Jim Banville

And? Go to autospies.com and read about the BIG problems Lexus is having with its first car built in the USA, and how Lexus is worried that it will bring down their good reliability numbers. Sound familiar? Duh!

Buellwinkle

It's funny because I had 2 Ford pickups and I never had any squeaks, rattles, check engine lights, or even car wash destroyed engine sensors. Heck not even dash top vent that deposited chemical vapors on the winshields or over engineered fiber optic wires that made the radio act funny, not even excessive brake dust. I bought my first Chevy pickup a few months ago and it's been great. Even came with an in-dash CD player, no extra charge. Made in America is not something that is bad as you can see all but one American brand beat MB's dependability, I'm proud my truck is made in the U.S. But there is a down side and it is huge, I do have to wash it myself but It's a small price to pay to have a dependable parts chaser for the MB. What's funny is the service advisors and mechanics that I've seen drive don't have MB's, they have Audi's, BMW's, Subies, Ford's, no MB's, what does that tell you? I'm sure they pass up incentives from the MB and dealer to drive these other brands.

Jim Banville

Great for you! I had 4 Expeditions that had everything from minor to major problems. From squeaks to vibrations. From bad window regulators to a bad tranny.


Great for you! Someone my wife knows bought a new Suburban and it has been in the shop more than in their garage.

Who said made in USA was bad? It is apparent that both MB and Lexus have had problems from their lines built here though. They is no debating that issue.

Don't put any grass sod in it! I JUST remembered out last Expedition's rear gas shocks blew out as my wife drove home from Lowe's. Quality Job #1, my ****!

Audi's?! Aren't they as "bad" as MB on those dependability lists you love to post? Perhaps you should go and bother the owners at an Audi forum (unless you already do)

speedfrk

Jim, the statistics don't lie. Even MB has admitted that they have a quality problem and are working to fix it. Lexus will iron out it's problems with it's US production plants. US made Hondas are very good quality, so it isn't a made in USA problem.
I think Exhibitions are made for hauling kids not sod. I've seen my friends F150 loaded until the bumper was practically on the ground and he never had any suspension problems. They make Exhibitions for show and ride, not hauling sod. Anyways, I admire your tenacity in defending MB. I bet you defended Ford until the 4th Exhibition. I really don't have any brand loyalities. If I did, it would be to GM for the way they always take good care of my mother and sister when they have a problem with their cars. But MB basically gave me the finger over my car, so they deserve no loyalty from me.

Buellwinkle

Frankly, unless I have about 200 lbs. in the bed of the truck it's a very bouncy ride. I bought it to go off road with about 600 lbs. of dirt bikes and gear and it seems to handle the rugged outdoors without much complaint although it does sag a bit in the rear. In comparison, the similar looking Blazer we used to use with a trailer had creaks and squeaks from the rear axle to the dashboard pulling the same duty (but with a trailer). I never took these things apart but the trucks are different despite some shared sheetmetal. I would imagine that although an F150 Supercrew looks very similar to an Expedition, they are totally different. Jim, sounds like you have better luck with Expeditions than I've had with 4 MB's (one that needed a tranny in 1 week).

BTW, the one mechanic with the Audi now has a Subie, maybe he got tired of working on it.

BenzOwner02

Can someone tell me why I know 6 people at my work place that have had a Lexus IS300 for about 1-2 years with not one single problem and why I who own a benz have had several?????

The issue isn't where the car is built, the issue is who is the manufacturer. No one said Japanese cars did not have issues. The thing you want to remember is they have a lot less issues. If go out to the street and pull over 10 lexus cars and ask them what problems have you had chances are they will tell you non if maybe one problem in one of them. Do the same for Benz and 7 out 10 will tell you they have visited the dealership over 2 times. I can not back up this statistic but try it out some time it really does work. I work in a building that has over 3000 people in it. I have talked to so many people with different cars over the last couple of years.

Again, I bought my benz for look and for the feel. I knew in advance that it will have issues and sure enough it did.

Jim Banville

Ckeck out the Lexus boards and you'll see plenty of people with problems!

WRONG. The Expedition shares the SAME chassis (same frame, suspension, engine, tranny, etc.) with the F150. The Expedition SHOULD carry hundreds of pounds in its cargo area, wether it be sod or gold bars. It tried and failed! Let's not make excuses for Ford.

Nope. I just tell it like it is. I was never very crazy about the Expeditions. It drove like a boat . The only thing they had going for them was seating space and cargo room, but you see what happened when I really tried to use it . I'll be trading in my C240 for an Infiniti in a few months, so I have NO loyalty to MB. I dount I'll ever have another one. Not because of problems, but because life is short and there are too many other brands that I'd like to taste

I never said it was. I merely pointed out that the almighty Lexus is having the SAME problem that MB had

Jim Banville

Lexus owners complaining...alignment problem noisy brakes suspension noises CD changer quirk dash problem ac/alternator problems
climate control problem starting problem dead car
power window problem

BenzOwner02

Jim, thanks for the link to the lexus forums. Man, I went there and they dont have as many issues as we do. You guys should check it out. For every viewable page of posts they have they have way less more complaints and problems than we do. For example pull up on our web site last 30 days and count the complaints we have then do the same for them. No way can we compare to them in quality. That supports my stats from earlier

By the way, just by posting links to a couple of people having problems with lexus does not by any way support that lexus is equal with benzs issue. Nice try though Jim All I am saying is they have issues as well but no where close as to what we have. The question that benz can not answer is why?

I could be wrong on this but werent you the one that was going to buy an infiniti instead? I think you used excuses such as you need space, you need a higher car etc....

Guest0001

remember benzC240 anyone? i dunnoooo

Jim Banville

Well, duh! I wasn't trying to compare Benz reliability to Lexus. Get a clue! I was posting those complaints as a contrast to the notion that they have NO complaints

I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT! He's baaaaack!

Moderator, you wanna check out this newbie/Benz hater?

Guest0001

i second this

he even has an 02 C240 just like him

look at his typing style. very very familiar

Jim Banville

Well, whereas most of everthing you have said in this thread is wrong, you are correct that I will be getting an Infiniti. If the E320 was only $40K, we would STRONGLY consider it. We drove it and it is only slightly bigger than the C240 in seating room. 50 extra HP and a few inches of extra seating room isn't worth the nearly $50K asking price! For someone who makes more money than we do, it may very well be worth it. The size/HP/looks/potential "above average" reliability of the FX35 does seem worth the $40K we are willing to spend.

Xpeed

Jim you’re a hypocrite. If you like your MB so much and It never gave you any problems why do you want to trade it in for a Infinity, and its not like your car is old it’s a 02. You need the extra space my a$$ so what’s the real problem has your car started to crap out on you, and you might have to change that VERY RELIABLE. I bet your one of those people that once you sell your MB you will start badmouthing it. People like you really annoy me.

Jim Banville

Xspeed, you are a real IDIOT! Not that it is any of your friggin business, but we get a new car every year ot two. Starting in '93, we've had (all bought new) a Geo Prizm (a.k.a. Toyota Carolla), Ford Taurus, 2 Ford XLT Expeditions, 2 Ford Expedition Eddie Bauers and now our C240. Starting with the Expeditions, we decided to have 1 "expensive" vehicle and 1 "basic" vehicle. Our basic vehicle is a '91 Nissan 240SX. I had an '89 Ford F-150, but the beater couldn't hold oil pressure, even after breaking my back putting in another oil pump! Therefore, if we are going to get the FX, which is "expensive", we MUST trade in the C240. We can't afford to keep both. Happy now, jerk?!

oggle

LOL

BenzOwner02

I agree with XSPEED. What I wanna know is who are u people comparing me to? Geez, all I do is voice a couple of opinions and some of you cant deal with them. So it seems like there are 2 child acting Benz owners in this forum who I wont mention their screen names because its obvious who they are. People, why do you get defensive when the truth comes out about reliability? Its not like you created the car. If you bought it and you are happy with how it looks, feels, and drives then taking it to the dealership 10 times or so to get fixed then it shouldn't matter right? Grow up you 2

Inifinit is an awesome car by the way, I just wish people would admit the real reasons why they buy it. I did consider the car for reliabilty reasons but then I bought my car because it looked better you see how easy that was to say it

Jim Banville

What people?

Point out any opinion that anyone here couldn't deal with?

Happy Benz owners don't like to continually read here how ALL Benz's are junk and stay in the shop. That is a lie. No one claimed they are as relaible as Toyota's or Hondas. Please point out any post here that is contradition to what I just said

BenzOwner02

Only thing I need to point out besides the obvious is that you are the one going Japanese not us. So stop acting all supportive of Benz. Your a sell out man

Jim Banville

You prove yourself a bigger moron with each and every post. The nationality of the brand I'm buying next doesn't mean crap to me, although I doubt I'd buy any car built in Cuba or Liberia
The back seat of our C240 is very cramped for an adult. It's even more cramped with 2 kids and a 90 lb. golden retreiver. I knew this when we bought it, but I also knew that we would only have it for about 2 years, AS WE DO WITH ALL OUR "EXPENSIVE" CARS. I tell you what benzC240...BenzOwner02...whatever you are - YOU keep the payments up on our C240 so we can afford an FX35 too and we'll GLADLY keep it . I'll even GIVE my Nissan 240SX (which is also Japanese, which destroys your premise of a German car guy going Japanese in the first place) to CHARITY!

c2jones

Come on... do we have some children amongst us?

People have rights to their opinions here. If you don't welcome them, just like the TV, simply change the station. If we find ourselves offending others, perhaps we can adjust our tone a little. Some of this is outlandishly trivial.

For instance, the Infinity G35 Sedan is the Motor Trend Car of the Year, and for good reason. If someone wants to go to another make, what is our (sometimes hostile) objection? Let's relax on the attacks. Let's welcome diversity. That's what online forums are supposed to be for.

Chris

c2jones

I posted this response in another thread, but it best applies here. I have made some comments about my take on the report and manufacturing in general. This is the way I see it. This is in the mode and spirit of any healthy, constructive and productive forum.

Excerpt (from other thread):

MB (as well as some other German/European makes) have been caught up in developing breakthrough technologies (except for Porsche, whose 911 has been pretty stable for years) and this usually causes the public to become guinea pigs to some extent, even if standards are still high. (Bill Gates has been doing this for years assisted by his almost exclusive operating system – translate: MB loyalists.)

MB allows a compromise between leading technology and some degree of setbacks as a result. MB contends that Lexus and others are followers and not leaders, and therefore it is easier to perfect standards this way. I don't think this is entirely true, as Toyota (Lexus), Honda (Acura), and Nissan (Infinity) have all been contributors to technical advances. However, MB (Audi, BMW, Volvo) are usually innovators of automotive surges that set the pace.

Furthermore, in truth, some of the issues MB have do not at all deal with technical experiments. When AC, heaters, noises, rattles, leaks, etc., are failing with MB, this technical alibi falls down. It’s a nice cop-out, but not always the whole truth. Toyota quality, for instance, has stood for reliable workmanship for fit and finish standards for years. This said, most MB issues are electrical and MB is a leader in advancing electrical communication in their product.

Finally, let's face it. MB knows that many people buy their cars for perceived status and prestige and pure styling characteristics alone. Even in their post-purchase surveys, one of the questions as to why you chose MB is simply, styling. German engineers have stated for years that they spend countless hours in visual media labs to come up with linear and curvature design that meets the interest of humans in terms of pure scientific (neural) tendencies. Knowing all these things, they can slowly lax their standards a bit on the simpler things in trade for the advantages they have elsewhere.

Why do you think they get the price they do on their cars? They do not always have better power, accessories, or features beyond competing models per each class, especially per the price. The reasons above are clearly why they get their prices. Some people just feel pleasure in saying they have a Mercedes and they like the look and styling which gives them a boost in their choice in purchasing this make. The technical features are always a plus, but as one person just said, they would “rather have any MB with 2 problems than most of the comparable Lexus's with only 1 problem.” What does this tell you? And, this loyalist outlook also helps MB.

Consider that the substances in their factory brake pads actually eat into the finish on their wheels (amongst a few similar examples). This causes dulling and many people either upgrade their wheels through MB, or simply trade the car in. The dust could be eliminated (as aftermarket pads have done – like Porterfield) and the materials used could be different. But MB will either play dumb or indifferent as they swear by their own products for one reason… to boost sales, period! These little nuisances they’re known for keep people coming back to the dealerships, which aids sales, too. Let’s use our heads. MB certainly has. This is a business. If those JD power reports were steering people away from MB, it would be different. But they know otherwise. MB has experienced their best sales figures ever in 2003.

Translation? They make a car everybody cherishes and they know it. Little need to change anything that is working, financially anyway.

For the record, I have had good luck with my MB and we love our car(s). I will be purchasing at least two more models this year (AMG E and AMG SL). I do this to celebrate their push for safer, environmentally-friendly (remember, MB can run on ethanol) and leading-edge technologies in the automotive industry. For the service issues, they’ll hear about those as well! Let’s keep them honest, after all.

Christopher Jones

Guest0001

C2 jones

exellent post bro

now lets leave it at that and finish this thread

moomeh

wow. lots of opinions in this thread. i do not have a 'wow thread' smiley so i'll post this guy: hehe.

vyse

I think c2jones hit the spot as to why so many people buy Mercedes, well, at least I think it's one of the reason I'd take a C$40k (ie. C-class), over a comparable Lexus IS300, even though I've heard many times from my dad that Lexus and Japanese cars in general are more reliable, exactly because the C-class is a Mercedes and a German car Well, I'd take a BMW too But it's true, woah, German cars are just extremely appealing! Who cares if they have problems, my family has had so much trouble with VW, it's not even funny, but I myself am still a huge fan of the GTI, and my aunt still bought a Golf, and, I stilll plan to buy a Golf sometime in the future