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Talk me out of an E63 wagon as my only vehicle

 
Old 06-07-2019, 04:16 PM
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Talk me out of an E63 wagon as my only vehicle

I know i'm stepping into a biased forum, and that's cool. I figure if anyone here talks me out of this, it really is a bad idea.

I currently have 3 cars, I have a fun hatchback daily driver, an suv for snow days and for hauling stuff, and a muscle car for the weekends when i want want something more visceral. They take up too much space. I want to sell them all and just have 1 car that is a little more jack of all trades (master of none probably).

I'm self employed and for work I need something with more utility and cargo space than my daily for going to my customers. I drive 20k a year. I carry around a few boxes of materials, It all almost fits in my hatchback with the seats up, and everything is jammed. I want something fun,with AWD for the snow, and cargo capacity to cary around all my work equipment and the occasional home depot run. We're going to start trying for a kid soon, so also a family car to throw a car seat in and be able to take trips to Costco, or whatever it is people with families do. Also I hate SUVs... so based on all that, I've got blinders on for a sport wagon. I like the e450 and the e63. The nod goes to the e63 as my only car for the fun factor. I want to have the option go to the track with local car clubs and the AMG Driving Academy.

One big thing I like about the W213 wagons are the subtle looks. I believe most of my clients will look at the car and think "oh a mercedes, that's nice and professional, and the wagon is utilitarian dad mobile". The ones that are car people will know what an e63 is. But I don't think most of my clients will get jealous if i roll up in it since they'll have no idea what it is. You can't say that about the porsche wagon, I think it screams for attention which is not what i want rolling up to one of my customers. I always worry about having too nice of a car causing me to lose a sale for someone on the fence, which is why my current car is slightly more modest. It's silly, but image is everything and people can get jealous. I know some people will still get jealous of an MB, but i don't think it's too much flash.

I've never owned an MB in my car history. I heard that if something breaks MB only lets amg certified mechanics work on amg cars which can cause delays? And that If you need parts you could be waiting months? Also heard reliability is a **** show. Any truth to any of that? or people who are repeating one off horror stories?

Based on what i know about the e63 Wagon, here are my concerns:
  • Ride may be too stiff as a daily?
  • I live in the north east, I'm also concerned about potholes trashing rims.
  • Mileage is god awful for someone who drives 20+k miles a year, but smiles are priceless. I know i'll depreciate the vehicle faster with the wear and tear.
I plan on getting either a 1 year old CPO or buying new with an extended warranty. I plan on keeping the car 3-5 years before replacing it.

Anything I'm missing? Any other reasons not to get an E63 wagon? Do you think I'd be better off in an e450? Another vehicle? Those of you who have an e63 have any input?
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Old 06-07-2019, 05:44 PM
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I've had my '14 for over 4 years & am picking up an '18 tomorrow. I'm not talking you out of anything!
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Old 06-07-2019, 05:52 PM
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Great thread, iím debating the same thing but slightly different angle.
currently have 2018 q7, want something with more fun, more power and limit to one car.
canít wait to read the fully objective perspectives on here
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Old 06-07-2019, 05:56 PM
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1. if you use the 600hp, youíre most likely breaking the law

2. the wagon isnít that cool in the real world outside of the bubble this forum is in

3. more expensive maintenance/insurance/gas than a honda civic
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Old 06-07-2019, 06:12 PM
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I was also nervous about reliability. I can say with confidence that the W212 and W213 have never given me an issue, and I put 30k on my W212 and so far almost 8k on my W213 (since I just got it back)

I also put down on average 15-20k a year in miles. Even with the last gen, the most I have ever did was brakes and oil changes. Even with the reliability of the current and last gens, I wouldn't get one without a warranty.

I bought my last one, and leased this one, and if I can give you any type of advice it would be to LEASE if you go with the AMG, especially with the miles you are gonna do and the fact you are self employed. With the miles you are about to put on this thing, you will get nickle and dimed when you goto off it. I purchased a 15k/year on my current model lease and an additional 5k miles is only $1250/year. Not to mention I am able to write the entire lease off my income over 36mo.

If you enjoy your speed and torque, do not get the 450!
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Old 06-07-2019, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by amgcb View Post
I was also nervous about reliability. I can say with confidence that the W212 and W213 have never given me an issue, and I put 30k on my W212 and so far almost 8k on my W213 (since I just got it back)

I also put down on average 15-20k a year in miles. Even with the last gen, the most I have ever did was brakes and oil changes. Even with the reliability of the current and last gens, I wouldn't get one without a warranty.

I bought my last one, and leased this one, and if I can give you any type of advice it would be to LEASE if you go with the AMG, especially with the miles you are gonna do and the fact you are self employed. With the miles you are about to put on this thing, you will get nickle and dimed when you goto off it. I purchased a 15k/year on my current model lease and an additional 5k miles is only $1250/year. Not to mention I am able to write the entire lease off my income over 36mo.

If you enjoy your speed and torque, do not get the 450!
wow... what? how can you write your lease off? i have an LLC as an IT consultant... can i write my $1,800/mo lease off? lmfao
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Old 06-07-2019, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by amgcb View Post
I was also nervous about reliability. I can say with confidence that the W212 and W213 have never given me an issue, and I put 30k on my W212 and so far almost 8k on my W213 (since I just got it back)

I also put down on average 15-20k a year in miles. Even with the last gen, the most I have ever did was brakes and oil changes. Even with the reliability of the current and last gens, I wouldn't get one without a warranty.

I bought my last one, and leased this one, and if I can give you any type of advice it would be to LEASE if you go with the AMG, especially with the miles you are gonna do and the fact you are self employed. With the miles you are about to put on this thing, you will get nickle and dimed when you goto off it. I purchased a 15k/year on my current model lease and an additional 5k miles is only $1250/year. Not to mention I am able to write the entire lease off my income over 36mo.

If you enjoy your speed and torque, do not get the 450!
how much did brakes cost you? how often did you do front/rear pads and how often did you do rotors?
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Old 06-07-2019, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post
how much did brakes cost you? how often did you do front/rear pads and how often did you do rotors?
ha...maybe another con that I missed! On my W212 the brake job cost me $4k for front/rear pads AND rotors - about $3-3.4k of it being parts (I have a mechanic in the family). I did them once. I bought the W212 with 18k miles on it and sold it with 48k.

Had my situation been different with my W213, I would have went carbon ceramic all day.


Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post
wow... what? how can you write your lease off? i have an LLC as an IT consultant... can i write my $1,800/mo lease off? lmfao
not a tax professional so can't give you that advice, but definitely brush up with your CPA! I write both my leases off in full, but the vehicles are also registered under LLCs.

Last edited by amgcb; 06-07-2019 at 06:21 PM.
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Old 06-07-2019, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by amgcb View Post
ha...maybe another con that I missed! On my W212 the brake job cost me $4k for front/rear pads AND rotors - about $3-3.4k of it being parts (I have a mechanic in the family). I did them once. I bought the W212 with 18k miles on it and sold it with 48k.

Had my situation been different with my W213, I would have went carbon ceramic all day.
at what mileage did you do the brakes and how hard did you drive it/use them?

i miss my bmw lease with free rotors
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Old 06-07-2019, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post
wow... what? how can you write your lease off? i have an LLC as an IT consultant... can i write my $1,800/mo lease off? lmfao
I'm not an accountant. This is all what I understand and remember from talking to my accountant. Check with your CPA.

So generally speaking: You can write off either by miles or expenses/depreciation. It depends what's most beneficial for you. However if you start off writing expenses you are stuck you can't switch. If the first year of the vehicle you write off mileage, you can switch to expenses later with a different depreciation curve.. It's a game, generally the more economical the vehicle or the more miles you drive the more writing off miles makes sense. The more of a gas guzzler and money sink the vehicle is and the fewer miles you drive writing off expenses makes more sense. But as with all things not always there are exceptions.

Writing off miles is the simplest way: You can write off the miles you drive for work use of your vehicle. The irs assigns a rate that covers things like depreciation, wear and tear, insurance, etc. In 2019 it will be $0.58 per mile. It doesn't matter if it's a lease, or if you own the car. It takes none of your actual expenses into account. But it's very easy. If you drive 12k total miles, 10,000 work miles times 58 cents a mile you can write off $5,800.

Expenses: Generally this makes more sense with a lease. You can write off the percent of your lease payment based on the percentage business use of your vehicle. So if i use my vehicle 100% for work, i write off 100%. If i use my vehicle 75% for work i can write off 75% of my lease payment. I can also write off that percentage of costs association with the vehicle for repairs and operation. Fuel, Tires, Breaks, Insurance, Taxes, registration, and the big one is depreciation. But in my above example of 12k total, 10k work you can only write off 10/12 or 83% work use of vehicle.

However rules around depreciation are different if you buy vs lease. If you lease depreciation is your lease payment, and i think up to $50k sales price, after that, after that value is exceeded you can only write off a portion even with 100% business use, there are tables that explain this. It's called Lease Inclusion Amounts.

If you own the vehicle, you can also write off depreciation. There are more tables that explain what percentage you can write off per year. Based on a 5 year curve. I think the first year is now limited to a maximum $18k. However if the vehicle is over 6,000 pounds (aka the hummer write off) you could write off the entire cost of the vehicle in your first year if you wanted to or depreciate it however you and your accountant see fit....

Last edited by AngelOfDeath; 06-07-2019 at 09:00 PM.
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Old 06-07-2019, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by AngelOfDeath View Post
I'm not an accountant. This is all what I understand and remember from talking to my accountant. Check with your CPA.

So generally speaking: You can write off either by miles or expenses/depreciation. It depends what's most beneficial for you. However if you start off writing expenses you are stuck you can't switch. If the first year of the vehicle you write off mileage, you can switch to expenses later with a different depreciation curve.. It's a game, generally the more economical the vehicle or the more miles you drive the more writing off miles makes sense. The more of a gas guzzler and money sink the vehicle is and the fewer miles you drive writing off expenses makes more sense. But as with all things not always there are exceptions.

Writing off miles is the simplest way: You can write off the miles you drive for work use of your vehicle. The irs assigns a rate that covers things like depreciation, wear and tear, insurance, etc. In 2019 it will be $0.58 per mile. It doesn't matter if it's a lease, or if you own the car. It takes none of your actual expenses into account. But it's very easy. If you drive 12k total miles, 10,000 work miles times 58 cents a mile you can write off $5,800.

Expenses: Generally this makes more sense with a lease. You can write off the percent of your lease payment based on the percentage business use of your vehicle. So if i use my vehicle 100% for work, i write off 100%. If i use my vehicle 75% for work i can write off 75% of my lease payment. I can also write off that percentage of costs association with the vehicle for repairs and operation. Fuel, Tires, Breaks, Insurance, Taxes, registration, and the big one is depreciation. But in my above example of 12k total, 10k work you can only write off 10/12 or 83% work use of vehicle.

However rules around depreciation are different if you buy vs lease. If you lease depreciation is your lease payment, and i think up to $50k sales price, after that, after that value is exceeded you can only write off a portion even with 100% business use, there are tables that explain this. It's called Lease Inclusion Amounts.

If you own the vehicle, you can also write off depreciation. There are more tables that explain what percentage you can write off per year. Based on a 5 year curve. I think the first year is now limited to a maximum $18k. However if the vehicle is over 6,000 pounds (aka the hummer write off) you could write off the entire cost of the vehicle in your first year if you wanted to or depreciate it however you and your accountant see fit....
very good post, highly appreciate you taking the time to write that up

however, one big question.

what if you don't legally use your vehicle for business at all? i work from home and my clients are scattered throughout the world (aka i'm not driving 15k miles a year to have lunch with them and shoot the ****). :P
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Old 06-08-2019, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post
very good post, highly appreciate you taking the time to write that up

however, one big question.

what if you don't legally use your vehicle for business at all? i work from home and my clients are scattered throughout the world (aka i'm not driving 15k miles a year to have lunch with them and shoot the ****). :P
Lol, in that case proceed with caution as it would be tax fraud.
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Old 06-08-2019, 01:05 AM
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Old 06-08-2019, 01:42 AM
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I use my Ď19 as my daily. We have a small child and itís a perfect family car. We can put the dogs in the back, baby in car seat, parents riding up front with plenty of room for all our luggage and hit the road. And like you said, most people donít know what it is. And when you wanna open it up, itíll put a smile on your face. It wonít be as reliable as a Honda but you mentioned you plan to keep it for 3-5 years so it shouldnít be an issue. I think if you find a good CPO one thatís be the way to go and itíll save you a couple of bucks. Rides a bit stiff so definitely go for an extended test drive and see if itís something you can live with. As for mileage, driving on the freeway I get get 21 mpg fairly consistently when in cruise control at 75 mph. Driving enthusiastically, all bets are off. And no, you donít ever ďneedĒ 600 horse power, itís just nice to have and makes you happy when you use some of it when you want :-)

This car is one of 3 in my garage, and I find myself taking it out the most. Recently drove in a rally for a charity and chose to drive the wagon instead of the sports car. Itís really that much fun to drive. Itís equally nice to sit in, but thatís also true about the E450. Good luck making up your mind.

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Old 06-08-2019, 09:32 AM
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From what I understand, you need to document daily or whenever you drive how much is for work vs personal use. You can't just guestimate at the end of the year. Also, home to office to home is not considered work mileage. Some people find that out the hard way when they are audited.
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Old 06-08-2019, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by CanuckE63 View Post
From what I understand, you need to document daily or whenever you drive how much is for work vs personal use. You can't just guestimate at the end of the year. Also, home to office to home is not considered work mileage. Some people find that out the hard way when they are audited.
on top of that, doesnít it need to add up to more than the standard deduction anyway? or am i mixing up personal taxes with business?
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Old 06-08-2019, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by CanuckE63 View Post
From what I understand, you need to document daily or whenever you drive how much is for work vs personal use. You can't just guestimate at the end of the year. Also, home to office to home is not considered work mileage. Some people find that out the hard way when they are audited.
You're right, but if you have a home office, then pretty much any driving you do for work is deductible.

And documentation is indeed critical if you are audited.
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Old 06-08-2019, 04:36 PM
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Both the e450 and the E63s are great choices for what you need.

The e450 will give you great ride confort, very good cargo space, top interior quality, discreat looks and lots of power, but will not put a smile on your face like the E63s. But this car is on another league.

I never had a MB, neither a performance car and all I can tell you is that I absolutely love the E63s! What a car. Sufficient ride quality for a daily, big and luxury car for taking the family, and the power, oh my God the power... Unspeakable! Pure joy. And I've used the 600hp several times. Power is never enough. I can find good roads on my country, with lengthy straights and no traffic and no cops. USA can be thougher but you will be able to use at least 450/500 hp several times.

The way the car transmits the power and speed and asks for more is unspeakable. You can drive it to work very calmly and still see other cars get behind in the rear mirror. And when you press the gas pedal it just builds more and more power and speed and you will find that the gas pedal has still room to be pressed! Just beautifull. What a car! And to think that it can take 5 persons and lots of baggage and still kick the butt of previous Porsche and Ferrari's models it's unbelievable.

I took it to a track just after break in mileage. Got 30l/100km fixed. Driving at 140km/h for 200miles I got 10.6l/km if I remember correctly. Driving at 200km/h I get 20l/100km.

If you want a stylish and sober car with great confort and power but with much less adrenaline and smile on your face go with the e450. But if you really want the shill and thrill experience of a shear but tanabe brute force with a bit more flashy looks, stiffer ride and bit more gas consumption then go for the e63s. The extra cost is worthy.

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Old 06-09-2019, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by IGotId View Post
I've had my '14 for over 4 years & am picking up an '18 tomorrow. I'm not talking you out of anything!
I used my '14 as a daily driver & the wagon was very reliable! I picked up the '18 yesterday & drove the beast back home (almost 9 hr trip). I highly recommend the current generation.

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post

1. if you use the 600hp, youíre most likely breaking the law

2. the wagon isnít that cool in the real world outside of the bubble this forum is in

3. more expensive maintenance/insurance/gas than a honda civic
As stated above, I just picked up my '18 yesterday. The first stop on the long drive home was at a burger joint to get myself & my daughter lunch. Shared parking lot with a gym, a young kid (in his 20s) had just gotten out of his Bimmer & made a beeline to my car! He had nothing but compliments for the car. He didn't seem to be a 'car guy' as he was not aware of the existence of the W212 AMG wagon, the current one, or the E55 wagon. I also got countless compliments on my '14 wagon.

All that being said, the car is 'cool' to me which is really what matters! (One of my friends who has/had Ferraris, Lambos, Astons, Bentleys, etc asked me when I got my '14 AMG wagon, "you could have bought almost any car, why did you get that one?)
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Old 06-10-2019, 05:02 AM
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Iíll try...

based on your write up, you seem to be a young dude. And if you have the budget to buy a e63, there is really no reason of getting a e450... Price is $40k-$50k difference.

once you got the e63 wagon, you will eventually sell your other cars because this is the ultimate daily driver. Unless your others cars are exotic ones.

but if you think e63 is a bit too expensive, then go for the e450 wagon, it has plenty of power for daily use!!!

I have my eyes on e450 wagon cuz e63 wagon is out of my budget.
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Old 06-10-2019, 12:56 PM
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I own a MY19 E63s sedan and have not driven the Estate/wagon. From what I have heard and read on this forum there is not much difference in the ride quality between the two. While I totally love the car I can say that driving it in NY City including the 5 boroughs (as I have attempted to do on occasion) is not advisable. I do not baby my cars and own a Porsche Turbo. I love tight suspensions and don't mind stiff riding cars at all--actually prefer them. While I don't ever hesitate to take the Porsche into NY city I can tell you that I will not be doing it with my E63s again. The car does not deal well at all with all the patchwork and potholes found in NYC and the surrounding highways. The vibration, road noise and harshness of the ride in NYC and surrounding boroughs would make for a very bad daily driver--especially with clients in the car.That said, if your driving will be on the highway or mostly in the suburbs the car's ride is fine and it will blow you away with its power and handling for a 4,500 plus lb. car.. I have the multi-contour seats and love them--very supportive and very comfortable but they can't hide the discomfort and noise of the car on NY streets.
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Old 06-10-2019, 01:02 PM
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Old 06-10-2019, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by jacklmd View Post
I’ll try...

sed on your write up, you seem to be a young dude. And if you have the budget to buy a e63, there is really no reason of getting a e450... Price is $40k-$50k difference.

once you got the e63 wagon, you will eventually sell your other cars because this is the ultimate daily driver. Unless your others cars are exotic ones.

but if you think e63 is a bit too expensive, then go for the e450 wagon, it has plenty of power for daily use!!!

I have my eyes on e450 wagon cuz e63 wagon is out of my budget.
Yeah, i'm pretty young, in my 30s, it's one of those deals where we could afford it and It won't affect our standard of life at all. My wife isn't fond of me getting what i like to call a "wicked wagon", she'd rather see me get something a little more moderate, like a standard sporty wagon, and continue to aggressively build up our investment portfolio...

I asked the original question based on the car itself. To see if the car was a possible choice based on my needs. It seems like some mixed opinions here. I drive a lot of highway miles, however i split my non highway between suburban and city areas. Every single rim on my daily GTI-R is bent thanks to potholes... It sounds like an extended test drive through a downtown area is ultimatly required to judge for myself on the ride harshness.

Last edited by AngelOfDeath; 06-10-2019 at 02:10 PM.
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Old 06-10-2019, 01:22 PM
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Honestly, based on the things you've pointed out and your concerns, I would get the e450. Ride quality is subjective but if you have rough roads and pot holes to deal with, most will probably consider the e63 harsh and extremely noisy. Fuel mileage obviously is not good at all either. If the e63 was my ONLY car and I had to drive rough roads on a regular basis, I would sell it and get something else. Threre's a stretch of road I drive only on occasion (thankfully) and it is so loud in my e63 that you would not be able to carry a conversation without yelling (I have the Michelin's too).

Edit: I should say that on good smooth roads, it can be one of the quietest cars that I own. It really can be that much of a night and day difference, depending on the road surface.

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Old 06-10-2019, 01:25 PM
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I run a E63 S Wagon (tuned by Brabus) as my daily. It's the ultimate Swiss Army Knife of a car, hauls kids, pets and groceries but will see off most supercars with 800 PS and 1,000 NM. The 4Matic+ system puts all the power down without drama unless you put it into rear wheel drive only.

Can't comment on NYC streets but the (Brabus lowered) air suspension is great on the UK's back roads despite running Brabus 21" forged monoblocks. The ability to raise the ride height gives almost SUV type clearance for those bad weather days.

The standard seats are superb, no need for the performance seats, it's the only car I can drive all day without any discomfort.
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Quick Reply: Talk me out of an E63 wagon as my only vehicle


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