Tuned E63s Disaster
06-20-2019, 09:31 AM
#51
Something to note, if you watch the videos from the mechanic in the middle East, he mentions how the bent rods happen even on stock cars.
He suspects the rod design on the M157s as a possible culprit.
Bent rods will lead to scoured cylinder walls
He suspects the rod design on the M157s as a possible culprit.
Bent rods will lead to scoured cylinder walls
06-20-2019, 11:29 AM
#52
I am probably off base here, but I thought running high on the torque was a culprit to bent rods etc?!??! On a side note with cold plug discussion, I find it comical we own a very expensive car and wouldn't just add a 1-step cold plug for $175.00-US. There are a lot of opinions here with most people agreeing to go the extra step with a colder plug on tuned cars to ensure you cover the bases as best as you can. For instance, I can bring the car off a red-line on the tachometer, but why not have a limiter to ensure the safety overall; just in case. Not sure if this is accurate, but when making spark plug heat range changes, it is better to err on the side of too cold a plug. Running too cold a plug can only cause it to foul out, whereas running too hot a plug can cause severe engine damage. Again, I might be wrong here but if you have the option to play it safe in any manner possible then go the extra mile. I suppose someone would just say, do not do the tune at all >>lol I have probably already said too much here, so I will move on and agree with those that have much more experience with this specific engine than I. Regardless, I wish you all the best of luck and then some!! 
Kind regards...
Kind regards...
Last edited by MBHR; 06-20-2019 at 12:27 PM.
06-20-2019, 04:38 PM
#53
Super Member
There is slight cylinder washing, and premature wear of the silitec cylinder lining because of this, both not good of course.. If anyone with one of these tunes was to do a blackstone oil analysis, they would find good traces of fuel in their samples.. Seen many of them. Not saying this was the cause here..
06-25-2019, 05:47 PM
#54
Peter you should be good if that’s what your tuner recommended I originally had the same setup as you and was fine for 5k miles but went with an even colder plug just for piece of mind (NGK). I’ve also been seeing guys mixing 3-5 gallons of e85 into their tanks to boost octane which should also help with knock. I’m just not sure if that will cause fuel system issues in the long run.
Adding E85 to a car that doesn't have a flex fuel sensor or is tuned for E85 would make it actually run leaner because, although it is higher octane, you need around 25% more E85 to reach the proper air fuel ratio...that's why modded cars that run E85 need such upgraded fuel systems with super high flow/multiple fuel pumps and often a surge tank because you need so much more of E85 for proper AFRs; gas AFR is 14:1 whereas E85 is around 9:1...
I imagine there might be a point where you can add a small amount of E85 to get the benefit of the higher octane but it seems like a bit of a gamble to me...just my $0.02.
03-17-2020, 08:36 PM
#56
Super Member
Now for sale on Bring A Trailer, "gently used E63s, lightly used, never tuned." https://bringatrailer.com/listing/20...nz-e-class-28/
03-18-2020, 11:11 PM
#59
MBWorld Fanatic!
I hope his car blows up again. ***** this guy.
Playing dumb in the comment section too "I dOnT KnOw WhY tHe WarRaNty iS VoiDed"
Die in a fire
Playing dumb in the comment section too "I dOnT KnOw WhY tHe WarRaNty iS VoiDed"
Die in a fire
The following 2 users liked this post by CarHopper:
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04-05-2020, 09:35 AM
#61
I am probably off base here, but I thought running high on the torque was a culprit to bent rods etc?!??! On a side note with cold plug discussion, I find it comical we own a very expensive car and wouldn't just add a 1-step cold plug for $175.00-US. There are a lot of opinions here with most people agreeing to go the extra step with a colder plug on tuned cars to ensure you cover the bases as best as you can. For instance, I can bring the car off a red-line on the tachometer, but why not have a limiter to ensure the safety overall; just in case. Not sure if this is accurate, but when making spark plug heat range changes, it is better to err on the side of too cold a plug. Running too cold a plug can only cause it to foul out, whereas running too hot a plug can cause severe engine damage. Again, I might be wrong here but if you have the option to play it safe in any manner possible then go the extra mile. I suppose someone would just say, do not do the tune at all >>lol I have probably already said too much here, so I will move on and agree with those that have much more experience with this specific engine than I. Regardless, I wish you all the best of luck and then some!!
Kind regards...
Kind regards...
With the crappy space issues under the hood installing plugs, I've heard of dealers use torque specs to ensure the plugs are indexed, that will not line up on a colder non oem plugs
04-05-2020, 02:05 PM
#62
Super Member
I know this is old but I have one question.....since we know improper indexing of plugs will cause engine damage, how do you properly index colder non oem plugs?
With the crappy space issues under the hood installing plugs, I've heard of dealers use torque specs to ensure the plugs are indexed, that will not line up on a colder non oem plugs
With the crappy space issues under the hood installing plugs, I've heard of dealers use torque specs to ensure the plugs are indexed, that will not line up on a colder non oem plugs
04-06-2020, 08:49 AM
#64
Maybe that's why Renntech recommends stock plugs, easier to index.
04-06-2020, 12:54 PM
#65
Super Member
otherwise, that's how they would do it provided the tech is smart enough to understand the concept of indexing.
Otherwise, in addition to marking the plug you could mark the socket and extension(s).
04-07-2020, 10:38 AM
#66
I find your response dubious. If you know how to index a plug, then you knew the answer. There's no other way short of measuring and recording torque for each brand of plug with the heads off to ensure consistency.
otherwise, that's how they would do it provided the tech is smart enough to understand the concept of indexing.
Otherwise, in addition to marking the plug you could mark the socket and extension(s).
otherwise, that's how they would do it provided the tech is smart enough to understand the concept of indexing.
Otherwise, in addition to marking the plug you could mark the socket and extension(s).
And the spacers/seals on the stock plug were designed to squish flat in a position that puts the ground strap in an optimum position in the M157 cylinder (at least two dealership techs have told me so).
Cos if not....dealers are NOT indexing plugs then
Last edited by kponti; 04-07-2020 at 10:42 AM.
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04-07-2020, 11:26 AM
#67
Super Member
I have indexed plugs in cars since the late 90s. Have you actually attempted to change plugs in the M157? Note that I specified the M157 in my post, there is a reason for that. Try changing the plug on cylinders #4, 7 or 8 and you will see what I mean
And the spacers/seals on the stock plug were designed to squish flat in a position that puts the ground strap in an optimum position in the M157 cylinder (at least two dealership techs have told me so).
Cos if not....dealers are NOT indexing plugs then
And the spacers/seals on the stock plug were designed to squish flat in a position that puts the ground strap in an optimum position in the M157 cylinder (at least two dealership techs have told me so).
Cos if not....dealers are NOT indexing plugs then
As for what the dealer service advisors and techs are saying,sI'd take that with a grain of salt. More than a few of them still swear up and down that changing the CPS on a w211 requires you to drop the motor. 😂
04-07-2020, 11:50 AM
#68
I've changed the plugs on mine without any issue. It's really not that difficult. Not even any clear
As for what the dealer service advisors and techs are saying,sI'd take that with a grain of salt. More than a few of them still swear up and down that changing the CPS on a w211 requires you to drop the motor. 😂
As for what the dealer service advisors and techs are saying,sI'd take that with a grain of salt. More than a few of them still swear up and down that changing the CPS on a w211 requires you to drop the motor. 😂
Maybe that is why Eurocharged recommends BMW plugs that have multiple ground straps (and is colder), no need for indexing those plugs
04-09-2020, 06:46 AM
#70
Super Member
The longer answer is only you can answer that question depending how risk adverse you are. If you like the car stock, then leave it stock. If you're not prepared mentally or financially for the possibility of a catastrophic engine failure, then leave it stock. If you're not prepared to troubleshoot "gremlins" such as periodic misfires or maintain the car at increased intervals, leave it stock. People tend to forget the cost associated with owning a car like ours due to "how cool they are".
As for regular or super conservative, that is a misnomer. Once you start tuning any vehicle outside of its factory calibration, you are no longer conservative and are assuming risk WITH ANY CAR. The reality is it's still more than possible to bend the rods under stock power as it is under a mild-aggressive ecu calibration. Reasons for this could vary from car to car to include, but not limited to:
1. Tune too aggressive for any car (bad tuner).
2. Tune too aggressive for your car.
3. Underlying mechanical issue that is further accelerated by the tune.
4. Car not well maintained over its lifetime prior to the ecu recalibration (common occurance among second-hand cars)
5. Owner stupidity (extremely common occurrence)
Etc....
Etc....
Etc....
In conclusion if you are going to play with these (or any) cars, you have to be prepared to break parts. Anyone who tells you their tune is risk-free is lying.
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04-09-2020, 11:10 AM
#71
Super Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
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2014 AMG E63S and 2020 AMG GTC
The short answer is "it depends".
The longer answer is only you can answer that question depending how risk adverse you are. If you like the car stock, then leave it stock. If you're not prepared mentally or financially for the possibility of a catastrophic engine failure, then leave it stock. If you're not prepared to troubleshoot "gremlins" such as periodic misfires or maintain the car at increased intervals, leave it stock. People tend to forget the cost associated with owning a car like ours due to "how cool they are".
As for regular or super conservative, that is a misnomer. Once you start tuning any vehicle outside of its factory calibration, you are no longer conservative and are assuming risk WITH ANY CAR. The reality is it's still more than possible to bend the rods under stock power as it is under a mild-aggressive ecu calibration. Reasons for this could vary from car to car to include, but not limited to:
1. Tune too aggressive for any car (bad tuner).
2. Tune too aggressive for your car.
3. Underlying mechanical issue that is further accelerated by the tune.
4. Car not well maintained over its lifetime prior to the ecu recalibration (common occurrence among second-hand cars)
5. Owner stupidity (extremely common occurrence)
Etc....
Etc....
Etc....
In conclusion if you are going to play with these (or any) cars, you have to be prepared to break parts. Anyone who tells you their tune is risk-free is lying.
The longer answer is only you can answer that question depending how risk adverse you are. If you like the car stock, then leave it stock. If you're not prepared mentally or financially for the possibility of a catastrophic engine failure, then leave it stock. If you're not prepared to troubleshoot "gremlins" such as periodic misfires or maintain the car at increased intervals, leave it stock. People tend to forget the cost associated with owning a car like ours due to "how cool they are".
As for regular or super conservative, that is a misnomer. Once you start tuning any vehicle outside of its factory calibration, you are no longer conservative and are assuming risk WITH ANY CAR. The reality is it's still more than possible to bend the rods under stock power as it is under a mild-aggressive ecu calibration. Reasons for this could vary from car to car to include, but not limited to:
1. Tune too aggressive for any car (bad tuner).
2. Tune too aggressive for your car.
3. Underlying mechanical issue that is further accelerated by the tune.
4. Car not well maintained over its lifetime prior to the ecu recalibration (common occurrence among second-hand cars)
5. Owner stupidity (extremely common occurrence)
Etc....
Etc....
Etc....
In conclusion if you are going to play with these (or any) cars, you have to be prepared to break parts. Anyone who tells you their tune is risk-free is lying.
