What is invoice?
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Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: North Berkeley
C230 C-Coupe
What is invoice?
When people talk about 3% over invoice do you including the invoice on the options?
I will order a C-Coupe next month and try and plan to use the websites listed to get a good price. Then bargain with the dealers in N. California (In best sales tax areas).
I am going for Black (no special order charge) with Oyster leather, C2 and auto. Previous posts have said they got CD changer or tele aid thrown in, should I expect to get one of the options knocked off?
I suppose I really would like to know if anyone got a good deal in N Califronia? If so who from?
Thanks
Nathan
I will order a C-Coupe next month and try and plan to use the websites listed to get a good price. Then bargain with the dealers in N. California (In best sales tax areas).
I am going for Black (no special order charge) with Oyster leather, C2 and auto. Previous posts have said they got CD changer or tele aid thrown in, should I expect to get one of the options knocked off?
I suppose I really would like to know if anyone got a good deal in N Califronia? If so who from?
Thanks
Nathan
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Joined: Dec 2001
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I've been spec'ing out prices on the coupe myself. You should go to carbuyingtips.com. They have an excellent worksheet to factor in all the costs and financing. Also kbb.com (kelly blue book) has breakdowns on the invoice price vs. msrp, any factory to dealer holdbacks - rebates (right now they're at 3% of invoice) and breakdowns of all option costs vs option msrps. My pricing comes with C5, C7 and cd changer has an offer of $28,672 (with a 5% dealer profit margin). The msrp total is $30,340. Whatever you do don't get the cd changer from the dealer. They bumped the price up from $750 to $950. Get the factory changer off the internet and have the Mercedes techs put it in. It should be covered under the warranty at that point. I live in the bay area as well. Tell me how your luck goes with negotiating with the dealers. You will have to wait just like the rest of us, if you want leather.
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Hey Kwik,
How many dealers did you go through and did you submit them their one single cost figure? Did you have to wait for your car to come in from the factory as well. What dealership gave you such a great deal. Hell they're so many dealerships up in norcal, when I'm ready, I'll let them all cannibalize each other in order to get the right price.
How many dealers did you go through and did you submit them their one single cost figure? Did you have to wait for your car to come in from the factory as well. What dealership gave you such a great deal. Hell they're so many dealerships up in norcal, when I'm ready, I'll let them all cannibalize each other in order to get the right price.
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From: SF Bay Area
MB C230 Kompressor Sports Coupe
dealers in Northern California
When I was shopping around for a C230 in Northern California, most didn't want to deal with me (especially in Oakland). I dealt with Sacramento, San Rafael, San Francisco, Oakland, etc.
I had to go down to Laguna Nigel in Southern California to get a good deal.
$28k out the door (black, stick, C2, cd-player, car cover, 7.25% sales tax, license, tire fee)
I had to go down to Laguna Nigel in Southern California to get a good deal.
$28k out the door (black, stick, C2, cd-player, car cover, 7.25% sales tax, license, tire fee)
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Hey Tomgqui,
Did you fax your offer down to Laguna Niguel? Was there a specific salesman you dealt with. Was there alot of negotiating? You got a pretty good deal. At least you got alot of break-in mileage driving back up from Socal. Let me know, thanks.
Did you fax your offer down to Laguna Niguel? Was there a specific salesman you dealt with. Was there alot of negotiating? You got a pretty good deal. At least you got alot of break-in mileage driving back up from Socal. Let me know, thanks.
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From: SF Bay Area
MB C230 Kompressor Sports Coupe
Originally posted by heat010
Hey Tomgqui,
Did you fax your offer down to Laguna Niguel? Was there a specific salesman you dealt with. Was there alot of negotiating? You got a pretty good deal. At least you got alot of break-in mileage driving back up from Socal. Let me know, thanks.
Hey Tomgqui,
Did you fax your offer down to Laguna Niguel? Was there a specific salesman you dealt with. Was there alot of negotiating? You got a pretty good deal. At least you got alot of break-in mileage driving back up from Socal. Let me know, thanks.
There is a lot of competition down there, so I think that's why it was easier to deal. For some reason, Northern California dealers didn't want to even negotiate. Sacramento and San Rafael were willing to give $500 off as the "internet" discount.
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Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2001
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From: North Berkeley
C230 C-Coupe
Heat, I would appreciate the breakdown. Did you get this price on web?
I was planning to get the CD changer from Becker or ebay and get MB to install.
I bought my last car for Invoice but paid MSRP on the options. I ended up buying a Ford Focus but wanted a new bug but the sales staff would not budge on the price.
This time I want to get the car I want at a better price.
I was planning to get the CD changer from Becker or ebay and get MB to install.
I bought my last car for Invoice but paid MSRP on the options. I ended up buying a Ford Focus but wanted a new bug but the sales staff would not budge on the price.
This time I want to get the car I want at a better price.
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Here's the breakdown from kbb.com
First price is invoice, second is msrp
C230 - 23,204, 24,950
C2 - 925, 995
Auto - 1209, 1300
Leather- No price listing, so I got it off of mbusa.com - 1,410
Destination - 645
Dealer Holdback - Kickback from factory - 3% of msrp - $748.50
Subtotals - invoice - 27,393, msrp 29,300
Good luck in your negotiations.
First price is invoice, second is msrp
C230 - 23,204, 24,950
C2 - 925, 995
Auto - 1209, 1300
Leather- No price listing, so I got it off of mbusa.com - 1,410
Destination - 645
Dealer Holdback - Kickback from factory - 3% of msrp - $748.50
Subtotals - invoice - 27,393, msrp 29,300
Good luck in your negotiations.
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From: SoCal
2002 C230 : 2007 C230
heat010,
I called two dealers, told them the car & options I wanted and the price I would pay. They both laughed and said NO. I replied, with my number and said call me if you change your mind. The next day the second one called and said OK to my price. Never had to leave home to work out the deal.
The funny part: When I arrived that night to pickup the car, I noticed that the car came from the first dealer.
I called two dealers, told them the car & options I wanted and the price I would pay. They both laughed and said NO. I replied, with my number and said call me if you change your mind. The next day the second one called and said OK to my price. Never had to leave home to work out the deal.
The funny part: When I arrived that night to pickup the car, I noticed that the car came from the first dealer.
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From: CT
Here is more than you ever wanted to know:
Here are my numbers/strategy. I did the shopping on the phone after deciding what price I wanted to pay. I called the dealers, asked for a salesman, said I was a serious buyer who had bought 5 previous cars over the phone. I told them I was prepared to buy and was looking for a car with (my specs) and a price of $**. Ultimately, I got 3 dealers to agree to that price.
Here are calculations for 230 coupe, silver, auto, C5 (and yes, I know I passed up a great bargain by not getting C7)
NOTE: The Edmunds and, at last check KBB calculators do not add in the metallic paint charge ($640MSRP) when they compute invoice. I added $600 to their invoice price. The other "wild card" is what amounts the dealer adds in for advertising fees and what is know in CT as "conveyance fee". These are just additional dealer profits that they are reluctant to delete, so I considered these charges in my computations of what I wanted to pay "out the door", exclusive of tax & license. Conveyance fees varied from $200-300, and advertising fees from $0-500. Don't be caught with a lowball price and then big add-ins.
Invoice MSRP
Base Price 23204 24950
Auto 1209 1300
C5 2511 2700
Metallic 600(est) 640
Dest. Charge 645 645
Total 28169 30245
The invoice +3% is $29,014, which, at least in this area, is a number at which dealers were willing to sell (actually got a bit under-2.4%).
A final note--if there is any doubt about net obtained invoice vs what dealer says, ask them to fax a copy of their paperwork.
In my case, I gave a CC# over the phone and faxed sales agreement.
Happy shopping!
Here are my numbers/strategy. I did the shopping on the phone after deciding what price I wanted to pay. I called the dealers, asked for a salesman, said I was a serious buyer who had bought 5 previous cars over the phone. I told them I was prepared to buy and was looking for a car with (my specs) and a price of $**. Ultimately, I got 3 dealers to agree to that price.
Here are calculations for 230 coupe, silver, auto, C5 (and yes, I know I passed up a great bargain by not getting C7)
NOTE: The Edmunds and, at last check KBB calculators do not add in the metallic paint charge ($640MSRP) when they compute invoice. I added $600 to their invoice price. The other "wild card" is what amounts the dealer adds in for advertising fees and what is know in CT as "conveyance fee". These are just additional dealer profits that they are reluctant to delete, so I considered these charges in my computations of what I wanted to pay "out the door", exclusive of tax & license. Conveyance fees varied from $200-300, and advertising fees from $0-500. Don't be caught with a lowball price and then big add-ins.
Invoice MSRP
Base Price 23204 24950
Auto 1209 1300
C5 2511 2700
Metallic 600(est) 640
Dest. Charge 645 645
Total 28169 30245
The invoice +3% is $29,014, which, at least in this area, is a number at which dealers were willing to sell (actually got a bit under-2.4%).
A final note--if there is any doubt about net obtained invoice vs what dealer says, ask them to fax a copy of their paperwork.
In my case, I gave a CC# over the phone and faxed sales agreement.
Happy shopping!
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I bet those dealers were willing to go with that approx 2.4% profit over invoice because they're already getting the 3% of the msrp holdback/kickback from the factory. So essentially they're getting a 5.4% profit.
As usual, excellent feedback from experienced buyers.
As usual, excellent feedback from experienced buyers.
Thread Starter
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From: North Berkeley
C230 C-Coupe
DrMike, excellent information and heat, Kwik and toqbui. I bet I'm not the only one on this list who will find this useful.
Considering the amount of time I have invested in buying this car, nothing could be more than I want to know.
I have though subjected my co-workers, friends and wife to far more details than they would ever want to know.
Nathan
Considering the amount of time I have invested in buying this car, nothing could be more than I want to know.
I have though subjected my co-workers, friends and wife to far more details than they would ever want to know.
Nathan
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From: CT
The 3% holdback is money that comes to the dealer from MB. On a build-to-order car, this is extra profit. However, on a car that has been on the lot, this money goes to defray interest costs. Even at the 5.4% profit, I felt that it was a reasonable deal for me and for them too. Not to pity them too much, but the generally slim margin on this model means that they are not getting exhorbitantly more even when sold at msrp. If I recall correctly from my last Benz in '85, at that time the profit margin was close to 20%. In addition, I am quite content to be paying $1000 less for the 2002 Benz than I did for my '85.
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