Tom,

Have you taken any ethics class required by your profession? Do you not control your temper at all?

I don't have any complex. I simply dislike people who cannot carry on a civil discussion without losing manners. Just like how you dislike people who badge their standard Mercedes as AMG models.

Keep in mind, you were the one who first lost his temper in this thread. And now you wanted to compare our credentials? Have I ever attempted to make fun, belittle, or mock your trade/profession to begin with?

Plus, how the heck do you do your job as a CPA when you can't even control your own emotion to participate in a debate? Much less than working through the tax season.

If you question my comments and analysis, you're always welcome to read major case laws from any 1st year law student's Constitutional law class. If you're lost, then ask me and I'll give you some cites. It's really not that disputable that mis-badging a car is part of one's right to express himself. What's there to argue about?

If I had superiority complex, I wouldn't even have bothered to take the time to discuss this matter with you. Let's back track a little bit. This is what you have initially done in your mind:

Again, I had the decency not to expose it and instead, simply carried on a friendly debate with you. But you had to turn it into an ugly shouting match.

******
Tom's head:
Okay, I have a CL65, I spent a crap load of money on it. Now I am looking at a CL500, which probably is worth less than a third of my car's value. And oh God, now this guy's making others think that he has a car which is almost equal to the value of mine. Man, I'd better put him down and call him as a poser, in hope that he will take off the badge so that I can be more exclusive.
*******

Isn't it?

Who's the one with superiority complex here?

And lastly, as long as a civil discussion can be carried on, I am not going to have a problem if someone here chooses to put a fake Esq. connotation on his/her name. However, the law is going to have a problem with him or her.

For the Nth time, this is something called the freedom of expression. You called me on it. I admitted to posing but questioned your exercise of double standard and prejudice. You never had the ***** to admit it. What's not to get in this discussion?

Jon

 

I have 2 Benzes...one is an AMG-
If I debadge the AMG and rebadge my non-AMG vehicle will it make it faster?

 

Very interesting,

I get your point.

How does your ML55 compare to the standard CL in terms of performance?

Jon

 

What I don't understand is someone who takes the badges off to clean a line or remove chrome is telling you nothing about their car vs. someone who is misrepresenting what there car is. Seems clear to me someone wants no attention while others a looking for it.

 

Nice way to avoid the actual question. Let's compare my verbatim question with your response:


Would you be bothered if someone put a law degree (with their name on it) on their wall for all to see (mind you ...not saying they are a practicing attorney)...when in fact they didn't even go to law school?

Now your answer:

And lastly, as long as a civil discussion can be carried on, I am not going to have a problem if someone here chooses to put a fake Esq. connotation on his/her name. However, the law is going to have a problem with him or her.

See here is a tangible example of how you fail to read, comprehend and respond to a simple...direct question. You fail to read that, I already anticipated the question of legality by stating that the person was not espousing to be a practicing attorney. I made no mention of putting a fake esquire designation behind their name. Either you really don't have the capacity to answer it (which deep down I really do think you are intelligent...despite my rhetoric)...or you are so married to your position that you can not bring yourself to destroy your facade.

Amazing that Ethics classes = temper control. CLE training is very similar to the CPA profession's CPE (sometimes the same classes). Please show me where temper control is in the curriculum. Once again...a vapid argument...not really becoming of the intelligent person that I know is lying somewhere beneath. The funny thing is you can not discern between anger and someone who is actually trying to state his opinion. This probably isn't the best medium for this type of communication but once again you make presumptions and go full bore into attack mode.

You seem to be the one who is fixated on money. I am not justifying my position because of wealth or any of the other BS you just forked out. If you put a badge on a car to designate it as an AMG/Kompressor...and it is not...you are poser. Pretty clear cut. Just because you want it to be different...just doesn't make it so.... sorry.

Tom

 

In a way, everyone asks for attention. It's only the method of asking for it that differentiates one from another.

To be a successful advocate, I don't mind having the attention. However, given the fact that I already knew I would receive more negative attentions from AMG drivers than positive ones from others, I can only tell you that I've chosen to leave these badges on my car for no other purpose but to exercise my rights.

What I don't understand is why can't some people just leave me alone and let me be who I am and what I want to do?

Jon

 

Jon seriously...you seem like a nice enough kid, but cut the persecution complex. You keep on coming up with worse and worse arguments for why your not posing or a poser. Then you have the unmitigated gall to act like a martyr for freedom of expression. We are expressing ourselves freely and legally on the internet. No one is forcing you to take your misinformation off your car. I am not sure what being "left alone" means in the context of you freely coming to a forum where you can choose to ignore threads or even individual screen names. You have that freedom too...

Tom

 

Why are you wasting another few paragraphs just to prove that I am a poser?

Have I ever denied that I am one?

If you believe in being an angry CPA is not relevant to your practice of ethics, then be my guest. It's your boat, you steer how you want it.

You want direct answers?

Sure, go ahead and put a fake law credential on your wall. It's not going to bother me nearly as much as these little tiny badges have bothered you. And I am certainly not going to waste my breath commenting on what's done. After all, it's your wall and your choice to go to prison.

I made assumption that you had anger issues? As I recall I wasn't the one who used vocabularies such as being "dense", "in need to be rehabilitated", etc. What's with these personal comments?

If you are a man, just end this once and for all. Man up and just gather the ***** to say that you have been exercising double standard and were prejudicial when you called me a poser.

Jon

 

Are you sure you are a licensed...practicing attorney? You can't seem to delineate between having a law degree on the wall and the actual practice of law. You do know that not all law school graduates are licensed to practice.... don't you? How is having a degree on the wall tantamount to practicing law...if that were the case...why would each state have its own bar exam??? Like I said in my question...the person is not representing that they are a practicing attorney.

It is funny how you transferred the supposed anger on here to our professions. Me thinks you are angrier than I. Does that make you a bad attorney...no...unless you consider this part of your law practice. I certainly don't think of this forum as tax consulting. It is also telling that you obviously never worked for a top law/accounting firm. I have worked at a Big 4 accounting firm and have had many dealings with literally a dozen of the Top 20 law firms (just checked to be sure). I will tell you that there are dozens and dozens of partners at these firms who have zero tolerance for things and will strike at a moments notice (between attorneys...obviously not at the client) with diatribes (some pretty comical). Accounting firms are no different. Not sure where your real world legal experience is....but maybe you might be lucky to avoid such individuals.

BTW...I hope you haven't been wasting your "breath" on me...as I can only read the written word through this medium and can't actually hear your rants. Just a heads up.

I have no prejudice in calling you a poser..... this is your device to try to impune those who call you out for posing. Sorry...once again not buying into this.

Tom

 

Must you bicker with me about making a distinction of simply having a law degree on the wall and the actual practice of law? Where in my post did I use the word "degree"? I made a loose hypothetical by using the word credential, how much more clear do you want me to be?

Frankly, to be technical most lawyers not only have their framed law degree hung on the wall, they also have their State Bar certificate and other credentials such as their admission to various courts in the jurisdiction they practice.

The problem with your bickering is, other than taking more stabs at me with my professional knowledge, what does your question accomplish? This discussion is about badging and misbadging a car, and you're taking a little phrase that I made to make your own points. Just like a Jehovah's witnesses taking phrases out of the Bible to point out contradictions. Why?

Must I also comment on your punctuation or grammar to judge whether you're a competent CPA or not?

Go ahead and stick with your points. Put a bar number that belongs to another person and use it as your own. Would that finally satisfy your hypothetical? My answer is once again I don't care. I am not so narrow minded to an extent where it would upset me to see another person trying to be something/someone he's not. As a matter of fact, I would feel bad for that person because of the fact that he's never had the privilege to become what he had dreamed of.

Good. If you've had the experience with big firm attorneys, then instead of arguing back and forth with me, you could've simply asked them about whether my analysis made sense or not.

You know what your problems are? You not only refused to openly admit what I called you for, you're also trying to judge my legal competency when in fact, you're not even qualified to practice law at all. That's just straight up bullying, man.

Does one get mad when he gets bullied? Of course. And to an extent I am not saying I am happy to be in this debate with you, either. Anger control/management is the issue. No matter how upset I was, I don't think I have directly or indirectly made personal attacks on you, your profession, or your competency as a CPA.

Jon

 

Jon, Im far from the eloquent one of the group, but man u sure took it **** trying to be a bad *** with some cats smarter then you, this has been quite entertaining to watch so I guess a thank you is in order. Man this is just the action the CL section needed to get some views to it, haha. whats up fellow W215's

 

No one is more eloquent than another in this forum. Period.

Aren't we all entitled to the same thing?

You're right. In a way it wasn't too smart of me to have spent all these time trying to make my points.

If I ever made any gesture to suggest that you or anyone else are anything less, then I'll man up and acknowledge my faults. It's more attributed to the heat of the moment than anything else. Not that it's a justification or anything.

Honestly, to everyone here. I wish I had the privilege to drive an AMG Mercedes. And believe me, I will eventually buy one for myself. But you can rest assured that if there's ever going to be another "poser" thread, I'll never be the one who jumps on that wagon by sharing the laughter.

Jon

 

Jeez, I step away for a bit to catch dinner and a movie and look what happens - I miss half the fun!

Jon, I'm not sure I concur with your claim that none are more eloquent than others on the forum, but I might be biased.

Also, it sounds to me as though your making the act of using rational judgement a hate crime, a prejudiced hate crime. It's not. You could argue that lying is a form of expression, sure. But c'mon now, don't call me - or anyone else for that matter - prejudiced soley for excercising our judgement and finding it reprehensible. That's just silly.

It's frustrating, Jon. Some of the tightest logic in captivity, right here in this thread for all to see and yet you try to confound it with accusations of prejudice and non sequitors and illusions of persecution and so much else.

Bottom line is you're a poser. Our saying it doesn't make it so. Our disliking it doesn't make it so. Our sharing our disgust in it doesn't make it so. In fact, this has nothing to do with us at all. If a poser drives through a forest and no one is there to see him, he is STILL a poser. Don't attempt to cloud the issue by drumming up accusations of prejudice, anger, and loftiness. Clearer minds will see right through it.

-V

 

Hahaaaaaaaaaa! What's up to you too, buddy. You know, I was thinking the same thing. Judging from the post dates, this is the most through traffic this section's seen in a long time!

Well, I'm glad to see that something positive came from all this...


-V

 

Vendetta,

Yeah, I think you've missed the fun.

I am not sure I agree with you that I was formulating my replies solely on "act of rational judgment", either. Prior to being picked on, have I ever exercised any of my rational judgment on anyone of you? To me your definition of a rational judgment, even with the most modesty way for me to think of, is inconsideration at best.

I must state once again that I wasn't trying to cloud up the fact that I am a poser. Had the first response simply stated, "You poser, ", I may even have responded with a simple laughter. I am man enough to live with a little bias from others.

It's the attitude and expression from certain members that I had to point out as prejudicial. Less so with the word "posing" itself. Clearly, there's no doubt that from my observations, to some of you misbadging a car is considered to be the most egregious act even though it's nothing but a freedom for one to express his/her rights. That's fine with me if you are going to swear it by heart.

Frankly speaking, after all these years on the internet, I am simply tired of seeing myself and others being constantly picked on for badging our cars the way we want it.

If someone intentionally places a poser label on us, but does not have any proof that he/she exercise the same distaste for another form of expression (i.e. debading a car or badging an AMG model as something less), then that's a prejudiced opinion derived from double standard. What's so hard to admit that you're prejudiced? It's not as if it's you committing a crime or are acting unconstitutionally or anything. Your prejudiced opinion has nothing to do with hate crimes (Of course, when such prejudice is taken to extreme, it may rise up to that level).

Perhaps it's not my job or even my right to tell you what to do with life. But as a human being, I certainly pray that when we discuss a person's possession, particularly something that we as car enthusiasts all care about, we can all look at the good side and minimize what you consider the bad side of it.

I only asked some of you to stop being biased and take some fairness in consideration when expressing your opinions. I wasn't intending to say I was being persecuted. You probably have mistakenly drawn this conclusion from another member. For me to do so, I would have impeded the very right that I have been advocating, the freedom of expression that all of us are guaranteed in this country.

I have already made my concession in this debate. Now it's up to you to think about what a rational judgment really is.

Jon

 

Edit****

Didnt realize this was just for the 500 and 600's.

 

Jon:

The whole point about the degree on the wall is to provide an analogy of the type of posing that you are engaging in. Did you know that certain universities are suing those who falsely claim to have gone there on their resume? The universities are claiming damages to the "value" of their degree and are protecting "their" intangible property. Obviously, no one is going to sue you for putting a badge on your car, but it is an interesting parallel to the diminishing the value of the AMG marque.

I think we are partly down this path because of your use of incendiary words like "prejudice". No one likes the label of "prejudist" ... especially when it is completely unwarranted. I would concede that I have a vested interest in keeping AMG badges off cars that are not AMG's. Just as those afforemention universities have a vested interest...or any other litigant... so too do we AMG owners. Yes, we have a vested interest but it doesnt make us biased....and it doesn't iinvalidate our arguments in the least.

I am also not against adding badges. I am totally fine with people putting "V8 Kompressor" badges on a car that they installed an aftermarket supercharger...such as a Kleemann. I am also fine with 600 owners putting "Biturbo" badging on their 2003-2007 cars. That really shouldn't be considered posing (just as debadging isn't) because it is not representing yourself as something it is not. That really is the dividing line. I am sorry you feel that I am bullying you.... it was not my intention. But please stop with the:

I must state once again that I wasn't trying to cloud up the fact that I am a poser. Had the first response simply stated, "You poser, ", I may even have responded with a simple laughter. I am man enough to live with a little bias from others.

My first response really was simple and to the poitn...go back and check. Making that statement is somewhat disingenuous.

Good luck and enjoy your car.

Tom

 

Tom,

That's the stuff I was hoping to hear from a guy like you. Not something like, "are you sure you are a licensed, practicing attorney?" Or, "what kind of law school will graduate guys like you?", or "Your analogies have now exposed that you lack basic logic", etc. These mockeries were completely uncalled for.

Plus, as much as you have some wonderful work experiences including the ones with top 20 big law firms as you've cited, you have to understand that these "experiences" are not always something exclusive to just a person.

If you must know, even when I was a student I had interned for the "biggest law firm" for the purpose of this discussion. That would be the U.S. Attorneys Office. I also passed the California Bar on my 1st try. Therefore, notwithstanding the fact that you disagree with me, please don't mock my analysis as if they make zero sense or attack my knowledge of a profession that I practice. It's really upsetting when I was in fact, trying to make a valid point to show why it's really not an egregious act to mis-badge a car.

My two cents:

I practice criminal law and therefore, I don't keep track of civil cases.

However, from a constitutional law analysis, the universities you cited may have standing to sue for damages because these false representations arguably have directly caused harms and damages to the school's academic reputation.

By hanging a fake degree on the wall, these people are essentially using a false degree to gain confidence from their clients and customers. This false confidence will inevitably cost their clients economic damages. Therefore, they risk being sued in a court of law. Had I used the V8 Kompressor badges to gain membership to an AMG exclusive Club, or try to sell my car as a supercharged model, then arguably I'll face the same problem as well.

As an AMG owner, your vest interest may or may not entitle you to have standing to sue the mis-badgers for diminishing the value of your vehicle. The truth is even if I misbadge my car, it'll be awfully tough for you to prove that because of my doing so, the market value of your vehicle has diminished. It'll probably be even more impossible to prove that because of an act of mis-badging, the public will suffer from any type of economical harms at all.

Furthermore, thus far I have yet to see an AMG poser being sued in court for such matter and therefore, I can only assume that your analogy has yet to be approved by the court.

Based on your responses, I don't think we'll ever come to an agreement that mis-badging a non-AMG vehicle is a politically correct thing to do. That being said, I don't think we'll have to beat on each other's head to prove our points, either.

I did not intend to use the word "prejudice" to incite angers for the purpose of this discussion. It's not as if you're a racist or a hater in my opinion. To me, prejudice is something that's more visible than most of us realize. Just check out the chicks. Some of them would rather carry a genuine LV bag with its tag removed than a fake LV bag. And they too, make a big deal of those who wear fake bags and on the other hand, don't mind their own de-tagged LV bags. Wouldn't that be a form of prejudice too?

Either way, I'll dwell on what you said and who knows, I'll probably either take these badges off someday or simply get a supercharger for the fun of it.

Jon

 

what I find funny is that you think tom recruited us to "have his back" in pointing out that youre posing. Did you notice that we all drive CL's? I can assure you that if I recruited anyone to come to this thread, you will find out that we were actually being very nice to you in this process.

 

I initially only stated that I noticed both you and him are from the same town. You then admitted that you are from the same city and that you actually know Tom, correct?

It’s true that some of you are directly and indirectly responding to each other’s comments about mocking me, right?

If Tom didn’t incite any of you to participate in this discussion, were you intentionally and willfully putting me down for what I believe to be a freedom given to each and every one of us? Wouldn't that make the situation even worse from a fairness standpoint?

But anyway, that’s beside the point for now.

The point is, do you understand why I took the time to discuss all these comments about posing? It's because of the mentality you've just suggested: "we were actually being very nice to you in this process".

Do you actually believe that what I did was prohibited and by simply calling me out and mocking me as a poser, you are in fact condoning me what I have done by being nice?

The way I see it is, if I were in your position even if all the others are having a laugh at it, I would've just have left this entire discussion alone as is. Why make an effort to impose on others (even if it's only one person) what you believe if everyone else has the freedom to do what he/she wants with his/her car?

Jon

 

Oy Vey....

 

See fellas, you gotta know when to just take your pound of flesh and move on... After expending enormous amounts (by forum standards) of what risked being Sysiphean effort, I took Jon's last volley to me as well enough to be left alone. And this from a guy named Vendetta.






...I'll stick around just in case though.
-V

 

If a man's got to go down, how about going with some dignity?

I am looking for some Cadillac emblems. And I suddenly have this urge to take the "De Ville" badge and stick the letters "De" just in front of the Kompressor badges on my car.

I shouldn't be reading anymore F Us from anyone of you by then, correct?

It may just be the most honest badge in the entire universe!

Jon

 

I want that 20 minutes of my life back please.....

 

And I want picture posting back in a picture thread...