E63ory

Hi folks,
Lease ended on E63. Miss having an AMG (the IS-F is sweet though). Looking into an 07 CLS63 with pp. It is certified and sold by a mercedes dealership. The dealer showed me the carfax which indicates that the car was involved in a 'minor accident' (according to dealer). I am surprised that MB certifies cars that were in any sort of accident, and don't know if I should worry about purchasing a car with a blemished carfax. Any advice?? The price is not aggressive, but I haven't pushed yet.

Thanks!

Esleeper

Interesting. My local dealer will not sell a car if the carfax is not 100% clean.

Are there any pics of the damage? I know that a few bodyshops that are the exclusive to my MBZ dealer take before and after pics to show off how good their work is. If it's not too bad then?

How about going through the glove box if it's at the dealer and see if you can find a registration with the original or previous owners name. That way you may be able to find them and ask. ?? I bought my car CPO from a MBZ dealer, it was a lease return with 17k miles on it and the previous owners/lesee's registration was there. The carfax was clean and by going to zaba search I deducted that she was a 50 year old woman. Needless to say that explained the car didn't appear to be ragged and beaten on.

Maybe the salesman will tell you exactly what was replaced and repainted?

Carfax's are not 100%. There are plenty of cars out there that have major accident history and the carfax is clean. There are salvage cars that have the title washed from another state and sometimes the carfax is clean as well. It's your call.

Personally, I'd prefer a car that has a clean carfax. That way you don't wonder about it everytime you drive it.

E63ory

I am puzzled myself. Nothing in glove box. The car is VERY clean. It not only has the pp, it has some special designo touches such as exterior graphite paint, two tone leather and piano black inside. the MSRP was 117K. It has 37K miles. Asking price is 58.9K. Any idea what it is worth knowing that it doesn't have a clean carfax?

allenjdmb

Check it on Autocheck. Sometimes they will have info that Carfax does not, and vice/versa. If you are extremely lucky, the accident report will be posted, it will have a date and a number, and you can sometimes find it in a national or state atabase. This is a fairly new concept, and only a few states are participating so far, so don't be dissapointed if you don't find it.
MB Dealers can sell CPO cars that have up to 2 panels painted. Of course, there are some who don't play by the rules. I don't suppose you have a paint meter, or can get your hands on one? Why don't you tell the dealer you'll make the deal subject to an inspection by Magoo's or one of the other outside inspection services? It costs about $100 to do, and you might find out something you don't know. If they won't do it, would make me a little skittish. The car never has to leave their lot, the inspectors will come to their place and it takes about an hour.
A painted/repaired car is certainly worth a little less. That being said, I would not throw a really nice car in the trash because it had a painted panel. If people knew how many of their cars were painted before they took possesion, they would lose their minds.
I have held a dealer license in my state for nearly 30 years, and am a lawyer in and around the industry, so just my experience. Hope this helps.

E63ory

Thank you very much - This is very informative. The dealer actually offered me HIS paint meter! Hypothetically, if all goes well, I need to determine how much am I willing to pay for this car. Any thoughts?

Esleeper

"If people knew how many of their cars were painted before they took possesion, they would lose their minds.



That say's it all. No doubt. Almost everything has been painted.

If he offered his paint meter, that's a good sign.

$58k is right in line for an 07 with high 30's on the clock. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

E63ory

58K is suggested retail value according to KBB. I would be nuts to pay that much, in particular for a car with a blemished carfax.

Esleeper

I agree. //

That's what dealers and pp's are asking but they do not appear to be moving! I'd say move on from anything that does not have a clean report. There are plenty of 63's out there. It's not like trying to find a 55/ Good luck on your search!

m_berman

Typically, tax time is very very slow for dealers, especially luxury dealers. I would start in low $40k and work up to high $40k, then start walking if dealer is not dealing.

I would not consider anything except a clean car fax with no body work. There are lots of those perfect babes out there.

E63ory

Are you serious? The dealer told me he won't budge below 57K. He quoted me 61K which includes additional 2 years warranty.

france2112

Just checked Manheim auction. They are totally ripping you off!!! 2007 CLS63's with similar mileage are going for low to mid 40'sK in good condition. Do not buy this car at what they are asking. F*** them!! Tell them you know the wholesale price and you will be willing to pay a few K over that and that is it. That car will sit unless they can sucker an uneducated guy off the street which is possible. No enthusiast would touch that car especially a painted car at that price. BTW, ask them for the VMI (vehicle master inquiry). It will tell you all the services and fixes to the car. I never buy a car without looking at it. If they won't show it to you then they are hiding something. I never have a problem getting so you shouldn't either. Good luck.

Larry

E63ory

France 2112 - This is valuable info thank you. I will tell them that. I will ask for a printout of the VMI, but, my feeling is that these folks are going to hold on to that car. Several months ago, I missed out an opportunity to purchase a beautiful, certified cls55 IWC with only 26K miles. The asking price then was 49.9, and I went home to think about it. It was purchased the next day by a fellow mbworld member. That was a special car, and this one is too only due to the pp and all the designo paint/interior touches. I will ask for a copy of the VMI. They did share it with me, but only through the computer screen.

france2112

Hmmm. I hear what you are saying but it bothers me the car was in an accident. I agree a Designo car with PP is rare but is it really worth paying that much more then a standard good condition CLS63? BTW does it have distronic, parktronic, keyless, and trunk closer? It better or definitely no deal. If you really must have this particular car and pay this premium price then have them agree to drive it to a body shop you pick to have it inspected. Tell the body shop of your choice the situation and make sure of the previous damage. These guys can spot a paint job a mile away and they will check for replaced parts and frame damage. I know you lost the IWC car but they just want too much friggin money for this one. It does sound like a nice car from what you are describing however. Good luck.

Larry

iamnsxtc

E63ory,
They are ripping you off. I just picked up my car in December for around 56k out the door with an additional 2-year warranty on top of the remaining factory. They originally were asking 63 w/o all the warranties and taxes

This car sounds very similar to mine. 07 CLS63 w/47k miles CPO Designo Graphite exterior with Black wood grain and interior w/ white seats and door panels. P03, Distronic, parktronic, trunk closer the works. One-owner, off-lease car. They can go lower

E63ory

I just got off the phone with the sales manager. He wouldn't budge off 57K, saying that this is a rare car blah blah blah. He quoted me different prices off Manheim, and since I am not a member, I coudn't despute. I told him 50K + the 2years extra warranty. iamnsxtc - Your car sounds similar, but mine has no disctronic and parktronic. Sounds like you got a hell of a deal. Which dealer?

iamnsxtc

I started working with them in Nov '09 like I said they wanted 58k no CPO. In a week with the CPO it went up to 63 without all their taxes and crap. December '09 got my asking price. MB of Tampa. Jay was my salesman.

E63ory

Sounds like you got quite a great deal. I am willing to wait for the right car to come along. These guys are not budging and honesty, with a non clean carfax, they are idiots not to sell it to me for a better price. If they do come down, I will certainly take it to get inspected by a body shop. I am also bothered by the fact that the car does not have parktronic.

iamnsxtc

I would say to wait them out. Asking that much for a car with damage and with little options is crazy. This is the first time I realy liked the deal I got. I have been looking for A CLS since 07. A 55 or 63, I didn't care. But I'm glad I waited as long as I did... I really like this car..
Good luck with it or another search
Charles

france2112

Screw that car!! No parktronic and has been in an accident! I will be pissed at you if you buy that car J/K. Really, tell them to stick there car up there a$$ and I mean it. Wait it out and you will find a better deal. You may have to get a car from another state but that is really no big deal. Good luck.

Larry

Esleeper

Yea,


There are enough CLS63's out there to take a pass on this one. We don't want another Igor car on out hands.

iamnsxtc

here's one P03, parktronic cpo w/ 47k in Florida

Blk04cobra1

You have gotten some real good advice from multiple people. I would shy away from this car too with the carfax report having a ding. Technically speaking if it shows on the Carfax, then they are not allowed to CPO. As for the painted panels, that's really up to the dealer and most will not keep a car with extensive paint work.

Also remember that AMG's cost a little more to CPO than the average MB. Talking Manheim pricing and dealer pricing are too completely different things. I would say on the average AMG to CPO would cost the dealer between $4k and $5k. So let's say they bought the car for $42k, they would have about $47k in it before adding the cost of the warranty, which I believe is $1495 (could be wrong) for the one year. So now, they own the car for $48.5k. Now, not budging off the $57k to make a deal is not good, but I could see why they wouldn't accept an offer of $50k (if this is the case with this car).

If the car is CPO'd, I would always ask for the repair order (and VMI) when they CPO'd it. This will tell you what they did to the car and also give you a peace of mind on what work you will not have to do in the near future. Good luck with your search, there are plenty of them out there, just keep looking.

E63ory

Dear all,
You are all so kind to share your very valuable input. Who is Igor and what was the fate of his CLS? I did see the car in FL, but it is higher miles and no designo (which is fine). I am willing to wait until the right one shows up. I am pretty much sold on having a CLS - No other car is to me as beautiful with such pure lines. I will never forget Clarkson's video of the CLS55, it really impressed me. I was wondering why the dealer told me at first that the accident was only 'the driver backing into a pole', if so, why was there a police report? And how would they know - They didn't show may any repair paperwork, but offered me a paint detector and claim that only one panel was painted. At this point, I don't believe them. I think that it WAS a more major accident, with police involvement, and I doubt only one panel is involved. They probably got the car really cheap as result, maybe low 40s, and since it is such a nice example with low miles, they decided to certify it and sell it to AMG enthusiasts... I know the bodyshop that repaired the car (beverly hills mercedes). They worked on my E63 - I will stop by and demand to see the paperwork - At this point out of sheer curiousity.

Esleeper

Here is the "Igor" thread I was referring to!

https://mbworld.org/forums/cls55-amg...d-content.html


This is L.A.

Between here and the O.C. you should be able to find a decent car with the mileage you are looking for. Good luck on your search.

E63ory

Poor Igor.... I found another car in the SF area, 2007 cls63, 17K miles with pp no designo but most other goodies. They want 62K and are firm! This is basically kbb certified value, the highest there is. That is waaay too much, and I am a pretty good negotiator.