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Old 10-27-2011, 01:20 AM   #1
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Transmission problem shifting and other problems

I went to the track and was doing a burnout and then rolled out with pedal to the floor still then quickly hit the brakes so I wouldn't pass the staging tree. The transmission made a bang/thumb and then went in to neutral (car was still in drive though). I shifted the tranny to reverse, park, back to drive but nothing so I shut it off and restarted and all was fine (sorta).

I did I think 2 more runs after this and both times after I crossed the line the car would hang in 3rd gear and not shift to 4th as I had let off the gas so I hit the stick over to make it shift up but it wouldn't shift up to 4th and the car actually felt like the tires locked up for a split second like it went to downshift instead and continued on in 3rd.

I parked the car and watched a friend do 2 more runs and then left the track and gunned it and it worked perfectly fine ripping up through 3rd gear and I continued on down the road for a mile or so. I then noticed the car wasn't upshifting so I hit the c/s/m button trying to see if that would do anything and then it ended up getting stuck on C and the car was stuck in 3rd gear. I hit the shifter to the sides to up and downshift but nothing happened and I couldn't get it to change out of C mode hitting the button. I was a little stressed out at this point and just wanted to make it back to the house so I just drove it like that in 3rd for about 6 miles running at like 2400rpms.

To add to this the car was in like a limp mode because I could floor it and it had no power at all and with the pedal to the floor would slowly accelerate instead of ripping through 3rd gear. No check engine light or anything came up. I don't have a logger so can't check codes but will be going in the morning to an Advance Auto to see if they can pull anything up for me.

I got close to the house in the neighborhood so if something happened I could walk home. I shut the car off and restarted and could switch through the C/S/M with the button and started driving toward the house (I was only 100 yards away). I felt it shift so it seemed like it was working again but it was about 11:40 at night and like I said I am a little stressed out on what it could be (hoping nothing major) so I just parked the car instead of taking a quick drive to see if it was working ok or not. I figure I will go check it in the morning when I go to get codes read.

Now I did some searching and read about this plug thing on the passenger side of transmission that I guess goes bad and gets fluid in it and also read about some electrical board inside the transmission pan that causes problems, I don't know if it could be one of those things or not. It just is a little weird because I haven't had any problems before this. I don't know if all of this is related to that original clunk and knock in to neutral it did after the burnout and then quick on the brakes or if it is a coincidence.

I read a thread by Kjlindgr who had all these symptoms but he said it happened when he would floor the car which seemed a little different from me since I was just driving normally when the car got stuck in 2nd and I couldnt change the C/S/M setting. But he didn't mention the engine limp mode type deal while this was also going on which I experienced.

Many people replied and they all seemed to have a different though of "this is what is wrong," some saying your tranny is slipping from low fluid, others saying the electrical connector plug, another guy claiming he had same problem but saying a filter got clogged then shorted out the electrical plate inside tranny with one more saying the valve body was bad so I don't know what to think.

Like I said before, no previous issuese before that crazy ordeal going in to neutral after burnout, then making the 2 more passes shifting fine 1st, 2nd and 3rd and also leaving the track again shifting 1st, 2nd 3rd which short after all the problems came to life.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

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-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 01:35 AM   #2
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Well, bottom line is this, your going to go crazy searching and searching (been there) and until you start getting the tools out, will only go bonkers in the process.

The plug on the side can leak and fluid can seep up to the TCM which is located under the passenger side foot well. Very easy to tell by opening it up as I did mine. But, if you heard a bang and then your trans went south from there.......not good. I hope it is something simple though.

Also, on pulling codes, you might just get a 'error code stored on TCM' error when pulling from a standard OBDII scanner and require STAR to actually pull the TCM code which incidentally will need to be cleared anyhow even after the problem is corrected else it will always go back into limp mode. Once in limp mode, you cannot change C/M/S and the car will stay in 3rd gear. It is possible that you are a qt low on fluid, seen that as well when WOT on low fluid.

I have rebuilt 3 of these trans so far, they are solid units, surprised though there are no more failures reported here with the kind of HP/TQ people are running.

Curious what it might be, keep us posted.
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:08 AM   #3
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P0730 "Gear ratio incorrect" is what the scanner said.

Oh and as for the "clunk" I heard at the track, it has done that before in the past where if I got on the throttle for a split second and then let off. It would be like it got confused on if it should shift or not and then did a hard shift making the clunk, not sure if you have ever experienced that before.

When I left the house everything worked, I got out of the neighborhood and floored it and shifted through the gears fine but then when I let off it did the little what feels like tires locking up for split second. It is like it goes to shift up to 4th to coast but instead tried to shift down a gear or something then remains in 3rd where I let off the gas.

After that it went back to the stuck in 3rd gear deal and then the engine light actually came on right before getting to the auto parts store. After checking the codes I again restarted the car and left and it shifted briefly down the road and then went back to the stuck in 3rd.

I didn't get the limp mode for power these times though. I wish these stupid cars had a damn dipstick so I can check the fluid level. I really don't want to go to the dealer to have them check it and charge me $100 or something stupid for 30 seconds of work.
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:10 AM   #4
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I had that happen to me more than once. I did a fluid change and the problem went away. This was like 6 months ago and it's rock solid!
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:15 AM   #5
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Yeah, I am almost tempted to just get some ATF and dump a half quart down the tube and see if it fixes it but at the same time don't want it to be something else like one of these plugs or something and then have to much fluid in the tranny. It probably is something simple like fluid being to low though and I am just overthinking/overreacting.


EDIT: Just checked the plug on side of transmission and it was nice and dry.
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-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 11:30 AM   #6
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First thing to check is fluid level, that could cause the error.
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Old 10-27-2011, 12:21 PM   #7
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I know this may sound silly, but did you change out your rear wheels to a drag setup when you went to the track?
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Old 10-27-2011, 12:29 PM   #8
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Added 1/2 quart and tested and it still acted up so added the other half and tested again. Guess it wasn't the fluid, when putting it in to gear now it does a jerk from I assume to much fluid now. Continued on home and it got stuck in 2nd gear this time (was 3rd before) and then got the engine limp again.

So it wasn't fluid and wasn't the plug on passenger side of transmission since it was nice and dry so what does that leave? The electrical plate thing inside the pan? Need to do more research since I don't even know where that is or what is involved to change it, just read that it is like $140 for the part when searching around before.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

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-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 12:30 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chawkins2001 View Post
I know this may sound silly, but did you change out your rear wheels to a drag setup when you went to the track?
Nope, just the same 19s and tires that have always been on the car.
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Old 10-27-2011, 12:40 PM   #10
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Oh and if anyone can post a link to show me where that plate thing is and how to swap it out that would be awesome. Running out the door now to do some stuff, did a quick search but haven't found it yet. I will look more when I get back unless it is posted.

After doing some more reading it sounds like this Electrical Conductor Plate is on top of the valve body? So I would need to drain the oil, take the pan off and then also separate the valve body from the transmission and it would be on the top side of that?

I also read something about recoding for the new electric plate so this isn't something I can just do myself by replacing this plate and actually need to bring it to get recoded? Off to do more searching.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

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-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 01:54 PM   #11
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The speed sensor is on top of the valve body on the plate. When the sensor sends a signal that does not match the drivetrain=error code. I have pics of the plate, it is easy to to replace, just messy. I will post up later if nobody else does.
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Old 10-27-2011, 02:01 PM   #12
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I just found your tranny rebuild thread and was looking at all the pics trying to figure it out.

So what I said would be right with taking the pan off then taking the valve body off and the whole plate sits on top?

I believe the proper name is Transmission Electrical Valve Body Conductor Solenoid Plate with a part number of #1402701161 From this on ebay Click me

Or found it here doing a search using the part number Click me


I am going to call the local dealer and see if they have it or how fast they can get it and pricing. Kinda sucks since I had planned on making a 450 mile trip tomorrow but I am guessing this part wont be in stock so that will not be happening.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

CTS-V Sedan 674whp 656wtq 10.46@136, full weight 93 octane and meth injection

-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 02:01 PM   #13
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"Incorrect gear ratio" happens EVERY time I track my SL600. It's caused by the vehicle thinking that the front and rear total rolling diameter is off +/- 5%. It only happens when I do burnouts in "dyno mode" on my car though. It's no biggy at all. Just take your handy dandy code reader, and reset the code. Fire it up, run the snot of it, rinse, repeat.

I get the exact same symptoms. Clearing the code, and taking it out of dyno mode fixes it every single time.

Common with these cars...
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Old 10-27-2011, 02:07 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benz-O-Rama View Post
"Incorrect gear ratio" happens EVERY time I track my SL600. It's caused by the vehicle thinking that the front and rear total rolling diameter is off +/- 5%. It only happens when I do burnouts in "dyno mode" on my car though. It's no biggy at all. Just take your handy dandy code reader, and reset the code. Fire it up, run the snot of it, rinse, repeat.

I get the exact same symptoms. Clearing the code, and taking it out of dyno mode fixes it every single time.

Common with these cars...
Well I have tracked the car like 4 times in the past 1.5 months and this never happened and I haven't changed anything either and don't use dyno mode. And like I mentioned earlier in the thread I brought the car to get code read and cleared and then drove again and it happened a few more times. I then went to another autoparts store and had code read again and cleared and bought the fluid thinking it was low and that didn't help and once again had all the issues of it getting stuck in a gear. And before it got stock in the gear and actually shifted it wouldn't go to 4th and when letting off throttle on a hard pull it locked the tires up for a milisecond like it went to downshift instead of upshift and then just stayed in the present gear.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

CTS-V Sedan 674whp 656wtq 10.46@136, full weight 93 octane and meth injection

-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 02:12 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by urbamworm View Post
I just found your tranny rebuild thread and was looking at all the pics trying to figure it out.

So what I said would be right with taking the pan off then taking the valve body off and the whole plate sits on top?

I believe the proper name is Transmission Electrical Valve Body Conductor Solenoid Plate with a part number of #1402701161 From this on ebay Click me

Or found it here doing a search using the part number Click me


I am going to call the local dealer and see if they have it or how fast they can get it and pricing. Kinda sucks since I had planned on making a 450 mile trip tomorrow but I am guessing this part wont be in stock so that will not be happening.
Yes, it basically sits on top of the valve body. Has a few plastic covers that need removal, etc. Easy. oediscountparts.com has it for a great price shipped.
I would try to reset the TCM code first as it will continue to send the error code to the ECU unless cleared. From what I have seen, even if fixed, the error code will remain in the TCM until cleared. Do you know someone local with STAR?
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Old 10-27-2011, 02:31 PM   #16
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No I don't know anyone and I am actually not even at home which sucks more since I don't have any tools. I am visiting family and they don't have crap for tools. I just called the dealer and they have a few of them in stock for $250.

I am just on the fence of should I go buy it and swap it and pray that is the problem or not. I mean what else could it be if the plug was dry on side of tranny and the oil was obviously not low since I added a quart and it still doesn't work.

So it looks like get 3 quarts of Royal Purple ATF for $15/each and that electric plate for $250. I just need to figure out what kind of tools I need to be sure if they have them here at the house or if I need to buy stuff. I know a ton of stuff is those reverse torx "external torx" style bolts which sucks because nobody has those tools laying around to borrow.

I am not sure if I need those to do this job or not. It looks like normal torx inside the pan from looking at your pics, but what about to take the pan off is that the reverse style torx or something else like regular torx or even normal bolts? I am pretty sure from the pic it looks like regular torx as well.

And do you happen to know sizes since you did the job? I will buy a whole set of the External Torx since I need some anyway but already have 2 sets of regular torx so would rather just buy the size I need instead of a whole set.

I know what size it takes to do everything on my other car but really haven't done anything to this repair/maintance wise so don't know what sizes are needed for different stuff yet.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

CTS-V Sedan 674whp 656wtq 10.46@136, full weight 93 octane and meth injection

-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 02:55 PM   #17
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Before you go replacing parts, pull the battery cable off the rear battery and let it sit for an hour or so. Sounds crazy, I know. The very first time it happened to me at the track, I called Marcin, thinking it was my brand new TCU. This is what he told me to do.....

Can't hurt....and it's free.
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Old 10-27-2011, 03:06 PM   #18
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Parts department is open until 6 so I will give it a try, just unhooked it. See what happens and then head to get the part if it is still jacked up which I am sure it will be because not many have worse luck than me.
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-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 04:47 PM   #19
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Well the battery disconnect didn't do anything. I went back and had codes read again but this time with a Snap-On reader instead of the cheap little one they were using.

Scanning first brought up code P206D "electronic transmission ecu" and then they scanned the transmission and got P2501 "engine has excessive speed" and P2503 "Negative Gear Compa/Target not reached."
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

CTS-V Sedan 674whp 656wtq 10.46@136, full weight 93 octane and meth injection

-David-


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Old 10-27-2011, 06:16 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by urbamworm View Post
Well the battery disconnect didn't do anything. I went back and had codes read again but this time with a Snap-On reader instead of the cheap little one they were using.

Scanning first brought up code P206D "electronic transmission ecu" and then they scanned the transmission and got P2501 "engine has excessive speed" and P2503 "Negative Gear Compa/Target not reached."

I have seen the P2503 before, be careful driving the car at this point. Without going into it too far, once you drop the pan, if you see anything in the fluid that should not be present, you know it is not the plate. Inspect what you drain and the pan carefully. GL.
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Old 10-27-2011, 07:14 PM   #21
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Don't tell me that man! I bought the electric plate, filter, pan gasket and locking pin. Gonna go at it tomorrow and hope for the best.
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Old 10-27-2011, 07:35 PM   #22
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Have you or can you check the condition of the fluid before dropping pan? Also did you try clearing all TCM codes?
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Old 10-27-2011, 07:42 PM   #23
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I haven't checked it no. I haven't even looked to see if there is a drain plug or if I have to actually just drop the pan and dump it. Have a recommendation? I went and bought all the stuff but I am visiting family right now. My birthday is in a few days and I was supposed to leave town tomorrow so they had a party for me tonight so I didn't get a chance to mess with it.

Yes all the codes were cleared on the transmission scan and the regular engine scan using the fancy snap-on diagnostic tool which were those last codes I mentioned. I left and drove through 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear then it stayed in 3rd, I then slowed down to make a turn close to the neighborhood and then it was once again stuck in the gear and wouldn't down or upshift.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

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Old 10-27-2011, 07:54 PM   #24
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You can get a thin cable from Lowes or HD and use that down the fill tube, check color and smell. 4 feet is long enough. You can also use this as a dipstick by measuring back. If it is grey/black and/or smells burned don't bother with the plate.

Last edited by pearlpower; 10-27-2011 at 08:34 PM.
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Old 10-27-2011, 08:05 PM   #25
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I am looking through a WIS instruction pdf that TTMotorsports was kind enough to send me after seeing the thread. I see it mentiones a drain plug torque value so assume I can just pull the plug and watch the fluid and check it out when it is in the drain pan. And then inspect the transmission pan and hope to find a nice fairly clean pan.

To me it just seems like it has to be electrical since if you turn the car off and then back on it would let the car do the 1st-3rd shift then mess up again and then sometimes it would just go right to the stuck in 2nd or 3rd from taking it out of park.
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White Pano E55, *new setup (Yes I went backwards in power but more consistent) 480whp 497wtq *old setup 500whp 11.69@120 on 19s*

CTS-V Sedan 674whp 656wtq 10.46@136, full weight 93 octane and meth injection

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2001, 3rd, e55, electrical, gear, incorrect, mercedes, nag1, plate, range, ratio, rover, shift, solenoids, transmission



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