*** VR550 for M113 55 Kompressor ***
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Banned
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From: Southern California
S600TT, R350
*** VR550 for M113 55 Kompressor ***
Although there have been dynoes done on 175 mm pulley before, we would like to start from scratch and build a car with our parts, one part at a time.
Our first performance stage will be called VR550. 550 represents HP level.
We have discussed AMGs HP rating of M113 Kompressor engine in the past. In E and CLS it is rated at 469HP, in CL, SL, S and G it is rated at 493HP. In reality it makes the same power in all chassis and it is very close to 500HP. (One exception is 2003 and 2007/2008 SL55s, those had 80 mm TBs from the factory and were rated at 510HP).
On average, 55s make between 410-430 RWHP. If we use 420 as an average number, and 16%-17% drivetrain loss - 420/0.84 = 500HP.
Our goal is to add another 50HP (45RWHP) through our crank pulley kit and custom software tune. So, we have selected an 2006 E55 with 18K miles for testing and development purposes.
As you can see on the graph below, this car is a perfectly average E55 with 420RWHP.
Tomorrow, we are going to install our pulley kit and see what kind of power it adds, than we are going to tune it with Powerchip assistance and we should be at our goal of 465 RWHP.
Stay Tuned!
Our first performance stage will be called VR550. 550 represents HP level.
We have discussed AMGs HP rating of M113 Kompressor engine in the past. In E and CLS it is rated at 469HP, in CL, SL, S and G it is rated at 493HP. In reality it makes the same power in all chassis and it is very close to 500HP. (One exception is 2003 and 2007/2008 SL55s, those had 80 mm TBs from the factory and were rated at 510HP).
On average, 55s make between 410-430 RWHP. If we use 420 as an average number, and 16%-17% drivetrain loss - 420/0.84 = 500HP.
Our goal is to add another 50HP (45RWHP) through our crank pulley kit and custom software tune. So, we have selected an 2006 E55 with 18K miles for testing and development purposes.
As you can see on the graph below, this car is a perfectly average E55 with 420RWHP.
Tomorrow, we are going to install our pulley kit and see what kind of power it adds, than we are going to tune it with Powerchip assistance and we should be at our goal of 465 RWHP.
Stay Tuned!
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From: Portsmouth, NH
none
You guys are doing great! Seems you are filling the voids all the other tuners couldn't. Congrats.
As far as your sig, you've got sexier pics to choose from. Long tubes...cams...etc.
As far as your sig, you've got sexier pics to choose from. Long tubes...cams...etc.
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From: Caribbean/Florida/Colorado
E-ZGO 53hp., 1999 E 430 sport, 2004 E 55, 2008 Tahoe LTZ on 24"s
FWIW
One other bit of information to address regarding the base dyno would be if the car underwent the air pump flash.
Seems that could be 30 to 40 hp. needed just to get back to stock (420 RWHP).
One other bit of information to address regarding the base dyno would be if the car underwent the air pump flash.
Seems that could be 30 to 40 hp. needed just to get back to stock (420 RWHP).
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Southern California
S600TT, R350
You guys are doing great! Seems you are filling the voids all the other tuners couldn't. Congrats.
As far as your sig, you've got sexier pics to choose from. Long tubes...cams...etc
As far as your sig, you've got sexier pics to choose from. Long tubes...cams...etc
I just threw the sig together. Over the weekend I will have more time to make it prittier..............
One other bit of information to address regarding the base dyno would be if the car underwent the air pump flash.
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'03 E55, Range Rover Sport Supercharged, Ducati 748R
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From: Southern Cali (Ontario)
very nice Vadim.
hopefully.. Stage 1 VRP with Intercooler set up will be tested before you add the headers and TB's.
stage 1 with intercooler for me is the perfect set up, without spendin too much money on the other goodies.
hopefully.. Stage 1 VRP with Intercooler set up will be tested before you add the headers and TB's.
stage 1 with intercooler for me is the perfect set up, without spendin too much money on the other goodies.
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Out Of Control!!
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: San Diego
2015 S212
That isn't just "that" car, its OEM E55s. That is why I have always hesitated on ECU mapping. It is really an intricate balance that MB tries to do with the A/F ratios. Adding a pulley should (in theory) raise the A/F back up some, but my guess is that the dyno with just pulley will show similar, IF NOT LOWER, A/F ratios at the top end. That is because the ECU steps in at some point and dumps enough fuel to keep the area safe. This is exactly why they say an empty gas tank is the most dangerous, since it has the most vapor gases (which is what blow). So, to get power it seams that you have to intervien and I don't know where the safety factor goes then. It is definitely all too comlicated for me, but it is fun to see.
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From: Southern California
S600TT, R350
UPDATE:
We are currently datalogging the car and working on TQ limiting maps.
E55 is 2006 and as soon at sees more than 12.5 psi it pulls timing, richens fuel mixture below 10:1 and opens bypass valve. Powerchip is returning from vacation next week and we will continue tuning.
Stay Tuned!
We are currently datalogging the car and working on TQ limiting maps.
E55 is 2006 and as soon at sees more than 12.5 psi it pulls timing, richens fuel mixture below 10:1 and opens bypass valve. Powerchip is returning from vacation next week and we will continue tuning.
Stay Tuned!
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Joined: May 2004
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From: Richmond Hill, Ontario
2003 E55 AMG
We gotta get it next to Vic's old 55 and see how close they are... its a good benchmark.. Then we can add more JUICE... hehehehehe...
BTW, did you try the M6 yet?
BTW, did you try the M6 yet?
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From: OC, CA
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From: Northern VA
06 e55 wagon
Really looking forward to the results on the completed package(s). Great work so far guys, keep the info coming!
Is the 'panic mode' of seeing too much boost and pulling timing/dumping fuel something that was already known (wouldn't the other tuners have hit this already) or was this a surprise on the '06?
Ready to foolishly spend some (arguably according to my wife) disposable income
...
Is the 'panic mode' of seeing too much boost and pulling timing/dumping fuel something that was already known (wouldn't the other tuners have hit this already) or was this a surprise on the '06?
Ready to foolishly spend some (arguably according to my wife) disposable income
...
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: San Diego
2015 S212
Really looking forward to the results on the completed package(s). Great work so far guys, keep the info coming!
Is the 'panic mode' of seeing too much boost and pulling timing/dumping fuel something that was already known (wouldn't the other tuners have hit this already) or was this a surprise on the '06?
Ready to foolishly spend some (arguably according to my wife) disposable income ...
Is the 'panic mode' of seeing too much boost and pulling timing/dumping fuel something that was already known (wouldn't the other tuners have hit this already) or was this a surprise on the '06?
Ready to foolishly spend some (arguably according to my wife) disposable income
...I've argued this point for well over a year now, because I had information before it even came out. Do searches and you'll see that I have put up a challenge to any tuner to "crack" the code and I would buy it. The thing is, it isn't just for '06 cars built in '06; it is for any E55 that has a current dealer flash.
Lucky for me, VRP was working with PC on some tunes and I happenned to bring up my concerns again. Thanks to VRUS for stepping up and acknowledging that he had heard of the same thing and so PC took it as a challenge. With Vadim gathering data and Jeremy tuning, things are finally getting somewhere. They definitely have found the right levers to pull, but just need to figure out the setings. As we've all known, tuning takes time. It takes Dyno data and real life data and that is exactly what VRP / PC are doing. I LOVE IT!!
By the way, I heard yesterday that the 80mm TB stops the issue? Maybe less air velocity.
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2004 E55 AMG and 2003 C320 4Matic Miss my 993 Turbo above!!
I thought, Oliver @ Evotech, who customizes ECU tuning has/had it all figured out. I had my ECU shipped to Adam and Oliver did his thing. Perhaps Adam or anyone else could chime in................
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I think it is particularly interesting that most E55s on the road probably have the upgrade software flash, which means that many people with mods are really getting the extra hp they think they are. Believe me, with an upgraded pulley, you can actually make less hp than stock! I am surprised more people don't dyno their cars after mods.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: San Diego
2015 S212
In the end, a VRP pulley with PC tune vs EVOTech tune will be nice to see. It isn't that I don't think that Adam / Oliver can do it (since they are actually the best pair to attempt it), I just do not believe that they have dedicated the resources to it as VRP / PC have. That is why I am so happy with VRP. They don't just say, "you want stage 1". They listen to what I want and also go about it in a very systematic way. It just makes you feel comfy to leave your car in their hands. Vadim still thinks my tune has a long way to go. I think it is pretty fast as is and all of you know how picky I am
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: San Diego
2015 S212
I think it is particularly interesting that most E55s on the road probably have the upgrade software flash, which means that many people with mods are really getting the extra hp they think they are. Believe me, with an upgraded pulley, you can actually make less hp than stock! I am surprised more people don't dyno their cars after mods.
VERY VERY true. That is VRP's exact point. That is also why they do not only rely on dyno data. All a larger pulley does is increase boost. From there, all the various parameters are effected and many are pulled out of their sweet spots. Tuning entails finding each and every one of those parameters and maximizing the sweet spot. True tunes are an absolutely tedious task.
