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Chinese Longtubes vs Reputable Midís

Old 11-20-2018, 05:45 PM
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Chinese Longtubes vs Reputable Midís

hello, Iím wondering what your folks opinion is on buying some XSP Longtubes as opposed to mids from a reputable company like eurocharged or kleemann. I do recall a thread posted by a member here a while back that showed true performance gain by switching from eurocharged mids to maximizer longtubes. is all the extra labour cost associated with the poor fitment of the longtubes worth it in the end? Or am I better off getting mids and not having to worry about quality?

Would love to hear some input from people who use these XSP/Maximizer headers on their vehicles as they are on sale at the VRP website so I would like to pick them up if they are worth it and not a big hassle installment wise

thanks
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Old 11-20-2018, 06:36 PM
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Have a look at the YouTube video Alex did on these (legitstreetcars). It doesn't look worth it to me personally but it's not a right/wrong decision. Some people have no issues, others have on going problems. I would pay the $3k for quality long tubes or use the cheap mid lengths depending on my budget as they have far fewer fitment issues than longtubes. Depends what you are willing to deal with.
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Old 11-20-2018, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by failboat View Post
hello, I’m wondering what your folks opinion is on buying some XSP Longtubes as opposed to mids from a reputable company like eurocharged or kleemann. I do recall a thread posted by a member here a while back that showed true performance gain by switching from eurocharged mids to maximizer longtubes. is all the extra labour cost associated with the poor fitment of the longtubes worth it in the end? Or am I better off getting mids and not having to worry about quality?

Would love to hear some input from people who use these XSP/Maximizer headers on their vehicles as they are on sale at the VRP website so I would like to pick them up if they are worth it and not a big hassle installment wise

thanks
I made that thread. Hands down it was worth it. Gained over a car length in a roll race and saw 1.8 mph more at the drag strip at high DA. Dropped close to 1psi of boost when i switched to these long tubes from the mids as well. I have the Maximizers on my E55 and fitment was pretty good. I had an exhaust shop add V-Bands. The clamps that come with it aren't the best. I helped my friend install his XS Power headers and that was a pain. Had to take it to an exhaust shop to adjust the mid pipe to get it to fit and add v-bands.
Maximizer> XS Power is my vote.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Maximizer-H....c100005.m1851

Last edited by Das_it16; 11-20-2018 at 07:33 PM.
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Old 11-20-2018, 07:37 PM
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Originally Posted by tw2 View Post
Have a look at the YouTube video Alex did on these (legitstreetcars). It doesn't look worth it to me personally but it's not a right/wrong decision. Some people have no issues, others have on going problems. I would pay the $3k for quality long tubes or use the cheap mid lengths depending on my budget as they have far fewer fitment issues than longtubes. Depends what you are willing to deal with.

thanks for the info, iíve read that the Kleemann/eurocharged mids are also prone to cracking. little bit torn...i really dont want to drop 3k for ARH/MBH headers but it seems like every other header has some sort of issue
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Old 11-20-2018, 07:45 PM
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They should all be reasonably resistant to cracking with good engine mounts. Grab the black series mounts or poly if you can deal with the vibration.
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Old 11-20-2018, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Das_it16 View Post
I made that thread. Hands down it was worth it. Gained over a car length in a roll race and saw 1.8 mph more at the drag strip at high DA. Dropped close to 1psi of boost when i switched to these long tubes from the mids as well. I have the Maximizers on my E55 and fitment was pretty good. I had an exhaust shop add V-Bands. The clamps that come with it aren't the best. I helped my friend install his XS Power headers and that was a pain. Had to take it to an exhaust shop to adjust the mid pipe to get it to fit and add v-bands.
Maximizer> XS Power is my vote.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Maximizer-H....c100005.m1851

Very impressive! any issues so far with the maximizers? I was told by VRP guy that the XSP and maximizer headers are a carbon copy of each other and that there really are no differences
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Old 11-20-2018, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by failboat View Post
Very impressive! any issues so far with the maximizers? I was told by VRP guy that the XSP and maximizer headers are a carbon copy of each other and that there really are no differences
I did put a ratchet strap over the engine mounts to prevent them from over extending and cause the header to rub when I got WOT or throttle. The strap also helps extend the life of the mount. The OEM mounts are rated for factory power. Other than that no issues.

I donít know how true that is but Iíve seen and installed both. The Maximizers come sand blasted, a lifetime warranty, a decent merge spoke and the mid section fits great. The XS Power weíre a living hell. The collectors had leaks and the mid section is not bolt on. We made it work with the help of an exhaust shop rewelding the collectors and modifing the midsection to get it to fit.
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Old 11-21-2018, 12:14 AM
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Both junk,but the l.t eBay are better overall
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Old 11-21-2018, 12:54 AM
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Originally Posted by oneslow55 View Post
Both junk,but the l.t eBay are better overall
can you elaborate please
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Old 11-21-2018, 02:34 PM
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Maximizer and XSP are virtually identical, XSP have flex pipes.
Alex just made a great video where he swapped from mids to Longtubes, watch to the end for the final result (TLDR: They fit with minimal modification, no rubbing, noticeable difference in power)



XSP are on sale right now

https://vrpspeed.com/index.php?route...product_id=393

We will be removing maximizer and OBX from our site in the near future as these have replaced them entirely. we have sold over 60 sets of the XSP, and generally all feedback has been good.
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Old 11-22-2018, 05:34 AM
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You get what you pay for. A pair of merge collectors from Burns Stainless will cost more than all these complete 'headers' mentioned in this thread. If you want to squeeze every single BHP out of your engine you go with equal length headers. If you just want more noise, you'll be fine with whatever your budget allows.
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Old 11-22-2018, 07:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Alex L View Post
You get what you pay for. A pair of merge collectors from Burns Stainless will cost more than all these complete 'headers' mentioned in this thread. If you want to squeeze every single BHP out of your engine you go with equal length headers. If you just want more noise, you'll be fine with whatever your budget allows.
Is equal lenght headers available for w211?
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Old 11-23-2018, 03:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Alex L View Post
You get what you pay for. A pair of merge collectors from Burns Stainless will cost more than all these complete 'headers' mentioned in this thread. If you want to squeeze every single BHP out of your engine you go with equal length headers. If you just want more noise, you'll be fine with whatever your budget allows.
LT headers will make more power than the stock OEM exhaust. 40-50 whp is nothing to sneer at. It's not just noise, it's power. Are equal length headers better, usually yes. (Non Turbo)
Is the money difference worth the difference in power between equal length and LT? Lot of variables.

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Old 11-23-2018, 04:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Fountain35 View Post
Is the money difference worth the difference in power between equal length and LT?
I doubt it. The performance is likely to be very similar between long tubes and specifically designed equal length. Of course properly designed headers are probably engineered to a quality where you get zero fitment issues and no reliability problems, maybe this brings the value for money in some cases.
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Old 11-23-2018, 09:40 AM
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Zero fitment issues
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Old 11-23-2018, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by cnterline View Post

Zero fitment issues
which headers are those?
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Old 11-23-2018, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by tw2 View Post
I doubt it. The performance is likely to be very similar between long tubes and specifically designed equal length. Of course properly designed headers are probably engineered to a quality where you get zero fitment issues and no reliability problems, maybe this brings the value for money in some cases.
one thing that baffles me is how MBH headers produce great power 40whp+ but then people have success with other chinese branded headers too and seem to be making great power. if all these longtubes are making 40whp+ due to the stock manifolds being extremely restrictive, is the premium we pay for mbh/arh just for qualify/fitment?
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Old 11-23-2018, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by duccen View Post
Is equal lenght headers available for w211?
No. Equal length headers make zero quantifiable difference in power on a blown V8. They can change the note, however.
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Old 11-23-2018, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by duccen View Post
Is equal lenght headers available for w211?
Yes.

Originally Posted by Fountain35 View Post
LT headers will make more power than the stock OEM exhaust. 40-50 whp is nothing to sneer at. It's not just noise, it's power. Are equal length headers better, usually yes. (Non Turbo)
Is the money difference worth the difference in power between equal length and LT? Lot of variables.
Almost anything will be better than standard log manifold.

Originally Posted by AMG-SVT-FTW View Post
No. Equal length headers make zero quantifiable difference in power on a blown V8. They can change the note, however.
Wrong on both accounts.
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Old 11-23-2018, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Alex L View Post



Wrong on both accounts.
Prove it.
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Old 11-23-2018, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Alex L View Post
Almost anything will be better than standard log manifold.
Alex,
I don't know if the slight difference due to the scavenging effect between EL and LT is much of a difference. Do you have any quantifiable evidence to show it does?

BTW: I lived in Farnbourough (North East Hampshire) many years back.

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Old 11-23-2018, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by failboat View Post
which headers are those?
MBH stamp on the side if you look closely.

I'd be more worried of the metallurgy used in Chinese headers versus American made. I am assuming the MBH and ARH header material is USA manufactured. Chinese metals are shi#.
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Old 11-23-2018, 04:03 PM
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I will be going the headers route as well, I get worried about quality since I had a really bad experience once. I had a 01 M3 and put headers on that and the leak and a big one at that was in between were all the pipes come and connect to. No matter what we did couldn't plug it up. Didn't want to pull it off and maybe fix it and put it back on. Even so on that car it was big gains I felt an immediate difference so I can only imagine on our engine 40+rwhp is a lot.
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Old 11-23-2018, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by AMG-SVT-FTW View Post
Prove it.
Lemme see...

1. You said equal length headers donít exist. I have them in my car.

2. I gained over 50whp by replacing Kleemann headers with them.

Pics and graphs in my Instagram somewhere.
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Old 11-23-2018, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Fountain35 View Post
Alex,
I don't know if the slight difference due to the scavenging effect between EL and LT is much of a difference. Do you have any quantifiable evidence to show it does?

BTW: I lived in Farnbourough (North East Hampshire) many years back.
I havenít done any tests on EL vs other Chinese crap, only Kleemann. My EL are in fact LT - the runners are 22.5Ē each. Iím in the process of fabbing a slightly bigger EL set for my E55 and will be going with tri-y collectors this time as I want to try and separate gases from consecutive firing cylinder in each bank. Positive pressure plays very little role in exhaust pulsing so whether itís a ďblown V8Ē or a N/A flat 6 is irrelevant. The car will have a bigger and less restrictive exhaust this time too so result might not be as clear cut but I will dyno the two sets for scientific purposes.

PS: Hampshire is nice. Iím an hour north of London in Bedfordshire. It has the least amount of annual precipitation in the UK which is great.

Last edited by Alex L; 11-23-2018 at 04:55 PM.
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