Best Air Filter, AirBox, Air Intake
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,673
Likes: 4
From: Pittsburgh
C63 AMG
I guess to lots of folks an intake mod looks more attractive cause it's cheaper and certainly easier to install. Since I'm new to this, however, what sort of HP/tq gains can be had by replacing headers, deleting cats, fully modding the exhaust? Having perused some of the threads it seems like there are many different schools of thought on what options are best (x-pipe, long vs. short headers, etc.), some of which I'd assume I should chalk up to taste, i.e. some prefer one sound some prefer others, and then performance gains are also a consideration. Some of obviously tracking their cars, others are worried about failing state emissions, and then others aren't.
So I guess I'm wondering what the spectrum is on HP/tq gains for more modest to more widespread exhaust mods? Thanks for the input
So I guess I'm wondering what the spectrum is on HP/tq gains for more modest to more widespread exhaust mods? Thanks for the input
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 272
Likes: 4
C63
Longtube headers with 3 inch Mids and xpipe will give the most power coupled with a GOOD dyno tune. Not a lame canned one. You should 600+ crank or right around 485+ at wheels. Currently, I'm in the process of purchasing mbh headers since mike is a class act! As soon as they arrive. My car will be shipped to renntech for a custom dyno and os giken LSD install.
The stock heads on this car out flow nascar heads. To get the heads off you need to pull the motor out of the car. It's a 21 hour job. And, if you don't have headers and cams, what's the point of better flowing heads when they bottle down to stock manifolds and still have all the stock cam lift. Makes no sense logically. On top of that why would you want to open up a motor that isn't broken if all your gonna do is drive to Starbucks and then to work? Once you open it up it will never be the same as it came from AMG.
Headers and tune as I see it is the best thing for this car. After that it's either cams or supercharging. And, trust me. As soon as you start playing with forced induction, I promise you, you will need to rebuild the transmission. I've talked Keith (Dads C63) and he's basically a pioneer for how he has pushed the envolope on m156 platform. His motor on stock internals without p31 pkg handle 700rwhp on 200 shot. run after run and he never blew a piston. The problem was the tranny.
Remember, you gotta pay to play.
The stock heads on this car out flow nascar heads. To get the heads off you need to pull the motor out of the car. It's a 21 hour job. And, if you don't have headers and cams, what's the point of better flowing heads when they bottle down to stock manifolds and still have all the stock cam lift. Makes no sense logically. On top of that why would you want to open up a motor that isn't broken if all your gonna do is drive to Starbucks and then to work? Once you open it up it will never be the same as it came from AMG.
Headers and tune as I see it is the best thing for this car. After that it's either cams or supercharging. And, trust me. As soon as you start playing with forced induction, I promise you, you will need to rebuild the transmission. I've talked Keith (Dads C63) and he's basically a pioneer for how he has pushed the envolope on m156 platform. His motor on stock internals without p31 pkg handle 700rwhp on 200 shot. run after run and he never blew a piston. The problem was the tranny.
Remember, you gotta pay to play.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 564
Likes: 1
From: Australia
AMG
Longtube headers with 3 inch Mids and xpipe will give the most power coupled with a GOOD dyno tune. Not a lame canned one. You should 600+ crank or right around 485+ at wheels. Currently, I'm in the process of purchasing mbh headers since mike is a class act! As soon as they arrive. My car will be shipped to renntech for a custom dyno and os giken LSD install.
The stock heads on this car out flow nascar heads. To get the heads off you need to pull the motor out of the car. It's a 21 hour job. And, if you don't have headers and cams, what's the point of better flowing heads when they bottle down to stock manifolds and still have all the stock cam lift. Makes no sense logically. On top of that why would you want to open up a motor that isn't broken if all your gonna do is drive to Starbucks and then to work? Once you open it up it will never be the same as it came from AMG.
Headers and tune as I see it is the best thing for this car. After that it's either cams or supercharging. And, trust me. As soon as you start playing with forced induction, I promise you, you will need to rebuild the transmission. I've talked Keith (Dads C63) and he's basically a pioneer for how he has pushed the envolope on m156 platform. His motor on stock internals without p31 pkg handle 700rwhp on 200 shot. run after run and he never blew a piston. The problem was the tranny.
Remember, you gotta pay to play.
The stock heads on this car out flow nascar heads. To get the heads off you need to pull the motor out of the car. It's a 21 hour job. And, if you don't have headers and cams, what's the point of better flowing heads when they bottle down to stock manifolds and still have all the stock cam lift. Makes no sense logically. On top of that why would you want to open up a motor that isn't broken if all your gonna do is drive to Starbucks and then to work? Once you open it up it will never be the same as it came from AMG.
Headers and tune as I see it is the best thing for this car. After that it's either cams or supercharging. And, trust me. As soon as you start playing with forced induction, I promise you, you will need to rebuild the transmission. I've talked Keith (Dads C63) and he's basically a pioneer for how he has pushed the envolope on m156 platform. His motor on stock internals without p31 pkg handle 700rwhp on 200 shot. run after run and he never blew a piston. The problem was the tranny.
Remember, you gotta pay to play.
One of the best modifications when you SC your car is doing the heads.
May i ask.... Have you done heads on your car?
No one has mentioned anything about driving to starbucks. It was a simple opinion that heads are one of the best modifications to the car. And yes why open a motor that isn't broken? Well it's simple, if you're adding a big SC it will break, so you either rebuild it prior or rebuild it when it blows
Just like running big HP will destroy the tranny and diff too. Hence why we rebuild or strengthen these. If the M156 and it's driveline were unbreakable, reputable companies like Weistec would not offer packages that include rebuilds etc for them. *shakes head*
Clearly you don't have CNC Ported heads because if you did, you'd be jizzing yourself on your way to Starbucks to have your chai late`
Last edited by RawBenz; Jul 11, 2014 at 08:17 PM.
Banned
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,811
Likes: 7
C63 AMG
Flowing the heads
On a na engine there is some advantage
It basically reduces airflow friction losses
This means more atm P gets to the cylinder and higher pumping efficiency
It's like getting several ounces of free boost
On a FI engine you can negate theses losses by adding the ounces of boost so the net charge is achieved
AMG always had a rep for getting great volumetric efficiency out of their heads
T = cu in x 14.7 x comp ratio of 11.3 x vol eff / (4 pi x 12)
Using 443 lb ft you will see vol eff is >> 1
A good number is 1.03 range ( M3, RS4 range)
The M156 is closer to 1.06
A 0.03 difference is like 0.4 psi or 6 oz of boost
On a na engine there is some advantage
It basically reduces airflow friction losses
This means more atm P gets to the cylinder and higher pumping efficiency
It's like getting several ounces of free boost
On a FI engine you can negate theses losses by adding the ounces of boost so the net charge is achieved
AMG always had a rep for getting great volumetric efficiency out of their heads
T = cu in x 14.7 x comp ratio of 11.3 x vol eff / (4 pi x 12)
Using 443 lb ft you will see vol eff is >> 1
A good number is 1.03 range ( M3, RS4 range)
The M156 is closer to 1.06
A 0.03 difference is like 0.4 psi or 6 oz of boost
Last edited by Ingenieur; Jul 11, 2014 at 08:46 PM.
Super Member
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 521
Likes: 3
From: North East
2011 C63 AW
I really don't know much about cars. Don't want to try and act like I do. Certainly wasn't trying to stir a hornets nest on my train of thought or down on anyone for wanting to strap on a mod.
I always thought that an engine was a giant air pump. If you increase the possible airflow in with an intake, then it would be a good idea to increase the flow out with an improved exhaust and headers, then tune on a dyno with a custom flash to yield real world horse power gains.
I went through the whole fast and furious thing with Jap tuner cars. It was fun, but I think I wasted a lot of money on sucking sounds and cerebral seat of the pants feel when in reality I probably decreased performance that came from designers and engineers much smarter than myself.
Personally, my best mod is saving for my next set of tires and brake pads. This thing is all the car I can ever need but I commend anyone who wants to try and make it better.
I always thought that an engine was a giant air pump. If you increase the possible airflow in with an intake, then it would be a good idea to increase the flow out with an improved exhaust and headers, then tune on a dyno with a custom flash to yield real world horse power gains.
I went through the whole fast and furious thing with Jap tuner cars. It was fun, but I think I wasted a lot of money on sucking sounds and cerebral seat of the pants feel when in reality I probably decreased performance that came from designers and engineers much smarter than myself.
Personally, my best mod is saving for my next set of tires and brake pads. This thing is all the car I can ever need but I commend anyone who wants to try and make it better.
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 728
Likes: 6
From: Chicago, IL
2018 AMG E63s
Great info in this thread. I guess I'll have to see how far I want to go. I've got a new set of wheels on order which is 6K alone, and I may get some KW V3s to tweak ride height (another 3K), but these are cosmetic and will probably give some ride benefit. But if I'll ever feel the motivation to go full on, Weistec stage 3 or something else, I don't know. I wonder if I'd save the 20K involved and instead buy another ride in a couple of years with additional HP and acceleration stock. When you're looking at having to modify the remainder of the powertrain because the engine now kicks out way more HP/tq than the rest of the system can take, that's probably way beyond my limit. But watch, I'll be getting a set of headers in a few months
And I certainly appreciate to each their own and it's all in good fun after all. thanks
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Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 272
Likes: 4
C63
One of the best modifications when you SC your car is doing the heads.
May i ask.... Have you done heads on your car?
No one has mentioned anything about driving to starbucks. It was a simple opinion that heads are one of the best modifications to the car. And yes why open a motor that isn't broken? Well it's simple, if you're adding a big SC it will break, so you either rebuild it prior or rebuild it when it blows
Just like running big HP will destroy the tranny and diff too. Hence why we rebuild or strengthen these. If the M156 and it's driveline were unbreakable, reputable companies like Weistec would not offer packages that include rebuilds etc for them. *shakes head*
Clearly you don't have CNC Ported heads because if you did, you'd be jizzing yourself on your way to Starbucks to have your chai late`
May i ask.... Have you done heads on your car?
No one has mentioned anything about driving to starbucks. It was a simple opinion that heads are one of the best modifications to the car. And yes why open a motor that isn't broken? Well it's simple, if you're adding a big SC it will break, so you either rebuild it prior or rebuild it when it blows
Just like running big HP will destroy the tranny and diff too. Hence why we rebuild or strengthen these. If the M156 and it's driveline were unbreakable, reputable companies like Weistec would not offer packages that include rebuilds etc for them. *shakes head*
Clearly you don't have CNC Ported heads because if you did, you'd be jizzing yourself on your way to Starbucks to have your chai late`
There is no point of doing heads if you don't have cams and headers. Simple. I already asked weistec. They said the cost and labor (21+ hours) get the heads done to the power you would recieve wouldn't be smart. The heads would only be necessary trying to squeeze every last ounce of power from the stage 3.
Dads car withstood 200 shot of spray with no internal work at all.
He had 3 transmissions replaced all by weistec. The motor never had a problem handling the power. The transmission was the culprit.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 564
Likes: 1
From: Australia
AMG
Mate, youre a clown.
If only you knew lol.
Re read what you wrote. You said there's no point in doing the heads on a car that you're going to drive to Starbucks lol.
1) I don't drink coffee
2) You've obviously never been to Libya or the Mideast so sit back in your western hole of GM's and talking about daddy's car.
3) One of the best modifications you can do is the heads on a car, that's my statement whether you like it or not.
4) Before your foolishness, I had never heard of someone saying a daily driven car shouldn't have it's heads done.
5) Re read what I wrote before you begin making silly posts
6) Everyone has their own experiences and opinions, just like not every car is the same and not ever engine is the same.
No one said anything about cams and headers because when someone does heads common sense would say they'd already done supporting mods.
Maybe we can make a fire and sit around, while you tell us stories about daddy's car and his 200shots of 'I don't give a sh*t about your daddy's car'.
Allah Saednah..
Fool
If only you knew lol.
Re read what you wrote. You said there's no point in doing the heads on a car that you're going to drive to Starbucks lol.
1) I don't drink coffee
2) You've obviously never been to Libya or the Mideast so sit back in your western hole of GM's and talking about daddy's car.
3) One of the best modifications you can do is the heads on a car, that's my statement whether you like it or not.
4) Before your foolishness, I had never heard of someone saying a daily driven car shouldn't have it's heads done.
5) Re read what I wrote before you begin making silly posts
6) Everyone has their own experiences and opinions, just like not every car is the same and not ever engine is the same.
No one said anything about cams and headers because when someone does heads common sense would say they'd already done supporting mods.
Maybe we can make a fire and sit around, while you tell us stories about daddy's car and his 200shots of 'I don't give a sh*t about your daddy's car'.
Allah Saednah..
Fool
Last edited by RawBenz; Jul 12, 2014 at 05:31 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 272
Likes: 4
C63
Mate, youre a clown.
If only you knew lol.
Re read what you wrote. You said there's no point in doing the heads on a car that you're going to drive to Starbucks lol.
1) I don't drink coffee
2) You've obviously never been to Libya or the Mideast so sit back in your western hole of GM's and talking about daddy's car.
3) One of the best modifications you can do is the heads on a car, that's my statement whether you like it or not.
4) Before your foolishness, I had never heard of someone saying a daily driven car shouldn't have it's heads done.
5) Re read what I wrote before you began making silly posts
If only you knew lol.
Re read what you wrote. You said there's no point in doing the heads on a car that you're going to drive to Starbucks lol.
1) I don't drink coffee
2) You've obviously never been to Libya or the Mideast so sit back in your western hole of GM's and talking about daddy's car.
3) One of the best modifications you can do is the heads on a car, that's my statement whether you like it or not.
4) Before your foolishness, I had never heard of someone saying a daily driven car shouldn't have it's heads done.
5) Re read what I wrote before you began making silly posts
Banned
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,811
Likes: 7
C63 AMG
In the old days P & P of the heads made sense because good gains could be had
With modern tech like sand castings, NCM's, CFD, 4 valve geometry, variable cam phasing, etc., not so much, the gains are marginal and aren't really cost effective unless trying to eek out every last HP
With modern tech like sand castings, NCM's, CFD, 4 valve geometry, variable cam phasing, etc., not so much, the gains are marginal and aren't really cost effective unless trying to eek out every last HP
Last edited by Ingenieur; Jul 12, 2014 at 05:41 PM.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 564
Likes: 1
From: Australia
AMG
But it is a very noticeable and in my opinion a great modification.
I highly recommend it for anyone installing a stage II or III blower.
After they have other supporting mods like headers etc off course. But even then you need headers for Stage II or III so common sense says you get the heads done after you've had those mods done.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,673
Likes: 4
From: Pittsburgh
C63 AMG
Mate, youre a clown.
If only you knew lol.
Re read what you wrote. You said there's no point in doing the heads on a car that you're going to drive to Starbucks lol.
1) I don't drink coffee
2) You've obviously never been to Libya or the Mideast so sit back in your western hole of GM's and talking about daddy's car.
3) One of the best modifications you can do is the heads on a car, that's my statement whether you like it or not.
4) Before your foolishness, I had never heard of someone saying a daily driven car shouldn't have it's heads done.
5) Re read what I wrote before you begin making silly posts
6) Everyone has their own experiences and opinions, just like not every car is the same and not ever engine is the same.
No one said anything about cams and headers because when someone does heads common sense would say they'd already done supporting mods.
Maybe we can make a fire and sit around, while you tell us stories about daddy's car and his 200shots of 'I don't give a sh*t about your daddy's car'.
Allah Saednah..
Fool
If only you knew lol.
Re read what you wrote. You said there's no point in doing the heads on a car that you're going to drive to Starbucks lol.
1) I don't drink coffee
2) You've obviously never been to Libya or the Mideast so sit back in your western hole of GM's and talking about daddy's car.
3) One of the best modifications you can do is the heads on a car, that's my statement whether you like it or not.
4) Before your foolishness, I had never heard of someone saying a daily driven car shouldn't have it's heads done.
5) Re read what I wrote before you begin making silly posts
6) Everyone has their own experiences and opinions, just like not every car is the same and not ever engine is the same.
No one said anything about cams and headers because when someone does heads common sense would say they'd already done supporting mods.
Maybe we can make a fire and sit around, while you tell us stories about daddy's car and his 200shots of 'I don't give a sh*t about your daddy's car'.
Allah Saednah..
Fool
Although I don't always see eye to eye with Perakii63, the man knows his business. In this case I don't have an opinion because I don't have any experience with these mods on this particular car, but if Petakii speaks it, the truth won't be found too much further away if it hasn't already been spoken.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 564
Likes: 1
From: Australia
AMG
Just a heads up when Petkakii63 refers to "Dad's" car he isn't referring to his father's car... Lol search Dads C63 in this forum an you may learn a thing or two.
Although I don't always see eye to eye with Perakii63, the man knows his business. In this case I don't have an opinion because I don't have any experience with these mods on this particular car, but if Petakii speaks it, the truth won't be found too much further away if it hasn't already been spoken.
Although I don't always see eye to eye with Perakii63, the man knows his business. In this case I don't have an opinion because I don't have any experience with these mods on this particular car, but if Petakii speaks it, the truth won't be found too much further away if it hasn't already been spoken.
I simply stated that heads are one of the best modification in my opinion. Everyone's setup is different etc.
That's my opinion.
As much as I respect the fact that you think he knows his stuff, i don't think you've seen what the Mideast produces lol. A simple google search or youtube will help you see that.
There are a lot more people in the Mideast who are just as capable and competent with what they do and their information as him lol. I happen to be lucky to have experienced a lot of this first hand
I love how people sit here and drop names of people's cars like "dads c63" etc.
But what about Eissa's Red Arrow ? Fastest C63 in the gulf and the second fastest in the world? That's 10.5 1/4 without Nitrous. Allah Yehmik brother.
Nitrous is like using the bumpers at a bowling alley. You can still get a strike but technically it wasn't done 100%
But at the end of the day it's horses for courses.
All you need to do is take a look at my posts before that racist dog began to run his mouth.
Allah Saednah... clowns these days, a simple post about how heads are a good modification in my opinion turns into this *rolls eyes*
Last edited by RawBenz; Jul 12, 2014 at 07:23 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 272
Likes: 4
C63
That's where the issue is, there is no right or wrong in this situation.
I simply stated that heads are one of the best modification in my opinion. Everyone's setup is different etc.
That's my opinion.
As much as I respect the fact that you think he knows his stuff, i don't think you've seen what the Mideast produces lol. A simple google search or youtube will help you see that.
There are a lot more people in the Mideast who are just as capable and competent with what they do and their information as him lol. I happen to be lucky to have experienced a lot of this first hand
I love how people sit here and drop names of people's cars like "dads c63" etc.
But what about Eissa's Red Arrow ? Fastest C63 in the gulf and the second fastest in the world? That's 10.5 1/4 without Nitrous. Allah Yehmik brother.
Nitrous is like using the bumpers at a bowling alley. You can still get a strike but technically it wasn't done 100%
But at the end of the day it's horses for courses.
All you need to do is take a look at my posts before that racist dog began to run his mouth.
Allah Saednah... clowns these days, a simple post about how heads are a good modification in my opinion turns into this *rolls eyes*
I simply stated that heads are one of the best modification in my opinion. Everyone's setup is different etc.
That's my opinion.
As much as I respect the fact that you think he knows his stuff, i don't think you've seen what the Mideast produces lol. A simple google search or youtube will help you see that.
There are a lot more people in the Mideast who are just as capable and competent with what they do and their information as him lol. I happen to be lucky to have experienced a lot of this first hand
I love how people sit here and drop names of people's cars like "dads c63" etc.
But what about Eissa's Red Arrow ? Fastest C63 in the gulf and the second fastest in the world? That's 10.5 1/4 without Nitrous. Allah Yehmik brother.
Nitrous is like using the bumpers at a bowling alley. You can still get a strike but technically it wasn't done 100%
But at the end of the day it's horses for courses.
All you need to do is take a look at my posts before that racist dog began to run his mouth.
Allah Saednah... clowns these days, a simple post about how heads are a good modification in my opinion turns into this *rolls eyes*
🙉
Banned
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,811
Likes: 7
C63 AMG
Let's say you've done all this:
Row boxes with hi-flo filters
Larger tb's
Extrude hone intake manifold
Cams
Headers
Hi-flo cats
Low restriction exhaust system
Pulley
Custom dyno tuned software
How much gain would a P&P yield ?
In HP or percentage wise
Does anyone make a higher compression piston
Say a 12.5:1 that would be a 10% torque increase across the band
40-45 lb ft peak
That is probably more than ALL the above mods combined
Row boxes with hi-flo filters
Larger tb's
Extrude hone intake manifold
Cams
Headers
Hi-flo cats
Low restriction exhaust system
Pulley
Custom dyno tuned software
How much gain would a P&P yield ?
In HP or percentage wise
Does anyone make a higher compression piston
Say a 12.5:1 that would be a 10% torque increase across the band
40-45 lb ft peak
That is probably more than ALL the above mods combined
Last edited by Ingenieur; Jul 12, 2014 at 08:19 PM.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 564
Likes: 1
From: Australia
AMG
True lol.
In all honesty though, getting heads imo is a great mod if you go down the track of running a SC.
Yes we all know that you need to do the Tranny and Diff once you go SC. But honestly if you've blown the internals or you really want power figures and piece of mind, opening it up and doing the internals then heads is a great mod. Especially if the M156 is already out, you might swell do the heads.
In all honesty though, getting heads imo is a great mod if you go down the track of running a SC.
Yes we all know that you need to do the Tranny and Diff once you go SC. But honestly if you've blown the internals or you really want power figures and piece of mind, opening it up and doing the internals then heads is a great mod. Especially if the M156 is already out, you might swell do the heads.
Last edited by RawBenz; Jul 12, 2014 at 09:15 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,673
Likes: 4
From: Pittsburgh
C63 AMG
That's where the issue is, there is no right or wrong in this situation.
I simply stated that heads are one of the best modification in my opinion. Everyone's setup is different etc.
That's my opinion.
As much as I respect the fact that you think he knows his stuff, i don't think you've seen what the Mideast produces lol. A simple google search or youtube will help you see that.
There are a lot more people in the Mideast who are just as capable and competent with what they do and their information as him lol. I happen to be lucky to have experienced a lot of this first hand
I love how people sit here and drop names of people's cars like "dads c63" etc.
But what about Eissa's Red Arrow ? Fastest C63 in the gulf and the second fastest in the world? That's 10.5 1/4 without Nitrous. Allah Yehmik brother.
Nitrous is like using the bumpers at a bowling alley. You can still get a strike but technically it wasn't done 100%
But at the end of the day it's horses for courses.
All you need to do is take a look at my posts before that racist dog began to run his mouth.
Allah Saednah... clowns these days, a simple post about how heads are a good modification in my opinion turns into this *rolls eyes*
I simply stated that heads are one of the best modification in my opinion. Everyone's setup is different etc.
That's my opinion.
As much as I respect the fact that you think he knows his stuff, i don't think you've seen what the Mideast produces lol. A simple google search or youtube will help you see that.
There are a lot more people in the Mideast who are just as capable and competent with what they do and their information as him lol. I happen to be lucky to have experienced a lot of this first hand
I love how people sit here and drop names of people's cars like "dads c63" etc.
But what about Eissa's Red Arrow ? Fastest C63 in the gulf and the second fastest in the world? That's 10.5 1/4 without Nitrous. Allah Yehmik brother.
Nitrous is like using the bumpers at a bowling alley. You can still get a strike but technically it wasn't done 100%
But at the end of the day it's horses for courses.
All you need to do is take a look at my posts before that racist dog began to run his mouth.
Allah Saednah... clowns these days, a simple post about how heads are a good modification in my opinion turns into this *rolls eyes*
Why are you taking this so personal, I said not one word about you. Lol
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 272
Likes: 4
C63
Let's say you've done all this:
Row boxes with hi-flo filters
Larger tb's
Extrude hone intake manifold
Cams
Headers
Hi-flo cats
Low restriction exhaust system
Pulley
Custom dyno tuned software
How much gain would a P&P yield ?
In HP or percentage wise
Does anyone make a higher compression piston
Say a 12.5:1 that would be a 10% torque increase across the band
40-45 lb ft peak
That is probably more than ALL the above mods combined
Row boxes with hi-flo filters
Larger tb's
Extrude hone intake manifold
Cams
Headers
Hi-flo cats
Low restriction exhaust system
Pulley
Custom dyno tuned software
How much gain would a P&P yield ?
In HP or percentage wise
Does anyone make a higher compression piston
Say a 12.5:1 that would be a 10% torque increase across the band
40-45 lb ft peak
That is probably more than ALL the above mods combined
I think mhp is the only one who makes pistons which change compression. Weistec maintains stock compression.
If your upping the compression on a car. You'll need to up the grade of fuel your using. It's a double edge sword.
The limit of an engine simply doesn't rely in the hands of a tuner. It simply relies on how far you wanna go and how deep your pocket is. I'm sure if you can dream it anyone can build it. As long as your ready to hand them a signed blank check... Money talks, bs walks.
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 272
Likes: 4
C63
True lol.
In all honesty though, getting heads imo is a great mod if you go down the track of running a SC.
Yes we all know that you need to do the Tranny and Diff once you go SC. But honestly if you've blown the internals or you really want power figures and piece of mind, opening it up and doing the internals then heads is a great mod. Especially if the M156 is already out, you might swell do the heads.
In all honesty though, getting heads imo is a great mod if you go down the track of running a SC.
Yes we all know that you need to do the Tranny and Diff once you go SC. But honestly if you've blown the internals or you really want power figures and piece of mind, opening it up and doing the internals then heads is a great mod. Especially if the M156 is already out, you might swell do the heads.
Banned
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,811
Likes: 7
C63 AMG
Header and tune should net 100 wheel hp. Cams with heads should be another 50-70 at the wheels. Are intake manifold is already perfect with nothing much to be improved on it. Pulley should be about 10 wheel but the pulley actually moves the rpm band 300-400 rpms lower... So you get in the power band sooner. Tb's who knows since not many people put them on this car. The stock ones are dual 70mm which is insane for this motor. They flow so good. I can only imagine razor sharp throttle response from renntech.
I think mhp is the only one who makes pistons which change compression. Weistec maintains stock compression.
If your upping the compression on a car. You'll need to up the grade of fuel your using. It's a double edge sword.
The limit of an engine simply doesn't rely in the hands of a tuner. It simply relies on how far you wanna go and how deep your pocket is. I'm sure if you can dream it anyone can build it. As long as your ready to hand them a signed blank check... Money talks, bs walks.
I think mhp is the only one who makes pistons which change compression. Weistec maintains stock compression.
If your upping the compression on a car. You'll need to up the grade of fuel your using. It's a double edge sword.
The limit of an engine simply doesn't rely in the hands of a tuner. It simply relies on how far you wanna go and how deep your pocket is. I'm sure if you can dream it anyone can build it. As long as your ready to hand them a signed blank check... Money talks, bs walks.
670 hp crank
These mods give high end HP but not much mid range torque
You need boost (or displacement or comp ratio) to do that
High comp >12:1 on 93 octane US with modern controls is common now
My 12.5:1 RS4 was rated for 91 iirc, it did have direct injection though
Last edited by Ingenieur; Jul 12, 2014 at 10:45 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 272
Likes: 4
C63
Close to 180 whp or 220 crank with bolt ons?
670 hp crank
These mods give high end HP but not much mid range torque
You need boost (or displacement or comp ratio) to do that
High comp >12:1 on 93 octane US with modern controls is common now
My 12.5:1 RS4 was rated for 91 iirc, it did have direct injection though
670 hp crank
These mods give high end HP but not much mid range torque
You need boost (or displacement or comp ratio) to do that
High comp >12:1 on 93 octane US with modern controls is common now
My 12.5:1 RS4 was rated for 91 iirc, it did have direct injection though
Direct injection is the reason why you are able to run pump gas with no engine knock.
Direct injection process allows the fuel to evaporate in the cylinder and cool the air/fuel mixture. That helps avoid premature ignition, so these engines with direct injection can increase the compression ratio with no ill affect. Many of the engines now, are using multiple injector sprays per stroke. One spray occurs as the air starts flowing in on the intake stroke, to cool things down. The second occurs right before the spark plug fires. This creates a stratified charge for a better burn pattern using less fuel. Direct injection is awesome. I wish the m156 had it.
