Finally dyno'd my C200 with TMC Tuning Box
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2010 C200 CGI
Finally dyno'd my C200 with TMC Tuning Box
Finally got the car on the dyno.
2010 C200 CGI, TMC Tuning Box, Modified BMS Intake, Straight pipe from the cat back to a single muffler, Sun Auto Voltage Stabilizer + Grounding Kit, Shell Ultra 5w40 oil, Shell V-Power Nitro gas (I think it's 98 ron grade).
We had to run the car in sport mode even in dyno mode as "C" caused the car to shift at 5xxx rpm's, in "s" mode the car was able to rev to about 6500 rpms.
Tq curves at top and hp curves under.
Red figures are when we were calibrating the dyno and car
Green is the TMC box on "0" setting which is suppose to be like stock. Only reason we did this is because TMC didn't include the bypass plug for the harness for when you unplug the box.
Pink is on the TMC preset of "6"
Blue is on setting of "7"
I ended up keeping the setting at "6" after seeing the tq curve on "7" which frightened me, also note that the hp on the "0" setting is greater but the tq comes later which is why I opted to lose a few hp in return for an earlier tq curve.
There is a video but after reviewing it saw no point in posting it as it doesn't show anything worth watching. Just the car on the dyno. The data is more relevant.
Here is the advertised gains from TMC
http://www.tmcmotorsport.com/TuningB...px?s=903385247
Original Tuned Gains
KW 135 169 + 34
BHP 183 230 + 47
NM 270 311 + 41
Factoring in drivetrain loss from the auto tranny (0.20), my hp figures are lower than advertised.
2010 C200 CGI, TMC Tuning Box, Modified BMS Intake, Straight pipe from the cat back to a single muffler, Sun Auto Voltage Stabilizer + Grounding Kit, Shell Ultra 5w40 oil, Shell V-Power Nitro gas (I think it's 98 ron grade).
We had to run the car in sport mode even in dyno mode as "C" caused the car to shift at 5xxx rpm's, in "s" mode the car was able to rev to about 6500 rpms.
Tq curves at top and hp curves under.
Red figures are when we were calibrating the dyno and car
Green is the TMC box on "0" setting which is suppose to be like stock. Only reason we did this is because TMC didn't include the bypass plug for the harness for when you unplug the box.
Pink is on the TMC preset of "6"
Blue is on setting of "7"
I ended up keeping the setting at "6" after seeing the tq curve on "7" which frightened me, also note that the hp on the "0" setting is greater but the tq comes later which is why I opted to lose a few hp in return for an earlier tq curve.
There is a video but after reviewing it saw no point in posting it as it doesn't show anything worth watching. Just the car on the dyno. The data is more relevant.
Here is the advertised gains from TMC
http://www.tmcmotorsport.com/TuningB...px?s=903385247
Original Tuned Gains
KW 135 169 + 34
BHP 183 230 + 47
NM 270 311 + 41
Factoring in drivetrain loss from the auto tranny (0.20), my hp figures are lower than advertised.
Last edited by Knightmare69; Apr 24, 2013 at 02:36 AM.
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From: Bangkok, Thailand
W124, W203, W204, W251
I'm not familiar with TMC tuning box. Is it a piggyback? Can you show us some pics? 5G-tronic or 7G-tronic?
But, 230hp is quite a bit of improvement for c200. Keep it up!
But, 230hp is quite a bit of improvement for c200. Keep it up!
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2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
If pink is upgrade and green oem, there is no significant hp change. And the lower end curves don't suggest a torque increase.
I'd say you have a big problem with TMC.
by 20% efficiency loos with the automatic, I can see that for the 5 speed, but not the 7 speed, as TC slip is limited.
.
I'd say you have a big problem with TMC.
by 20% efficiency loos with the automatic, I can see that for the 5 speed, but not the 7 speed, as TC slip is limited.
.
Thread Starter
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From: Hong Kong
2010 C200 CGI
If pink is upgrade and green oem, there is no significant hp change. And the lower end curves don't suggest a torque increase.
I'd say you have a big problem with TMC.
by 20% efficiency loos with the automatic, I can see that for the 5 speed, but not the 7 speed, as TC slip is limited.
.
I'd say you have a big problem with TMC.
by 20% efficiency loos with the automatic, I can see that for the 5 speed, but not the 7 speed, as TC slip is limited.
.
As for the tq curve, the upgraded setting allows for the tq to come on earlier as well as increase from the stock figures no? "6" (pink) peaks at 240 lbs/tq.
OEM specs for 2010 C200
http://www.parts-specs.com/Mercedes-...r-sedan-056830
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Hong Kong
2010 C200 CGI
Pink (6) was the closest to that of all the runs we did. When I saw the curve for Blue (7) it scared the crap out of me so I dialed it back.
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From: Hong Kong
2010 C200 CGI
Well I emailed the graph to TMC to see what they will say. Given the erratic response rate I've been having with them I'm not sure I'll get a reply. I'll also post it on their FB page if I end up not hearing from them.
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From: Delaware
2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
As for the tq curve, the upgraded setting allows for the tq to come on earlier as well as increase from the stock figures no? "6" (pink) peaks at 240 lbs/tq.
....
....
Basically, your dyno run is messed up at lower end torque, and shows no hp gain.
Finally, you can not compare oem values with a dyno run. Only with and without runs on the same dyno are compareable.
.
Last edited by kevink2; Apr 25, 2013 at 05:05 PM.
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2010 C200 CGI
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From: Delaware
2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
You should be dissappointed, as it indicates the upgrade did not deliver the hp you paid for.
The chassis dyno run has transmission and other losses, and tries to measure power at the wheels. Only an engine dyno, at near standard conditions, will measure hp & tq to be compared with oem rated values.
.
The chassis dyno run has transmission and other losses, and tries to measure power at the wheels. Only an engine dyno, at near standard conditions, will measure hp & tq to be compared with oem rated values.
.
Thread Starter
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2010 C200 CGI
I am, I'll be posting the results on their fb page later on. Now if only someone could run a dyno with the jb so we could compare.
*edit- looking at it some more, though the bhp is off what they advertised, my tq figures are actually higher if my conversion is correct. 240 ft lbs=325 nm(?) If this is correct then I'm making more than their advertised 311nm.
Ah ok, you were talking bout an engine dyno.
*edit- looking at it some more, though the bhp is off what they advertised, my tq figures are actually higher if my conversion is correct. 240 ft lbs=325 nm(?) If this is correct then I'm making more than their advertised 311nm.
Ah ok, you were talking bout an engine dyno.
Last edited by Knightmare69; Apr 27, 2013 at 02:11 AM.
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2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
JB before after dyno curves, at least they show you the improvemnt, vs telling you. And you can see how they lied about the hp increase, as standard proceedure is to give peak power increase.
.
.
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2010 C200 CGI
I'm hoping for an independent dyno with the JB tune. Truthfully I'm not comfortable taking the word of a company that can't even admit their intake might have a design flaw.
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2004 Mazda6, 1993 RX7
You deal with what you have. If that ideal data shows up, great!. But this JB data looks real, based on my discussion with them. They were only able to provide lower end boost increases with this limited piggyback.
1) you can see the boost/torqure climb was the same a oem.
2) there was little/no gain in peak hp, so they tried to slide that by with hp gains where the torque gains were, but not peak values.
It's believable, based on reviews by owners.
.
1) you can see the boost/torqure climb was the same a oem.
2) there was little/no gain in peak hp, so they tried to slide that by with hp gains where the torque gains were, but not peak values.
It's believable, based on reviews by owners.
.
Thread Starter
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2010 C200 CGI
True, I'll remain hopeful that one day some of our members will be more into data. In the end though, these boxes are no replacement for a real tune. Unfortunately for us CGI members, there currently isn't any viable ones ATM.
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From: Brea Ca
2013 C250
horse power increase
I'm new to this and my question might sound stupid, but did you actually have less horsepower with the tuning box on? because the stock had like 178 hp (fly) and the ones with the higher settings were less than that. although the torque seems to have gone up quite a bit. Again sorry if I'm asking something obvious or dumb, I'm new to this and I've been trying to look/shop around for piggybacks for a while now.
Thread Starter
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2010 C200 CGI
I'm new to this and my question might sound stupid, but did you actually have less horsepower with the tuning box on? because the stock had like 178 hp (fly) and the ones with the higher settings were less than that. although the torque seems to have gone up quite a bit. Again sorry if I'm asking something obvious or dumb, I'm new to this and I've been trying to look/shop around for piggybacks for a while now.
Newbie
Joined: Jul 2013
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S212 E200 CGI
Hi, I'm new to this forum, but very curious to hear if you made any progress with your TMC box. I'm considering buying it for my E200 CGI but the reviews, actual dyno results and real live experience is hard to find for this tuning box and the M-B CGI -engines.
I have noticed in your first picture in the "cell condition window" that the "mechanical efficiency" is 70.00. I'm not sure exactly what that refers to, but could it be that you are calculating with a 30% drivetrain loss?
The results with the box on the "0" setting also might not be identical as bypassing/running without the tuning box. So your delta might hopefully be better then the graphs indicate. Could you get a reference run with the box bypassed? Have TMC bin able to give you some satisfactory support?
Best regards from Sweden
I have noticed in your first picture in the "cell condition window" that the "mechanical efficiency" is 70.00. I'm not sure exactly what that refers to, but could it be that you are calculating with a 30% drivetrain loss?
The results with the box on the "0" setting also might not be identical as bypassing/running without the tuning box. So your delta might hopefully be better then the graphs indicate. Could you get a reference run with the box bypassed? Have TMC bin able to give you some satisfactory support?
Best regards from Sweden
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From: Hong Kong
2010 C200 CGI
Welcome
The last conversation I had with TMC (thanks for reminding me to post this) was that they dyno in the winter and autumn months with cooler air and run 102 octane race fuel plus 3 air conditioned cooler fans at the front. They also explain that they run cars completely stock (which mine is not so to speak, running BMS intake at the time and straight pipe from the stock downpipe to custom rear muffler (I've since gone back to stock box with K&N drop in and waiting on my Eisenmann rear muffler)).
Having said that, in the end TMC noted that not all dyno's are the same nor dyno environments. Also, the air in Hong Kong is usually humid aside from the heat, it is possible that did affect my results. Yes, the data may show that I didn't get the advertised gains but the car performs more powerfully than stock. In the end it does what I need it to do as it's still just a piggyback box but it's one of the better ones out there (in my opinion from my research) than others.
I eventually did get the bypass plug but arranging another dyno appointment has not been high on my list as just getting this session was a headache (few places with dyno's in Hong Kong so they tend to monopolize it with their favored clientele which I am not).
The last conversation I had with TMC (thanks for reminding me to post this) was that they dyno in the winter and autumn months with cooler air and run 102 octane race fuel plus 3 air conditioned cooler fans at the front. They also explain that they run cars completely stock (which mine is not so to speak, running BMS intake at the time and straight pipe from the stock downpipe to custom rear muffler (I've since gone back to stock box with K&N drop in and waiting on my Eisenmann rear muffler)).
Having said that, in the end TMC noted that not all dyno's are the same nor dyno environments. Also, the air in Hong Kong is usually humid aside from the heat, it is possible that did affect my results. Yes, the data may show that I didn't get the advertised gains but the car performs more powerfully than stock. In the end it does what I need it to do as it's still just a piggyback box but it's one of the better ones out there (in my opinion from my research) than others.
I eventually did get the bypass plug but arranging another dyno appointment has not been high on my list as just getting this session was a headache (few places with dyno's in Hong Kong so they tend to monopolize it with their favored clientele which I am not).
Newbie
Joined: Jul 2013
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S212 E200 CGI
Thank you!
Yes, according to my research this one of few piggybacks that monitors/controls boost pressure, throttle body, cam shaft and inlet manifold pressure.
Did you notice any change in fuel consumption or acceleration with TMC?
Yes, according to my research this one of few piggybacks that monitors/controls boost pressure, throttle body, cam shaft and inlet manifold pressure.
Did you notice any change in fuel consumption or acceleration with TMC?
Newbie
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 3
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S212 E200 CGI
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2010 C200 CGI
Yes, acceleration has changed, both in sport and comfort mode.
