pfarah77

Hey all,

I typically lurk in the W204 area as I currently own a 2012 C250 Coupe (Lunar Blue) with 54k miles. She's in wonderful shape as I'm extremely proactive with her maintenance schedule.

So... why am I here? Well, I've been researching the R230 models for the past few months, learning about some of their weak areas (Suspension, roof, camshaft sensors/seals), but have fallen in love with the style and how they answer the need/want for two distinct driving experiences. Having said this, I just found a 2008 SL550 for sale with 75k miles near my hometown. The CarFax report verifies all maintenance performed at (primarily) two MB dealerships with a substantial amount of work completed within the past 5 months. It's currently located at an indie shop which specializes in European automobiles; a couple friends of mine have used them exclusively on their Porsche's.

I took the car on a test drive yesterday after work and everything works as it should. One of the facility's owners is a master mechanic and just replaced the roof lift shocks along with what other repairs/updates needed. No strange sounds and operates very smoothly. He will also flush the ABC system (Rodeo procedure) as a courtesy while performing a full inspection - detail prior to delivery. In fact, the only item that hasn't been replaced (based on CarFax) is the fuel filter; I'm sure I can negotiate that job.

They're asking $21,500.00, which appears to be a fair price. The question I'm leading up to is: Does it make any sense to trade my 2012 (4 years younger with 20k less miles) for the SL? I understand the financial aspect of these cars but there's really not much out there that can compare IMHO. Would this be a dumb move...? I appreciate any feedback, thanks!

BTW: the exterior is a bronze-gray with the beige interior along with new tires.

Patrick

pfarah77

Oh, I almost forgot; an extended warranty is available (haven't discussed cost yet).

Rudeney

If you are going to rely on a mechanic to maintain the car, my advice would be keep your W204. That is, unless you are willing to budget a few grand a year for maintenance and repairs. The car WILL need ABC parts, and there are plenty of other things that can go wrong, too, that are no worries on your W204.

Hary Gahtoe

Key factors to this SL550; overall mileage and amount of work done <5 months.

These cars become exponentially expensive for repairs at this mileage range. It was sold because of that. Just depends how much you want to shell out.
Warranty will not be cheap because they know what breaks and its a bet they will pay for > 50% of average repairs on your car.
Ask the shop how much an ABC front valve block and 2 front struts cost to replace. That's approximately 1/3 of a ABC system that normally dies @< 100,000 mi.
Big $$$'s are going to be spent in this cars near future.
If you're down with this, the overall drive can be quite enjoyable
Good Luck. You're going to need it if you choose an SL.

FWIW; Maybe ask yourself why or search this forum on why would they have NOT already done a Rodeo on the car unless they know it's already past normal service wear AND quite possibly kill the valve blocks and Accumulator and maybe even the ABC pump.
Most dealerships won't perform a Rodeo unless you basically sign a waiver

bobterry99

I don't think so. I would note that from my reading of the forums the owners that experience major ABC problems involving pumps, struts, and hoses seem to consistently have 65K-75K miles on their vehicles, and the '08 car is in this range. That said, only a small fraction of SL owners participate in forums, and I am very wary of drawing any conclusions based upon statistics over such a small sample.

Hary Gahtoe

R230's will bite your wallet. There is no time limit or mileage range and it Will happen to a statistically large segment of all cars not just some by a few on this or other MB forum

Hary Gahtoe

Bobterry; I take it you own an R230?
Have you got any mileage close to 100,000 ?

bobterry99

I have a 15-year-old SL500 with 50K miles that has been poorly maintained. Nevertheless ABC repairs have totaled about $20 for an o-ring and a litre of Pentosin, and all out-of-warranty repairs have totaled around $500.

gafitanu

My wife's SL has 100K. I replaced the o-rings on the front ABC block valves myself a few years back for a few $. The ABC pump took me a long time to swap and that was $300. I had only one problem that needed the dealer and that was the dreaded ignition switch that was about $1500 but I believe that problem was solved by 2008 together with the valve o-rings.
On the plus side all the components and the design of the car is truly exceptional, not one engineering rule being bypassed for the sake of cost cutting as I see even in my W211. The original brake pads and rotors lasted 100k (really got tired of them) the ball joints are tight like new. As a mechanical engineer I am amazed at the design of the lower control arm (wouldn't want to be that designer's spouse though).
After working on it I came to the conclusion that they are indeed worth $100+ for what they offer.
If the 550 engine falls outside of the bad sprocket period I would go for it, it's an awesome ride.

Hary Gahtoe

I don't want to come off as a Debbie Downer but I wouldn't want a hydraulic system with 15 yrs and no regular filter replacement and a flush done every 5 yrs regardless of mileage. If you open the reservoir and it smells burnt chances are it's got a lot of crap floating in it.
Same as the lifetime trans.

carguyshu

My SL55 absolutely destroys the bushing in the lower control arms that the front struts attach to. The original owner had to have them replaced at around 40k miles and now the car has a little over 80k and they are again completely hammered, so I have to disagree with you on the greatness of the lower control arm design.

If the car was serviced at a dealer, ask for a VMI, which would show every service and repair ever done at the dealer.

If you can't DIY, then an R230 can get expensive fast. With the top, there are 2 flap covers that go bad, and the front solenoid that operates the latch is usually the first to go (on my car the previous owner had to replace them both at 50k miles and the flaps at 80k are about to break again). The 2 struts you mentioned that were just replaced are about the cheapest and easiest common issue to fix on the car. If it doesn't have a power trunk closer, then you can also expect the soft close trunk mechanism to go bad (if it hasn't already) every 40k, unless you epoxy shut several useless check valve ports.

Regardless of what maintenance has been done to the ABC system or how well it was cared for, hoses will start going on it eventually. There is just no way around it. They start by weeping at the crimped ends as an early warning sign and the 2 that go to the front 2 struts and the one that goes from the pump to the pressure control valve are the first to go, due to engine heat. If you don't replace them as a preventative measure, then there will be a time one explodes and if you don't shut the car off quickly enough the ABC pump will begin ingesting air and will blow up and also need replaced (which is not cheap).

The accumulators will also need to be replaced approx. every 10 years or 100k. While not all cars will show obvious signs when they go (often when one goes bad another will pick up the slack to the point where most test in STAR won't show them as bad), they are merely rubber membranes that are going to deteriorate with age. While the ABC system will still work when these are worn out, it will place lots of extra stress on both hoses and pumps. Plan on replacing all 4 as soon as you buy the car (if you buy it) as preventative.

The so-called updated ABC that came in 07+ cars did very little to add to reliability. The accumulator that was on the pressure control valve is now directly on the pump, which slightly improves the life of the hose that goes from pump to pressure control valve, but makes it so the accumulator is a lot harder to replace. The newer style valve blocks look different, but are going to have no better reliability compared to the original design as the problem is o rings wear out and/or dirt particles prevent a good seal. They are the same basic design and this flaw is not fixed (nor can it really be fixed). The other thing the new ABC system does is slightly open close the valve blocks off and on when the car is sitting, which puts slightly less pressure on the system. Over the years some hoses were improved, but again any hydraulic hose subjected to age, heat and pressure will eventually fail. The reason there haven't been as many complaints with the 07+ ABC system is that the cars are just now starting to age out enough to start having problems, and there were very very very few cars built in 07/08 compared to earlier years.

If you buy one, get the extended warranty. It will pay for itself as long as it covers everything. Some won't cover the SBC unit or ABC. The SBC brake unit, btw, needs replaced every 300k brake actuations, which usually happens between 80k and 120k miles. Wholesale that part is $800 and requires 2 hours to replace as well as a couple more hours of labor to bleed the brake system. The only way to properly bleed the system is with a dealer STAR tool. You can get a lot of fluid out without a STAR, but not all and a STAR is required to do it correctly. I typically see dealers charge around $1600 for the part and labor to do the SBC unit, which this car will need soon.

I would also disagree with the statement that no corners were cut engineering wise. My car has gone through 2 plastic supercharger idler pulleys in 80k miles and 3 other idler pulleys were cracked and about to go when I upgraded them to aftermarket metal units as preventative maintenance. The seals are also poorly designed for all of the hydraulic actuators and a substandard material was used. For a few extra dollars those seals could have had at least double the life expectancy compared to OEM (top hydraulics rebuilds these actuators with the better seals). The hydraulic top motor was also inferior in later model cars compared to earlier motors (another thing I learned from top hydraulics). The transmission electrical connector is also a joke and if not regularly replaced will actually allow transmission fluid to wick up through the wires leading to the transmission computer and ruin it (when I purchased my car this had already happened, but luckily enough fluid hadn't been dumped into the TCU to short it out and ruin it yet).

There are other common problems with the car and in the next month of so I plan on writing up an very extensive buyers guide and maintenance/repair guide of the common faults and how to fix. This is a complex car with numerous systems that have many common issues and was engineered during the darker days when Daimler/Chrysler existed together.

pfarah77

Wow, thanks everyone! While I'm no expert MB mechanic, I've been on the driving side of a wrench for over 35 yrs (pre-teenager being taught by my dad. I do perform some simple stuff on my C Class but have totally restored an order Porsche and many motorcycles. The shop does offer an extended warranty so I most likely purchase that if I decide to buy the car. I appreciate the feedback!

pfarah77

Here's the CarFax report; I'm curious on the Viti MB suspension checks. Perhaps they replaced parts but wouldn't know unless I contact the dealer.

Rudeney

Sounds like pretty much every other modern MBZ. I've had the same results on all of mine - W163, W203, W209.

Great advice! Some dealers are hesitant to give this to customers because it does contain personal info on previous owners, but that can easily be redacted.

That's only an issue on the 722.6 5-speed. The 722.9 7-speed carries the TCU internally, so only power and CAN bus wiring is needed for the connector and that hardly ever leaks. Even the large connector on the 722.6 shouldn't leak if the pilot bushing seal is replaced with the revised part.

FYI, there was ZERO crossover engineering from Chrysler to MBZ. Only the opposite - MBZ providing tech and engineering to Chrysler. Any quality issues that occurred during that time period were strictly the result of MBZ management and engineering decisions. One of those decisions was to implement the most cutting-edge technology. There were lots of growing pains there. Still are.

Rudeney

So given that, my advice is buy it if it's what you want. If you get the warranty and it covers ABD, SBC and other systems, great. If not, then invest in SDS and learn to use it and use the forums and you'll be good to go.

pfarah77

Advise well taken. I'm revisiting the car in the AM and will make my final decision. Either way, I greatly appreciate all the comments.

SLron

I would appreciate you advise on where to learn about capabilities of SDS and what system is best to buy at a reasonable cost.

Heatwave

Do you like it? Do you enjoy driving it? Do you want it?

If "yes," then buy the car, put the top down, and enjoy the drive. If for any reason you later become dissatisfied, it's easy to sell.

MB SLs are in a class by themselves. They turn heads wherever they go. Buy it, drive it, and never look back. And welcome to the forum.

pfarah77

Ok guys, I bit the bullet this afternoon; my wife came along and also loved the car. I did purchase a 48 month/48,000 mile comprehensive extended warranty so I feel I made a good decision.

The exterior color is actually Pewter (723) with Stone Leather interior. Options include the following:
-Electronic Trunk Closer
-P01 Premium 1 Pkg. = Active ventilated seats, multi-contour seats, Bi-Xenon headlamps, corner-illuminating fog lamps, Keyless Go.

The shop has/will perform the following before I take delivery in a few days:
-Engine oil/filter change
-New fuel filter
-ABC system flush/filter
-Recondition brakes
-Rear deck flap update
-Four brand new tires
-Full detail and touch-up a few rock chips

Also, I have all original books and the window sticker ($101,065.00 MSRP), both keys, all tools including the air pump and un-opened first-aid kit. It's time to read this forum seriously! Thanks, again, to all respondents and look forward to fully enjoying my new toy.

Rudeney

Congrats! Love the pewter color.

Rudeney

We probably need a whole new forum for SDS. It's a very complex suite of tools designed for trained technicians. However, if you are very tech savvy, and are willing to invest some time with it, you can learn it. To purchase a copy, I'd check DHGATE (sort of a Chinese eBay). You can get a plug-and-play system, including laptop, for under $700, or, if you want to save some money, get the multiplexer hardware there for around $250, then find a "free" download of the software.

Icarus747

Kelley Blue Book or NADA comes to mind for pricing to see if they are fair or gouging you

SLron

Is ther a step by step with pictures repair manual for the SL Class R 230? Where can I purchase it?

Heatwave

pfarrah77: Congratulations on your new scoot. You chose well. Great looking car! It's the best color you can get if you can't get Mars Red. I hope you and your wife enjoy many miles and smiles in the newest addition to your garage. Suggestion: stow the roll bar ... if you get into a situation in which it's necessary, it will deploy automatically.

There were a flew aircraft I once flew ... I haven't been an old man all my life. Everytime I walked away after a hop, I'd turn around and walk backwards, just soaking in their beauty and power and grace. I do that every time I park my SL550 ... and I hope you do too.

Welcome to the forum.

Rudeney

Get WIS - it's all over eBay for under $30. If you decide to DIY, then SDS (Star Diagnosis) is a MUST and it includes WIS.