C63 AMG (W204) 2008 - 2015
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C63TT in the near future?

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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 08:23 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-
I've never driven a FI Mercedes. How bad is the turbo lag?
Can't even tell IMHO.
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 09:18 PM
  #27  
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What doesn't make sense is if they were going to put in a 5.5TT, why didn't they do it for the refresh? I mean, that would of been perfect timing.
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 09:30 PM
  #28  
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Curves in performance and price is what MB seems to be fixed on now. I don't blame them one bit.

Currently AMG's lowest priced model performs way to close to their hallmark cars stock vs stock. Not good for sales. Dropping a TT in the C63 would have the same result. You want the performance of a TT then shell out another 30-40K.
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 09:48 PM
  #29  
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My MB tech friend was just in Vancouver for training. He said there was mentions of the 5.5NA going into the C Class AMG. They wont be using turbos on it he explained.

He said the training mentioned that they would be focusing more on the agility and sportiness of the car. Maybe weight reductions?
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 09:57 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Merc63
My MB tech friend was just in Vancouver for training. He said there was mentions of the 5.5NA going into the C Class AMG. They wont be using turbos on it he explained.

He said the training mentioned that they would be focusing more on the agility and sportiness of the car. Maybe weight reductions?
Would HP/torque suffer from the downgrade? Sounds like MB really wants to take it to BMW and the M3. Here's a hint Mercedes, WIDER REAR TIRES.
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 10:05 PM
  #31  
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100% Torque would be the first to suffer.

Only thing I can see them doing if this is the case is to really work on driving dynamics and weight reduction.
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 10:29 PM
  #32  
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I predict that the W205 C63 is about 300 pounds lighter and comes with the NA version of the new M157 motor with cylinder deactivation that was just introduced in the SLK 55. By then it will probably have direct injection, make about 450 horsepower and be good for 20 city and 28 highway.

I doubt this new motor was built for exclusive use in one model, especially the low production SLK.
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 10:32 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by hhughes1
I predict that the W205 C63 is about 300 pounds lighter and comes with the NA version of the new M157 motor with cylinder deactivation that was just introduced in the SLK 55. By then it will probably have direct injection, make about 450 horsepower and be good for 20 city and 28 highway.

I doubt this new motor was built for exclusive use in one model, especially the low production SLK.
Sensible prediction.
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Old Nov 3, 2011 | 10:45 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by CELLryuu
i read that the 5.5tt had too much torque for the c-class chassis.
We already have some Weistec C63's Stage 2s with LTs, etc... that are pulling 600rtwq and I haven't heard anything about the chasis coming apart.
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Old Nov 4, 2011 | 01:02 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=-
What doesn't make sense is if they were going to put in a 5.5TT, why didn't they do it for the refresh? I mean, that would of been perfect timing.
I agree with propain that MB's prices work in a curve. If MB put the m157 in the 204 platform, the more expensive models would be hard to sell at their higher price points. Plus, even despite the w204 C63's rear tire problem, the car would still put down some near-supercar performance numbers. And car makers never give too much for a fair price.

I do think it makes sense for MB to use the m157 for the 205 platfom C63 in 2014-2016. The engine would be 4 years old and ripe for a new chassis. The engine is an easy setup to make 3 power levels for regular C63's, PP-optioned cars, and a BS version if one was made.
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Old Nov 4, 2011 | 01:13 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by hhughes1
I predict that the W205 C63 is about 300 pounds lighter and comes with the NA version of the new M157 motor with cylinder deactivation that was just introduced in the SLK 55. By then it will probably have direct injection, make about 450 horsepower and be good for 20 city and 28 highway.

I doubt this new motor was built for exclusive use in one model, especially the low production SLK.
Your prediction makes a lot of sense. And admittedly, I don't know a lot about the non-turbo 5.5L, but I think it would be hard to match the performance of the M156 given its smaller displacement; and simultaneously increase fuel efficiency.

If the 3 types of C63's [regular, PP, BS] becomes a trend for AMG, then the NA 5.5L doesn't seem like the best choice of motor.

Obviously, weight reduction can even the scales; not only in performance, but also mpg.
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Old Nov 4, 2011 | 09:29 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Merc63
He said the training mentioned that they would be focusing more on the agility and sportiness of the car. Maybe weight reductions?
I can see that. The facelifted C63, especially the coupe, handles quite differently than the pre facelift cars. I can't say in terms of outright grip, but turn-in and mid corner stability is improved, without losing a single lb of weight. It'll be interesting to see what kind of tire wear penalty the suspension changes will incur.
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Old Nov 4, 2011 | 09:46 AM
  #38  
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Old Nov 4, 2011 | 07:09 PM
  #39  
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It's officially going to be the NA 5.5 V8 from the new SLK55...tuned up from the SLK version.

Sorry for the confusion!
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Old Nov 5, 2011 | 03:04 PM
  #40  
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I'd like to see that confirmed by some sources I can see.

It would be sad to see the 6.3 go though. It really packs a punch.
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Old Nov 5, 2011 | 03:37 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by WWMIndy
Can't even tell IMHO.


http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbob...housing_sizing

A/R (Area/Radius) describes a geometric characteristic of all compressor and turbine housings. Technically, it is defined as:

the inlet (or, for compressor housings, the discharge) cross-sectional area divided by the radius from the turbo centerline to the centroid of that area (see Figure 2.).
compressor housing showing A/R characteristic


Figure 2. Illustration of compressor housing showing
A/R characteristic

The A/R parameter has different effects on the compressor and turbine performance, as outlined below.

Compressor A/R - Compressor performance is comparatively insensitive to changes in A/R. Larger A/R housings are sometimes used to optimize performance of low boost applications, and smaller A/R are used for high boost applications. However, as this influence of A/R on compressor performance is minor, there are not A/R options available for compressor housings.

Turbine A/R - Turbine performance is greatly affected by changing the A/R of the housing, as it is used to adjust the flow capacity of the turbine. Using a smaller A/R will increase the exhaust gas velocity into the turbine wheel. This provides increased turbine power at lower engine speeds, resulting in a quicker boost rise. However, a small A/R also causes the flow to enter the wheel more tangentially, which reduces the ultimate flow capacity of the turbine wheel. This will tend to increase exhaust backpressure and hence reduce the engine's ability to "breathe" effectively at high RPM, adversely affecting peak engine power.

Conversely, using a larger A/R will lower exhaust gas velocity, and delay boost rise. The flow in a larger A/R housing enters the wheel in a more radial fashion, increasing the wheel's effective flow capacity, resulting in lower backpressure and better power at higher engine speeds.

When deciding between A/R options, be realistic with the intended vehicle use and use the A/R to bias the performance toward the desired powerband characteristic.

Here's a simplistic look at comparing turbine housing geometry with different applications. By comparing different turbine housing A/R, it is often possible to determine the intended use of the system.

Imagine two 3.5L engines both using GT30R turbochargers. The only difference between the two engines is a different turbine housing A/R; otherwise the two engines are identical:
1. Engine #1 has turbine housing with an A/R of 0.63
2. Engine #2 has a turbine housing with an A/R of 1.06.

What can we infer about the intended use and the turbocharger matching for each engine?

Engine#1: This engine is using a smaller A/R turbine housing (0.63) thus biased more towards low-end torque and optimal boost response. Many would describe this as being more "fun" to drive on the street, as normal daily driving habits tend to favor transient response. However, at higher engine speeds, this smaller A/R housing will result in high back pressure, which can result in a loss of top end power. This type of engine performance is desirable for street applications where the low speed boost response and transient conditions are more important than top end power.

Engine #2: This engine is using a larger A/R turbine housing (1.06) and is biased towards peak horsepower, while sacrificing transient response and torque at very low engine speeds. The larger A/R turbine housing will continue to minimize backpressure at high rpm, to the benefit of engine peak power. On the other hand, this will also raise the engine speed at which the turbo can provide boost, increasing time to boost. The performance of Engine #2 is more desirable for racing applications than Engine #1 since Engine #2 will be operating at high engine speeds most of the time.

Of course you can't tell, A/R Ratio is only .50.
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Old Nov 5, 2011 | 06:43 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by yooker


http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbob...housing_sizing




Of course you can't tell, A/R Ratio is only .50.
Is that good? :dunnno: How does this differ from other manufacturers like Nissan and the GT-R? BMW and their entire line-up?

Last edited by -=Hot|Ice=-; Nov 5, 2011 at 06:48 PM.
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Old Jun 26, 2012 | 10:07 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by yooker


http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbob...housing_sizing

Of course you can't tell, A/R Ratio is only .50.
Learn something new everyday! It's an interesting read that website, lots of useless info..
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Old Jun 26, 2012 | 11:28 PM
  #44  
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Old Jun 28, 2012 | 06:21 PM
  #45  
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FF. W212 E63 M156 non-pano 18" P2 ParkT NightV (gone but will be missed).
There's a reason MB chooses 6.2NA rather than 5.5TT for the SLS.
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Old Jun 28, 2012 | 07:52 PM
  #46  
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I have heard they are doing a V6 cylinder 4.4 liter engine for the new C-Class, Mercedes are turning to turbo engines and we will see the last of the NA in the SLS's.
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Old Jun 29, 2012 | 01:43 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by dbasons55
I have heard they are doing a V6 cylinder 4.4 liter engine for the new C-Class, Mercedes are turning to turbo engines and we will see the last of the NA in the SLS's.
hate to see the NA engines go I hate the a45 with it's 4cyl turbo for example with these turbo's AMG will lose it's soul sure they will be fast, but with a different feeling to it stupid emission rules
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Old Jun 29, 2012 | 03:29 AM
  #48  
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I know its a marketing thing to the call them 63's when they have 5.5 liter motors in them. Forced induction motors will alway make more power esp when modded (but with the turbo housing integrated into the exhaust manifold this is going to be expensive), but let's call them what they are .....5.5 bi turbos. If he C class doesn't get the biturbo motor, but just a NA 5.5, it will be a huge step down from the 6.3.

Last edited by DuaneC63; Jun 29, 2012 at 03:33 AM.
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Old Jun 29, 2012 | 05:28 AM
  #49  
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Question

I don't think anyone knows what will go into the "new" C63.....but whatever it is, I can't see the speed/performance of the car suffering.
I just hope that the new model is not dramatically faster than mine?
Cheers, Pickles.
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