Stanley59

Why is a good question and more importantly your in Sweden. It's not like you can use it most of the time with the countries driving restrictions but to each his own.

Last time someone said "Trust Me" they were about to give up a load of BS. Not saying this is the case here but I'd choose my words more closely.

I can see there's been some really good advice given by a few, even if it was a bit arrogant. I've got to agree, unless you're ready to do a whole lot of internal work. I'd also agree, "I'd be a bit more conservative with your attempted power output." I believe someone already stated, "a new engine was in the $16-18K range."

Sounds like some sound advice.

JoeNobody

M133 has fully forged internals. So it should be good to go even at absurd boost levels.

Stanley59

No sorry they're not completely actually. AMG rates the maximum boost pressure at 28 psi. Anything more, requires copper or stainless ringing the top of the cylinder to hold the additional pressure. The gasket surface won't hold a sustained pressure of over 28 psi in an over boost situation. Rods and rod bearings are not stressed for continued operation over 28 psi, not to mention the crank pins which need to be welded up. Twisting a crank is a major consideration with any major upgrade in boost pressure. Heat and detonation is another major consideration with additional boost pressures. A really good methanol injection system, is a must to keep combustion in control. There are no provisions or systems available for the M133 at this point.

The added boost pressure, requires additional work to sustain longevity of the engine. To many "if's" involved when you start raising boost pressure beyond 30 psi. Additional fuel deliver, pressure and much larger injectors are major upgrade requirements, just to mention a few. The OEM fuel rails won't deliver enough fuel or pressure for optimal combustion. There are just to many limiting factors with the ECU in the M133 engine. Some of this has already been attempted by aftermarket manufactures without any success.

It takes some major understanding, knowledge and engineering to make a high pressure turbo engine run efficiently with any longevity.

Talk to any AMG certified Technician and they will tell you the same.

tekfoc

Yea sure there are limiting factors with any engine just a lot less with this motor.
Lack of aftermarket products .
Give it time .

Just take a look at the old ej motor from the STI now that motor had many many limiting factors just look at all aftermarket parts are available. Lots of possibility's available for Subaru .
Again give it time for the aftermarket company's to take this AMG MOTOR and future upgraded motor under there wing

Stanley59

Wouldn't give a good crap for a Subaru!

There just won't be that much made available as the AMG production is limited and not everyone will purchase one. It's kind of a rare bird among tuners and aftermarket manufactures, even after two years. Prices for aftermarket parts will be overpriced and stay that way do to limited availability. Development will be slow and very limited. Anyone who jumped on the band wagon has already and there won't be much more other than bolt on performance parts.

Internals are a whole different story.

The Subaru STI is a totally different bird. You see them on nearly any street and it's a racer boys dream. It was built for the masses. The GLA45 AMG wasn't and it's that affordable either.

vaelin

You might be forgetting that the A45 exists outside of the US, and has been driving the aftermarket development outside of the US pretty rapidly because it's quite popular with the boy racers outside of the US.

All in all, the A-series has been a runaway success for Mercedes, and the sheer volume of A/CLA/GLA AMGs will drive the aftermarket soon enough.

tekfoc

take a trip to the big city's in NY LA ands so on you do see quite a bit of them.
for what I paid for my 45 AMG I could of easily purchased a c63 but what lures me in is the 4matic and having a 2.0 under dog engine doing amazing things. what ever floats your boat.
do not knock on Subaru cause this is one of the main reasons why Mercedes said yes to the 45 AMG .
it generates mass of interest to the youth of the world who normally would never look at Mercedes. the old man car.
Mercedes has won a very very large young population with the cla gla and A class A45.
this is what Mercedes needed and got . HOME RUN


A lot of us 45 AMG owners have very good relationships with aftermarket parts company's so keep sleeping your thoughts about aftermarkets not being available.
just the sales on regular cla 250's and A class vehicles is plenty of interest for the aftermarket to float the parts for the 45AMG .
tons have been sold.
The STI is very very similar to the 45 AMG in almost all driving behavior.
had a very modified 07 STI purchased new for years .

tekfoc

thank you

soolman32

To add to what Vaelin and Tekfoc have already said, this platform is getting more and more attention from tuners. There are a decent amount of options overseas already and more tuners stateside are jumping in. Proper turbo upgrade options are just around the corner with Weistec leading the charge. AMS has also recently joined in and given their background, it won't be long before they get into the engine internals and gearbox itself (if needed). They are already set to release cooling upgrades this fall along with a tune and downpipe. Wonder why that is.... Clearly building blocks for a full on Alpha package down the road.
And since "limiting factors" keep being tossed around... the engine and gearbox or turning up boost pressure isn't as much of a big deal as people are making it out to be... AMG technical data sheet shows the current gearbox and engine are designed to handle up to 700 ft/lbs TQ... something to think about.

Stanley59

Whatever your little heart wants to believe. You know people believe there's aliens and big foot too.

I'll repeat it again, "I don't give a good crap about a Subaru!" Really seriously, they're two totally different automobiles. It's a throw away overpriced rice burner!"

I'll talk to you in another two years, when the plethora of make believe accessories doesn't transpire and what's available is to much too for most to afford.

By-the-way, Mercedes doesn't care about Subaru. They don't follow any Japanese manufactures lead and never have. They're just not into the rice burner mentality.

Why would I want or need to come to New York? New York is not indicative of the rest of the country. In fact most NY'ers are so out of place in the rest of the US, it's why they stay in NY.

??? Who's allot? You speak for yourself and maybe one other NY'er, maybe! So you're a majority in yourself?

tekfoc

Thanks for your response it's exactly what I expected . LoL

Stanley59

Don't flatter yourself, you can't even provide an answer or response to the a simple question put to you. I knew I was talking to a ricer just by the way you responded. NEXT!

I think you mean 700 nm which is (520 ft lbs) of torque that's what is posted by AMG. In terms that you might understand, that's 200 ft lbs more then the current torque the M133 is making ( 332 lb-ft of torque at 2250 rpm.). In reality, 200 ft lbs additionally isn't as astronomical as you might believe. You might want to re-read your information and think about it yourself.

Oh my word I just realized, "I'm attempting to have a cognitive discussion with the un-informed." Oh and you're welcome!

soolman32

If you're going to be full of yourself, then at the very least know your material. I'll leave this here. 1000Nm = 737.6 ft lbs

Stanley59

Full of myself no, just full of you and the crap you're attempting to lay down. You're still totally uninformed and that's the problem with stupid!

soolman32

Oh c'mon. If you're going to troll, you can do better than that for an answer to try and discredit my post. You were so eloquent earlier, this basic "oh no, you're wrong" type answer is disappointing lol

Stanley59

It's not worth the argument with someone who really has limited mechanical intelligence and can only cut and paste from the Internet.

Trolling is attempting to cause undue argument or aggravation. You can't have an intelligent argument or conversation with someone who is incapable of having one.

The M133 engine isn't able to produce or handle 1000 nm of torque and I don't care what you do to it. Nuff said and I don't care what the transmission or clutch pack is rated for. You really need to understand a bit more about what you're talking about. The problem is quite obvious. It's simply your lack of overall mechanical and engineering knowledge.

Go attempt to convince someone else with your nonsense.

soolman32

Definitely a better attempt. Yet I can't help but notice that none of the condescending statements you keep making go beyond the basic "no you're wrong because I'm so smart and I know everything". Not interested in convincing you, I've backed up my claim with data beyond " because I said so". You claim to not be able to have an intelligent conversation or debate, yet all you're able to do is personal attacks, rather than provide an elaborate argument with supporting data. I could be wrong, but I'll venture and say you have no engineering or scientific background. The first thing you're taught is to back up your claims with evidence. "Because I say so" isn't evidence the good news is, you're likely never going to meet anyone you've been talking down to, so you can continue with the tough guy who knows everything act. It's actually quite entertaining

JoeNobody

Perhaps the there's a stipulation that a 1000nm usage would need some minor configuration changes (new clutch packs, different tuning, who knows what else).

But if AMG says the gearbox can handle 1000nm, then I would tend to believe them.

Stanley59

You still haven't provided anything that could substantiate your original claims. So no, I don't really want to engage with someone who really doesn't know what they're talking about. Stupid people generally entertain themselves quite well without any assistance and you ought to listen to yourself more often.

I don't need a scientific background, it's simple mechanical engineering. Keep talking, you're eventually bound to swallow your foot completely without anyone's help to boot..

On the contrary, no one has personally attacked you, you're doing a good enough job on your own. I simply stated you have no idea what you're talking about. If that's a personal attack, then you have far more personal issues to deal with then just an inferiority complex.

I'll say this once more, you have no idea what you're talking about and because you can cut and paste a document, (oops you screws that up too in the beginning with attempting to post a link that didn't work), doesn't mean you have the capacity to understand. I didn't even quote you but you felt it necessary to answer for someone else and do it in a condescending manner. (Feel even more stupid now!) Refer to post #60 bonehead! So now, you've simply reverted to being condescending, just as you did in your first comments. As they say, "one good term, deserves another." so here's your sign. Now if you have nothing else to add that actually bears any weight or has bearing on the original comments made then; "don't go away mad, just go away!

You're a big boy, think what you want it's your right but it just doesn't make it so.

So, what's the transmission got to do with the M133 engine output, which is still the original general topic of conversation? It's a know factor at present the engine isn't able to handle much more than it's designed for without internal modifications, which I've already commented on. You on the other hand haven't provided anything in line or in rebuttal to these comments or statements. Doesn't matter what the transmission can or can't handle. If the engine is incapable of producing it in present trim, it's simply irrelevant.

At least attempt to stay on topic, instead of trying to justify your incapability to comprehend with some off the wall arbitrary information. Nuff Said!!

soolman32

This is an interesting response. You obviously have all the answers. Didn't realize post #59 offended you so much. The engine in its current form with the help of aftermarket support is currently able to output 401 whp and 425 wtq. You shouldn't have any trouble converting that to crank HP and TQ given you're smarter and more in the know than us un-informed folks.

Why does the transmission and what it can handle matters? Because it has often been perceived by forum members as one of the limiting factors. When in fact, it's rated by AMG to be able to handle twice the stock output. If the engine can be made to output that amount of TQ, the tranmission failing isn't a concern. At this point, we'll simply agree to disagree.

the argument was never over the need for supporting mods for the engine to generate a considerable higher output. Every response you've gotten to post #53 said the same and pointed to the aftermarket support and growing interest the M133 platform is getting. You don't believe such support exist or will materialize over the next 2 years to quote you. That's perfectly fine.

The OP got impatient and is obviously trying to push the limit all on his own. It's admirable and as most here, I'm looking forward to the outcome. Some of us who are more conservative are waiting for the likes of AMS, Weistec, Renntec, Rebellion, Eurocharged ( just to name a few) to offer a solid package to increase the power output similarly. Post #59 did nothing more than state that fact.

There was 2 ways you could've handled being corrected and you chose to persist in your ways. Most likely because your ego won't let you admit you could be wrong after addressing everyone else as being inferior to your great self. As I stated before, no one here knows you, nor cares to. I'll go on with my "off the wall arbitrary information" and you keep on enjoying your GLA45.

PS: given your vast knowledge on the M133 and mechanical engineering in general, it would be great if you could help the community by designing and releasing some supporting mods. You know just in case the make belief tuners I mentioned don't deliver. And I do apologize for taking comments such as the bold text to be personal attacks, good chat

P3T3

Guys quit picking on poor old stanley, he's obviously right. I mean how many times has he said so?

shaunee

I would suggest that no one really knows 100% what is the failure point of our engine components. Hats off to the OP for going down this route, and trying things.

I'm starting to take a similar route, having just moved to a Stage 2 conversion (ECU remap, exhaust and induction) which has enabled me to achieve 451bhp at the crank.

It's big blower time now!

soolman32

I've been reading through your thread in my spare time. Not yet caught up but lots of good info. Looking forward to your results.

overboost

3 things to say

1, holy SH&#! Stanley59, you are part of the reasons I cringe every time I log into the forums. Every time I try to find updates or new info I run into posts like yours. Its like you guys have a gang. and all you do is go around on mercedes forums trying to **** people off.
Pompous douches like yourself are the reason the mercedes community is trash.

2, soolman32, give the aftermarket world some time to catch up.
I also plan to make all sorts of performance products but the whole tuning thing is holding everyone back. We need a good reliable way to flash through obd2.
like OP, I plan on running a huge turbo very soon... just need a way to tune

and finally, back on topic, Rannestig
do you think you could post up some pictures of the setup? interested in seeing the manifold design. also, are you running a external wastegate? post some pics!!

Stanley59

It's trashed, as people like yourself can't stay on topic or control their personal outbursts and obscure opinions. So I'm a pompous douche (personal attack but I won't report it) but I suppose one knows what one is akin too, right!

No one asked for your off topic comments and I surely don't give a crap one way or another. It's trolls and personal attackers like yourself, others can do without. 13 posts and you're already making personal attacks. Looks as if you're exactly like one of those you cringe at and you're referring too!