Blackdog1

I don't plan to track my wagon. Some say CCBs are a no brainer, others say they squeak. Dealership has talked me out of them for now saying they will squeak. I like the idea of better stopping power and will do some spirited driving from time to time but don't want them if I will have to put up with squeaking. Interested to hear what others have to say, especially from those that have the CCBs.

Thanks.

Vic55

You will get a lot of answers here.... my thoughts are that if you are not tracking the car its not necessary but both of my sedans have them based on the model and packages I chose. Its money and its relative and I love the lack of dust; I have no squeals on either my RS7 or E63S but i did an immediate bedding of the brakes the day I got the car.

On my prior cars I had zero issues with squeaks as well (7 cars besides the above) but maybe thats due to proper bedding up front:

Quickburn7

E634Me

Jan AMG

Get CCBs if you have the chance. I have two CLS63 at the moment, one with steel brakes, one with CCBs and I love how the latter feel and perform. They are a bit noisier but they are so much better, I'd opt for them every time. I don't track my cars yet just regular use.

2012 merc amg

I'd be curious to see 60 to 0 stops with both brakes and how much shorter the CCB brakes stop, I guess there are other factors like brake fade when they are hot etc.

Jan AMG

I'd say I have more confidence when stopping from autobahn speeds with the CCBs, the brake effect is linear, there is no fading at all. There is one difference though, the initial bite is better with steel brakes, it takes some time to get used to CCBs. Also CCBs feel softer in wet/cold conditions if you need to brake from high speeds after you haven't used them for a prolonged period of time. It takes about 1s to get them to the optimum operating condition.

Ralcbah

These steels are more than enough for the street at any speed...more than enough. I drag race and drive hard all the time... these steels feel firm and don't let up. If not tracking and not into hard lengthy canyon carving, go steel. Take the 8k, tune your car, buy some sick wheels, and have fun. If you value no dust at about 8k of value, then go ccb.

Jan AMG

Oh yeah, no dust is a huge bonus with CCBs.

Shellbmb

Vic, did your brakes squeal on your F10 M5? Mine were horrendous and the M5/X5M/X6M boards were replete with threads about brake squeal and how to fix it which they never did. My E63's are whisper quiet.

OP, if you aren't tracking, I'd go steel and take that extra cash and protect the car with something like Modesta or the like. According to my detailer, they can even coat the wheels to reduce brake dust accumulation or at least make it easier to get off.

2012 merc amg

Dagger9903

My moderately researched take:

IF YOU TRACK YOUR CAR OFTEN:
- Do NOT get CCBs. From everything I've read, CCBs OEM'd on on street-first cars get worn down relatively quickly with regular track use (see below for why). That, combined with the expense of replacing them ($10K+) compared to non-CCB rotors with track pads, makes them prohibitively expensive for most reasonable people. I think the performance WILL be better with respect to brake fade and pedal feel, and possibly with stopping power given the larger size of the rotors on the CCBs, but for the expense it's just impractical

IF YOU TRACK YOUR CAR RARELY OR NEVER:
- Get them if you want. =) There are some advantages that are mostly emotional (in my POV) - the looks are pretty awesome, no brake dust, MUCH longer service life (e.g. 100K miles), and possibly marginally better stopping. They are more expensive to buy and replace, but the replacement cost isn't as egregious as when you track often because the service life is so long, and you'll have to replace non-CCB brakes several times in that 100K cycle (which ins't cheap), so your net cost is below that $10K mark.

BUT WHY? CARBON BRAKES SHOULD BE AWESOME FOR SUPER-AGGRESSIVE DRIVING:
It seems that (based on some light reading) that it has to do with the composition used in the CCBs put on street-first cars. My hypothesis is that this is how the manufacturers improved the experience with CCBs for STREET use. They basically massaged the chemistry to reduce cold-brake squeal, improve cold-brake pedal feel, and make them more livable for a DD (probably to address complaints from the 90% of users who only use them for DD). However, doing so meant the top-end temperature (at which the rotors start to wear) came down some. At the extremely high end, you have carbon-carbon brakes that are used in F1. Amazingly effective above 650 deg C, but really terrible below 400 dec C. I think street-car Carbon Ceramic brakes have a top end around 400-500 deg C, which you may never reach in DD (which is why they last forever), but you will definitely reach tracking the car aggressively). On the other hand, CCBs ARE usable well below this temp, making them usable in DD cars. I bet they could choose a composition that would be better in a more race-first application, but it'd be meh for DD (think early incarnations of CCBs on street cars) and customers would complain.

Related to this is how CCBs wear, which apparently is different than standard brakes. CCBs only actively wear when they operate above a certain temperature. Thus, using them in a DD when they never reach this critical temp (call it 500 dec C for arguments sake) means they will last the 100K miles. However, they can wear rapidly above that critical temp (substance inside the CCB burns off, which destabilizes the entire structure, which is why you weigh CCB rotors to test for useful life). If you track the car often, then you're above this critical temp often, so you wear significantly faster.

Anyway, fascinating topic and if anyone has a more educated view on the above, would love to hear it. Having said all that, I got them, but mostly for the emotional appeal and occasional spirited mountain run on the way home from the grocery store!

v8plus4

Are you buying or leasing? Would the steels require rotor replacement during the lease? Does the cost of CCB over the lease term exceed the out of pocket cost of replacing the steels?

Brian Clarke

The CCB's do fine with heat. No Fade at 165 mph.

E634Me

Interesting that the rear brakes are glowing brighter than the front. I wonder if this is because the larger area and mass of the front brakes are dissipating the heat better as I'm sure there is a larger braking load on the fronts.

Brian Clarke

A few laps later they we're both the same color.

Vic55

On both of my F10 m5's I had irons.... but they didnt squeal. I did bed the brakes on those cars too.

Dagger9903

I'm buying so didn't think about that. Steel replacement definitely depends on how hard you drive it though.

v8plus4

My steels needed replacing at 30k (rears) and 38k (front). About $5k for f&r.

CCB on my new build adds approx $115/month to my lease pmt. x 36 = $4140.

$$ savings plus no brake dust plus cool looks = I went with CCB

E634Me

My jeep needed new rear rotors after only 35 k miles. I was quite surprised to see that they were totally worn but yet the fronts were only about half way or less worn.

The reason, as it turns out, is that the rear brakes are often engaged for traction control purposes (the jeep sees a reasonable amount of off-road use) and during ESP events such as cornering - I drive it somewhat spiritedly.

As Ronin observed on one of his up hill runs recently, he noted a fair bit of brake odor even though he hadn't used the brakes that much going up hill. Leads one to the conclusion that the brakes - rears mostly - are going to be seeing more wear than one might at first expect. More so perhaps than my jeep case due to the higher power output and greater likelihood of wheel spin in the E63.

I have the CCBs and plan to check them regularly to make sure that I still have plenty of pad to make sure the rotors aren't damaged.

Shellbmb

What's your particular bedding procedure?

Vic55

Warm up the brakes with a few mid aggressive stops (to a roll actually) then around 8 to 10 aggressive non abs stops from higher speeds (usually over 100 again down to a roll and back up).

of course this is all right when I get the car...

CLS63dreamer

Is it fair to say that if you make sure to replace your pads regularly on the CCBs you'll probably never have to replace them if you're just street driving? I'll hopefully be getting into a CLS63 S and there's one I'm watching that has the carbon ceramic option, I'm just leery of the cost associated with replacing the rotors. I've heard on the steel rotors they have to be replaced ever so often because the pads are designed in a way that grooves develop in the rotors as the pads wear down. I'm just trying to make sure to avoid any crazy brake replacement job a year or 2 into ownership that I wasn't planning on.

EPower

Dagger9903

Not sure about "never", but I've heard 100K+ miles, which is a lot. You're right though, CCB rotors aren't designed to wear down.

The one problem you might have is there's no way to visually assess rotor wear with CCBs (unless maybe they've been damaged). If the current owner had them checked (taken off and weighed), that's your best bet information-wise. Otherwise you might have to insist on that before buying (it IS a $10K+ job after all to replace them).