HBKHBK

Hi guys,
I called my local Mercedes dealer today for a price check on an oil change.

they told me, a 2001 one mercedes benz does not need "synthetic oil" but if I wanted to,they'll do it...
they would charge me around 80 bucks for an oil change.

any feedback about it?

I am a brand new benz owner and have no experience or knowledge about it.
What is included at a mercedes dealer with an oil change?
do they also change thethree iirfilters as well?

also my meter says, my car i due in 200 miles for the maintainance?
how much does that usually cost and whats involved...

would appriciate it, if some of you guys would give me some idea to a benz newbie...

also, where do you guys do your oil change that is equal to a benz dealer.
Is a bmw dealer the same? cheaper? do they have the software to reset the maintainance due date aka milage on the meter,just like a merdedes dealer can?

thank you

amcfall

That is odd, these cars have a computer that tells you when to change the oil and the interval is around 10,000 miles. I sure would not do that on regular oil. I do my own, MB filter from dealership with Mobil 1 0W40 full synthetic. Costs about $60 per change and I do it about 2000 miles early (when the cars says I have about 2000 or less left). My dealer wants $250 for an A service.

Avery

HBKHBK

Amcall,

thank you for your respones. I did my oil change yesterday, synthetic.
And it cost me around 80 bucks here at the local mercedes benz dealer,in noth Ohio. I also added to have the airfilter changed ,so the total was around 120 bucks.

I am however dissopointed by mercedes benz, that they would not offer or perform a "basic" inspection when you do your oil change like most dealers do as courtesy. Dissopointing that they charge for a basic inspection,which would cost here $129.

I assume with the A service, the oil change,tire rotation and inpsection is included and it would cost here as well $250.

I asked them how much a transmission flush would cost me they said "250 bucks" and i should consider it when it reaches 100k miles....

I called right away my best friend who happens to be the business development manager of mercedes benz is south California...

He assured me by talking to the techinicans/mechanic...

I can have a transmission flush at any other dealer for 100 bucks...he admits its a rip off how much mercedes charges for a simple transmission flush, not to mention "oil change"

Him and I are originally from germany and from city stuttgart,to be exact, where the mercedes benz is from. And its known, that that unleaded fuel is enough and good enough for the SLK and most other benz's.

Because if you notice,when you open the gas tank, there is sticker saying "ONLY PREMIUM" which is added here in the US and not by germans.
Because in germany u can and people use regular gas...
sure some like the premium, but officially its not asked for! Again depending on the car though.

Same with spark plugs...mercedes will tell you ONLY use mercedes benz spark plugs,especially here... not realizing, that the BOSCH spark plug is equal to the mercedes benz spark plug, not to mention. Bosch is also a german product!

Thought I would put that out there for people who did not know.

Buellwinkle

Wow, you are getting really good prices, $80 for oil change, $250 for tranny. Man, dealers in So Cal sure charge more than Ohio.

First let me tell you, you can not do a tranny oil change on an MB for $100 even if you did yourself unless you used some cheap tranny fluid you got at the 99 cent store and this is not an area where you want to skimp, it's not like motor oil. If you used MB fluid, MB filter, MB gasket and do it properly, you are looking at about $150 in parts and about half hour labor, they probably charge a full hour labor to make it $250. Doing the oil change yourself, with mobile 1 and an MB filter would probably cost you $40, so $80 is reasonable and actually cheap for an MB dealer. Frankly I would not wait to 100K miles to change the tranny fluid. We did it on my kid's SLK at about 90K miles and it was murky brown with a lot of sludge buildup. I would have liked to have done it at 50K miles. What you should do at 100K is change the rear diff fluid, that should be cheap, $30.

You can certainly use regular unleaded gasoline but you should have your car calibrated for such fuel. Yes, in some countries MB's runs fine on regular unleaded but there's options in the ECU to set the octane level so you don't damage your car. What's the price of doing so, I've tested it both ways on the dyno, and on my C230 (same motor as 2001 SLK230) I lost about 17HP at the lowest octane setting and about 12HP at the mid octane setting. Fuel mileage actually rose slightly. The earlier SLK230 in particular will ping with lower octane fuel, it would certainly reduce the life of the engine if you chose to do so. Newer SLK's can probably get away with mid-grade because it has more sophisticated knock detectors that pull back timing to save the engine. Don't understand the value of doing it though, th 5% you'll save on fuel costs is eaten up by about the same loss in fuel economy from the ECU pulling back timing.

HBKHBK

Buellwinkle,

thanks, very interesting...yeah Cali is more expensive.
But for me here in Toledo,Ohio 80 bucks for an oil change is high, considering,changing the airfilter is not included.

Transmission flush $250 and A service also $250

would u do you transmission flush at a less expensive dealer,for the same quality service aka flush?
I am thinking about doing it at my ford dealer..and I agree with you. I will do it now instead of waiting till 100k miles. My 2001 slk 230 has now 73k miles.

As far gasoline goes...I was wondering. If I start putting premium in it, would I see and feel the difference?

what would u do yourself or have something done at a different place instead of mercedes benz and in what case would you ONLY let mercedes benz do?

thanks bro

Untertürkheim

You can only use MB transmission fluid, and about 8-9 quarts of it, so a $100 transmission flush is impossible. $250 is a great price for a full flush with OEM fluid and filter, at $250, you will not save any money anywhere, since that is equal to the parts cost and about an hour of labor.

Also, do not be cheap with the gasoline, your car was not designed for it, and it will damage your engine. I can cite many sources on this, and explain it at legnth.

No offense, but if you cannot pay for the full service/inspection and proper fuel, you seem to have bought the wrong car.

HBKHBK

Actually I can pay for anything and everything...

I am one of those people who just see and realize the scam and rip off mercedes benz does.

Besides, each location state charges you for the same service either more or less.

No offense, but its been proven that a unleaded gasoline vs premium does not make a difference, not to mention it does not effect nor damage the engine one bit.

According to your name I assume you are from Germany and ADAC has proven that fact almost a decade ago so did the US here.

PS: Even though I have the money, I would never let Benz put new brake pads on my car for an amount I could take a trip to Vegas....

Untertürkheim

Please show me and everyone here what study says "its been proven that a unleaded gasoline vs premium does not make a difference, not to mention it does not effect nor damage the engine one bit."

Anyone who understands how engines work will know that this is not true.

By the way, Regular fuel is nearly being phased out in Germany, and I am sure the rest of the EU will follow.

Also, if you have SBC, you have no choice but to let MB install your brakes.

Do some searches on the forums, you will learn a lot about fuel.

320 dreamer

hi guys. im new here so if i may what is sbc for the brakes? just trying to learn what i can do myself and what i cant!

also why do you have to use mb tranny oil only? is it a special blend ?

HBKHBK

Untertuerkheim,
hello there buddy...

Look I hate to prove people certain things who believe in myths for decades.
Its the year 2008 and I can not only tell you a little bit gasoline but also facts and sources.

One example, a Mercedes Dealer,Technician will never ever tell you "its okay to buy a product other than Benz or do the Transmission Flush only at Benz"

My best friend is the business development manager at south Cali at Mercedes Benz also.And has been employed by Mercedes Benz for 6 years. He and even the technician there say "insiders" to him, not to the outside world aka costumers, what the deal is aka what rip off it. Just ask your local dealer,what Spark Plug you should use aka need for your slk,and you know what a Benz dealer/technician will tell you "only use mercedes benz spark plugs"

But fact of the matter is, the Original Mercdes Benz manual says "use Bosch Spark Plugs " and the SLK comes even originally when U buy it brand new with the Bosch spark plug.

Also a benz dealer will also tell you " only do an oil change with Mercedes Benz, and anyone with half of a brain knows, you can have the same oil change,with the same product and service at a BMW, FORD, Lexus etc...not to mention you can do it by yourself as well.

same with Transmission flush for a benz can be done anywhere else,if they have the right material/product. Again,you have to make sure they use the product thats needed!

Now to gasoline facts...look buddy, alot of people, including here in the US and also there in Europe to this decade are uneducated and still believe in myths what they have been told by their parents and others, as far gasoline goes aka premium gas. (sure 15 , 20 years ago it was difference)

The Environmental Protection Agency made test over and over again with gasoline, unleaded and premium, for 35 years that is.

People believe the myth : - Premium is better, better for the engine,cleaner engine, better gas milage etc etc all unproven myths that has been proven wrong over and over again. But its true however, a premium gasoline can sslightly more power,thats it!!!

Exceptions : Some older cars need higher octane and cars with high compression,high engine, to run smoothly...90% of todays vehicle do not need
high octane ( slk does not belong to that category aka high engine ) and inside honest mercdes benz service man will tell you that.

And..unntil about 15 years ago, if a car called for premium gas and you pumped in regular, the car began to knock and ping and even vibrate. Today [performance comes from] electronically controlled spark curves, turbos, variable valve timing, supercharging and knock sensors...

My best friend who is the development manager also drives a 2007 E Class,he has been using regular,ever since gas prices went up few years ago there in Cali, like most other of his co workers... and to this day, it did not make any difference to the engine or sound,and no build up,like people believe it happens...and they tested it. He also did not even notice lose of power,no knocking nothing...

and all Premium does is,a high-octane gas is formulated to burn slower than regular, making it less likely to ignite without benefit of spark.

Dr. Loren Beard, senior manager of Environmental and Energy Planning for Daimler Chrysler even admits " there is absolutely nothing wrong with using 87octane, as the knock sensors and engine management system 'protect' the engine from knocking."

And yes its true, using regular gas can make the car a tiny slighty bit slower, aaka does not accelerate fast enough,but no other side effects or damage thats believed, but thats about it.

Also, Steve Mazor, principal auto engineer for the Auto Club of Southern California says : A driver could opt to use a lower grade of gas (87octane), if they were willing to accept slightly reduced performance and fuel economy.

I guess I have established my facts with sources, even though this is my first mercedes benz I own, but does not mean I have no knowledge,experience and sources and more importantly education about these issues and cases!

Also people should realize the difference between whether premium gasoline is "required" or "recommended", big difference!!!

A silly example, since I am in the health care field.
We reccomend patients to drink 5-8 glasses water a day,its reccomended. But fact is, its not required.If a person drinks more juice instead of water,does not make a difference and the bpdy reacts the same way. As long has the body has the required daily fluid in the system...

Everyone is free to use whatever gasoline they wanna use, but I put my side out there, the facts and the sources whats truly true.

Some refuse to believe this, claiming, for example, that premium gives better mileage. These people are in dreamland. Others say premium is purer or contains detergents that will cleanse your engine of uncouth deposits.

final note, the biggest difference between today's gas and the gas sold 15 years ago is the removal of lead. Taking out the lead, and developing effective catalytic converters to more completely burn emissions, have radically cut pollution.

Likewise misguided thinking--government regulations require detergents in all grades of gasoline. (BP Amoco, I notice, asserts that its premium gasoline contains more detergents than legally required; if you think that's worth 20 extra cents a gallon, be my guest.). Believe what you like; the point is, don't assume "premium" means "better."

and remember there are many countries outhere who Only supply
"Unleaded Gas" ;-)

Source : Steve Mazor,auto engineer for the Auto Club of Southern California

Source : Dr. Loren Beard, senior manager of Environmental and Energy Planing

Source : Edmunds.com

Source : The Environmental Protection Agency

Source : Mercedes Benz Manual

Buellwinkle

Like I've said before, you can run the car on any octane fuel you want and MB has settings in the ECU to accomondate this, just need to get the dealer to set them but I would not run regular unleaded when the ECU is set to run on premium. I've spent lots of dyno time testing this, to me it's not worth it but it's certainly doable. MB's survive in countries with marginal fuel quality.

As for would I pay $250 for a tranny fluid change at the dealer, yes if I trusted the dealer, but I would not take my car to the local MB dealer for service because they have proven themselves incompetent to service my cars, not because of price. My independent MB mechanic charged me about $185 for this service, actually a bargain considering he used all MB fluids and parts. Would I do it myself, no, I hate doing any sort of fluid changes, it's messy, they have low payback for my time and I don't enjoy it. I do lots of work on my 8 vehicle but I pass on fluid changes.

Untertürkheim

You put quite a lot of words in my mouth there.

First off, I never brought up spark plugs, I am well aware that my car uses Bosch plugs, I actually replaced them myself. I never said anything about supposed "MB spark plugs" nor have I ever been told they exist by anyone at any dealership.

I also never said anything about where you can change your oil, but the fact remains that a trained MB tech at an MB dealer will be most likely to be most compitent in performing the oil change and very importantly, the inspection that goes along with it. I am sure a ford tech knows how to change the oil, but whether he will know what type of oil and filter to use it questionable, and I doubt he has advanced knowledge of MB cars and how to inspect them.

With transmission service, again, an MB dealer is most likely the best place to do it. Your models have a sealed transmission that needs to have all the fluid evacuated by a machine rather than by draining. Also, the filter and gaskets that are required are not very easy to come by, and an MB dealer is the only place to get the transmission fluid. Anyone with the knowledge, tools, and supplies can perform these services, but in many cases, MB certification is the qualification that people look for.

Now, on to gasoline, citing souces that are speaking in generalities is not very helpful in this case, MB is not exactly a mass-market car in the US. Nowhere did I say that "premium is better" I am very familiar with what octane means, and you were actually wrong in your explanation, it is not a slower burn, but rather octane is a measurement of the activation energy to start the reaction/combustion, this is DRASTICALLY different from being a slower burn. I know all about federal mandates for detergents, etc, and I know the only difference between the grades is the octane level.

The fact remains that you engine is tuned to accept a minimum of 95RON/91 R+M/2 octane (for our cars, it is Required), and although your engine can compensate by retarding the ignition, it is a completely false economy to use regular. The fuel economy will decrease by a percentage considerably larger than the percentage cost difference of the fuel, and you will still be risking damage to the engine since the car will constantly be compensating for preignition. The ECU compensates in two ways, by enriching the fuel/air mixture to cool down the combustion, and by retarding the timing. Besides reduced performance, an increase in fuel consumption, and risking engine damage from preignition, there will be carbon buildup, and not from some mysterious dirth of detergent (again, I never even insinuated this), but by simply having combustion temperatures lower than intended. To top it all of, using fuel or any other product (oil, atf) that does not meet the specifications outlined by MB is grounds for warranty nullification, and it has happened because of something as silly as an owner too cheap to pay for the proper fuel.

By the way, if you read the MB manual, you should notice all the precautions listed for "emergency use of regular fuel". As in, no heavy loads, high speeds, no more than 2/3 throttle, refuel with premium immediatly.

Since sources apparently substitute for logic and sound information, I will share mine: he is my uncle, Jochen Günther, he is now retired after working for over 35 years as an engineer for Daimler-Benz. If you are worried his information may be outdated, I will gladly ask the shop foreman at Mercedes-Benz of Calabasas.

HBKHBK

untertuerkheim,

thanks for your input and your side. I did not put any words in your mouth, you probabaly took it that way,because I compared few things.
I was talking generally about few things, did not mean to make it sound like you said it or brought it up.

U know I just bought my car and I used "once" regular ever since I purchased it. I assume, I'll start using premium afterwards to see how it will handle.

By the way, I used to live in germany for over 15 years, in Stuttgart that is.And I speak the language fluently as well. So I am I know, germans at MB know more than any MB technician here...or anywhere else.
I would take your word on that any time.

But my best friend who is the business development manager has also lived in germany/stuttgart with me and worked for mercedes benz there as well.

But tell me this bro, what was that u said about changing brake pads? in what case only a MB dealer is able to do it only?

thx

Untertürkheim

It is all in the interest of helping one and other, even though we are having this discussion, there will be countless people who will reference this thread.

In any case, no offense to you or your friend, but a business development manager may not be the best technical resource. I can assure you I do not like to waste money, but I would not cut corners either.

About the brake system, if a car has SBC, a dealer needs to do any brake work because the SBC system must be disabled via SDS before any brake work can be done.

HBKHBK

Hi again and thanks for the brake info.

My best friend,who happens to be business development manager at south cali for MB may not be the best about techical source about that kinda stuff, but he talks to the MB technicians daily and he hears and has been told whats basically a costumer rip off and whats the real deal.


You still did not tell me about my gasoline thing. So far I only put full-tank of gas into my car once,which was unleaded (Bleifrei in germany).
My tank is about to be empty soon...should I wait till the reserve light comes up or can I already adding the Premium on top of the unleaded gas?

thanks!

Untertürkheim

Sorry, I must have missed the question about the gasoline. You can/should fill up your car at your earliest opportinuty with premium, even if it is only 91 R+M, it will end up much closer to the correct octane than the 87 left in the tank. You can mix the fuels, better to get the car as close to the correct octane as soon as possible rather than wait until empty, you will go through plenty of tanks so no need to worry about "residue" lol.

Also, just to correct any misconceptions, I currently live in Los Angeles, although that may change soon. Happy motoring!

HBKHBK

Hi again,

i'll do that right away as far adding premium to my car.

I have one more question and I am sure people will have their own view and opinion.

Do those so called " fuel cleanser etc " u buy at places like Autozone work and worth it? to clean and care for the fuel filter etc...

I used it few times on my mustang, don't know if it helped or not...

any feedback?

Untertürkheim

The fuel system cleaners are meant to clean the injectors and intake valves (not the fuel filters, they are just meant to be replaced), although I would imagine they are not very useful. There is quite a lot of detergents in fuel, and MB engines run pretty hot, so as long as you keep up on service (I like to change the fuel filter early - 40k miles instead of 60k) I doubt it will be an issue. The ethanol in the fuel is very corrosive anyway, so chances are your injectors will need to be replaced before they clog.

HBKHBK

great...thanks.

Off topic - what are you doing here in the U.S.? if I may ask?
do you own a SLK 230 or any Benz?

viele gruesse aus Ohio

Untertürkheim

Well, I have never been asked that question before. Even though my family is from Europe, and half is still there, I was born in Los Angeles, Ca. Although I spent a lot of time away, the majority of my upbringing and education was here too. I have studied and lived in several places, and chances are I will be relocating more permenantly in the near future, but for now it is still home.

I have owned several MB's (actually, I have only owned MB), and my primary driving cars have always been diesels. I sold all of them except for one, my 560SEC, when I left the US once for an extended period to study and live in Europe. I am driving that car until I decide what I will buy as my everyday car, since I intend on keeping the SEC as special occasion car. I was set on an E320 Bluetec, but the consistent decontenting/reduction of options has turned me off, and it looks like I will wait until the S400 BlueHybrid comes out, unless a diesel S is offered.

I have never owned an SLK230, but a very close friend has a 2000 C230K which has the same M111 engine, and I am very familiar with it.

MFG aus Los Angeles