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E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil

 
Old 04-04-2017, 03:10 PM
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2006 CLS55 AMG
E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil

Hello all,

I've been trying to find a concrete answer regarding the rear end (differential) in all of the E55 and CLS55 cars. I've read about 25 different forum threads from various websites and they all seem to say different things. I've been trying to figure out what differential oil to use in my car.

1. Do the E55 and CLS55 cars have Limited Slip Diffs (LSD)? Some websites say they all do and the P030 performance package cars just have a more locking version of it. True? False? I can say that on asphalt, when I hammer it, it leaves 2 tire marks, not one.

2. On some websites, they advertise 75W-90 synthetic gear oil and others claim 75W-140 for LSD cars. Has anyone got a non-p030 car that has run either the 75W-90/75W-85 (according to local dealership) or the 75W-140?




This dictates an 85W-90 oil for the non performance package cars, but this isn't my manual, my manual says 75W-85 hypoid gear oil.

See how confusing this can be? Should be very simply laid out. Lets get the questions answered for all of those who have asked.

Thanks,
Pete.
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Old 04-04-2017, 05:07 PM
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WIS is clear. The 55's take the Castrol Limited Slip 75w-140w.

The manual is confusing in that it says "hypoid gear oil" which makes you think its the regular Hypoid 85w (or whatever it is) but they actually are referencing the MB 235.61 AMG-Hypoidgetriebeol specification which is the AMG spec 75w-140w for limited slip.

The 55's also do not have limited slip gearing per say (which you can easily see from a lift when you turn the wheels), but the SBC system holds the wheels electronically just like a 40% limited slip system. In fact, on the 030 models which have a locking differential they have to disable the SBC's limited slip functionality and it runs in "limited mode" (about 10%) only for emergencies. This is mostly due to SBC braking individual inside wheels around turns for stability... this portion of the SBC system has to be disabled when it's being done mechanically in the rear.

They all use the same differential oil.

See screenshots.
Attached Thumbnails E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-img_2424.jpg   E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-capture.jpg  

Last edited by equitiesguy; 04-04-2017 at 05:10 PM.
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Old 04-04-2017, 09:50 PM
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This is very interesting. I've never put or seen anyone put the Castrol 75-140 in anything other than locking diff cars. I do see what you mean though with that wis document. However if you look through wis for documents for actual repairs with the differential you will see a different document link for the specified fluids and this one specifies the standard 75-85 fluid which is what I've always seen used.
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Old 04-05-2017, 04:15 AM
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This is what I meant when I said in the other thread that you're an idiot giving people the wrong information in a half assed manner. Then this poor gentleman uses the wrong oil because you're clueless, and ends up having problems down the road.

Since you want to go by "repair information in WIS" let's start with AR35.31-P-0520TX which is the document in WIS for removing and replacing the rear differential on a CLS55 (I'm using that as my reference since I'm using my VIN for WIS and the OP is driving the same, but it's the same on the 211 E55 obviously).









Step 20 references correctly checking the rear differential oil as part of the repair process with a separate document : AR35.31-P-0520-03TX.







That leads us to the correct filling capacities and fluids via BF35.31-P-1003-01P.




And finally we reach the important page that matters.





And now we reach the point of my post:

Option one is document BB00.40-P-0235-07A for the regular 75-85w hypoid oil is for all W211/W219 NON AMG VEHICLES.

Option Two, and the correct option for W211/W219.376 AMG VEHICLES, is BB00.40-P-0235-61A. This is the same information I provided the original poster, and the correct information, calling for the castrol syntrax.






You clearly don't know how to use WIS, and have no idea what the hell you're talking about. Most of the information I see you provide is half assed and wrong, like the above.

And, obviously, if you called the dealer they would give you the correct information which is the Castrol, but I provided the correct WIS information to the OP to assuage his doubts.
Attached Thumbnails E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-capture.jpg   E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-capture2.jpg   E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-capture3.jpg   E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-capture4.jpg   E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-capture5.jpg  


Last edited by equitiesguy; 04-05-2017 at 04:50 AM.
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Old 04-05-2017, 09:57 AM
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Ok now lets do the same steps using a vin from an E55 instead of CLS and you will see the discrepancy. Since you are so good with WIS this should be easy for you to follow on your own to see with your own eyes.

Here is the same work procedure for r and r rear diff except for this is E55 document AR35.31-P-0520T




Then see step 19 for checking fluid level gives you document AR35.31-P-0520-03l




and we get BF35.31-P-1003-01L which will show you that the specified oil document is BB00.40-P-0235-07A




and here is the WIS specified fluid for E55 rear diff A0019893303 75W-85


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Old 04-05-2017, 10:11 AM
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Also here is a nice sheet that breaks down the different fluid types and their usage. You can see that 235.61 is only for locking diffs and the 235.7 is specified for limited slip and for standard rear diff as well.


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Old 04-05-2017, 09:08 PM
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I put some kinda royal purple stuff in mine. 75-90 I think.
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Old 04-05-2017, 09:54 PM
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Hey all,

thank you for all the replies. I'm not looking to cause a pissing contest regarding who knows how to use WIS or not. Nor do I want any arguments here on this thread. We are all car owners and we should be looking out for the best interest of everyone. We have all been in a bind and asked for help, the person who helped you is a saint, and the ones who didn't are a $$holes right?

Equitiesguy, thanks for your detailed step by step, according to that, all 55AMG cars/trucks should be using the 75w-140 oil. Whether it be castrol, Fuchs, or total (they all make it to the same spec) they should all perform the same. No need to hate on Rocman8, everyone makes mistakes.

Rocman8, your last image that mentions all of the different models and body codes (211-e55 and 219-cls) as AMG vehicles, theyreally listed as castrol 75w-140 oils, that's where the "dot" lands on the chart, correct?

I'm not trying to diss anyone or cause a ***** storm, just trying to get the facts straight so that we can all use the correct fluid for our cars!

cheers,
Pete.
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Old 04-05-2017, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by pmgiarrizzo View Post
Hey all,

thank you for all the replies. I'm not looking to cause a pissing contest regarding who knows how to use WIS or not. Nor do I want any arguments here on this thread. We are all car owners and we should be looking out for the best interest of everyone. We have all been in a bind and asked for help, the person who helped you is a saint, and the ones who didn't are a $$holes right?

Equitiesguy, thanks for your detailed step by step, according to that, all 55AMG cars/trucks should be using the 75w-140 oil. Whether it be castrol, Fuchs, or total (they all make it to the same spec) they should all perform the same. No need to hate on Rocman8, everyone makes mistakes.

Rocman8, your last image that mentions all of the different models and body codes (211-e55 and 219-cls) as AMG vehicles, theyreally listed as castrol 75w-140 oils, that's where the "dot" lands on the chart, correct?

I'm not trying to diss anyone or cause a ***** storm, just trying to get the facts straight so that we can all use the correct fluid for our cars!

cheers,
Pete.
Yes that last picture I posted shows a lot of AMG models but if you read before that it says "rear axle with AMG differential lock". And we don't have a locking differential so that means that column doesn't apply to us. Did you read my step by step clearly showing how wis states 75-85 as the correct fluid? I do agree that if you run through wis with a cls55 it directs you to that other page showing 75-140 and I know the standard cls55 uses the exact same diff as e55 so that's where I see wis obviously has a discrepancy. Anyways use what you guys want but as you can see in my last post locking diffs only is 75-140 and limited slip and standard diffs are 75-85 or 85-90
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Old 04-06-2017, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Rocman8 View Post
Yes that last picture I posted shows a lot of AMG models but if you read before that it says "rear axle with AMG differential lock". And we don't have a locking differential so that means that column doesn't apply to us. Did you read my step by step clearly showing how wis states 75-85 as the correct fluid? I do agree that if you run through wis with a cls55 it directs you to that other page showing 75-140 and I know the standard cls55 uses the exact same diff as e55 so that's where I see wis obviously has a discrepancy. Anyways use what you guys want but as you can see in my last post locking diffs only is 75-140 and limited slip and standard diffs are 75-85 or 85-90
Good Point, equitiesguy, anything to contribute beyond what you have already?

I'm not trying to be a referee but it would be great to have the discrepancy corrected so that when people are doing this service and they all search the forums and create another 1000 threads about it, hopefully this one comes up.

Let's go with 2 scenarios:

1- Lets say the cars call for the 75W-140, and I swap my current fluid for the 75W-140 (more than likely a 75W-85 or 85W-90 based on the last service that was done). According to my local MB dealer, its supposed to be 75W-85 with my VIN number. However, the dealer has never ever even heard of the 75W-140, so therefore, take their consideration with a grain of salt. They also couldnt answer as to whether my car had an LSD or not. Again, take it with a grain of salt.

Assuming all goes well I drive around and nothing destroys itself.

2. I ordered the 75W-140 fluid, and if our cars actually call for the 75w-85 or 75W-90 or 85W-90, what's the outcome? Topics all over say you can run limited slip oils in non-limited slip diffs, the extra friction modifiers tend to "help" since the limited slip will usually see more sliding force between the pinion and ring gear. Would that not help our case out in the end? Or would the viscosity be too high and cause too much heat?

Anyone to chime in would be great. Especially those who are running big HP without swapping the OEM Differential out. I'd be curious to know what oils you're running.

Equitiesguy, are you running the 75W-140 in your CLS55 AMG? Is it a P030 car? If not, it should make it have the same specs as my car. If you run the 75W-140, has it ever caused you any issues? Has the differential ever become really hot? When you change the fluid, is it still relatively clear when being changed?

Thanks,
Pete.

Last edited by pmgiarrizzo; 04-06-2017 at 07:27 AM.
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Old 04-06-2017, 09:13 AM
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Looks like I need to change mine again. It's a P030 car, and I really don't remember what is in it. Thanks for the clarity guys, I'll pick up some 75w-140.
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Old 04-06-2017, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by StarvingArtist View Post
Looks like I need to change mine again. It's a P030 car, and I really don't remember what is in it. Thanks for the clarity guys, I'll pick up some 75w-140.
See, at least some good has come of this thread! haha. So for the P030 cars, lets assume that they need the 75W-140 oil.

For the non P030 cars, what have we determined? 75W-140 or the regular oils (75W-85 or 75W-90 or 85W-90) all three would perform similarly.

Cheers,
Pete.
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Old 04-10-2017, 10:17 AM
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Well, I just thought I'd make a post about the oil I've used in my CLS55. No one seems to have responded further other than equitiesguy in PM's. He firmly believes in the 75W-140 Limited Slip oil and that's what I've used. I ordered Fuch's Sintopoid 75W-140 Limited Slip oil and have driven the car all weekend. I won't be that guy and say "yah man my car puts down 50 more hp now". Quite honestly, I cant even tell the difference. And I really don't think any one would be able to tell. So the 75W-140 is a viable option for those who were on the fence. It works.

Cheers,
Pete.
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Old 04-11-2017, 05:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Rocman8 View Post
Also here is a nice sheet that breaks down the different fluid types and their usage. You can see that 235.61 is only for locking diffs and the 235.7 is specified for limited slip and for standard rear diff as



You do know SBC acts like a limited slip/differential lock, and this is reason for using the increased viscosity oil? Read your own image for christ sake. You didn't notice those are all SBC cars?

This document is SPECIFICALLY calling for the 75-140 in ALL those AMG models.

Come on man, stop giving people information that will end up costing them thousands of dollars.

Your 211 repair documents are end of life, and were never updated to reflect what's recommended now. Just as the 722 transmission used to be lifetime fluid in your car, but never was in my CLS, I would recommend then you never change yours, since its "lifetime" --- even though we have the exact same transmission, and my documents call for changes every 40k miles (which I change every 20).

Last edited by equitiesguy; 04-11-2017 at 06:03 AM.
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Old 04-11-2017, 05:20 AM
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Originally Posted by pmgiarrizzo View Post
Good Point, equitiesguy, anything to contribute beyond what you have already?

I'm not trying to be a referee but it would be great to have the discrepancy corrected so that when people are doing this service and they all search the forums and create another 1000 threads about it, hopefully this one comes up.

Let's go with 2 scenarios:

1- Lets say the cars call for the 75W-140, and I swap my current fluid for the 75W-140 (more than likely a 75W-85 or 85W-90 based on the last service that was done). According to my local MB dealer, its supposed to be 75W-85 with my VIN number. However, the dealer has never ever even heard of the 75W-140, so therefore, take their consideration with a grain of salt. They also couldnt answer as to whether my car had an LSD or not. Again, take it with a grain of salt.

Assuming all goes well I drive around and nothing destroys itself.

2. I ordered the 75W-140 fluid, and if our cars actually call for the 75w-85 or 75W-90 or 85W-90, what's the outcome? Topics all over say you can run limited slip oils in non-limited slip diffs, the extra friction modifiers tend to "help" since the limited slip will usually see more sliding force between the pinion and ring gear. Would that not help our case out in the end? Or would the viscosity be too high and cause too much heat?

Anyone to chime in would be great. Especially those who are running big HP without swapping the OEM Differential out. I'd be curious to know what oils you're running.

Equitiesguy, are you running the 75W-140 in your CLS55 AMG? Is it a P030 car? If not, it should make it have the same specs as my car. If you run the 75W-140, has it ever caused you any issues? Has the differential ever become really hot? When you change the fluid, is it still relatively clear when being changed?

Thanks,
Pete.

I have a Non 030 CLS55 and Ive been running Castrol for years because that's what belongs in the car. It takes 3 of the little bottles of Castrol ($45 total) when I do it (it's like 2.5 when full). I'm a fan of Castrol, and I run the european formula engine oil, and I use the Castrol for the rear. I've never heard of the Fuch's, but as long as it's the same spec, I don't think you'll have any significant issues.

Call Miami Beach Pete. They have the best AMG service center in Florida and know what belongs in the car if you have a question.

I attached the side image of the castrol bottle with the Mercedes parts sticker on it. No idea why this dealer "hasn't heard of it" Pete.
Attached Thumbnails E55 AMG or CLS55 AMG Differential Oil-img_2426.jpg  

Last edited by equitiesguy; 04-11-2017 at 05:40 AM.
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Old 04-11-2017, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by equitiesguy View Post
You do know SBC acts like a limited slip/differential lock, and this is reason for using the increased viscosity oil? .
i am confused now as i read through this -- but i dont agree that you lump limited and locking as the same using SBC to simulate function as that is the whole discussion being the difference between locking diff and limited slip for oil selection -- to be clear i have not looked ito this any further than reading through this ****storm
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Old 04-11-2017, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by equitiesguy View Post
You do know SBC acts like a limited slip/differential lock, and this is reason for using the increased viscosity oil? Read your own image for christ sake. You didn't notice those are all SBC cars?

This document is SPECIFICALLY calling for the 75-140 in ALL those AMG models.

Come on man, stop giving people information that will end up costing them thousands of dollars.

Your 211 repair documents are end of life, and were never updated to reflect what's recommended now. Just as the 722 transmission used to be lifetime fluid in your car, but never was in my CLS, I would recommend then you never change yours, since its "lifetime" --- even though we have the exact same transmission, and my documents call for changes every 40k miles (which I change every 20).
Ok, in my image all those cars are SBC cars? Interesting because only 3 out of those 14 models use SBC. The document is calling for that fluid in all those models "if" they are equipped with a locking differential. SBC has nothing to do with the diff fluid. You say my W211 wis documents are "end of life" but you can see the dates are 2011 whereas your 219 documents are dated 2006 and 2009.

Actually your 2006 CLS55 factory service sheet calls for transmission service "once" at 40k just like my service sheet shows since they are after 2005.
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Old 08-25-2017, 02:24 AM
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Hey Guys, don't get too upset MB makes these things very complicated and have contradicting info all over the place. I have been trying to figure this out myself and am also confused. Do you have more info on SBC functioning like LSD? Also I have been looking through every MB vehicle and almost every car except the CLS and E55 have different differentials for vehicles with limited slip. When looking in EPC they only give one single option for every e55 and CLS55 nothing coded with 471 or P30 does anyone happen to know how that is even possible if there are different options?

Also if you look into a E63 211 which doesn't even have SBC it will specify the same oil the castrol so it also contradicts what you are saying with SBC needing catrol since it does not have sbc and it says use castrol in WIS. I think the data may even be wrong in WIS.

If you look in the owners manual it's calling for some after-market fluid which I looked in google and it's the same spec and the universal gear oil

WDBUF77X09B398242

Fuchs Titan EG 5010D /
Mercedes-Benz MB 235.7 --
FE-Hypoidgetriebeöl 0019893303



Last edited by JonMBZ; 08-25-2017 at 02:27 AM.
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