AMGJAY

So it's quite obvious we all admire the AMG brand line up, but why is that? Why did you buy an E63 over the M5? Or any M.

Was it looks? Performance? Big engine?

Personally I love my E63 and I love it for the big engine and the sound it can produce, but sometimes I wish we had the M transmission which feels 10x more connected to the car with the abrupt actions it can produce. The M tranny can shift so fast it's unbelievable, yet the MCT feels very lazy and sluggish. I feel that it really messes with the experience of the car.

Celicasaur

Looks, rarity, baller factor, looks, interior...
And once bought, I was delighted with the handling and the looks once modified.

If the E60 wasn't so ugly, that would have been much higher on my list. But then it got trumped with the W212 being newer and more fancy.

joseyu

For me, it all came down to a difference in philosophy between the Mercedes AMG versus the BMW M. Having driven the more recent M3, M4, M5, and M6s it has become apparent that these M cars are too smart to the point that it has become nerdy and a little boring to drive. They are definitely fast cars, but lack emotion when being driven. AMG on the other hand has a certain rawness in its character that exudes an attitude while being driven. It may not be as fast an M car in some cases, but this bad attitude makes it more fun to drive. I think AMG cars can be perfectly summed up as being a hooligan in a Hugo Boss suit, while BMW M cars are like a businessman in a Brooks Brothers suit.

PeterUbers

Awd and the good looks of the e class

Was actually very happy with my 2014 e550 sedan but thanks to a crap trans I made Benz buy it back and got into the amg hoping the mct was smoother and it was

The M5 just didn't do it for me, looks, sound, no awd

Some other thoughts from a recent thread

https://mbworld.org/forums/w212-amg/...bo-rs7-m5.html

megasaurus

if my e63 could take a dump it would be bmw

AMGJAY

Very nice generalizations made regarding the suits! I understand exactly what you are talking about.

I agree regarding the amount of fun it is to drive our AMG's. Two things I love about the BMW is their amazing handling. Feels more secure and held to the ground around rough cornering and I love their transmission. It's much more closer to a manual than our MCT.

Other than that I can't compromise for the sound of the M156 and the way it delivers power.

If I had the M tranny in my AMG I would never have a complaint!

Davidkuo0330

+10000000

joseyu

This great handling car with a M-like tranny and AMG engine that you seek is called the AMG GT-S. I drove the GT-S at COTA a couple of weeks ago and fell in love with the car immediately. The DCT in this car is leaps and bounds better than the MCT and is very similar to the M-DCT or PDK. There is no lag or hesitation from a stop and manual up- or down- shifts are nearly instanteanous. In fact, I loved this car so much that within a week of returning from COTA, I pre-traded my M6 to the dealer and will be receiving a GT-S in April. There is no doubt that the M6 was a fast car and a relatively good handler for its weight, but it just didn't drum up any strong emotions like what I felt after 5 minutes in the GT-S.

cadeca

I really loved the early M5s, but the cars have gotten progressively bigger and softer. Others have mentioned the styling, handling and engines. Add in the artificial engine sounds and a disproportionately high ratio of db M drivers...the current model was not something I considered.

cadeca

And of course, no wagon...

abhatti55

To me you get more for the money with the M5. With extended leather the interior is leaps and bounds nicer. More gadgets (HUD, better speedo, infotainment, sound system. Soft close doors, rear heated seats, four zone climate controls. Have you compared the front seat bw the two not even close. To each his own, but with all this combined it just makes for a better a package especially for a daily driver. Take a look at the undercarriage bw both cars, the M means business.

6G Schnell

Because I owned M's
And E60 M5 was a wake up call
Should have switched to AMG long time ago....

AMGJAY

Very valid points made here. I am jealous of the HUD, Soft Close, Rear Heated Seats, and 4 Zone Climate. I wish these were all options on my year, but they weren't. I'm really big on options and even the little ones make a large difference.

I suppose Mercedes didn't offer them to E-Class customers since it's available in the S-Class. Could not think of any other way. Not sure about the HUD though.

Fairbird

my answer would be very short
https://www.instagram.com/p/_tPUJdEK6G/

sdg1871

Well I went this this thought process myself when I bought my 2015 E63 S AMG sedan over the M5 after having 3 V8 5 Series BMWs including a 2012 F10 Dinan Stage 2 550xi.

First and foremost I bough the E63 for the engine. The M5's engine does not hold a candle to the M157 engine in the E63 S. The M157 is bigger and much more tuneable especially in the torque department. If you wanna beat my M Slayer with Renntech tune with an M5 you need catless exhaust. With same mods the M5 cannot beat my car. The only M5 I ever lost to had meth injection.

The other huge advantage of the M157 engine is its reliability. You can beat the **** out of that engine all day at a speed event and never have a drivetrain malfunction. By contrast virtually every BMW M5 I have seen at speed events has thrown drivetrain malfunctions and going into limp home mode. I had similar woes with my 550. BMW has just not figured out engine electronics. AMG has.

The build quality and internals of the M1 57 are miles above that of the M5's engine. The engine as with all AMG engines is hand assembled by one person and it has forged internals meaning you can really tune the **** out of it and not be afraid of blowing the engine given the internals. AMG spends a fortune on those engines. BMWs M series engines are just not in the same ballpark.

Engine and exhaust noise. My E63 S with Renntech mufflers sounds like a late 1960s muscle car. So raw and emotional. The M5ms sound sucks. Which is why BMW must resort to pumping in sound though the stereo

The E63 S has all whee drive while the M5 is only rear wheel drive. My acceleration advantage off the line and coming out of corners is massive over the M5. My car with just tune and mufflers turns a 11.1 second quarter mile. Try that in an M5. No way. The big boy M5s refused to come to our October 2015 Atco track day because they didn't want to get ravaged by my M Slayer.

Winter traction. My E63 S all whee drive has a massive winter/snow traction advantage over the RWD M5. With my snow tires it goes everywhere.

Size. The BMW F10 is just too damn wide to feel sporty. I know as I had one for three years. Based off the seven series which is no Bueno for a sports car. It feels like a slightly smaller 7 series. By contrast E class is a perfect size. It is narrower, better visibility, easier to park and more nimble.

Exclusivity. The E63 S js much less common than the M5.

The above constitute the reasons why I purchased the E63. But the M5 does have advantages over it in my opinion as set forth below:

1. Looks. I think the M5 is much better looking

2. Paint. The M5 has some fantastic and bold colors available. For reasons I do not understand AMG seems to have old men picking their paint colors and they are super boring for the car. 

3. Stereo and electronics -- the M5's are much better. The W212's stereo options including the B and O suck. Thankfully those are getting a mega upgrade with the next model coming out.

4. Transmission. The E63 S's MCT sucks. It is slow to downshift and basically freezes for a second if you are rolling to a stop and then floor it. Upshifts are great but downshifts blow. The M5's DCT is much much better and faster to shift.

rory breaker

AWD.
As I recall, no pano option.
The interior gadgets were not as effective (massager doesn't massage).
The piped in exhaust got on my nerves.

The other stuff (sound, looks, performance, etc) were either better, worse, or on par w the 63, but they were things Where the difference was negligible. Except the exterior color options and the transmission, both big wins for the M5, but not enough to overcome the above.

Davidkuo0330

I went from a family of M classes modded of course and you don't get the looks you do with the E63. Overall, you don't get what you have with an E63 against an M5 looks or performance wise.

6G Schnell

Specs may look great on the web, however user experience may be different in the real life.
What is the value if HUD is not visible? See what owners are experiencing:
http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e63...unglasses.html

Wildwarrior

I was wondering what ECU you are running? those are impressive times very impressive.
Thanks!

sdg1871

Thanks.

My only mods are Renntech full tune and Renntech sport mufflers. Stock cats and stock downpipes. If I switched to catless DPs with a revised tune I would expect 10.9s.

But honestly I really wouldn't want to put more power on the suspension and steering. This car is not designed for that kind of power and at high speed, unlike my Panamera GTS, the steering always feels a little bit loose with and insufficiently strong on center feel. I love my E63 S but I feel it has all the power I need in it. The car destroys the Hellcat Charger by 5 car lengths in roll races and destroys my friend's Ferrari F12 from a dig and roll-- a car costing four times as much. What more could you want from a family sedan with so little mods?

Bye bye F12:

http://youtu.be/XLh-5oYjaRc

See ya Superleggera:

http://youtu.be/NNVLfK49AjE

Modified M4 gets MSlayed:

http://youtu.be/POLOcEQZITA

All my mod money is spent on my 991 Turbo S. This is more of a daily driver with a big kick.

Wildwarrior

I do appreciate the feed back I had a 99 Diablo SV back in 2007 at the time I also owned my first AMG car a 2006 CL-55AMG and as I recall straight line was similar until 140 -150 and I do recall the steering / stability was not near the Lambo at speed understandably so a 1 ton difference in weight to start with etc..
I am considering a few more ponies but per your thread have second thoughts as to this cars true purpose and capabilities.The car is already a pretty stout straight line performer!
Thanks again!

sdg1871

A tune and mufflers really wakes up the car, gets killer performance results and doesn't break the bank

Wildwarrior

Are you referring to the newly programed ECU as the tune? If so who do you recommend?

Thank YOu!

sdg1871

My tune is from Renntech. I love it. It is a reflash of the ECU.

NickyBlack

HUD, RWD, DCT transmission, and better handling is why i bought my F10
Looks are subjective as both brand's top models barely visually distinguish themselves from their lesser counterparts in their line.
And interiors arent super amazing in either.
Both are superb super saloons but for me the M brand took my money