Brake fluid, question...
01-17-2016, 06:05 PM
#26
MBWorld Fanatic!
on a left hand drive vehicle:
1. Right rear
2. Left Rear
3. Right front
4. Left front
and: Better use a Power Bleeder as described further up in this thread, rather than pumping.
1. Right rear
2. Left Rear
3. Right front
4. Left front
and: Better use a Power Bleeder as described further up in this thread, rather than pumping.
01-17-2016, 07:30 PM
#28
Member
Thread Starter
Thanks guys! 
Yes, I have Power Bleeder.
I got the Goodridge Brake lines. And I want to install it in the coming days.
Yes, I have Power Bleeder.I got the Goodridge Brake lines. And I want to install it in the coming days.
Last edited by Alex-r-1; 01-17-2016 at 08:06 PM.
01-28-2016, 11:27 AM
#31
Member
Thread Starter
Today I bought a new Bleeder Screws (my screw was rusted inside) on my dealer. Included was the instruction Brembo how to replace Bleeder Screws and was table with torque settings.
I measured my screw. Screw M10 - 20Nm torque setting. Right?!
I measured my screw. Screw M10 - 20Nm torque setting. Right?!
Last edited by Alex-r-1; 01-28-2016 at 11:45 AM.
01-28-2016, 12:55 PM
#32
MBWorld Fanatic!
Great - thanks for posting! Yes, if it is M10, then 17-20 Nm. I think the rear bleeders are smaller, probably M8, so they would need 7-10 NM.
01-28-2016, 05:28 PM
#34
Member
Thread Starter
I measured the rear Bleeder Screw. It is the same as the front! So, you can tighten all screws to 20 Nm.
Last edited by Alex-r-1; 01-28-2016 at 05:38 PM.
12-30-2017, 12:26 PM
#36
I know this thread is a little old but I haven't been able to find any newer info on the MB 331.0 DOT 4+ brake fluid. Diabolis is stating that the MB stuff is half the viscosity of other DOT 4+ fluids, but I haven't seen the viscosity spec of the MB 331.0 listed anywhere so I am not sure how he can make that claim. Since the 'plus' designation doesn't actually mean anything specific, some manufactures seem to be using this as a designation for their premium (higher boiling point and/or longer service life). Additionally several manufactures are making low viscosity products that are either marked LV or class 6. If the viscosity is the hallmark of MB 331.0, why don't they spec class 6? I know many have said to just buy the MB branded stuff and be done with it, but I would like to know what they are selling for $20 per quart.
12-31-2017, 07:12 PM
#37
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W204 C63 Coupe, W166 ML350 BlueTEC, 928GT, C5 Z06 & IS300 race cars, EQE 4Matic+ on order
The MB DOT4+ fluid was originally designed to work with the complex SBC system found on various MB cars including the SLR and Maybach. There was a note in a TSBs on the SBC system a number of years ago that indicated that the vast majority of SBC complaints and/or failures were caused by using unapproved fluid and that the MB DOT4+ fluid was engineered to maintain a very uniform low viscosity throughout the temperature range thus keeping the SBC braking components both operating withing the "calibrated" range and furthermore prolonging their life as it also had additives and conditioners specific to the materials used in the SBC braking system.
While the SBC system has now been replaced with a hydraulic one, the complex ESP systems in the current batch of cars rely on essentially the same servos and pumps that were developed for the SBC to provide very rapid automatic brake modulation, and require that specific MB fluid to operate properly and maintain their longevity. That's what they are selling for $20 a liter.
You are not going to find any more info on it (just like you won't on their specific coolant either) unless you get a job as a design engineer at MB Germany.
While the SBC system has now been replaced with a hydraulic one, the complex ESP systems in the current batch of cars rely on essentially the same servos and pumps that were developed for the SBC to provide very rapid automatic brake modulation, and require that specific MB fluid to operate properly and maintain their longevity. That's what they are selling for $20 a liter.
You are not going to find any more info on it (just like you won't on their specific coolant either) unless you get a job as a design engineer at MB Germany.
01-01-2018, 05:42 PM
#38
MBWorld Fanatic!
The MB 331.0 DOT 4+ brake fluid is among the best on the market (the dry and wet boiling points are about the same as DOT 5) but it's nowhere near as hygrosocopic as other DOT 4+ glycol-based fluids so you can change it every two years instead of every six months.
As Jasonoff pointed out, the biggest issue here is the fluid viscosity. All DOT 4+ aftermerket fluids are about twice as thick as the MB stuff. I think the conventional SBC system was dropped in the late 2000s as MB now accomplishes the advantages of the SBC system using some clever programming in the ESP, but for proper operation of those you need the thinner fluid.
Yes, Castrol SRF is about as good as brake fluids get FOR TRACK USE ONLY, but unless you flush it every three months and never drive your car in the winter, I wouldn't use it in a daily driver car.
Silicone-based DOT 5 fluid is a big no-no in systems not designed for it as it will destroy pretty m,uch everythign, so if you're absolutely determiend to use something aftermarket, do what Jasonoff did and use the DOT 5.1 fluid... except that there's really no reason to use it over the OEM MB DOT 4+ fluid as their characteristics are the same and the OEM fluid won't bugger up your ABS pump, harden your seals or make the hard brake lines corrode from the inside.
If it ain't broke - or doesn't need upgrading as is clearly the case here - don't fix it.
As Jasonoff pointed out, the biggest issue here is the fluid viscosity. All DOT 4+ aftermerket fluids are about twice as thick as the MB stuff. I think the conventional SBC system was dropped in the late 2000s as MB now accomplishes the advantages of the SBC system using some clever programming in the ESP, but for proper operation of those you need the thinner fluid.
Yes, Castrol SRF is about as good as brake fluids get FOR TRACK USE ONLY, but unless you flush it every three months and never drive your car in the winter, I wouldn't use it in a daily driver car.
Silicone-based DOT 5 fluid is a big no-no in systems not designed for it as it will destroy pretty m,uch everythign, so if you're absolutely determiend to use something aftermarket, do what Jasonoff did and use the DOT 5.1 fluid... except that there's really no reason to use it over the OEM MB DOT 4+ fluid as their characteristics are the same and the OEM fluid won't bugger up your ABS pump, harden your seals or make the hard brake lines corrode from the inside.
If it ain't broke - or doesn't need upgrading as is clearly the case here - don't fix it.
01-13-2018, 09:31 PM
#39
Junior Member
Anyway I'm actually one of the owners of Motive Products. If anyone needs a bleeder or anything else we manufacturer send me an email and we'll give you a discount. Cheers
Marco
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BLKROKT (01-13-2018)
01-14-2018, 09:03 AM
#40
MBWorld Fanatic!
Nice to see the product in use. Also like the mod - but I hope you are using CDA on the mod, else wise you'll be contaminating that nice clean fluid :-(
Anyway I'm actually one of the owners of Motive Products. If anyone needs a bleeder or anything else we manufacturer send me an email and we'll give you a discount. Cheers
Marco
Anyway I'm actually one of the owners of Motive Products. If anyone needs a bleeder or anything else we manufacturer send me an email and we'll give you a discount. Cheers
Marco
Even if the compressed air was full of moisture, wouldn't the fluid from the bottom of the bottle, in theory, be unaffected?
01-14-2018, 12:42 PM
#41
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2017 SQ5, 2012 C63 P31, 2001 Boxter S
I've had my 2012 C63 for a few months now and it will be going to the track 3-4 this year starting in April. This will be my first time taking a AMG to the track and can't freaking wait.
How does the OEM brake fluid handle the track? And the same goes for the brake lines? I've used Motul
in all my other cars I've taken to the track, will this also be good for the C63? I am a more advanced driver for what it's worth and the car is completely stock with the performance package.
Thanks for any advise!
How does the OEM brake fluid handle the track? And the same goes for the brake lines? I've used Motul
in all my other cars I've taken to the track, will this also be good for the C63? I am a more advanced driver for what it's worth and the car is completely stock with the performance package.
Thanks for any advise!
01-14-2018, 01:21 PM
#42
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2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
I've had my 2012 C63 for a few months now and it will be going to the track 3-4 this year starting in April. This will be my first time taking a AMG to the track and can't freaking wait.
How does the OEM brake fluid handle the track? And the same goes for the brake lines? I've used Motul
in all my other cars I've taken to the track, will this also be good for the C63? I am a more advanced driver for what it's worth and the car is completely stock with the performance package.
Thanks for any advise!
How does the OEM brake fluid handle the track? And the same goes for the brake lines? I've used Motul
in all my other cars I've taken to the track, will this also be good for the C63? I am a more advanced driver for what it's worth and the car is completely stock with the performance package.
Thanks for any advise!
01-14-2018, 04:52 PM
#43
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W204 C63 Coupe, W166 ML350 BlueTEC, 928GT, C5 Z06 & IS300 race cars, EQE 4Matic+ on order
... and finding a 44O package because with a 2012 you'll be able to do about five laps before the oil overheats and the car goes into limp mode. 
01-14-2018, 05:28 PM
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2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
With the addition of a radiator blockoff plate you can be good up until it’s gets to about 80F out. But anything hotter than that then, yeah, you’re screwed.
01-14-2018, 06:00 PM
#45
Senior Member
For track use,IMHO basics are :
- stainless brake lines
- high performance brake fluid (Motul RBF 600 or 660 is good, Castrol SRF is probably better but really expensive) to change twice a year at least
- track (higher friction coefficient) brake pads
- stainless brake lines
- high performance brake fluid (Motul RBF 600 or 660 is good, Castrol SRF is probably better but really expensive) to change twice a year at least
- track (higher friction coefficient) brake pads
01-15-2018, 04:12 AM
#46
Junior Member
Good question - the hand pump doesn't compress the ambient air enough to really cause a problem. But I'm assuming you're using a typical air compressor that pressurizes a tank to 100psi or more and then you are regulating the air down to 15psi. It's the compression to 100psi+ that is the issue. Have you ever drained your air compressor tank after use? I bet you get some water coming out of the drain (and rust).
https://www.thecompressedairblog.com...ressed-air-wet
Air / water separators are pretty cheap and also will help keep your air tools in better shape.
cheers
Marco
01-16-2018, 09:58 AM
#47
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2017 SQ5, 2012 C63 P31, 2001 Boxter S
Do these things really over heat after a short amount of time on the track??
01-16-2018, 11:56 AM
#48
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Unfortunately yes. Even when the ambient temperatures are low enough so that the car doesn't go into full limp mode, the oil temperature without the 44O package gets high enough (>120C) that the oil can no longer provide adequate protection to the engine, which then leads to other problems down the line.
01-16-2018, 12:14 PM
#50
Super Member
Cooling package 440 for C 63 AMG Results of the further development from inter alia the F1 AMG Medical Cars have led to the development of an enhanced cooling system for the C 63 AMG. In order to allow an even better cooling, high-performance coolers are applied in combination with an optimized air path which allow a reduction of the engine oil temperature while driving. Therefore, these measures can also serve the purpose of an optimized cooling of the engine while operating in the outer limit.
The cooling package includes the following changes:
larger front oil cooler lying
larger wheel arch cooler
custom air guides
Larger air intakes in the underbody paneling and wheel arch right
Custom oil lines for engine and gearbox oil
The cooling package includes the following changes:
larger front oil cooler lying
larger wheel arch cooler
custom air guides
Larger air intakes in the underbody paneling and wheel arch right
Custom oil lines for engine and gearbox oil
