VW going after CLS, will you switch?
11-21-2005, 01:59 PM
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'05 Diamond Black C230K
VW going after CLS, will you switch?
From autoweek.com:
"Volkswagen AG is developing a coupe-style Passat that the automaker hopes will attract Mercedes-Benz customers.
The unnamed four-door coupe, code-named the CC, will be launched in early 2008. It will be assembled at the Emden factory in northern Germany.
VW hopes the coupe will compete against the Mercedes-Benz CLS."
Porsche can probably pull this off with the Panamera. But VW? Have they forgotten the Phaeasco already?
"Volkswagen AG is developing a coupe-style Passat that the automaker hopes will attract Mercedes-Benz customers.
The unnamed four-door coupe, code-named the CC, will be launched in early 2008. It will be assembled at the Emden factory in northern Germany.
VW hopes the coupe will compete against the Mercedes-Benz CLS."
Porsche can probably pull this off with the Panamera. But VW? Have they forgotten the Phaeasco already?
11-21-2005, 04:35 PM
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CLS 55 AMG
Originally Posted by Evil Duffman
i dont even think the porsche looks that nice in comparison with the CLS.
esp not with this
MB > Porsche > VW
11-21-2005, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Nij
That's a dumb question, who would want a VW over an MB even if it had 1000hp!
anyone want to buy a C32? My third VW product is on its way. :p
And there is a 1000hp VW: the Veyron 16/4.
11-21-2005, 04:53 PM
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actually.. going to take the opposing view here... THAT PORSCHE is HOT! as for it having the VW stamp on it... benz... Porsche ranks higher then MB.
from my understanding german status is:
Porsche
Mercedes-Benz
BMW
Audi
VW
from my understanding german status is:
Porsche
Mercedes-Benz
BMW
Audi
VW
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11-21-2005, 05:03 PM
#8
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VW is dreaming if they think people are going to commit significant money to one of their products. The Phaeton is proof that they dont have the image in this country to pull that off. The success of these new models that are being talked about such as this CLS fighter and an "M5 Killer" are entirely dependant on the asking price. Once they get into the high $50K's and up, they are dreaming.
11-21-2005, 05:18 PM
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BMW X5 4.8IS, CLS500
VW for CLS?? I don't know if you understand this, but in asia countries, especially in China, VW is just ubiquitous. I'm from china, so I know the majority of chinese families can only afford a VW because they are just what chinese people called them " Garbage cars". In China, all taxi uses VW jetta because they are cheap. No matter what, MB and BMW are the most prestigeful car in china. So in other words, choosing a VW for CLS is just crazy. Its just my opinion.
11-21-2005, 09:26 PM
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If VW wants to go up market, they better get a better dealer network. Also, I don't think the public believes VW is a prestigious brand. So one model would convince the public that it is? VW has a hard time selling in its own segment as Toyota and Honda are killing them.
11-21-2005, 09:46 PM
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2008 Bentley GTC, Porsche GT2/EVOMS GT700, 1968 Dodge Charger Hemi
Hey you guys, quit bashing VW, I have a really nice $170K VW.
Seriously though, they are capable of engineering high quality cars, they just can't put that VW logo anywhere near the thing, it reeks of tree hugging econo boxes.
Seriously though, they are capable of engineering high quality cars, they just can't put that VW logo anywhere near the thing, it reeks of tree hugging econo boxes.
11-22-2005, 02:12 AM
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I have one of those Phaeton coupes coming myself. :p
I'm convinced VW is building the best cars right now. I personally believe, hands down, that there is no comparison between the ML/X5 and Touareg. I don't even want to hear the typical mercedes "build quality" arguement, because I also own a Mercedes, and get the opportunity to drive an ML from the loaner fleet quite frequently. The S4 cabriolet is a very competitive car to the CLK55 for half the price. Even if money is were no object, I'd still probably choose the S4. The A8L W12 completely whoops the current S-class in ever review I've ever seen, and in my own experience, and will probably be a pretty good match to the new S-class. I would never take an SLR over a Gallardo or a Murc, let alone a Veyron.
Yes, VW does make some cars that are "crap" and exist merely for the sake of being cheap, i.e. the "polo" -- but, I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better engineered car for 15k than the Jetta. It's the best selling German car in America for a reason.
In summary:
A8L W12 > S600
S4 Cabriolet > CLK55
Murcielago > SLR
Touareg > ML
CGT > CL600
To me, it looks like VW is winning. That being said, the porsche looks like fecal matter on wheels.
I'm convinced VW is building the best cars right now. I personally believe, hands down, that there is no comparison between the ML/X5 and Touareg. I don't even want to hear the typical mercedes "build quality" arguement, because I also own a Mercedes, and get the opportunity to drive an ML from the loaner fleet quite frequently. The S4 cabriolet is a very competitive car to the CLK55 for half the price. Even if money is were no object, I'd still probably choose the S4. The A8L W12 completely whoops the current S-class in ever review I've ever seen, and in my own experience, and will probably be a pretty good match to the new S-class. I would never take an SLR over a Gallardo or a Murc, let alone a Veyron.
Yes, VW does make some cars that are "crap" and exist merely for the sake of being cheap, i.e. the "polo" -- but, I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better engineered car for 15k than the Jetta. It's the best selling German car in America for a reason.
In summary:
A8L W12 > S600
S4 Cabriolet > CLK55
Murcielago > SLR
Touareg > ML
CGT > CL600
To me, it looks like VW is winning. That being said, the porsche looks like fecal matter on wheels.
11-22-2005, 10:51 AM
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BMW E39
Originally Posted by RennTechV12
Hey you guys, quit bashing VW, I have a really nice $170K VW.
11-22-2005, 12:56 PM
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2008 Bentley GTC, Porsche GT2/EVOMS GT700, 1968 Dodge Charger Hemi
Originally Posted by naadp
In summary:
A8L W12 > S600
A8L W12 > S600
11-22-2005, 04:24 PM
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06 CLS55, 07 997TT, 07 ML63, 10 X6M, 11 Alpina B7, 12 997TTS, 13 G63, 13 MP4-12C
IF VW release it under Bugatti or Audi or Bentley then they might have a winner, if they do it under VW then it's bound to fail. VW just do not understand that VW stands for value brand, not luxury brand, they are just wasting the Audi/Bentley/Bugatti name if they try to go upmarket with VW brand. Look at how badly the Phaeton fails, if only they had release it under Audi......but then again they did already with the A8 and I think that car is a winner.
Even Fiat understands brand value better than VW, they don't try to release a 200k Fiat and they don't sell a 20k Ferrari. There is a proper segment for each brandname and VW brand is and will always compete with Honda/Toyota/Nissan/Hyundai etc. Audi is the one to go after BMW/Mercedes and Bentley is one step up from Audi and Bugtti is higher still.
Even Fiat understands brand value better than VW, they don't try to release a 200k Fiat and they don't sell a 20k Ferrari. There is a proper segment for each brandname and VW brand is and will always compete with Honda/Toyota/Nissan/Hyundai etc. Audi is the one to go after BMW/Mercedes and Bentley is one step up from Audi and Bugtti is higher still.
11-22-2005, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by RennTechV12
OOOh, I don't know if I agree with this one. Maybe with the W140 600 or even the '00 to '02 600 but not the '03 and up twin turbo V12. In my opinion this is probably the finest power plant in mass production today.
I also heard Bugatti has other cars coming in the near future, and this thing does look like the 4-door Bugatti concept (EB 218). I wouldn't be surprised to see it with that brand. I agree it would be dumb to launch it with a VW name and try to sell it for 100k.
Last edited by naadp; 11-22-2005 at 11:08 PM.
11-22-2005, 11:22 PM
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2008 Bentley GTC, Porsche GT2/EVOMS GT700, 1968 Dodge Charger Hemi
Originally Posted by naadp
I love the MB TT V12, but I think the overall experience of the Audi is superior: ride, handling, braking, road feel as well as feature content. I'd love to see it get the 552 TT W12. The new S8 with the Gallardo V10 should prove to be a very interesting car indeed. I can't wait to drive one.
I also heard Bugatti has other cars coming in the near future, and this thing does look like the 4-door Bugatti concept (EB 218). I wouldn't be surprised to see it with that brand. I agree it would be dumb to launch it with a VW name and try to sell it for 100k.
I also heard Bugatti has other cars coming in the near future, and this thing does look like the 4-door Bugatti concept (EB 218). I wouldn't be surprised to see it with that brand. I agree it would be dumb to launch it with a VW name and try to sell it for 100k.
11-23-2005, 02:15 PM
#19
I think the new Porsche is hot.. However in VW clothes a total waste of money and time.
Much like the Phaeton is great car, but it will never overcome being lumped together with the BUG. Isnt VW the "peoples car"?!
Guy on the street: Hey cool car, what kind is it?
VW Phaeton owner: Its a VW Phaeton!
Guy on the street: How much ?
VW Guy: 80,000
Guy on the street: ... has fallen down laughing his *** off.
Much like the Phaeton is great car, but it will never overcome being lumped together with the BUG. Isnt VW the "peoples car"?!
Guy on the street: Hey cool car, what kind is it?
VW Phaeton owner: Its a VW Phaeton!
Guy on the street: How much ?
VW Guy: 80,000
Guy on the street: ... has fallen down laughing his *** off.
Last edited by lorinserbenz; 11-23-2005 at 03:25 PM.
11-23-2005, 03:36 PM
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2008 Bentley GTC, Porsche GT2/EVOMS GT700, 1968 Dodge Charger Hemi
Originally Posted by lorinserbenz
I think the new Porsche is hot.. However in VW clothes a total waste of money and time.
Much like the Phaeton is great car, but it will never overcome being lumped together with the BUG. Isnt VW the "peoples car"?!
Guy on the street: Hey cool car, what kind is it?
VW Phaeton owner: Its a VW Phaeton!
Guy on the street: How much ?
VW Guy: 80,000
Guy on the street: ... has fallen down laughing his *** off.
Much like the Phaeton is great car, but it will never overcome being lumped together with the BUG. Isnt VW the "peoples car"?!
Guy on the street: Hey cool car, what kind is it?
VW Phaeton owner: Its a VW Phaeton!
Guy on the street: How much ?
VW Guy: 80,000
Guy on the street: ... has fallen down laughing his *** off.
11-23-2005, 05:06 PM
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2001 E320
Originally Posted by naadp
I have one of those Phaeton coupes coming myself.
11-23-2005, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Richard / E320
Good luck on your upcoming Volkswagen; when you go to sell it please post the resale value... if it's like anything that I've experienced in the past, you'll love hearing those famous words: "No resale value but grab your checkbook and we'll do you a favor and take it on trade and wholesale it for you..."
11-23-2005, 10:59 PM
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2008 Bentley GTC, Porsche GT2/EVOMS GT700, 1968 Dodge Charger Hemi
Originally Posted by naadp
The "Phaeton Coupe" (Bentley Continental GT since you missed the joke) is probably one of the slowest depreciating new cars you can buy. The 2004's are selling pretty consistantly on ebay for near their original new MSRP.
