my gains from stock to current
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Joined: Feb 2014
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From: Colorado
2013 C63 AMG, 2012 Callaway Corvette, 2010 Range Sport SC, 2013 Chevy Dually, 2012 Harley V-Rod
I might try that sometime, What's the name of it, and do they have a web-site with a schedule. The track in Evanston is only an eighth mile track, but I've had tons of fun at that slow, slow track. people get decent 60'ers there, but that might be because of the lack of power with da's normally in the 9K' range, lol, but the starting line is very sticky imo.
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Joined: Jan 2014
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2010 C63 P30
me too, and thanks. Like I said in the original post, I did not feel right about spending 2g's on a set of second-hand headers, but to shave off nearly a second on an already strong running car, I figure that was a bargain and a half!! I thought gaining a half second on just the "tune" alone was phenominal, and was totally un-prepared to see the G-tech flash a 12.3@115. I simply wanted to at least get a 12.anything, lol. Money well spent.
I used my caliper to measure the single outlet on both stock manifolds, and it was only 2". Each primary of these headers is 1 7/8"!! so 4 cylinders on each bank was breathing through a single hole approximately the size of each cylinder's current primary tube diameter, I feel that has more to do with the gains rather than the cats, but I'm sure there's gains there as well.
I used my caliper to measure the single outlet on both stock manifolds, and it was only 2". Each primary of these headers is 1 7/8"!! so 4 cylinders on each bank was breathing through a single hole approximately the size of each cylinder's current primary tube diameter, I feel that has more to do with the gains rather than the cats, but I'm sure there's gains there as well.
It seems that headers really wake up this M156 engine. Im at about 3700ft and currently my C63 is fully stock 451hp. I am seriously considering headers to go with my tune for next year. Is installation pretty difficult?
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 301
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
I wasn't easy, but doable if you're patient and fairly handy with a wrench. I gave myself plenty of time as well. 1 day to remove everything to the resonator, then a day for each header, then finished with the mid-pipes and reinstall all the stinkin skid-plates. I could've done it quicker, but I think when you get tired, you tend to hurry, and half a$$ things.
I will say that I reused the factory manifold gaskets, nuts, studs, and 02 sensors with no problems. People can say what they want but MLS gaskets can be reused ALOT.
PM me if you have any particular questions or want more details. I have no real special tools btw.
I will say that I reused the factory manifold gaskets, nuts, studs, and 02 sensors with no problems. People can say what they want but MLS gaskets can be reused ALOT.
PM me if you have any particular questions or want more details. I have no real special tools btw.
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C63 507, 911 Carrera, Range Rover, Disco
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 64
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C63 Coupe
There's more going on here then meets the eye. I 100% believe your times but thinking that the first tune had some issues. First a tune alone on a non p31 car is way more hp then any headers. Way more, has to do with throttle restriction. Secondly, to loose a whole second in the 1/4 mile on a 4000 lb car would probably take around 135 hp if traction was not an issue.
Last edited by Thor2j; Feb 21, 2014 at 04:07 PM.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 301
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
There's more going on here then meets the eye. I 100% believe your times but thinking that the first tune had some issues. First a tune alone on a non p31 car is way more hp then any headers. Way more, has to do with throttle restriction. Secondly, to loose a whole second in the 1/4 mile on a 4000 lb car would probably take around 135 hp if traction was not an issue.
Traction is also NOT an issue, as this car is pretty soft on tq. and the Nittos grab nicely 90% of the time.
Last edited by skaarlaj; Feb 22, 2014 at 12:52 PM.
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bmw e-60 550i,bmw e-92 m3, c63coupe p31, stable of Italian stallions MV's
No , a c 63 with headers and tune will be a good race. But the c63 p31 can do consistant 12 flat times. My money would be on a p31 with Hoosiers.
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 301
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
And we can't say driver mod, because these cars pretty much drive themselves, yes we're very spoiled! And I just realized the header car in the video has the older transmission that actually responds less to tuning than the 2012+ and the p31 is a 2012 and it DOES have the better trans, hope the p31 isn't a very expensive option. Not dissing the P31, as it's a very strong factory car, but if your on a budget and don't mind turning a wrench, there are other ways of achieving speed supremecy. But if your into warranties, and "buying" speed the p31 is for you, or perhaps a black series. Great, another dis-advantage to the poor car with headers in the video I just realized, he's running cats, and although I can't agree as strongly as most people do, cats cost power, so if this car in the vid was running with cat-less mids, "like most modded C63's of the world" it would be worse yet again.
Last edited by skaarlaj; Feb 22, 2014 at 12:14 AM.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2012
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
And you sir, would have a lighter wallet, the P31 can wear the Hoosiers, and I'll just bump my drag radials on the heavy stock rims.
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 301
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
[QUOTE=mvagusta;5950840]No , a c 63 with headers and tune will be a good race. But the c63 p31 can do consistant 12 flat times. My money would be on a p31 with Hoosiers. Here's the link for you again, I said I ran a 12.3@115 so take a look.
http://www.dragtimes.com/da-density-...ect+ET+and+MPH
And I'm seriously not trying to brag, but before these mods I was quite disappointed with the car, and if I stop and think what the car costed me, it's plain pathetic as far as quickness, "but only quickness" is concerned. I had a modded 04 Cobra that would easily rip this car apart in any sort of speed contest, that I felt luck getting 18,500 for. But the beauty of this car, is it is very very nice, has 4 doors, and My wife, or grandmother can get behind the wheel of this thing and click off just as good as an et as John Force.
When I went out to test the headers and tune, I truthfully was hoping for a 12.9, and was pleasantly surprised by the 12.3, enough that I had to test it again to rule out a "fluke" run, and it ran the same two more times in the same exact spot, even though the G-tech pro has proved to be very, very consistent for me after dozens, and dozens of runs, between several of my vehicles over the years. I'll also say again that this car has responded from mods more-so than any other vehicle I have modded, including my old 04 Cobra, and my 03 Lightning which are both factory supercharged, and increasing boost is literally a pulley change away for those two vehicles.
http://www.dragtimes.com/da-density-...ect+ET+and+MPH
And I'm seriously not trying to brag, but before these mods I was quite disappointed with the car, and if I stop and think what the car costed me, it's plain pathetic as far as quickness, "but only quickness" is concerned. I had a modded 04 Cobra that would easily rip this car apart in any sort of speed contest, that I felt luck getting 18,500 for. But the beauty of this car, is it is very very nice, has 4 doors, and My wife, or grandmother can get behind the wheel of this thing and click off just as good as an et as John Force.
When I went out to test the headers and tune, I truthfully was hoping for a 12.9, and was pleasantly surprised by the 12.3, enough that I had to test it again to rule out a "fluke" run, and it ran the same two more times in the same exact spot, even though the G-tech pro has proved to be very, very consistent for me after dozens, and dozens of runs, between several of my vehicles over the years. I'll also say again that this car has responded from mods more-so than any other vehicle I have modded, including my old 04 Cobra, and my 03 Lightning which are both factory supercharged, and increasing boost is literally a pulley change away for those two vehicles.
Last edited by skaarlaj; Feb 22, 2014 at 12:45 AM.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2012
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...ml#post5950955
Just found the guys thread here at mbworld whos car got beat in the video I posted earlier, check it out, good reading.
Just found the guys thread here at mbworld whos car got beat in the video I posted earlier, check it out, good reading.
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Joined: Oct 2013
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C63 Coupe
A tuned c63 would kill a p31 and beat a 507, it's simple hp. All else being the same. I have a renntech tuned c63 putting out 530hp, dyno'd.
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
I also wish all the tuner companies would advertise RWHP instead of flywheelhp, as aside from the manufacturers claims, nobody uses flywheel hp, it's all chassis dyno hp. I bet Kleeman, Oe, Eurocharged, Velos, etc. has never seen an M156 engine out of a chassis and on an engine dyno before, they're simple using math derived from gains achieved on a chassis dyno. Maybe because 530 sounds a lot better than 390-420. But as soon as you start looking at Mustangs, Camaros, Vettes, Vipers, aka the real kings of the streets. it's all RWHP?
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C63 Coupe
I've seen a few races between a stock p31 vs. tuned non p31's on youtube, and although many are close, usually the p31 edges the "tuned" one out by a hair.
I also wish all the tuner companies would advertise RWHP instead of flywheelhp, as aside from the manufacturers claims, nobody uses flywheel hp, it's all chassis dyno hp. I bet Kleeman, Oe, Eurocharged, Velos, etc. has never seen an M156 engine out of a chassis and on an engine dyno before, they're simple using math derived from gains achieved on a chassis dyno. Maybe because 530 sounds a lot better than 390-420. But as soon as you start looking at Mustangs, Camaros, Vettes, Vipers, aka the real kings of the streets. it's all RWHP?
I also wish all the tuner companies would advertise RWHP instead of flywheelhp, as aside from the manufacturers claims, nobody uses flywheel hp, it's all chassis dyno hp. I bet Kleeman, Oe, Eurocharged, Velos, etc. has never seen an M156 engine out of a chassis and on an engine dyno before, they're simple using math derived from gains achieved on a chassis dyno. Maybe because 530 sounds a lot better than 390-420. But as soon as you start looking at Mustangs, Camaros, Vettes, Vipers, aka the real kings of the streets. it's all RWHP?
My rwhp is now 434 from 375, p31 isn't close.
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Joined: Dec 2012
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
There are many dyno results where the p31 and 507 are all on the same dyno along with the non p31 cars. A dyno is a dyno. I understand what you are saying but the cars are identical besides this. A p31 doesn't stand a chance against a tuned c63. Hp is hp
My rwhp is now 434 from 375, p31 isn't close.
My rwhp is now 434 from 375, p31 isn't close.
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
But I would not trade my car with about 3500.00 in mods for a p31 car of the same year/ same mileage without mods.
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C63 Coupe
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Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2012
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From: Wyoming
ford svt's, and C63!!!
Just like my 6500' 12.3@115 time would be in the 11's at sea level, a stock P31 car would probably run a high 12 at my elevation, if I was to guess, where most probably see lower 12's maybe a few high 11's in sea level air.
