who8888

Can you PM me with some pics? I won't share it

FrankW

the reason is simple: make people believe they're made in USA and charge more $$.

this isn't something like the Vorsteiner or the new k1 grille that ARE actually made in USA therefore the higher price due to cost.

I've no problem on where it's made either as long as it is a good product that fits.

Ron Jr

I'm waiting for the Euroteck lip from the teaser pic I like it better than this one.

popejp41

But the Eurotech lip costs less than the JL lip so I don't think that's the case...how do you know for you sure where he has them made? if you don't mind me asking...

MercedesCLK5

I think Euroteck is just waiting for their shipments from taiwan thats why they are saying its going to be done soon. If they really made them in USA why would it take so long and only make 15 of them ? they probably bought 15 lips from china to test the market.

Stryder04

BlackC230Coupe

150% wrong! In fact, I will actually have Wilson at ABS call you to let you know you are wrong if you would like. Some of our lips in the past and some are still made over seas, we NEVER denied that, and all of our customers know that if they asked. However THIS W204 lip we are coming out with IS MADE IN THE USA!!!!!!!!!! I cannot stress that enough, anyone locally is more then welcome to swing by our facility. Many on the forum members locally have. You have done a mightly fine job spreading rumors and thanks to lots of loyal customers they all showed me the PMs. However you continue to think you know the truth by what you assume. The truth of the matter is, if we did have these made in China or Taiwan we would have had them done a long time ago. Being we only had a few people work on these took forever to make and we may not do the same in the future. Since we now also build parts for 12 other companies and one is a small OEM company, we are in the middle of acquiring a factory in China that we will own part of. I will be traveling there soon. This may eventually be the place we will have ALL our parts made due to many workers at a much lower labor rate will allow us to have parts done quicker and cheaper and we will have full control of quality.

So just to clear things up here, are some of our parts made overseas? YES!!!! Are the 15 W204 lips we are making made overseas? NO! Will they eventually be made overseas? Possibly so, very good chance. Why are they taking so long? Because we had a total of 4 people working on them and we do not have our own paint booth so we bring them to a local body shop to get clearcoated.

I hope that helps clear things up. Because I am still quite confused as to so many false rumors are going around that you started. I understand you may have assumed that, but keep in mind regarding these 15 W204 lips you are incorrect about.

Again I hope this helps clear things up. And if anyone has any questions on anything we make, please come to me and ask the source directly and not listen to rumors. I think by the age of most of us here, we should should know that rumors are not always true.

By the way, Merry Christmas to everyone!

Ron Jr

I for one am happy to wait for the Euroteck lip to come out. I know the quality will be very high. And I know I won't get screwed like I did a couple of times from overseas vendors.

Andr3an

great explanation, Neal. I'm convinced now

so, the lip you're making and the FrankW's do not have the same shape, right?

yxc145

we just want some pictures and pricing. don't know why that's so hard...........

micropower99

exactly

FrankW

LMAO

I've been to "real" CF shops. i.e. K1's shop. They were producing 2-3 grilles each day with only TWO people working on the it. And only ONE tech guy was working with me when I went there to test fit the grille for them. while chatting with the guy he said laying the CF is all easy after the fitment is set. It only take few hrs. When I asked them if there would be a interest in producing the front lip they said no because the mold is too expensive and with each one produced in USA cost would be higher than authentic Carlsson front lip since it has to be a 3-piece mold (whatever that means). However they did say the lip will be easier to make compare to the grille because the fitment is straight forward.

You are saying if these are made in Taiwan or China it would've been done long ago? That's exactly the opposite. I have had front lips for E46 M3 made in Taiwan before btw.

1. you couldn't get the hands-on on the fitment.
2. they require you to order in batches usually minimum of 15-20 lips each time.
3. shipment out from Taiwan or China can drag on because most shop simply don't own their freight company and from shipping to port on their end can be slow. especially in China.
4. because of the above they'll need to send you a sample lip for fitment and then have you tell them where it's wrong and then they'll have to make another one according to your inputs and that's where the "slow" process is going.
5. If this lip you are making is made in USA. It would've been DONE long time ago in less than 3 wks since all of the above is eliminated.

EDIT: also making minor changes doesn't require a new mold unless it is a drastic change. (according to Euroteck in their sneak peak thread it does) However for 99% of the factory changes are made before you go and make the mold. NO FACTORY WILL TOSS A $2000 MOLD and make a new one unless the customer is paying for it.

from day one when you started selling the CF lip you stressed on they're made in USA and not the "cheap Taiwanese" product everyone else were selling on ebay. EVERYONE knows this (read the link in my sig). yet, now you are saying you never denied it. Just in the last thread that was locked you "denied" it. also Like when you denied that you "just" made the CF mirror cover and it's not the same as the one vcruiser bought two wks early from your post.

I don't assume anything btw. I was a customer of absdynamic before I got out from the business. I was focused on the BMW products. Being the first that started purchasing Euro parts from them I was asked to help them test fit a lot of stuff including test fitting the W209 and W203 front lips.

plain and simple: go to your carbon fiber facility and snap a few picture of the guys working on the lip and I'll apologize if I'm wrong.

also my offer still stands on the mirror cover. send it to Vcruiser and have him check if they're the same or not and if he doesn't return the mirror cover to you I'll paypal you $100 as that's what they're selling on ebay right now. I'll also apologize to you in public forums.

Mxcn

blackc230, end all this shenanigan and post some pictures of euroteck employees (i better not see any taiwanese employees hehehe) molding/creating the front lip...end of story right

delirium

i agree if this is such an issue, just clear it up w/ some pics of the facility, you get an apology & the rest of us can focus on the actual products & not the logistics of where its made...

yxc145

I agree... all of us just want good products, doesn't matter where they are made (i don't care if it's made in MARS). it's just when the date kept pushing back once after another.... we got tired of it and started questioning why...... why does it need to take so long.
i don't think it has anything to do with not able to find a demo car to put the CF lip on, because we read on the threads that there are many guys willing to go into the shop to purchase the lip and be the demo car. all of us just want to see some pictures and know a price. that's not so hard, especially when the "final" product was annouced finished 1 month ago, before the show.
anyway, too much talking. we just need to see the product. In the end, service is just as important as the product. If we waited and waited for something and still not get it, we as customer will lose faith of what you do and the product you sell.

MercedesCLK5

where are the pictures Neal?

BlackC230Coupe

Frank,

A lot of points I would like to go over one in that reply. (this is going to be a LONG message).

First off, all our place is is a manufacturing facility, we are not a shop, and we do not work on cars, we simply design prototype parts here and send them to over factories overseas, and some parts we make here. Including the 15 W204 lips, which was probably a bad choice btw.

I am not sure why K1 said a mold is to expensive, if a mold is made by yourself (the company making it) it cost NOTHING! all it is made up upon is fiberglass. Now if you out source it, places will charge a mold fee of whatever they want. But how can a fiberglass mold me to expensive? all it takes is time.

Also, YES! When we have lots of our parts made in china, we get them in about 30 days. All our overseas shipments come directly from the factory via DHL air fright and from China to our dock only takes 4 days! its incredible. So yes, trust me, I get parts weekly from China, and they would have been much faster then us making it here even with shipping. Which is why I will most likely have them do the rest of these after the 15 are gone.

To answer all your questions in order

1. Fitment was not right because the bumper we had been working on off the car the wood beam we had supporting it was to short, and the entire lip was made to short on the first one.

2. Places we deal with require no minimum batches, however, I cannot comment on other places.

3. That is totally all wrong, shipping is incredibly fast out from China or Taiwan! We do not ship anything Via ocean container. All our parts are air freighted and arrive in 4 days. Although it is VERY expensive.

4. I answered in #1.

5. That is again all wrong. I am in this business for over 6 years already. My main focus is to get good parts done at a reasonable price in a reasonable time frame. This is why we will actually be doing the opposite in most cases in the future and deal with our factory in China since they are VERY fast!

Again, about not making a new mold because of the fitment issue. Like I said above, ours was much to short when we popped out the first one. About 2 inches actually. For small changes you do not need to make a new mold. However this small change did require a new mold since the whole thing was totally off. One main reason we did not show more pics of it in the sneak peek thread was because the other side was not even connected at the end in front of the wheel. And again, like I said, a mold cost $0 if you make it, Minus the labor and cheap fiberglass. Its only expensive if someone else makes it for you.

We also never denied our other lips were not made out of the USA. I did however deny that these 15 W204 lips were not made in Taiwan, because they are not. Although If I would have lied and said yes, it would have made things much easier. Also, some of our old lips that were made in Taiwan or China that ABS did in fact make, a customer who bought them from us must have had them copied in OTHER china or Taiwan factories and were actually just copy's of what we sold that ABS made for us. So yes, there are still lots of copy's out there that are not even from our source that we have no idea how they fit.

But again, now that we are acquiring part of an excellent facility in china that we will be part of. This will allow us to stay competitive on pricing, quicker turn around time, and we will be in charge of quality. Most parts will be designed by us in Florida and sent there for the production parts to be made. I am very excited about this, and we will be having tons of new parts made since we will have the ability to do so.

But I will go ahead and take some pics of our facility for you on Friday when we re open after Christmas. Keep in mind the 15 W204 lips we are still waiting to get back from a body shop and they are well past the point of us working on them. However we do have quite a few cool things to show that we are making in CF here, including new lips, and maybe even a few more W204 lips will be started on Friday, so I will be sure to take pictures for you to prove this if that is what you need to see. ( I wish your were local).

In regards to the mirror covers, we copied the same style that were out there from others, in fact before they even had them in CF we seen them in chrome and wanted to do the same style. These are however not made by those companies on ebay, those are made by us and will be made by our place in China. They may look similar, however the issue he is having with fitment, that is something you will not have with ours. We never sell a part that does not fit right. Our reputation shows that.

You seem to have gotten all fired up since I made the comment about our lips not being made in Taiwan by low salary workers. And the same reason you got fired up about that not being true is the same reason I got fired up about our lips not being made there being true. However like we all know, the labor rate in China and Taiwan is much lower the the US and helps places get things made cheaper. We all know almost every single part we own, either cheap or expensive usually says made in China or Taiwan on it and there is a reason for them being made there. However since I think its clear you took that the wrong way, I do apologize about that, and in no way was that meant to offend anyone. It was just a reference to mean things cost less to make there. I actually love Asian women, lol so I have nothing against any of them.

Pics to come on Friday!

BlackC230Coupe

Umm, its Christmas at 1:30am here, LMAO! do you actually think I am at work to take pictures now???????

BlackC230Coupe

I totally understand what your saying. I also learned my lesson, I will not be posting any pictures anymore or saying what is coming from us until they are done, this way it can be avoided...you live and learn.....But next time I will keep it all a screct till its done and ready so if we have issues on our side, no one needs to deal with them, or know, or wait.

delirium

Ahh, the Apple strategy...

FrankW

I'm not gonna bother arguing over this anymore. This will be the final post regarding this issue. I think the smart people already know what's going on with the lip situation. IF you do have your own carbon fiber facility it doesn't take a month and half to pump out just 15 lip and make 2 minor changes to the mold. AND doesn't matter if you own or out source the mold cost will be there. including renting the facility, paying the employees, material cost, the list goes on.

funny how you are saying you develop it and then send it overseas for the other products. I was there when they boxed up what's his name's original C32 front bumper (one with the silver CF hood) to send it back to Taiwan's Hong Chiang for making the mold. Wilson said they had a agreement with you not to sell the w203 lip to others at the time...however they can't control who Hong Chiang sells it to. THERE IS NO COPIES of YOUR LIP BECAUSE THEY ALL CAME FROM THE SAME SOURCE because you don't own the original mold.

Also something you probably don't know or fail to realize. carbon fiber industry in Taiwan is not that big...many factories shares the same mold on loan from the larger companies. They don't need to buy one of your lips to make another copy of it because the fitment of those will never be right. They only need to rent the mold when they need to fulfill certain orders.

YES, the mold is expensive and NO they're not just fiberglass. I had the chance to pick up the mold K1 use for the grille. It weights nearly 30lbs that I need to use two hand to pick it up. a fiberglass mold is only used when you only want to produce a single piece.

My brother and sister-in-law owns a trading company that deals with many different factories on daily basis and they're currently living in China. I've also been to the Guan-Zhu Trade Show many times. You sure you want to tell me ordering out of China requires no minimum orders?

btw, the CF mirror cover is made in China. currently only one factory in China makes it and sells it. amazing how much information you can find when you understand the language.

anyway, we better see some picture of the facility of the lip being worked on with people in the background. better yet, since you mentioned you have a front bumper you are using for the fitment how about a picture of that with the date and time and upload it to the free flickr so we can see the property of the picture shown on the right which will tell you when the picture was taken and what camera. picture of the mold doesn't hurt either. I doubt they can make a copy out of a picture.

remember, don't just show the lips where you can't see anything else. my apologies awaits. lol

popejp41

Frank I think you are taking this way too far , who gives a crap?? He doesn't have to prove anything to me, you or anyone else. He's in business to make money $$$ not to prove he can build a mold or part....who cares?? This has become a personal thing and has nothing to do with quality or price. I can't help but ask myself whats your real MO? why do you feel you have to discredit him so badly. I personally think your coming out of this looking nasty... and you seem like a decent dude on all other threads....what's up?? it's Christmas relax, wish people well.....

FrankW

no MO here. just can't stand people that are pretending to something that they're not, especially someone that intentionally make fun of another person's home country in a degrading manner while in fact was and is selling products from that country he just made fun of.

friends become enemies, enemies become friends. I don't really care what other people think of me with what I said. If when I'm proven wrong then I'll admit I'm wrong. I always stand by what I say. People that have met me and ones that have talked to me knows what's BS and what's truth coming out of me. If you think I'll come out of this looking nasty in the community so be it.

Like I've said, I don't really care where the products are made, but if they're good products why hide where they're made. I've never once said they're bad products.

EDIT: as far as getting personal I'm not the one who decides to show up every time the word "euroteck" is mentioned in a non-sponsored thread.

popejp41

I went back through you link to see what was said (i'm really bored) and this is what Neil said:

We also do not have 1000 taiwanese workers getting 3 cents a day making our stuff and copying things illigally.

which was kind of messed up but then I read your response:

3 cents a day making your stuff? this is Taiwan, not India

You basically did the same thing Neil did!! you smashed India!
Whatever not a big deal, I think you were both actually pointing out the obvious that the labor in these countries are ridiculously low and that's just reality.....

FrankW

yet, I was saying the truth without trying to make people believe that all taiwanese about is cheap labor and copying illegally. bad parts of India and China are still very much in poverty where labors are as cheap as they go. In many parts of China construction and factory workers are still only getting paid roughly $100 USD a month. They have to live on the job site until the works are done.

In Taiwan the minimum wage is $80-90 NTD I believe about $3 USD give or take. sure they're cheaper than in US, but pretty much all Asian countries have cheaper labor avg compare to US.

now that he admits he did sell Taiwanese products in this thread what was the intention saying what he said? I really do not get it. selling or sold products from Taiwan yet does not want other people to relate them to Taiwan. I think you know the answer to that as well.

happy holidays

apologies to yxc for ruining his thread.