attempts (this information is available in the Vehicle's Owners Manual).
Additionally, if the roof won’t open or close all the way you should look at the two flaps that are located on the underside of the truck lid, towards the passenger compartment end, to see if either side’s flap is hanging down from the underside of the trunk lid. If one is hanging lower then it is most likely the cause of the problem and what worked for me when I had the problem was that I lifted the low hanging flap up (I may have used a twig to hold it in place) while my wife operated the manual control switch to close the roof.
A Mercedes’ Service Manager also said that shaking the roof back and forth while someone is operating the roof’s manual control switch will sometimes free up the roof. However, it didn’t work for me.
There is a way to close the roof manually. Follow the link that follows for info and bear in mind that you’ll need the tools called out in these instructions.
http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/R230_technician/318%20Mod%203-3%20Manual%20Closing%20Vario%20Roof%20(WFF)%2001-22-02.pdf
Note: The guy that put the website (http://www.mercedestechstore.com) together is an awesome guy. I say awesome because he’s put a lot of time into building the site, I believe he helps people via email and he provides a lot of technical information for many Mercedes Models, which helps all of us Mercedes Owners.
When you go to his site click on “Access Our Training Print Files” to see a list of all the technical and repair information he provides.
2) Flap/s not tight against Underside of Truck Lid
If one or both of the above mentioned Flaps is/are hanging down from the underside of the truck lid and it has caused a problem before then it should be fixed with the repair kit because it will eventually cause a problem again if it hasn’t already.
So you know what is causing the problem, this picture
(http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vgap.jpg) shows the defective piece the repair kit will replace. The gap the arrow points to shows the bend that causes the problem. This gap is a little under 1/16 inch wide. This gap allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two on the cable pawl which cause the pad to hang down.
In other words, the gap is almost 1/16" within two inches, which is half the length of the piece that is being replaced, and it allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two.
Mercedes has manufactured a repair kit for the hanging flap problem. The Repair Kit Part Number is “A 230 750 01 11”. When you get this kit and compare the replacement parts to the old ones you will see that the replacement parts are superior in strength.
You can get the repair kit online and, although you can probably get the repair kit from several places the link that follows takes you to one site with a picture of the kit to give you an idea of what’s in it:
http://www.rmeuropean.com/Part-Number/Repair-Kit-Convertible-Top-Flap-__2307500111_GEN_5C1313F8.aspx
3) Installing the Repair Kit
Before you get started I strongly suggest you click on the below link, which will take you to a thread where a guy with the User Name “NikleinR6” put together an outstanding instructional “How To” thread with pictures that will give you an excellent overview of what you’re up against when you install the repair kit and it will also build your confidence.
Here is the link: https://mbworld.org/forums/sl-class-r230/364149-vario-roof-not-working-might-your-trunk-flap-easy-fix-diy.html .
As for NikleinR6’s Thread, he said it took him 20 minutes to install the repair part on the first side and that it took 10 minutes to do the second side. Whereas I have no reason to doubt him, for me it took about four hours to do both sides and I’ve been playing with cars as a gearhead for over 50 years so, when you do the repair, plan for four hours and hope it only takes 30 minutes.
The other thing he mentioned was the adjusting nuts, which I had to use on both sides, and they worked fine for the final pad adjustments.
Here is another link that takes you to a webpage that also provides the Mercedes WIS Instructions for removing and replacing the defective part:
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadrepair.jpg
Here is a list of tools you will need and some notes that will be helpful.
1) A 10 mm socket or wrench
2) A number 10 Torx Driver or Bit
3) A number 30 Torx Driver or bit
4) A Flat-Blade Screwdriver
In the repair kit there are two screw holes in each replacement part and four self-tapping screws. Because the screw holes don’t have threads I strongly recommend that use the self-tapping screws on the correct side of the part to start some threads before you start putting things back together. It just makes the job easier and prevents misalignment of the threads in the screw holes and once you have screwed the self-tapping screws into the replacement part only screw them in part way to hold things together. When you begin to screw the replacement part onto the gear drive the screws should to be left in a high enough position so that the separation between the two parts is enough to allow the pawl to move so the pad’s hinged arm can be pulled up into what would be the closed position (tight against the truck lid). Once you have the hinged arm pulled up enough and you've made sure the gear teeth are in proper alignment with the pawl teeth then go ahead and tighten the #30 torx screws and if the pads end up being too high, making reinstallation difficult, then loosen the screws again so the hinged arm can be repositioned lower and retighten the them.
So you understand what the above paragraph is about, when the #30 torx screws are loose enough it allows enough space between the drive gear and pawl so the pad’s arm can be moved.
There is one more thing you should be aware of: When you remove the defective part and install the repair kit’s replacement part the hole the cable goes through in the replacement part is slightly smaller that the defective part’s hole so getting the cable’s plastic bushing far enough into the hole is difficult. As can be seen in this picture (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpry.jpg) I used a screw driver to pry the bushing in far enough.
The small clamp (orange clamp pads) you see is there to keep the pawl in place so it doesn’t fall out and become detached from the cable. However, this is not a necessity.
Also, on the driver’s side there is a switch that controls the flap movement. It is the black plastic thing, which some wires are connected to, that needs to be removed with the number 10 Torx Driver as you are removing the defective part. There are two small spring-metal contacts that stick out of the switch. During removal and reinstallation of the pads be careful you don’t bend these two contacts. I say that because I did bend one of them and had to reshape it to match the good one, which was a pain.
4) Adjusting the Flaps:
After I finished reinstalling the flaps I opened and closed the roof. I then opened the trunk and found the flaps were hanging down a little bit so I loosened the counter nuts (lock nuts) and used the adjusting nuts to pull the flaps up enough so they were snug against the underside of the truck lid.
In order to loosen the counter nuts you’ll need a 17 mm open end wrench. You will also need a 12 mm open end wrench for the adjusting nut and if the counter nuts are too tight to break the two nuts apart you’ll need a 12 mm open end wrench that is thinner than normal , used in combination with the 17 mm wrench, to break the them apart.
With mine I was able to break apart the two nuts with the 17 mm wrench while holding the drive gear mechanism with channel locks.
To make the flap fit tighter against the trunk lid when it is all the way up you must turn the adjusting nut clockwise and visa versa to make it looser.
When you adjust the flaps make sure they are snug against the underside of the trunk lid to prevent noises and vibrations.
After I adjusted the pads, which worked fine, I found out the Mercedes shop manual says to do it differently. If you click on the following link you can see what the Mercedes WIS Program says.
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadadjust.jpg
5) Notes
At the http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/index.htm web page you will find eight Vario Roof PFDs dealing with such subjects as Vario Roof Diagnosis, Vario Roof Familiarization, Vario Roof (55 page overview of the Vario Roof), etc. In all there are eight PDFs related to the Vario Roof that cover just about anything you’d ever want to know about the Vario Roof. And, there's also many other PDFs that cover a lot of other information that's applicable to many Mercedes Models.
If you use this post as a reference for installing the Repair Kit and have suggestions for improving it please post your suggestions.
What has prompted me to do this is: I’ve had two problems with my roof and because of those problems I ended up doing hours of online research and in doing all that research I also realized that tons of people have had problems with their vario roofs. Because of that, and another guy’s thread that I found, I thought it would be a good idea to do a thread that summarizes information solely related to the Vario Roof (Kinda like a One Stop Shop).
Additionally, I have built a Web Page (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vario.html) that basically replicates this post, but it may be easier to follow because it has the pictures next to the paragraph that it applies to, which is something I am unable to reproduce here.
Also, the Safari Browser doesn't like my web page.
1) The Top will not Open or Close all the way
If this happens you are limited to four more consecutive attempts to open or close it. If after those five attempts (one of which includes the initial attempt when you realized the problem) the system will automatically be inactivated and you’ll need to wait 10 minutes before it reactivates itself to allow five more attempts (this information is available in the Vehicle's Owners Manual).
Additionally, if the roof won’t open or close all the way you should look at the two flaps that are located on the underside of the truck lid, towards the passenger compartment end, to see if either side’s flap is hanging down from the underside of the trunk lid. If one is hanging lower then it is most likely the cause of the problem and what worked for me when I had the problem was that I lifted the low hanging flap up (I may have used a twig to hold it in place) while my wife operated the manual control switch to close the roof.
A Mercedes’ Service Manager also said that shaking the roof back and forth while someone is operating the roof’s manual control switch will sometimes free up the roof. However, it didn’t work for me.
There is a way to close the roof manually. Follow the link that follows for info and bear in mind that you’ll need the tools called out in these instructions.
http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/R230_technician/318%20Mod%203-3%20Manual%20Closing%20Vario%20Roof%20(WFF)%2001-22-02.pdf
Note: The guy that put the website (http://www.mercedestechstore.com) together is an awesome guy. I say awesome because he’s put a lot of time into building the site, I believe he helps people via email and he provides a lot of technical information for many Mercedes Models, which helps all of us Mercedes Owners.
When you go to his site click on “Access Our Training Print Files” to see a list of all the technical and repair information he provides.
2) Flap/s not tight against Underside of Truck Lid
If one or both of the above mentioned Flaps is/are hanging down from the underside of the truck lid and it has caused a problem before then it should be fixed with the repair kit because it will eventually cause a problem again if it hasn’t already.
So you know what is causing the problem, this picture
(http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vgap.jpg) shows the defective piece the repair kit will replace. The gap the arrow points to shows the bend that causes the problem. This gap is a little under 1/16 inch wide. This gap allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two on the cable pawl which cause the pad to hang down.
In other words, the gap is almost 1/16" within two inches, which is half the length of the piece that is being replaced, and it allows the drive gear to skip a tooth or two.
Mercedes has manufactured a repair kit for the hanging flap problem. The Repair Kit Part Number is “A 230 750 01 11”. When you get this kit and compare the replacement parts to the old ones you will see that the replacement parts are superior in strength.
You can get the repair kit online and, although you can probably get the repair kit from several places the link that follows takes you to one site with a picture of the kit to give you an idea of what’s in it:
http://www.rmeuropean.com/Part-Number/Repair-Kit-Convertible-Top-Flap-__2307500111_GEN_5C1313F8.aspx
3) Installing the Repair Kit
Before you get started I strongly suggest you click on the below link, which will take you to a thread where a guy with the User Name “NikleinR6” put together an outstanding instructional “How To” thread with pictures that will give you an excellent overview of what you’re up against when you install the repair kit and it will also build your confidence.
Here is the link: https://mbworld.org/forums/sl-class-r230/364149-vario-roof-not-working-might-your-trunk-flap-easy-fix-diy.html .
As for NikleinR6’s Thread, he said it took him 20 minutes to install the repair part on the first side and that it took 10 minutes to do the second side. Whereas I have no reason to doubt him, for me it took about four hours to do both sides and I’ve been playing with cars as a gearhead for over 50 years so, when you do the repair, plan for four hours and hope it only takes 30 minutes.
The other thing he mentioned was the adjusting nuts, which I had to use on both sides, and they worked fine for the final pad adjustments.
Here is another link that takes you to a webpage that also provides the Mercedes WIS Instructions for removing and replacing the defective part:
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadrepair.jpg
Here is a list of tools you will need and some notes that will be helpful.
1) A 10 mm socket or wrench
2) A number 10 Torx Driver or Bit
3) A number 30 Torx Driver or bit
4) A Flat-Blade Screwdriver
In the repair kit there are two screw holes in each replacement part and four self-tapping screws. Because the screw holes don’t have threads I strongly recommend that use the self-tapping screws on the correct side of the part to start some threads before you start putting things back together. It just makes the job easier and prevents misalignment of the threads in the screw holes and once you have screwed the self-tapping screws into the replacement part only screw them in part way to hold things together. When you begin to screw the replacement part onto the gear drive the screws should to be left in a high enough position so that the separation between the two parts is enough to allow the pawl to move so the pad’s hinged arm can be pulled up into what would be the closed position (tight against the truck lid). Once you have the hinged arm pulled up enough and you've made sure the gear teeth are in proper alignment with the pawl teeth then go ahead and tighten the #30 torx screws and if the pads end up being too high, making reinstallation difficult, then loosen the screws again so the hinged arm can be repositioned lower and retighten the them.
So you understand what the above paragraph is about, when the #30 torx screws are loose enough it allows enough space between the drive gear and pawl so the pad’s arm can be moved.
There is one more thing you should be aware of: When you remove the defective part and install the repair kit’s replacement part the hole the cable goes through in the replacement part is slightly smaller that the defective part’s hole so getting the cable’s plastic bushing far enough into the hole is difficult. As can be seen in this picture (http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpry.jpg) I used a screw driver to pry the bushing in far enough.
The small clamp (orange clamp pads) you see is there to keep the pawl in place so it doesn’t fall out and become detached from the cable. However, this is not a necessity.
Also, on the driver’s side there is a switch that controls the flap movement. It is the black plastic thing, which some wires are connected to, that needs to be removed with the number 10 Torx Driver as you are removing the defective part. There are two small spring-metal contacts that stick out of the switch. During removal and reinstallation of the pads be careful you don’t bend these two contacts. I say that because I did bend one of them and had to reshape it to match the good one, which was a pain.
4) Adjusting the Flaps:
After I finished reinstalling the flaps I opened and closed the roof. I then opened the trunk and found the flaps were hanging down a little bit so I loosened the counter nuts (lock nuts) and used the adjusting nuts to pull the flaps up enough so they were snug against the underside of the truck lid.
In order to loosen the counter nuts you’ll need a 17 mm open end wrench. You will also need a 12 mm open end wrench for the adjusting nut and if the counter nuts are too tight to break the two nuts apart you’ll need a 12 mm open end wrench that is thinner than normal , used in combination with the 17 mm wrench, to break the them apart.
With mine I was able to break apart the two nuts with the 17 mm wrench while holding the drive gear mechanism with channel locks.
To make the flap fit tighter against the trunk lid when it is all the way up you must turn the adjusting nut clockwise and visa versa to make it looser.
When you adjust the flaps make sure they are snug against the underside of the trunk lid to prevent noises and vibrations.
After I adjusted the pads, which worked fine, I found out the Mercedes shop manual says to do it differently. If you click on the following link you can see what the Mercedes WIS Program says.
http://pages.suddenlink.net/budnsha/vpadadjust.jpg
5) Notes
At the http://www.mercedestechstore.com/pdfs/index.htm web page you will find eight Vario Roof PFDs dealing with such subjects as Vario Roof Diagnosis, Vario Roof Familiarization, Vario Roof (55 page overview of the Vario Roof), etc. In all there are eight PDFs related to the Vario Roof that cover just about anything you’d ever want to know about the Vario Roof. And, there's also many other PDFs that cover a lot of other information that's applicable to many Mercedes Models.
If you use this post as a reference for installing the Repair Kit and have suggestions for improving it please post your suggestions.
Where is the best place for me to get this part to New Zealand?
Thanks in advance
