A few pics from KLEEMANN flywheel installation-
08-08-2003, 08:55 PM
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A few pics from KLEEMANN flywheel installation-
Here is a side by side of the two units. The stock is on the left, the new on the right.
The new unit is a 6061 T6 Aluminum flywheel with a hardened steel friction face. A Unorthodox Racing clutch was utilized that is made from a proprietary sintered metel compound, the clutch is a step down from their "full race" unit. The new pressure plate is from a S4, is the same dimensions as the stock unit, and new springs with an increased spring rate was implemented.
This is truly an awesome unit with just enough streetability to not be annoying, and enough guts to be beaten. So far, I love it.
Just as Brandon stated, there is a slight vibration from the gearbox in third and fifth gears at certain RPMs. There is also a slight chattering noise at idle with the box in neutral and the clutch disengaged. Not big deal, the performance feel alone justifies the vibration and noise...
I am going to Dyno the vehicle tomorrow and post the results in the evening.
Thomas
The new unit is a 6061 T6 Aluminum flywheel with a hardened steel friction face. A Unorthodox Racing clutch was utilized that is made from a proprietary sintered metel compound, the clutch is a step down from their "full race" unit. The new pressure plate is from a S4, is the same dimensions as the stock unit, and new springs with an increased spring rate was implemented.
This is truly an awesome unit with just enough streetability to not be annoying, and enough guts to be beaten. So far, I love it.
Just as Brandon stated, there is a slight vibration from the gearbox in third and fifth gears at certain RPMs. There is also a slight chattering noise at idle with the box in neutral and the clutch disengaged. Not big deal, the performance feel alone justifies the vibration and noise...
I am going to Dyno the vehicle tomorrow and post the results in the evening.Thomas
08-09-2003, 02:28 PM
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All the chatter and no one responded to the pics? Foooey-
I can't dyno til next week. They over booked the Dyno and I got bumped. Sorry all-
I can't dyno til next week. They over booked the Dyno and I got bumped. Sorry all-
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08-09-2003, 04:46 PM
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Thanks for the pics! Now, seeing how much smaller the Kleemann unit is, do you experience increased vibration and noise? How bad is it in day-to-day city driving? Would you do it again if you were not into racing that much?
08-09-2003, 11:41 PM
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Day to day city driving? Like bumper to bumper traffic? It is just like you would expect a race clutch to be, it's much stiffer and more difficult. You end up resting your left leg inbetween shifts.
Good vibrations;
In nuetral with the clutch engaged you get lay shaft chatter. Not enough to be embarassing, but you can certainly tell the difference.
The gear vibrations are the same, just undampened. The fifth gear vibration is significant, but is only there when you coast in the gear between 3k and 3500. I don't even notice the 3rd gear vibration any more.
Benefits in my opinion;
The direct benefits to street driving are significant and are directly related to feel. If you are a downshifter, you'd love the KLEEMANN unit. If you shift to nuetral and coast, it doesn't do much for you.
The other immediate thing you notice is there is no more drop off. Stock the car stops pulling hard at 5400 or 5500. With the KLEEMANN unit it pulls hard straight through 6300.
The lump sum of the gains is that the motor is turning less mass directly bolted to the crankshalf, thus the power is better translated to the wheels. The other is if you are sick of Audi Quatros pulling away from you at the luanch, this stop that. The car launches like a freaking beast now.
I drive like my father, I think he is still better then me at 59. Today I toasted his mustang 5.0 off the line. There is just no more clutch slipping to catch up to the MASSIVE stock flywheel. It just lays in and connects. SW33T!
Today I drove the Garden State Parkway to my parents, I usually average about 22mpg on this trip, with local driving in my town and theirs, the 8 toll boths on the GSP always full throttle out of them too. Today I had 26.7 when I got here. I didn't drive any differently. Also the hills in my town that I used to have to down shift to third or second to climb, I can climb now in a higher gear with no chatter or vibration I used to get stock.
Difficulties;
The hardest part is readjusting and relearning the clutching of the car after a year of it being the other way. But once you have it down, it is awesome. I've also learned to avoid those RPM ranges where the vibrations are most significant. They are the odd ranges you don't want to be in anyway.
Another note is I am still using stock gear oil. I am going to replace the oil with Redline or Amsoil this week. The chattering I am experiencing will be reduced with this gear oil. End result is that I am very pleased with the KLEEMANN flywheel mod. I would still do it for street driving or for a performance oriented car. To me the shifts feel much more the way I expect a clutch to be and less like a honda.
Good vibrations;
In nuetral with the clutch engaged you get lay shaft chatter. Not enough to be embarassing, but you can certainly tell the difference.
The gear vibrations are the same, just undampened. The fifth gear vibration is significant, but is only there when you coast in the gear between 3k and 3500. I don't even notice the 3rd gear vibration any more.
Benefits in my opinion;
The direct benefits to street driving are significant and are directly related to feel. If you are a downshifter, you'd love the KLEEMANN unit. If you shift to nuetral and coast, it doesn't do much for you.
The other immediate thing you notice is there is no more drop off. Stock the car stops pulling hard at 5400 or 5500. With the KLEEMANN unit it pulls hard straight through 6300.
The lump sum of the gains is that the motor is turning less mass directly bolted to the crankshalf, thus the power is better translated to the wheels. The other is if you are sick of Audi Quatros pulling away from you at the luanch, this stop that. The car launches like a freaking beast now.
I drive like my father, I think he is still better then me at 59. Today I toasted his mustang 5.0 off the line. There is just no more clutch slipping to catch up to the MASSIVE stock flywheel. It just lays in and connects. SW33T!
Today I drove the Garden State Parkway to my parents, I usually average about 22mpg on this trip, with local driving in my town and theirs, the 8 toll boths on the GSP always full throttle out of them too. Today I had 26.7 when I got here. I didn't drive any differently. Also the hills in my town that I used to have to down shift to third or second to climb, I can climb now in a higher gear with no chatter or vibration I used to get stock.
Difficulties;
The hardest part is readjusting and relearning the clutching of the car after a year of it being the other way. But once you have it down, it is awesome. I've also learned to avoid those RPM ranges where the vibrations are most significant. They are the odd ranges you don't want to be in anyway.
Another note is I am still using stock gear oil. I am going to replace the oil with Redline or Amsoil this week. The chattering I am experiencing will be reduced with this gear oil. End result is that I am very pleased with the KLEEMANN flywheel mod. I would still do it for street driving or for a performance oriented car. To me the shifts feel much more the way I expect a clutch to be and less like a honda.
Last edited by nukblazi; 08-09-2003 at 11:44 PM.
08-10-2003, 05:43 AM
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C230K Coupe/Orion/C4/C5/CD/AMG Spoiler/V60/TeleAid, 2 MGB's
I was going to recommend changing to Amsoil....or some other more viscous gear oil. This will help the chatter and also prolong the life of the clutch system under racing conditions (your intended purpose).
Good luck with the mods, man....keep your tires clean and clip that apex!
Good luck with the mods, man....keep your tires clean and clip that apex!
08-10-2003, 10:31 AM
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2010 C300 4matic
Nuk, that was a great post. Going by what you said, I think I would love to have that in my car. It would probably suit my driving style very well and I don't care about vibrations. It's just too bad my car is leased and I have vowed not to spend that much more money on it. My residual is so high, it would be very unwise to buy it at the end of the lease either. 
08-11-2003, 09:50 AM
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Ah dang leases....
I've logged 390 miles with it already. Still loving it. Another note is that you actually want to be in the right gear at high speeds. Meaning that if you are cruising at 85 in 6th. Downshift to fifth and the gear is too high, with out the additional mass, the car let's you know.
Drop to 4th and it pulls so hard all the way to 110. A Passet turbo and I were goffing around last night on the GSP. A. He couldn't believe I was pulling away from him. B. He rolled up hard in the lane to my right, I wait til he was side by side. I punched it in fourth and stayed right with him. I pulled into the rest stop, he followed and asked "what do you have in that thing?" He said he has a T4 turbo upgrade, chip, CAI, and cat back exhaust.
Stock, at higher speeds there felt like there was a lag waiting for the new gear to "catch up" to the flywheel. It is gone now.
I've logged 390 miles with it already. Still loving it. Another note is that you actually want to be in the right gear at high speeds. Meaning that if you are cruising at 85 in 6th. Downshift to fifth and the gear is too high, with out the additional mass, the car let's you know.
Drop to 4th and it pulls so hard all the way to 110. A Passet turbo and I were goffing around last night on the GSP. A. He couldn't believe I was pulling away from him. B. He rolled up hard in the lane to my right, I wait til he was side by side. I punched it in fourth and stayed right with him. I pulled into the rest stop, he followed and asked "what do you have in that thing?" He said he has a T4 turbo upgrade, chip, CAI, and cat back exhaust.
Stock, at higher speeds there felt like there was a lag waiting for the new gear to "catch up" to the flywheel. It is gone now.
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