Long shot question, 55 swapped E430 lean issue
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 341
Likes: 6
From: Chicago, IL
2001 E430, 2002 ML55
Long shot question, 55 swapped E430 lean issue
Here we go, I have an 01 W210 E430 which has the 5.5 M113 from an W210 E55. I've had the ECU flashed to the W210 E55 stock tune as well.
Threw a wideband on to check AFR pre-cat and the car threw a Check Engine light due to the missing pre-cat O2 sensor. This should throw the car into open loop.
With the car in open loop, my AFR are 15 under idle and I struggle to get anything under 15 under any loading.
All sensors are good, MAF / MAP are both functioning properly. Fuel pressure stays at 60 psi (at rail) always.
I've been thinking of unplugging the Air Pump and maybe mess with EGR as well?
I'm currently stuck and trying to band-aid something so that I'm no running so lean. Even thought of bumping up the voltage of the MAF so that the ECU thinks more air is coming in.
Any suggestions guy? I know the C43 guys usually do the 55 swap but thought I ask here!
Thanks
Threw a wideband on to check AFR pre-cat and the car threw a Check Engine light due to the missing pre-cat O2 sensor. This should throw the car into open loop.
With the car in open loop, my AFR are 15 under idle and I struggle to get anything under 15 under any loading.
All sensors are good, MAF / MAP are both functioning properly. Fuel pressure stays at 60 psi (at rail) always.
I've been thinking of unplugging the Air Pump and maybe mess with EGR as well?
I'm currently stuck and trying to band-aid something so that I'm no running so lean. Even thought of bumping up the voltage of the MAF so that the ECU thinks more air is coming in.
Any suggestions guy? I know the C43 guys usually do the 55 swap but thought I ask here!
Thanks
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 324
Likes: 37
From: Somerset MA
2001 E55 1999 E55 2001 ML55 2017 C43
Here we go, I have an 01 W210 E430 which has the 5.5 M113 from an W210 E55. I've had the ECU flashed to the W210 E55 stock tune as well.
Threw a wideband on to check AFR pre-cat and the car threw a Check Engine light due to the missing pre-cat O2 sensor. This should throw the car into open loop.
With the car in open loop, my AFR are 15 under idle and I struggle to get anything under 15 under any loading.
All sensors are good, MAF / MAP are both functioning properly. Fuel pressure stays at 60 psi (at rail) always.
I've been thinking of unplugging the Air Pump and maybe mess with EGR as well?
I'm currently stuck and trying to band-aid something so that I'm no running so lean. Even thought of bumping up the voltage of the MAF so that the ECU thinks more air is coming in.
Any suggestions guy? I know the C43 guys usually do the 55 swap but thought I ask here!
Thanks
Threw a wideband on to check AFR pre-cat and the car threw a Check Engine light due to the missing pre-cat O2 sensor. This should throw the car into open loop.
With the car in open loop, my AFR are 15 under idle and I struggle to get anything under 15 under any loading.
All sensors are good, MAF / MAP are both functioning properly. Fuel pressure stays at 60 psi (at rail) always.
I've been thinking of unplugging the Air Pump and maybe mess with EGR as well?
I'm currently stuck and trying to band-aid something so that I'm no running so lean. Even thought of bumping up the voltage of the MAF so that the ECU thinks more air is coming in.
Any suggestions guy? I know the C43 guys usually do the 55 swap but thought I ask here!
Thanks
If your interested in finding out your true A/F plug your O2 back in and weld a bung after your post O2 sensor for the A/F to get a correct reading.
Steve
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 341
Likes: 6
From: Chicago, IL
2001 E430, 2002 ML55
I don't understand what your trying to do here? You removed the pre-O2 forced the car into open loop and your wondering why it's lean. The car is designed to run in closed loop and use the O2 to stabilize the A/F. Your not suppose to read your A\F before your O2 sensors because it's not a correct reading.
If your interested in finding out your true A/F plug your O2 back in and weld a bung after your post O2 sensor for the A/F to get a correct reading.
Steve
If your interested in finding out your true A/F plug your O2 back in and weld a bung after your post O2 sensor for the A/F to get a correct reading.
Steve
The idea is to see if the car defaults to a "safe tune" as it would when your O2 sensors fail. A car running in open loop doesn't do any fuel trimming to adjust fuel delivery allowing it to increase/decrease fuel based on conditions.
I do agree that I need to weld a bung in and see whats going on with the ECU adjusting fuel. Have you done this and what seemed to be the most convenient pre cat location?
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 324
Likes: 37
From: Somerset MA
2001 E55 1999 E55 2001 ML55 2017 C43
Thanks for your response
The idea is to see if the car defaults to a "safe tune" as it would when your O2 sensors fail. A car running in open loop doesn't do any fuel trimming to adjust fuel delivery allowing it to increase/decrease fuel based on conditions.
I do agree that I need to weld a bung in and see whats going on with the ECU adjusting fuel. Have you done this and what seemed to be the most convenient pre cat location?
The idea is to see if the car defaults to a "safe tune" as it would when your O2 sensors fail. A car running in open loop doesn't do any fuel trimming to adjust fuel delivery allowing it to increase/decrease fuel based on conditions.
I do agree that I need to weld a bung in and see whats going on with the ECU adjusting fuel. Have you done this and what seemed to be the most convenient pre cat location?
You said you couldn't get under 15:1 A/F when under a load. How did you apply the load?
Steve
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 341
Likes: 6
From: Chicago, IL
2001 E430, 2002 ML55
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 324
Likes: 37
From: Somerset MA
2001 E55 1999 E55 2001 ML55 2017 C43
If it were me I would put the O2 back in and put the car on the dyno to make sure everything is good.
As far as you trying to see if it will run safe with a bad O2 I would verify that who ever upload the E55 maps to your car installed the open loop map as well as the closed loop. I don't think you have the correct maps.
During open loop the only factor for the car to try and keep the fuel trims in check are the MAS/MAP and temp sensor.
Who changed the maps and what software did they use? I'm looking for a way to tune my car myself.
Steve
As far as you trying to see if it will run safe with a bad O2 I would verify that who ever upload the E55 maps to your car installed the open loop map as well as the closed loop. I don't think you have the correct maps.
During open loop the only factor for the car to try and keep the fuel trims in check are the MAS/MAP and temp sensor.
Who changed the maps and what software did they use? I'm looking for a way to tune my car myself.
Steve
Last edited by turbo1k; Apr 21, 2016 at 09:11 PM.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 341
Likes: 6
From: Chicago, IL
2001 E430, 2002 ML55
Yea Dyno seems and another bung seem to be the only thing in continuing forward. Dont want to show up to dyno with bad readings where I have to forfeit runs.
I went to Eurocharged in Chicago. They used their genius tuner (something like that) just to upload tune through OBDII.
I'd like to tune myself as well. Have only been able to find flashes from tuners. Might end up going back to Chicago and have them figure it all out.
I went to Eurocharged in Chicago. They used their genius tuner (something like that) just to upload tune through OBDII.
I'd like to tune myself as well. Have only been able to find flashes from tuners. Might end up going back to Chicago and have them figure it all out.
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Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 324
Likes: 37
From: Somerset MA
2001 E55 1999 E55 2001 ML55 2017 C43
Yea Dyno seems and another bung seem to be the only thing in continuing forward. Dont want to show up to dyno with bad readings where I have to forfeit runs.
I went to Eurocharged in Chicago. They used their genius tuner (something like that) just to upload tune through OBDII.
I'd like to tune myself as well. Have only been able to find flashes from tuners. Might end up going back to Chicago and have them figure it all out.
I went to Eurocharged in Chicago. They used their genius tuner (something like that) just to upload tune through OBDII.
I'd like to tune myself as well. Have only been able to find flashes from tuners. Might end up going back to Chicago and have them figure it all out.
Steve
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Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 324
Likes: 37
From: Somerset MA
2001 E55 1999 E55 2001 ML55 2017 C43
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 341
Likes: 6
From: Chicago, IL
2001 E430, 2002 ML55
Quick update after a long time. I decided to have Kleemann flash my ECU and it turns out that Eurocharged gave me the wrong 5.5 AMG stock map. The map they gave me was for the SLK55 which has a compression ratio of 10.5:1 (along with other differences) while the W210 E55 has a compression ratio of 10:1.
I verified AFR with the wideband and everything is spot on! Learned my lesson and now I know who to visit for Mercedes tuning!
I verified AFR with the wideband and everything is spot on! Learned my lesson and now I know who to visit for Mercedes tuning!
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 324
Likes: 37
From: Somerset MA
2001 E55 1999 E55 2001 ML55 2017 C43
Quick update after a long time. I decided to have Kleemann flash my ECU and it turns out that Eurocharged gave me the wrong 5.5 AMG stock map. The map they gave me was for the SLK55 which has a compression ratio of 10.5:1 (along with other differences) while the W210 E55 has a compression ratio of 10:1.
I verified AFR with the wideband and everything is spot on! Learned my lesson and now I know who to visit for Mercedes tuning!
I verified AFR with the wideband and everything is spot on! Learned my lesson and now I know who to visit for Mercedes tuning!
Any chance Eurocharged will give you a refund? Worth a shot. Steve
