RStevens63

On 91 octane at the wheels not going to happen. Take your car to a local Dyno Jet and post the results. MKB doesn't make that kind of gains with 91 octane. Did you actually read through the link I posted? I'm not saying there was foul play, just that you should redyno elsewhere because your initial results are clearly off. You would be the first car in history to gain that much power from a tune only on 91 octane, unfortunately it's physically impossible to do so. If it were me, well, I'd want to know what kind of power I was actually making, but that's just me.

Jae Duk

give me money to go pay for the dyno and i'll go do it.

btw your link doesn't work

RStevens63

That's odd on the link, I can't find the thread anymore either???Hmmm.Ok, I'll make you a deal. Go to a DJ, post SAE results and if you make 80rw or more than what you would've stock I'll pay for your dyno. Most stock C63s make about 355-360rwhp on a dyno jet using 91 octane would you agree? That would mean you're at 440rwhp now.

bhamg

The thing about most dyno threads is that there always seems to be a poster or two who go hard after the results of the OP, perhaps to question or discredit the results, or maybe not. Often they ask very detailed questions but I don't see them question results posted by other customers of the vendor they used for similar products or services. Usually this person a) is a customer of a competitive vendor and b) doesn't own a C63. I always question their motives...have been there as an OP, have seen that happen, have been nice enough not to point it out...sure this questionable dyno stuff happens but where do these guys come from that they just pop out of the woodwork like this on these kinds of threads?

Jae Duk

I'm just curious why? He/she seems to have a problem with the dyno because I dynoed it at RPI. Yet he has no problem accepting Evosport, MHP's dynos when they were all done at their place. Makes me wonder were you not happy with what Eloy did to your car and you're now attacking me and his items?
Everything that comes out for the 63 engine has been done and dynoed at the owner's own choice. Brian's x-pipe was originall dynoed on their own dyno probably. EVERYTHING has always been the same way. So why the lack of trust now? I've told you, if you really don't believe me go get the tune and dyno it yourself. This is my experience and what I SAW from the gains. I'm not bsing you or anything.

MB_Forever

Almost every single MHP car (except their own) has been dynoed by the owner at independent shops in different states and some have even been dynoed in different countries. The dynos are all posted here in the C63 section and you may find some on the AMG Performance.net website. More importantly, so far only MHP cars (and RennTech) have proven to record solid numbers on the track, mostly mid 11s with 122+ mph traps - not to mention Keith's car of course which, being in a league of its own, is currently in the low 11s before the latest round of upgrades (so it won't stay there for long ).

Anyways, I agree with you that RPI's dyno reads very low, but that is okay as you are only looking at the delta. When I dynoed my car at RPI, Eloy was very honest with me and told me from the beginning that his dyno was a very low-reading dyno. He offered me corrected numbers and non-corrected numbers. I chose to go with the non-corrected numbers despite them being so low. I also dynoed my car at 3 other places: 2 dynojets and one Mustang Dyno so I know exactly where the car stands. In general, I rather brag about a car that dynos a 100 hp but runs mid 11s than a car that dynos 1000 hp but runs 14 seconds down the 1/4 mile

RStevens63

No one is discrediting anything. I think you're taking this the wrong way. Unless of course you think a legit 80rwhp gain is possible on 91 octane from a tune only on a C63? Call Kleemann, call Evosport, call MKB and ask them what they think. Not possible.All I told the OP was to have his car dyno'd at another shop, an independant one that has nothing to gain or lose. I recommend this to anyone doing any kind of performance mod. Why even bother dynoing at the shop you got the parts/tuning from? Waste of time. I have nothing against RPI, ESS or anyone else for that matter, just trying to dole out some good advice. Several people in this thread spoke of how low RPI's DD reads, ok then, a normal DJ should read significantly higher right? So now I'm the villian after I offer to pay to prove a fact, sorry the listed gain is not physically possible, to another member. If you say so.

RStevens63

I never believe any quoted figures from the manufacturers themselves, this even goes for K&N filters. After searching through this forum and dragtimes MB_Forever hit the nail on the head. The track is #1 as far as proving worth and I don't see anything yet, dragtimes is all MKB, MPH, and Renntech. The guys that have proven stuff, have not only their own dyno's but those of customers performed at 3rd party shops. Kind of like what superlubricity and Dads do, they don't just take the manufacturers word for it, they test it themself at their own shops. I believe those results anytime.So for the good of the forum, take my $ and re-dyno please.

Jae Duk

Just outta curiosity who said anything about 80? I said 60ish gain on mine give or take on other C63s. The CHANGE or what MB Forever used was "delta". Why are you expecting it to gain 80 when I said 60? Doesn't make sense. If it reads higher it's only going to read a little bit higher it's not going to read 25% higher. 25% is A LOT!!

RStevens63

Properly setup Dyno Dynamics as noted in this thread, read significantly lower than properly setup Dyno Jets. 60rw on a DD is an easy 80rw on a DJ, maybe 85 in fact. DJs are more consistant than DDs dyno to dyno, which is why I suggested using one to get a second set of numbers for your car.I bet you won't see a 60rw gain on a Dyno Jet on 91 octane, 80rw is out of the question, and I'm willing to pay to prove it to you. It's not even a bet where I have the chance of winning something, I just want to see what this tune will do at a 3rd party site on a more consistant dyno. We do the same thing when any of my friends get something done to their cars, we take it around town to a few dynos to confirm gains, then to the track.Running at the track would also be great.Thanks

Jae Duk

Track is out of the question. No track on my car...you're gonna have to find some one else to be your guinea pig for that one

DAGREEKNYC

the 63 motor tuned correctly should be around the 430 rwhp range. sae smoothing should be set to 5 depending where u are located . mine stock put down 408

RStevens63

With all due respect you don't have to do anything, however the more data you put out there the better it will be for RPI/ESS. Redynoing, track testing, using a GPS box, whatever the more the better. I can respect your decision not to race, but what about redynoing with the original offer?Also, technically you're ESS/RPI's guinea pig, not mine

RStevens63

That's right in line with what a E63 with 93 octane tune should put down on a DJ. That's why 440rw+ on 91 octane from a C isn't feasible.

MB_Forever

Please keep in mind that there has been a couple of E63s, CLS63, and CLK63 BS (all rated at 507 crank hp) that have put down 420 to 430 hp on the dyno (on pump 91 gas). The dynos are all in the appropriate section and have been posted multiple times.

Please note that I'm not implying or inferring anything regarding what is possible and what is not possible on the C platform, but I can confirm from personal experience and a lot of exposure from the E and CLS platforms that the E63 and CLS63 should average between 410 to 420 wheel hp. In fact, if you take 415 whp as the mid point, using an 18% drivetrain loss, it comes out to 507 hp at the crank.

MB_Forever

By the way, the reason he referred to track numbers as being a solid indicator (although still not 100% accurate) was because:

First, it is sometimes hard to duplicate real driving conditions on a dyno. Things like load on the car, wind speed, aerodynamic resistance, tire/road contact resistance, etc... This would cause your car to react a little differently on the dyno vs on the road. It would be hard to generate 130 mph winds without a wind tunnel. I like dyno dynamics and mustang dynos because you can at least duplicate some load on the car although it won't vary as it will on the road... but still better than no load.

Second, there have been countless cases of people purchasing mods and tunes then posting very strong dyno numbers that dominate all other dynos posted before them within the same class of mods... but then when those people actually track their cars, the cars end-up performing very poorly - often below stock even. Dyno numbers are great, but usually without a solid track number, they are just a number. Track numbers are how the car actually performed in real life testing. I can't tell you how many times I've seen people post that their cars put down 500 to 600 wheel hp but when they actually go out to a track, they discover their cars run only 13 seconds This is actually a good indicator to go back, work on the mods some more/tune some more, then come back out and try again. After a few attempts, you'll be able to filter what mods work and what won't.

By the way, tracking your car does not equal to trashing your car. You can still do it in a fancy manner. You can go during a private rental where there is only 10, 20 or 30 guys to avoid the 400 car chaos on public test n tunes. You also don't have to do any burnouts or even race anyone. You just line-up and go as if you're on the street.

Scoobywrx

Eloy @RPI FTW...Did you do the exhaust yet Patrick?

Jae Duk

No exhaust yet.

champcar32c

So has anybody else purchased this tune, im very intrested but would like to here others feedback. Thanks