Broken/Plugged Cat?
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Miramar, FL
2003 C320 Sport Wagon
Broken/Plugged Cat?
Long time lurker...first time poster.
Had a rattle the last couple weeks in my 03 C320 Wagon...arrived about the same time as service so I thot I would kill two birds...I changed the air/cabin filters Saturday, planned service this week. Saturday nite while driving I get a check engine light and stumble. I stop the car...restart...and head home. Park the car for the rest of the weekend.
Yesterday I have to leave work early because my son wasn't able to get the car to the shop...bad stumble. I pull the airbox and recheck MAF connections (also rechecked on Sunday). Start the car and it runs OK. So I head to the shop. Halfway there I realize I can't drive any faster that 65 and the car won't maintain speed on overpasses (here in Florida there aren't any hills). I pull into the shop and there first inkling is that I screwed up a connection changing the air filters (this isn't my first rodeo). I invite him to check away but suggest that my rattle sounds an awful lot like it's coming from the Cat and my symptoms sound like a plugged/broken Cat. I'm waiting for his call.
My question to the forum is...has anyone had a similar problem? I did a quick search and didn't see anything. Emission equipment is carries 8/80 warranty so if confirmed it will be MB's problem. My mechanic is going to read the codes to confirm I didn't do anything that might show...he believes MB will try just about anthing to avoid replacing a 2K cat on their dime.
Had a rattle the last couple weeks in my 03 C320 Wagon...arrived about the same time as service so I thot I would kill two birds...I changed the air/cabin filters Saturday, planned service this week. Saturday nite while driving I get a check engine light and stumble. I stop the car...restart...and head home. Park the car for the rest of the weekend.
Yesterday I have to leave work early because my son wasn't able to get the car to the shop...bad stumble. I pull the airbox and recheck MAF connections (also rechecked on Sunday). Start the car and it runs OK. So I head to the shop. Halfway there I realize I can't drive any faster that 65 and the car won't maintain speed on overpasses (here in Florida there aren't any hills). I pull into the shop and there first inkling is that I screwed up a connection changing the air filters (this isn't my first rodeo). I invite him to check away but suggest that my rattle sounds an awful lot like it's coming from the Cat and my symptoms sound like a plugged/broken Cat. I'm waiting for his call.
My question to the forum is...has anyone had a similar problem? I did a quick search and didn't see anything. Emission equipment is carries 8/80 warranty so if confirmed it will be MB's problem. My mechanic is going to read the codes to confirm I didn't do anything that might show...he believes MB will try just about anthing to avoid replacing a 2K cat on their dime.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,067
Likes: 11
From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
I had my cat replaced - similar issue. However, I've had so much aftermarket stuff done that I didn't even try the dealer for a replacement - went with a Magnaflow for ~225, instead of 1350 at the dealership.
I do agree that you should start at the dealership, and yes, that warranty should be your first step. Good luck!
I do agree that you should start at the dealership, and yes, that warranty should be your first step. Good luck!
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Miramar, FL
2003 C320 Sport Wagon
I had my cat replaced - similar issue. However, I've had so much aftermarket stuff done that I didn't even try the dealer for a replacement - went with a Magnaflow for ~225, instead of 1350 at the dealership.
I do agree that you should start at the dealership, and yes, that warranty should be your first step. Good luck!
I do agree that you should start at the dealership, and yes, that warranty should be your first step. Good luck!
Banned
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 28
Likes: 2
230
tommy,
On the M111 the cat is separate from the header, so was the universal a bolt-in, or did you have to have a muffler shop weld one in?
I might be needing one for my M271, similar problems as above, being diagnosed today at the dealer.
On the M111 the cat is separate from the header, so was the universal a bolt-in, or did you have to have a muffler shop weld one in?
I might be needing one for my M271, similar problems as above, being diagnosed today at the dealer.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,258
Likes: 168
From: So. Oregon Coast
C230 Sport Coup + 2006 W164 ML350 + 99 Ford Escort RIP
Hey Guys, cool, glad to see there's already a current thread on this so I don't have to start a new one!
I'm getting rattling noises coming from my cat, and last night on the way back from Monterey, coming up the coast, I gunned it a little, the car sputtered, and threw a CEL.
It felt like the old Coil pack issue, in that the cylinder would turn off, till you shut off the car and restart. So, I have a couple of used ones I replaced before they went bad, tried mixing them around, but always the same problem,
which only occurs at high rpm's say 4K 5K rpm and under load.
Running the engine when not in gear, it limits at 4K rpm and runs smooth!
But it sounds like I got marbles in the cat. And I even got a backfire it seemed like.
I noticed a larger than normal amount of exhaust it seemed, but it was night. I'll try again tomorrow.
And as someone mentioned, a loss of power etc.
I'm getting misfire codes on cylinders 1 &2 + I got a P0352 code which means, P0352 Ignition Coil B Primary/Secondary Circuit Malfunction.
Where is Ignition coil B? Secondary circuit? I checked the service DVD, didn't find anything on that. But then it has the suckiest search function I've ever seen.
After clearing the codes, all which were misfired on various cylinders and P0352 Ignition Coil B Primary/Secondary Circuit Malfunction, I reset them,
put the pedal down till the CEL came back on, and it was
P0301 and P0302, misfire on 1 and 2.
Is this possibly the cat?
I've checked all the easy things. The battery is good, the alt is good,
the plugs are ok, and the coil packs are ok.
It's just at the hi rpms, and then it sputters and loses power.
Power seems good at low rpms.
Is this the symptoms of a Cat failure?
I didn't clean the MAF yet...but it was done not long ago.
What are the symptoms of the Crankshaft position sensor going bad?
I'm getting rattling noises coming from my cat, and last night on the way back from Monterey, coming up the coast, I gunned it a little, the car sputtered, and threw a CEL.
It felt like the old Coil pack issue, in that the cylinder would turn off, till you shut off the car and restart. So, I have a couple of used ones I replaced before they went bad, tried mixing them around, but always the same problem,
which only occurs at high rpm's say 4K 5K rpm and under load.
Running the engine when not in gear, it limits at 4K rpm and runs smooth!
But it sounds like I got marbles in the cat. And I even got a backfire it seemed like.
I noticed a larger than normal amount of exhaust it seemed, but it was night. I'll try again tomorrow.
And as someone mentioned, a loss of power etc.
I'm getting misfire codes on cylinders 1 &2 + I got a P0352 code which means, P0352 Ignition Coil B Primary/Secondary Circuit Malfunction.
Where is Ignition coil B? Secondary circuit? I checked the service DVD, didn't find anything on that. But then it has the suckiest search function I've ever seen.
After clearing the codes, all which were misfired on various cylinders and P0352 Ignition Coil B Primary/Secondary Circuit Malfunction, I reset them,
put the pedal down till the CEL came back on, and it was
P0301 and P0302, misfire on 1 and 2.
Is this possibly the cat?
I've checked all the easy things. The battery is good, the alt is good,
the plugs are ok, and the coil packs are ok.
It's just at the hi rpms, and then it sputters and loses power.
Power seems good at low rpms.
Is this the symptoms of a Cat failure?
I didn't clean the MAF yet...but it was done not long ago.
What are the symptoms of the Crankshaft position sensor going bad?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,258
Likes: 168
From: So. Oregon Coast
C230 Sport Coup + 2006 W164 ML350 + 99 Ford Escort RIP
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,067
Likes: 11
From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
Todd, got your email, tried to reply, and it didn't go through. So I'll post it here.
My cat definitely had loose material in it - I could hear it rattling about. I wasn't throwing the multitude of cels that you seem to be, but did have some hesitation at high rpms.
Other than knowing that it was a universal cat, I'm not sure which Magnaflow it was. I think that the shop did have to weld on at least one of the bungs - I'll take a look at things after work, and see if I can be more specific.
My cat definitely had loose material in it - I could hear it rattling about. I wasn't throwing the multitude of cels that you seem to be, but did have some hesitation at high rpms.
Other than knowing that it was a universal cat, I'm not sure which Magnaflow it was. I think that the shop did have to weld on at least one of the bungs - I'll take a look at things after work, and see if I can be more specific.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,258
Likes: 168
From: So. Oregon Coast
C230 Sport Coup + 2006 W164 ML350 + 99 Ford Escort RIP
Tommy, how did you determine your cat was bad?
What were the symptoms?
I contacted the local muffler store, and they said the Magnaflow
uniiveral is not CA approved, and therefore I have to buy from the dealer!
I don't have 1500 to spend on a cat, they said they'll install it, but no warranty, and that it could burn out in 6 months, but couldn't tell me why.
?????????????????
HELP!
Anyone have a model # of a specific Cat they've used and is working good, on 2002 C230?
What were the symptoms?
I contacted the local muffler store, and they said the Magnaflow
uniiveral is not CA approved, and therefore I have to buy from the dealer!
I don't have 1500 to spend on a cat, they said they'll install it, but no warranty, and that it could burn out in 6 months, but couldn't tell me why.
?????????????????
HELP!
Anyone have a model # of a specific Cat they've used and is working good, on 2002 C230?
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,067
Likes: 11
From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
Todd, that's how I knew. I'd call the guy who installed it, but he's on vacation this week. I'll look for a model # , but don't hold your breath.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,258
Likes: 168
From: So. Oregon Coast
C230 Sport Coup + 2006 W164 ML350 + 99 Ford Escort RIP
I had my cat replaced - similar issue. However, I've had so much aftermarket stuff done that I didn't even try the dealer for a replacement - went with a Magnaflow for ~225, instead of 1350 at the dealership.
I do agree that you should start at the dealership, and yes, that warranty should be your first step. Good luck!
I do agree that you should start at the dealership, and yes, that warranty should be your first step. Good luck!
Just got back from getting estimates.
500-600 at Midas and then 450 a smaller place.
I think in either case I'm getting farked, but they think they're doing me a favor. In both cases it's a Magnaflow, which isnt' certified in CA for my car, and they won't warranty. What BS. I know the part costs 225, and the labor wouldn't be more than an hour, so thats about 300.
Anyone know a place in San Jose?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,258
Likes: 168
From: So. Oregon Coast
C230 Sport Coup + 2006 W164 ML350 + 99 Ford Escort RIP
Cat was bad....problem solved.
It's a done deal. Got a new one installed, for $300 in San Jose.
Living in a small town is cool, but sometimes the lack of competition for business make people a little bold, expect to get paid more.
I went here....
Michaels Mufflers
3480 Pearl Ave, San Jose, CA 95136
Phone: (408) 265-7804
I think I saw on the box it was this one..
click here.
Car is running good again, though it seem like I'm getting a little throttle lag. Maybe it'll take a while for the ECU to adjust. But foot to the floor, 6000 rpm, and no CEL. Need to the throttle reset and the other thing, the valve or whatever.
The old cat had tan grey dust coming out of it, same stuff coming out the exhaust pipe. Anyway, interesting that the
cat caused misfires. So many things can cause that as in fouled or bad plugs, bad coils, MAF, bad battery, dragging down the voltage...
but I checked all those things, and plus it sounded like rocks in there....
all good now.
EDIT: Found this online for $180 if anyone needs it...
Living in a small town is cool, but sometimes the lack of competition for business make people a little bold, expect to get paid more.
I went here....
Michaels Mufflers
3480 Pearl Ave, San Jose, CA 95136
Phone: (408) 265-7804
I think I saw on the box it was this one..
click here.
Car is running good again, though it seem like I'm getting a little throttle lag. Maybe it'll take a while for the ECU to adjust. But foot to the floor, 6000 rpm, and no CEL. Need to the throttle reset and the other thing, the valve or whatever.
The old cat had tan grey dust coming out of it, same stuff coming out the exhaust pipe. Anyway, interesting that the
cat caused misfires. So many things can cause that as in fouled or bad plugs, bad coils, MAF, bad battery, dragging down the voltage...
but I checked all those things, and plus it sounded like rocks in there....
all good now.
EDIT: Found this online for $180 if anyone needs it...
Was the 225 installed?
Just got back from getting estimates.
500-600 at Midas and then 450 a smaller place.
I think in either case I'm getting farked, but they think they're doing me a favor. In both cases it's a Magnaflow, which isnt' certified in CA for my car, and they won't warranty. What BS. I know the part costs 225, and the labor wouldn't be more than an hour, so thats about 300.
Anyone know a place in San Jose?
Just got back from getting estimates.
500-600 at Midas and then 450 a smaller place.
I think in either case I'm getting farked, but they think they're doing me a favor. In both cases it's a Magnaflow, which isnt' certified in CA for my car, and they won't warranty. What BS. I know the part costs 225, and the labor wouldn't be more than an hour, so thats about 300.
Anyone know a place in San Jose?
Last edited by C230 Sport Coup; Aug 9, 2007 at 09:06 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 313
Likes: 0
From: NY
2016 C63s AMG
After reading this thread I think I have the same problem with my secondary cat. Just to make sure, this is how I can describe what is going on. First I had a rattling sound from the secondary cat. I drove it for a while and nothing bad was happining, actually the car drove better and shifted in every gear 200-500 more in rpms!(I have an auto). Then all of a sudden as I was driving past 60mph in high rpms the check engine light came on. The car sounded horrible like marbles rattling and then my car drove like crap, putting and stuttering, the ideal dropped, but the car never stalled or stalls. I pulled over shut the car.... then I got back in started the car and it was fine. Soon after going over 4000rpms or 5000rpms, cant remember it did it again! So I shut my car turned it back on and it was fine again. My car is at the dealership anyway for the pvc recall. I told them what is going on, but if our cars dont need the secondary cat I would rather not have it since the performance was better. I also have the Kleemann high flow cat so I was wondering if it is possible to have to much of a free flowing exhaust to cause any issues ie.. check engine light and car running like crap util I shut it off and turn it back on?
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
I had that issue and have it once again - sounded like marbles rolling around under the car - dealer replaced the cat - fixed the issue - now 1 year later it is back (started again last week) - hopefully it is the other cat and not the new one. I'm glad I bought the extended warranty.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 313
Likes: 0
From: NY
2016 C63s AMG
I had that issue and have it once again - sounded like marbles rolling around under the car - dealer replaced the cat - fixed the issue - now 1 year later it is back (started again last week) - hopefully it is the other cat and not the new one. I'm glad I bought the extended warranty.
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
No check engine light - just a noisy rattling cat. No difference in running - just noisy at lower RPMs and at acceleration - you can hear it really well if you open your door - and listen under the car as you gun it a few times - definitely broken material in the cat.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 313
Likes: 0
From: NY
2016 C63s AMG
No check engine light - just a noisy rattling cat. No difference in running - just noisy at lower RPMs and at acceleration - you can hear it really well if you open your door - and listen under the car as you gun it a few times - definitely broken material in the cat.
Last edited by pugguy2001; Jun 8, 2008 at 09:05 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 313
Likes: 0
From: NY
2016 C63s AMG
Oh ok, can you let me know if your car starts to have problems. As you drive the car more and more your cat will eventually break up even more and "possibly" start to give you problems like have. I read other threads that people had the same problems as me and had to shut the car and restart it every time until they had there secondary cat replaced.
