david_101

Nebraska99,

sorry, if my writing seems bloated. an antiflatulent or dramamine may help...me, that is. ;-)

a single word often replaces many more. just attempting to be succinct.

perhaps i'll omit the vowels, a la .sms...
LOL

david

david_101

lucycat,

sorry for the apparent intensity, but i promise the prose is much more intense than am i while writing it.

generally, i understand meanings quite well, and believe i wasn't mistaken.

where did i appear even moderately defensive? i may have to adjust my writing...

please notice that the discussion really isn't about the car, but rather the logic of and basis for certain statements relating to the car.

thank you for acknowledging my opinion about the 209.

the GF...she argues every day, and usually wins handily. (we've had only two or three arguments...ever.) she thinks this discussion is funny as can be, rolling her eyes when appropriate. and she knows my demeanor while writing this stuff -- quite calm, demonstrated by rhythmic breathing and timely exhalation. inhalation is another story altogether. but thanks for your, um, concern. ;-)

really, all, i'm just engaging posters who try to take me to task personally for simply stating my opinons in what i hope are fairly impersonal ways. no ill will or hard feelings, okay?

now if you'll excuse me, the time is drawing near for a real-world, practical argument that may indeed become heated. better break out the cuff to check my BP in advance. ;-)

continuing to wish you all the best,
david

Stiggs

Hey david...this is a little off topic but important none the less.
Do you have any pics of your girlfriend.....you never know...never hurts to ask!!

Oh yeah.....I think the style of the w209 is two fold.
The front is great, the back end is crappy.
Thats it!

david_101

Stiggs,

agreed about the 209.

and why, my friend, would you care to see the GF's image, other than for some salacious indecency? ;-)

do you think you know her?

david

Eich

Your opinion that the majority views the 209 negatively holds no more water than our opposite opinion.

Everyone who's seen my car in our parking lot, the only CLK out of 100+ cars, has made extremely positive comments. Seriously, not one negative comment, including from those who enjoy being negative. My local dealer said that he can't keep a new CLK on his lot. They sell as soon as he gets them.

From what I've experienced so far, it seems like former MB owners tend to prefer the older style W208 CLK while those who haven't owned an older generation CLK (or any MB) tend to prefer the W209. It doesn't bother me who likes what but that has been a common pattern in my experience.

Predator

I am realizing that this debate is a controversial one. I mean we can go on and on about which car is better. So my conclusion to this discussion is; everyone is entitled to their own opinions and no particular car is better. Happy? David.

Also one thing, I hope you don't talk like the way you write, because if you do, you sound a little like Cliff Claven from Cheers.
Cheers!

david_101

Eich,

my grey matter i believe is leaching into my hair, causing me inability to recall whether or not i ever wrote:

"...the majority views the 209 negatively..."

tiring rapidly from the labored exertion of my many postings, i care not to search for that phrase or any fragment thereof.

regardless, i do agree that my opinon is no more valuable than is yours. please note that i clearly label my support as other than empirical, and as such isn't conclusive. so we are in accord there.

as for reactions to your car, i think that's super.

re: your reference to a specific dealer's comments, i can say only that i repeated with fidelity was told to me by an MB exec and that i don't doubt your account.

Eich, catch you later.
david

david_101

Predator,

aren't debates really just controversies playing out within a framwork of rules?

i believe i haven't labelled either car as better. rather, i offered that i preferred the 208 based strictly on styling.

yes, as i've written and alluded to so many times before, i believe we're all entitled to opinions.

happy david? i never was unhappy, Predator. this isn't emotional engagement for me; it's just a discussion without winner or loser. just communication for the sake of appreciating thoughts and opinions. that's all it is.

"Also one thing, I hope you don't talk like the way you write, because if you do, you sound a little like Cliff Claven from Cheers."

i realize that your last comment may be a soft-edged jab, but i must ask why you've continually made personal unflattering remarks about me, but haven't definitively addressed the substantive issues at the root of our chat?

why attempt to discredit and marginalize the messenger when the message is the substance of the debate?

have i ever initiated remarks in any way about your writing, your psyche, or anything at all remotely personal? i think i haven't. instead, i've stayed on point, working on your claims.

regarding this cliff, having watched CHEERS infrequently because it's so pedantic (KIDDING!)...

Predator, live long and prosper, dude.

david

Stiggs

Hey it was worth a shot...maybe she is hot??

Its just the thing I do!!

david_101

Stiggs,

what you do? you mean troll?? LOL

while a pic must remain out of the question, i can write with utter sincerity that with regard to her, i'm one hell of a fortunate guy.

let your imagination roam freely; that's where you'll see her. and she's everything you could imagine.

david >>> {:-]

clkguy

as they say "ONE MANS TRASH IS ANOTHER MANS TREASURE" this might be fitting for the 208/209 contraversy and opinions on girlfriends

david_101

clkguy,

i'm contnually surprised by people who set bait for responses while claiming they're ending a discussion.

if you'd really intended to facilitate an end to the so-called controversy -- although my debate was about the integrity of what were called "facts," not the car itself -- then you wouldn't have made that GF-related comment, which clearly was intended as a parting shot at me.

well, the shot missed.

besides, the GF dialogue was a side chat between Stiggs and me, and is very far off point.

i've got to laugh about your erroneous inference, though. if only you knew... LOL.

Nebraska99

David.....are you really Frazier Crane?

IMazz

Anyone with a thesaurus can use belabored speech...

Eich

I'd say you got off pretty easy in here. Think for a moment, about the treatment any one of us would get in the W208 forum if we had the audacity to litter it with comments such as, "The W208 is uninspiring, hardly thrills the eyes and looks like a Cavalier" - and THEN.... when the responses started flying, we exhibited a thin-skinned and defensive reaction.

This has been an interesting couple of threads David but please don't act suprised by any of the responses you've seen.


OK, I'll do it for you.... David_101 quotes:

I think those statemens can be boiled down to, "The majority views the W209 negatively". In your opinion !

david_101

Nebraska99, no i'm not FC, just a cheap imitation of that icon. ;-)

IMazz, my thesaurus resides in a strong cup of coffee usually served up at or just before dawn. (i won't bait you with directed questions regarding your own thesaurus.)

Eich, but i am truly surprised by the pesonal nature of the comments. please note that i never mentioned the cavalier; that was someone else. as well, i've clearly written that my opinions are my own and that any substantiating evidence i have is ONLY anecdotal, meaning unscientific. and had you visited the 208 board or the amalgamated clk55 board, i'd have written civilly. on that you have my word, if only because guests are honored in my home...as long as they pee INSIDE the pot, flush and return the seat to horizontal. ;-)

my friends, catch you all a little later in the day.

david.

Eich

C'mon David... a little slow on the up-take this morning ? I was simply turning your comments referring to the W209 being similar to looking at a Camry, into what one of us W209'ers might say in the W208 forum, if we had the same intentions that you have shown here.

david_101

Eich,

you attibuted first the cavalier comment to me and second the camry comment.

dude, two strikes... who's slow on the up-take? (;-)

being a somewhat curious kind of fellow, what intentions have i shown?

actually, please belay that question. to avoid an onslaught of scurilous speculation, i'll say that i just came over to visit for a pleasant, lively chat. guess i should've brought a gift!

my disdain is for MB corporate alone. their penny-pinching and poor planning isn't doing us any service. and speaking of service, they're doing an awful job of regulating their service centers. have i got true stories...from rotating tires on my clk430 (forbidden) to not notifying when a tire was at the end of service life (although tire inspection is on the scheduled service checklist...and FYI the tire blew on I95). really, very chrysler... and speaking of chrysler, how about the crossfire having sl/slk styling elements and clearly recognizable parts? even a feature or two named just as is in the MB lines?

it's called brand dilution. they definitely are pouring weakerning drinks and charging premium prices for them. but yet again, just my opinion.

getting my drift?

back to work i go. later!

Eich

I never attributed the Cavalier comment to you. It was my coworker who make that comment after looking at a picture of a W208 that I showed him. Again, I simply took statements you made about the W209 and a Camry and turned them into a similar statement that I could've made in the W208 forum using a Cavalier instead of a Camry.

I never said you were the first person to suggest the Camry inference. You did however, agree with that person's assesments:

Originally posted by Eich:

Response by David_101:
So, no strikes for me today Dude !!

You tell me... Visiting a W209 forum, describing the car 90% of us own as "uninspiring, a return to the generic "been there and done that" body, hardly thrills the eyes etc.. when no one asked you for your opinion.

One of the threads was created to ask people here for recommendations on other CLK sites. You never offered any suggestions but so graciously provided your opinion of why the W209 doesn't deserve any message board traffic and why you instead chose the W208. Smells like bait for a heated debate.

Eich

Someone mentioned this word in one of the posts. This probably doesn't describe your intentions exactly but it's probably not that far off either...

Troll
An outrageous message posted to a newsgroup or mailing list or message board to bait people to answer. Trolling is a form of harassment that can take over a discussion. Well meaning defenders can create chaos by responding to trolls. The best response is to ignore it.

Also, the person who posts such messages.

david_101

Eich,

please tell me that you're not trying to take me to task for the troll comment i passed only to Stiggs...

you must know i was kidding around with Stiggs, who out of nowhere asked for a post of my GF's pic because, to paraphrase, it's what he does.

if i offended Stiggs, then i'd gladly apologize to him.

regarding posting on the 209 board, Eich, is possession of a 209 a necessary and/or sufficient condition for unimpeded access to this board? seriously, i'd very much like to know your thoughts on that.

your CLK cousin, david.

sjclk

I love this thread it really lightens my day.

david_101

sjclk,

glad to be of service.

david

clkguy

well i dont know what kind of creature you are, but that was a general comment but theres another saying that goes "IF THE SHOE FITS WEAR IT" you come off by blowing your sunshine up our ***'s with your praise for the 208, and then criticize the 209 well thats all fine and dandy, if you had as much brains as you come off that you have you would have known some response was going to come your way, and your comment about "if you only knew" well i can tell you i may not know **** about your chick, i can tell you that after 16 year with MERCEDES BENZ i am much more educated in the merceds topic than you can EVER hope to be, so take some medication and get a life

david_101

clkguy,

first and foremost, if you don't write scripts, then you should consider
trying because those lines sounded as if they'd come from lethal weapon or die
hard or something similar. really good stuff! i mean it. i know a fine,
reputable entertainment attorney out there -- and one in NYC too, though i
haven't been in touch with him for a few years -- if you need the contact.

now to the academic part of this response...

i won't compete with your notion that you know much more than i about MB in
particular. you may; you may not. i will say that my first car as a teen was
my dad's 280 which required more than a bit of tinkering. all but two of my
cars have been MB or BMW. and it's been a few years more than 16. but that's neither here nor there, right? it's the depth of your knowledge, not the
period over which you accumulated your knowledge that really matters. true?

of course i believed i'd receive responses. i said outright that i was looking for lively chat. i hadn't counted on what seem like genuinely hostile,
personal responses.

why? because we're talking about CARS, not your family members, not you, not
some dangling pride and joy that gets polished every day or two.

so who here is doing the flaming? and who here really needs to get a life,
medicated or otherwise?

and again, why is it that there's nary a substantive response? just
overwhelmingly personal criticisms?

FYI, i think the 209 is superior to the 208 in most every way but appearance.
(strictly an initial opinion because i haven't spent much time in the car for
reasons you know.)

but if you care to wage attacks for my impressions, then you probably can tell
that i've been up for the challenge. still, why you continue to pound for an
opinion really does stymie me.

so here's the big Q:

if i get a 209 -- 320, 500 or 55 -- then will you still pound on me for my
thoughts, be they good, bad or indifferent?

i mean, how many of you are for polite, honest chat, but only when it's what
you want to hear?

david

p.s. what kind of creature am i? priceless!