breastroker

Just bought a new Orion Blue C230 Kompressor coupe, C2 and C7 with oyster cloth seats, and automatic. Got $6K off list price which looks about right what others have been getting in this forum. Sure a big difference from my other Mercedes, a 1969 300 SEL 6.3. (0-60 in 5.7 seconds)http://members.tripod.com/~breastrok...sBenzM100.html

Does anyone have experience with getting more power out of the new 1.8 L engine? Power chip has a ECU for $840 they claim 207 HP. This requires 93 octane gas. 207 sure looks good though. I don't know how the engine would respond to gas additives like 108+. Still the additives are much cheaper than blending with 100 octane gas from Union 76 at $5.50 per gallon. Blending 3 gallons of 100 with 13 of 91 octane gives 93.4 octane. That's an extra $10 over 91 octane, while 108+ will do the job for less than $5.00.

Looks like a good cold air system that could use smoother hoses. Exhaust system could be a little more mandrell bended, and the sound is too quiet. Sound like a vacuum cleaner.

I just today found this forum, already bought a Audio 10 radio with CD from eBay. Also bought sheepskins, clear turn signal lights from eBay. None have arrived (had the car a week now).

I ordered the C230 4 door hood star from Caliber motors ($14), how do you remove the flat one?

Orion Blue 2003
Oyster cloth interior
C7 17" Wheel package
5 spd auto
Panoramic Sunroof

finalheaven

question? the overestimation by mercedes benz only for the c230 coupes? or does that apply for sedans too?

That is the reason for the 6k off right?

And personally i plan to get the c230 sedan and i like the flat benz sign better...just my perference...

Buellwinkle

18 HP from a chip is possible specially with 93 octane but your not in a position in CA to get 93 so it's probably not worth it. What are they claiming for 91 octane? There isn't anything worthwile for the 1.8L. It may never really get anything. If you can get custom made headers made and a full mandrel bent exhaust that's a little bigger, say 2 1/2" and a free flowing exhaust you may likely get 10-15 HP. Maybe a CAI would get you 5-8 HP if you can custom make one. It's tough when you have a totally new engine. Also you can probably get a pulley company like ASP to make you underdrive pulleys for the accesories, this seems to get decent gains on the V6. Anything more than that like a turbo replacement or a better s/c would like cost a few thousand more.

breastroker

I agree with Buellwinkle, the pulley may be the best source of power where you need it. The alternator puts out 120 amps, thats a lot of HP at 5000 RPM. (guess 15 HP) Does the A/C cut out under higher RPM, low vacuum?

Power chip http://www.powerchipgroup.com/datasheets/2/Mer0117.pdf
lists 204 HP using 91 octane gas, not bad from 109 cubic inches.


finalheaven, I was told by 3 different dealers that Mercedes had planned on selling the coupes to a major car rental company, but with the economy bad the rental company backed out. I have seen the 6 speed go for as low as $21.9K. They do not discount the 4 door C230 by much more than $2K max. It helped that I went to the largest MB dealer in the world, Fletcher Jones. They sell four cars for one of the next largest dealer. They treat you like a king, even sending a Fletcher Jones car blanket. They were $1,000 lower than any other dealer in southern california, and I checked almost 15 dealers! And they had the car I wanted. I went in telling them I wanted only a C230K coupe with automatic, but I prefered Orion blue and cloth interior. They forced me to take the wheel package (I really, really wanted it!) and the sunroof. But they cut the options costs in half.

I have seen a very complex instructions set for the Audio 10 radio, but it does not make sense to remove the A/C grill and the other stuff. I bought the tools to remove the stock radio, says Becker removal key set - 963 589 01 5000. Has anyone used these? The description on at set at eBay http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...&category=6774

Anyone have the illuminated door sills? Seems like a lot of money.

Thanks
breastroker

Lynn

Do you think we on this forum and others are so stupid that none of us thought of those keys in the over two years 203's have been on sale? Those keys don't work on the 203. The dash panel has to be removed to access two screws (four with COMAND) that hold the unit in its bracket. There are no holes to insert the keys into, either.

breastroker

Lynn,
Hey, I am a newbie to this forum. I only found it last night. Now if you want to talk about MB M100's I am there.

Thanks for the info on the radio tools. I guess I will need that long T20 torx screwdriver after all. Funny the Soundlabs web site lists the radio removal tools on it's web site. Thats where I went wrong.

Hey, I can only go with what other dealers have told me about Fletcher Jones. Penske had 920 MBs in stock and they said they don't come near what FJ sells. They did beat the already great price of every other dealer within a hundred miles, by a thousand dollars.

I do know the buying experience was the best I every had, and I have owned over a hundred cars. Guess that makes me old.

It will take me weeks to get up to speed at this forum, so remember there are no stupid questions, just newbies.

You have to admit, this forum is great.

Lynn

Interesting that you got the best price at FJ, because from what I read here, most people get a better price at MB of Laguna Niguel. Also from what I read here, no one is neutral about FJ. They either love it or hate it whether they are talking about sales or service.

I remember reading reviews of the 6.3 back when it was new. The guys at R & T would go looking for SS Chevelles and other muscle cars.

Buellwinkle

FJ never gave me a chance to buy a car from them, their salesmonkey was arrogant and felt that I was beneath them, probably because I were jeans and a harley shirt on the weekends. To bad for them because not only did I pay full sticker price for my coupe but I paid cash. MB of LN really pissed me off Friday. They brought my car out after service (yes, one more failure, this time it was teleaid and I don't even subscribe) and left the car there without setting the parking brake. Luckily I caught it after it rolled a few feet, inches from the side of another car. Since I couldn't hold it and get in the car I told them that I was just going to let go if nobody helped but they came running after I showed them I was serious by walking away from the car and it started rolling again. I didn't want to stay near it or they would blame me for the accident.

As for the Audio 10 radio, come on over and I can put it in for ya.

czachari

Both ASP and Kleemann are working on pulleys for the 1.8. Giac USA is working on a chip. I will be looking to mod by next year this time. I want to make sure this car will be a keeper first.....


CZ

breastroker

Buellwinkle

Your car sounds great, what did you pay for the Renntech Muffler, and ITG Air Filter. Really would like to see it up close.
Sounds like the service department at MB of LN is not so good. Any suggestions? MB of Long Beach sponsors the MB Club and seem OK. Caliber motors gives 25% off on parts. Haven't been to the service department of FJ yet. You are right, they are snooty, but I wore sharp clothes when I went in after work that Friday. I figure when in Germany, do as the Germans do.

How many times have you been on the dyno at evosport? What do they charge. I will wait till I get a couple of thousand miles on the engine and then do a few things to the engine and suspension. The PowerChip seems the easiest way to get HP withour affecting the warranty.

I am used to buying 108 Octane Booster or Outlaw octane booster for my MB 6.3L. I have the good year (1969) with high compression, dual points and vacuum advance. Get 15 mpg on the freeway, while those with the 70-71s get 10-11 mpg. I need every octane I can get with that car. Track Auto just had the Outlaw Booster for $2.99 a bottle enough to treat 20 gallons. I put the whole thing in my C230K. Should get about 93 octane with it.
Thanks
Wayne

Lynn

Almost a year ago, GIAC promised that a chip would be available in a few weeks. We haven't heard a word from them since.

Mike T.

Hmmm

Here's the math as I calculate it. Assuming your amperage figure is correct.

120 A at 14 V tension = 1680 W

1680 W = 1.68 kW

1.68 kW = 2.28 HP

Now I know it's not a 100% efficient conversion of mechanical to electrical energy, with any alternator. But according to your estimate of a 15 HP loss with the alternator, there would have to be a loss of 85% of the mechanical energy in the generation of this output power. That would be a pretty staggeringly poor efficiency (mind you, internal combustion engines aren't too great in this respect).

I could be wrong, please feel free to correct me if there is an error here. Electrics are not my strong point.

The second comment is that the alternator provides power on demand. When no electrical accessories are "on", the alternator windings do not generate much of a resistance to rotation. Only at highest electrical loads, and then some, would the peak output be generated, hence, peak resistance - and power loss - be felt.

The third comment is that the entire power loss attributable to the alternator cannot be recovered with underdrive pulleys. So how many percent of that loss will you recover by underdriving the pulley? Realistically, I think we're talking about gnat feces here....

And if the power loss is minimised with v. extreme underdrives, what electrical compromises does that entail? You won't be able to have the wipers and headlights on at idle?

czachari

asking me where I was located because the needed cars to try their chip on. Since I am in CT and they on the West Coast nothing happened but they said they're working on it. I think once the 1.8L has been out for a year or so and with the coupe selling in the mid-$20s I can see a lot of young people buying them and modding them. I am very happy with the power delivery of my C230 Sedan. Today it was 75 degrees and with 2 people in the car and the A/C on it was the 1st time I felt the need for more power. Pulley and chip and I/C will be the cure for me.


CZ

breastroker

I went to have my Audio 10 CD put in, Buellwinkle did most of the 15 minute job. Sounds much better. I really like his 2002, very fast and pulls VERY hard in each gear. I would guess 0-60 at about 6.0-6.2 range. Handles great two, perfect for California freeways and streets.

We spent some time comparing the 2003-2002 coupes. Looks like the 2003 has some advantages in some areas such as a larger exhaust manifold and pipe to the catalyst converter, with lots of room around the exhaust. There are two holes for air intake into ac one shaped air cleaner. Only one hole is hooked up from the factory, I intend on getting the 2002 plastic funnel and corregated pipe to tie into the other side (right side) so that there will be two operational cold air intakes. My hot rod days go way back and there can never be enough cold air intake surface area.

Another area of improvement engine wise is a cut out switch when engine throttle is wide open, to cut out both the A/C and the alternator. Most american cars cut out the AC under full throttle. From my hot rod days we used to see dyno reports of an extra 15 HP with the old 60 amp alternators. This can be set using the same kind of throttle voltage switches that the Nitrous oxide people are using for cars with electronic throttles.

I think I can produce the illuminated door sills for under $200, will know more in a week or two. I would be using the stock door sill for the coupes.

Anyone know the parts for the 2003 C32 AMG sway bars? I can get a discount at Caliber motors that might make it a great buy.









Orion Blue 2003 Jaspisblau
Oyster cloth interior
C7 17" Wheel package
5 spd auto
Panoramic Sunroof
MB Audio 10 CD
Silver sheepskins

Next week:
clear turn lights


soon:

Eiback sway bars and springs

Matt230K

That funnel and short hose is actually attached to the entire piece that goes across to both intakes, and it seems to go down around the radiator too. On my '02, I ended up cutting a hole in the left intake to get air to my cone filter when I tried that. It seemed easier than replacing the whole piece.

Buell, you might know better about what it takes to change this piece, since you have had your bumper off many times?

Buellwinkle

Wayne, the best place for MB parts is Hoehn Motors in Carlsbad, ask for Jeff and tell them you want wholesale parts. They are about 20-30% cheaper than any other dealer. They are only open weekdays but they can ship the parts.

Mike, I agree with you, the altenator does not have much drag on it most of the time because there's little or no load when it's not charging. I can see the higher drag if the battery was dead and you put high demands on it. As for me, mine's overdriven 20% as it is and most tuners like Renntech and ASP would not have done this if there was serious HP loses.

Lynn, I bug them at least once a week on this for the past year, so that's about 52 times already. And I'm sure their dealers like DSR that currently sell the SLK230 chip are also bugging them. Garrett will be done with med school real soon and he will likely wrap this project up this summer. Their remote control looks great. You can have 4 settings, for example a 91 octane, 93 octane, track racing fuel and stock setting and switch programs from the keyfob remote control.

breastroker

Buellwinkle

Can you email me the phone number of Hoehn Motors in Carlsbad?

Attached is a photo of the air to the filter on the 2003 C230K coupe, notice the convergence cone. Very trick from MB.

breastroker

Attached is the right scoop that goes nowhere on the 1.8. Getting the scoop from the 2002 2.3K and the attached corregated tube and then moulding it into the left scoop air will increase total cool air volume by 30-40%. Cool is good.

breastroker

Here is a photo of the plugged right scoop from the 1.8K.
Its a straight shot to the air cleaner inlet.

Here is from IC Theory:
Lower the inlet temperature. The less hard the turbo has to work to compress the air then the lower the temperature the air coming out of the turbo is.

You can work the turbo less hard by running less boost, by improving the pressure drop between the air filter and the turbo, or by having a more efficient compressor wheel.

You can also reduce the pressure drop in the intercooler, which allows you to run the same amount of boost in the intake manifold while having a lower turbo discharge pressure. More on this later. If you can drop the turbo outlet pressure by 2 psi, or raise the turbo inlet pressure by 1 psi, that will drop the turbo discharge temperature about 16 degrees (depending on the compression efficiency and boost level).

If the turbo air is going into the intercooler 16 degrees colder then it may come out only 10 degrees colder than before, but that is still better than what it was.

breastroker

Photo of the functional left side inlet air scoop for the 2003 1.8K

breastroker

Any one got the part number off the right (drivers side) inlet scoop from your 2002 coupe? Sure would appreciate it.
I want to start on this right away.

Matt230K

Did you read my post above about that piece?

breastroker

Matt230K

I may not be able to take the 2002 piece off of a 2002, so I may have to fabricate a nice scoop. I will have to add another air inlet to the piece in front of the air filter. Sure would be a good after market part for some company.

Matt230K

Yeah, since that short hose piece is shaped on the end to fit into the air box, you'll probably have to modify it anyway. So it's probably easier to just cut open the closed intake hole and then attach a custom hose.

tifosiv122

Wow that explains a lot. I have been noticing when I push the car it seems to get very hot in the cabin. I was going to complain at service 'a', but now i know that its supposed to do that i'm happy.

Erik