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Is Ceramic Brake really necessary for GT R order?

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Old 08-29-2017, 06:12 AM
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Smile Is Ceramic Brake really necessary for GT R order?

hello folks,

I have a deposit down for a GT R that's coming next late spring, since the freeze point is quite a while away still, I am deciding if I should get the Ceramic Brake ($13750 canadian dollar). My summer daily is a '17 911, so this car will probably be driven only 5000-7000km per year and may see track/DE event 1-2 times annually. The track package isn't available in Canada, so I wouldn't say I'd make this a track only vehicle as the AMG sports seats are quite daily useable.

Most of its time will still be on street/HWY so my question is how long do those AMG steel brake last? I was told they don't last very long, maybe 20000-30000km depending on how you drive. Is that a true statement?

This being my first MB and AMG, I never had experience of it; therefore, I guess I will get some useful opinions from you experts.

(one other reason I am leaning more towards the standard brake is that I am trying to match up the yellow callipers, yellow stitchings, and yellow seat belts)

Thanks in advance for your help, your opinions/suggestions are highly appreciated.

cheers,
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Old 08-29-2017, 06:57 AM
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The ceramics are ridiculously powerful and fitted on the GTS I demoed last year.... they felt like they could slow the earths rotation

Alas, I didn't go for them, since the steel brakes are perfectly adequate and with black wheels, brake dust is a non-issue.

Personally, I would save the $//, unless track use warranted.

Jamming on the anchors full whack is unquestionably an eyeball-straining party piece, but for road use not cost effective IMO!
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Old 08-29-2017, 07:42 AM
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There is a thread about this and there are people who swear by them.
If money is no consideration, then why not as the 2 major advantages are no fade on the track and no brake dust.
Personally, I feel I can spend that money somewhere else for more enjoyment of the car (interior upgrade, better stereo, tune or custom wheels) and you will get little to no money back on that option.
Congrats on the order. How did you spec it?
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Old 08-29-2017, 09:07 AM
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I just ordered by GTR as well with the steel brakes. It won't see a track so I declined the ceramics. Matching the yellow belts, stitching, badge and brakes was a bonus.

Was your dealer confident of that late Spring 2018 date? My dealer (in US) was thinking more end of the year 2017.

If it turns out to be Spring 2018, then I may just give up and pick up one already at the VPC.



Originally Posted by py0413 View Post
hello folks,

I have a deposit down for a GT R that's coming next late spring, since the freeze point is quite a while away still, I am deciding if I should get the Ceramic Brake ($13750 canadian dollar). My summer daily is a '17 911, so this car will probably be driven only 5000-7000km per year and may see track/DE event 1-2 times annually. The track package isn't available in Canada, so I wouldn't say I'd make this a track only vehicle as the AMG sports seats are quite daily useable.

Most of its time will still be on street/HWY so my question is how long do those AMG steel brake last? I was told they don't last very long, maybe 20000-30000km depending on how you drive. Is that a true statement?

This being my first MB and AMG, I never had experience of it; therefore, I guess I will get some useful opinions from you experts.

(one other reason I am leaning more towards the standard brake is that I am trying to match up the yellow callipers, yellow stitchings, and yellow seat belts)

Thanks in advance for your help, your opinions/suggestions are highly appreciated.

cheers,
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Old 08-29-2017, 10:08 AM
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Not one of the new eight (8) GTR's (or any of the 13 GTS's) at the AMG' Lime Rock' Driving Academy last week had ceramics. The GTS's all had 17-19k hard miles on them. No fade. Unless I were buying a dedicated track or collector vehicle, I wouldn't consider them. The stock steel units have instantaneous (sometimes abrupt) grip on the street as is.
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Old 08-29-2017, 03:01 PM
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There you go. MB probably made the cost analysis and found out it is cheaper to replace steel brakes than using CC units since they do not run the cars long enough where the CC brakes will show their strengths.
Originally Posted by 06032 View Post
Not one of the new eight (8) GTR's (or any of the 13 GTS's) at the AMG' Lime Rock' Driving Academy last week had ceramics. The GTS's all had 17-19k hard miles on them. No fade. Unless I were buying a dedicated track or collector vehicle, I wouldn't consider them. The stock steel units have instantaneous (sometimes abrupt) grip on the street as is.
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Old 08-29-2017, 05:55 PM
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The stock iron disc brakes are fine, especially if they are used like they are in the ADA. However, the front rotors can and will warp if you do a 30+ minute session at COTA or RA. However, I've not had any issues with Racing Brake's replacement.

The stock pads are just fine.

The stock fluid is pretty good too, but you can certainly boil it if pressing too hard.

I wish I had ceramics and all the issues go away, but sorting out the car is fun too.
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Old 08-29-2017, 08:25 PM
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Folks,

My build spec is as linked
http://www.mercedes-benz.ca/MC?Mcid=M8747307
except for now on the spec sheet the ceramic is added.

As for now, I am told that my delivery is expected for June/July 2017 as the build date will be in May (early or late), I will get more updates as time moves closer.

My past experience with ceramic brakes are they make a lot of noise until the temperature is up to the working condition. Out of all the performance cars I had owned, M3/M5, 2 911s, I haven't equipped any of them with CB. Interestingly, my m3 had 70000km when i sold it, my M5 had 70000km when I sold it, and I never had to replace the brake on those cars. My currently 911 has 17700km and the brake is still in very good condition although I had already done 1 track day, 2 autocross and lot of PCA drive events.

It's good to have CB but I just wish they can have the callipers painted in yellow. First world problem I guess.
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Old 08-30-2017, 01:46 PM
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I would unfortunately have to disagree on the black wheels statement I have a C63S with black rims and it Steele breaks have been nothing but a pain in the *** the dust is terrible with the steel brakes and covers the whole wheel it looks like a film of brown dust over the black wheels . I've been told the ceramics would have no Dust and this is the reason I chose ceramics this time as well as the performance if you're spending this kind of money on a car not ? and plus they look way better!

Originally Posted by xbox View Post
The ceramics are ridiculously powerful and fitted on the GTS I demoed last year.... they felt like they could slow the earths rotation

Alas, I didn't go for them, since the steel brakes are perfectly adequate and with black wheels, brake dust is a non-issue.

Personally, I would save the $//, unless track use warranted.

Jamming on the anchors full whack is unquestionably an eyeball-straining party piece, but for road use not cost effective IMO!

Last edited by Julienhi; 08-30-2017 at 01:49 PM.
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Old 08-30-2017, 02:17 PM
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If you'll never go to a road course with your GT R; (sacrilege I know), then the CCM rotors will last the lifetime of the car as long as you don't wear out the pads allowing them to then damage the rotors.

If you'll only attend a few HPDE events a year along with typical street driving, then again, you'll probably never wear out the CCM rotors as long as you exchange pads before they wear down too far. I use a width of 1/3rd for safety's sake on my Z06/7; meaning when the pads have worn down 2/3rds of the way, I replace them.

If you've bought the car primarily for road course duties, then it will be cheaper to stay with the iron brakes, although fade resistance may not be as good, and of course you'll have more unsprung weight at each corner.

I'm not sure if the CCM's on the GT R are Brembos and what size they are, but if so they may well be the exact same rotors as used on GM vehicles like my Z06/7, and hence this is the cheapest way to replace them should you need to do so.

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Old 08-30-2017, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Julienhi View Post
I would unfortunately have to disagree on the black wheels statement I have a C63S with black rims and it Steele breaks have been nothing but a pain in the *** the dust is terrible with the steel brakes and covers the whole wheel it looks like a film of brown dust over the black wheels . I've been told the ceramics would have no Dust and this is the reason I chose ceramics this time as well as the performance if you're spending this kind of money on a car not ? and plus they look way better!
Well I'll take brown on black vs black on silver

Waiting for the akebono pads here
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Old 09-02-2017, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by shakasean View Post
I just ordered by GTR as well with the steel brakes. It won't see a track so I declined the ceramics. Matching the yellow belts, stitching, badge and brakes was a bonus.

Was your dealer confident of that late Spring 2018 date? My dealer (in US) was thinking more end of the year 2017.

If it turns out to be Spring 2018, then I may just give up and pick up one already at the VPC.
We here, in Canada, have much fewer allocations comparing to USA, so I was told only 1 or 2 cars comes in to the region (I am in GTV) each month when delivery starts, who knows when due to the EPA holding issue.
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Old 09-11-2017, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by shakasean View Post
I just ordered by GTR as well with the steel brakes. It won't see a track so I declined the ceramics. Matching the yellow belts, stitching, badge and brakes was a bonus.

Was your dealer confident of that late Spring 2018 date? My dealer (in US) was thinking more end of the year 2017.

If it turns out to be Spring 2018, then I may just give up and pick up one already at the VPC.
I'm confused. As far as I can tell from the sales literature and builder tool, the yellow calipers are only available with ceramic brakes. Is this not the case? Because I want the yellow caliper so I can match the yellow stitching on the interior and all that.

Or am I not understanding... maybe the car comes standard with yellow/iron brakes but the ceramic is actually a copper/gold color? Hard to tell from the photos and the builder tool doesn't say.

Last edited by FourT6and2; 09-11-2017 at 01:52 PM.
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Old 09-11-2017, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by FourT6and2 View Post
I'm confused. As far as I can tell from the sales literature and builder tool, the yellow calipers are only available with ceramic brakes. Is this not the case? Because I want the yellow caliper so I can match the yellow stitching on the interior and all that.
Yellow calipers are only available with ceramic brakes. Red calipers with steel brakes. You can paint the red ones if you wish.
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Old 09-11-2017, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by California John View Post
Yellow calipers are only available with ceramic brakes. Red calipers with steel brakes. You can paint the red ones if you wish.
Are you sure? It looks like the car comes standard with yellow calipers and steel rotors. And the ceramic option has bronze calipers. That's if I am to believe MBUSA.com.

In any event, besides cost is there a downside to the ceramic option? Noise?
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Old 09-11-2017, 02:08 PM
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Calipers of the standard brakes can be either yellow or red at no cost.
Calipers of the ceramic brakes are yellowish .
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Old 09-11-2017, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by FourT6and2 View Post
Are you sure? It looks like the car comes standard with yellow calipers and steel rotors. And the ceramic option has bronze calipers. That's if I am to believe MBUSA.com.

In any event, besides cost is there a downside to the ceramic option? Noise?
You are absolutely correct. My mistake. Don't know about noise.


Last edited by California John; 09-11-2017 at 03:01 PM.
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Old 09-11-2017, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Gojirra99 View Post
Calipers of the standard brakes can be either yellow or red at no cost.
Calipers of the ceramic brakes are yellowish .
Thanks!
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Old 09-11-2017, 03:38 PM
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Ceramics stop you on a dime. They are over kill for street driving.

they do need to warm up before they grip Best . The rotors will wear faster than steel.
The replacement with wear is expensive. Unless you are racing and tracking the car, pass on the Carbon brakes
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Old 09-11-2017, 03:42 PM
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ANd if you're choosing on color, AMG ceramics are Bronze color not Yellow.
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Old 09-11-2017, 03:48 PM
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Cool, thanks!
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Old 09-11-2017, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by thecutter64 View Post
Ceramics stop you on a dime. They are over kill for street driving.

they do need to warm up before they grip Best . The rotors will wear faster than steel.
The replacement with wear is expensive. Unless you are racing and tracking the car, pass on the Carbon brakes
With the same tyre, iron brakes and CCMs will stop the same car in the same distance.

CCMs however will not fade like iron brakes with repeated high speed stops.

CCMs will not throw brake dust all over your wheels like iron brakes.

Modern CCMs do not need to "warm up" and work really well on the street even from first thing in the morning.

CCMs on the street will last the lifetime of the car and will outlast iron brakes as long as you don't allow the pads to get too low and ruin the surface of the CCM rotors.

Road course use will change the equation depending upon how many times a year you track the car, and how good a driver you are.
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Old 09-12-2017, 01:36 AM
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Actually the yellow callipers come standard for the steel brakes but you can take the optional red callipers for the steel breaks . Ceramics are an orange color and are much bigger

Originally Posted by California John View Post
Yellow calipers are only available with ceramic brakes. Red calipers with steel brakes. You can paint the red ones if you wish.
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Old 09-12-2017, 01:53 AM
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Originally Posted by thebishman View Post
With the same tyre, iron brakes and CCMs will stop the same car in the same distance.

CCMs however will not fade like iron brakes with repeated high speed stops.

CCMs will not throw brake dust all over your wheels like iron brakes.

Modern CCMs do not need to "warm up" and work really well on the street even from first thing in the morning.

CCMs on the street will last the lifetime of the car and will outlast iron brakes as long as you don't allow the pads to get too low and ruin the surface of the CCM rotors.

Road course use will change the equation depending upon how many times a year you track the car, and how good a driver you are.
So the key with CCMs is to replace the pads before it's too late?

Do the CCMs make noise during normal daily driving?
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Old 09-12-2017, 09:54 AM
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This is not so important, but ceramics don't put break dust on your wheels. The guy who details my cars keeps saying he wishes I had ceramics.
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