Flap Control, without remote
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
Likes: 453
From: Germany
AMG GTR
Flap Control, without remote
Hi,
Remote flap Controlls. Two things bother me. I don't like extra remote controls. You have to find it first, if necessary. :-)
Tip:
If you have homelink in the rearview mirror (3 buttons on the underside) you can also teach it in permanently.
Should also go in the USA with European remote frequencies.
Operation via existing switches would be nicer.
Most just want something louder "sometimes". :-)
The very quiet mode would also be important for me. (Cold start in the middle of the night in the parking deck, bank robbery, heir aunts, :-))
That would also be feasible here.
Second:
Has anyone ever thought about, what happens if you load properly, with the flap closed? Yes, the flap stays closed.
n my opinion, the flap should automatically open again after a certain load. And closed again.
Know a Flap control module that not have both disruptive factors.
It is activated using the stock ESP button.
(Exchanged ideas with the company owner. Nice guy. Better and now possible : Limiter switch)
Open / closed via the stock flap button.
When the flap is closed, the module opens automatically at 4000 rpm.
No remote control. Everything controlled via existing control elements.
And it's plug in.
No, I don't get any commission. This module convinces me.
I did not install this module. Since I need more functions, for other and secret reasons :-) have to build my own.
If I bought one, it would be this one.
Best regards.
Stenzel
Link:
CETE flap control
Translation:
Our flap module is connected plug & play in your vehicle and can be retrofitted at any time without leaving any residue.
Exhaust flap control via the original switch.
The following functionalities are given via the Agility Select menu:
You can still use the flaps via the button for your exhaust system, but with the addition:
When the button is activated, the flaps are now permanently / fully open and not only when the engine is running high.
If the button is not pressed, the flaps are completely closed. This also applies to the cold start phase.
This means that you can also drive off in the morning if necessary, without having to bother the roommates.
Innovative features Protection of the motor (safety function) Full load journeys with closed flaps can lead to damage, so our module opens both flaps for safety from a speed of approx. 4000 RPM in order to relieve the engine.
Temporary module deactivation using the original button. Would you like to temporarily activate the factory control for the upcoming trip?
No problem: Hold down the ESP button until the ESP-OFF message appears in the speedometer, then press the ESP button again without delay to deactivate the module.
The operating status, whether the module is active or inactive, is saved and is retained even after the car is restarted.
Remote flap Controlls. Two things bother me. I don't like extra remote controls. You have to find it first, if necessary. :-)
Tip:
If you have homelink in the rearview mirror (3 buttons on the underside) you can also teach it in permanently.
Should also go in the USA with European remote frequencies.
Operation via existing switches would be nicer.
Most just want something louder "sometimes". :-)
The very quiet mode would also be important for me. (Cold start in the middle of the night in the parking deck, bank robbery, heir aunts, :-))
That would also be feasible here.
Second:
Has anyone ever thought about, what happens if you load properly, with the flap closed? Yes, the flap stays closed.
n my opinion, the flap should automatically open again after a certain load. And closed again.
Know a Flap control module that not have both disruptive factors.
It is activated using the stock ESP button.
(Exchanged ideas with the company owner. Nice guy. Better and now possible : Limiter switch)
Open / closed via the stock flap button.
When the flap is closed, the module opens automatically at 4000 rpm.
No remote control. Everything controlled via existing control elements.
And it's plug in.
No, I don't get any commission. This module convinces me.
I did not install this module. Since I need more functions, for other and secret reasons :-) have to build my own.
If I bought one, it would be this one.
Best regards.
Stenzel
Link:
CETE flap control
Translation:
Our flap module is connected plug & play in your vehicle and can be retrofitted at any time without leaving any residue.
Exhaust flap control via the original switch.
The following functionalities are given via the Agility Select menu:
You can still use the flaps via the button for your exhaust system, but with the addition:
When the button is activated, the flaps are now permanently / fully open and not only when the engine is running high.
If the button is not pressed, the flaps are completely closed. This also applies to the cold start phase.
This means that you can also drive off in the morning if necessary, without having to bother the roommates.
Innovative features Protection of the motor (safety function) Full load journeys with closed flaps can lead to damage, so our module opens both flaps for safety from a speed of approx. 4000 RPM in order to relieve the engine.
Temporary module deactivation using the original button. Would you like to temporarily activate the factory control for the upcoming trip?
No problem: Hold down the ESP button until the ESP-OFF message appears in the speedometer, then press the ESP button again without delay to deactivate the module.
The operating status, whether the module is active or inactive, is saved and is retained even after the car is restarted.
Last edited by Stenzel-Germany; Nov 24, 2021 at 04:20 PM.
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
Likes: 453
From: Germany
AMG GTR
Hi,
Sure. If the module was activated before parking, or is activated before start,(2 x Limiter) and the stock flap button is on "Loud".
Then the flaps are completely open, always and forever. :-)
Best
Stenzel
When the (stock flap) button is activated, the flaps are now permanently / fully open ......
The operating status, whether the module is active or inactive, is saved and is retained even after the car is restarted.
Sure. If the module was activated before parking, or is activated before start,(2 x Limiter) and the stock flap button is on "Loud".
Then the flaps are completely open, always and forever. :-)
Best
Stenzel
When the (stock flap) button is activated, the flaps are now permanently / fully open ......
The operating status, whether the module is active or inactive, is saved and is retained even after the car is restarted.
Last edited by Stenzel-Germany; Nov 24, 2021 at 05:57 PM.
Junior Member
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 55
Likes: 15
From: Buda TX
GTS, GLE63S, G55
Hi,
Remote flap Controlls. Two things bother me. I don't like extra remote controls. You have to find it first, if necessary. :-)
Tip:
If you have homelink in the rearview mirror (3 buttons on the underside) you can also teach it in permanently.
Should also go in the USA with European remote frequencies.
Operation via existing switches would be nicer.
Most just want something louder "sometimes". :-)
The very quiet mode would also be important for me. (Cold start in the middle of the night in the parking deck, bank robbery, heir aunts, :-))
That would also be feasible here.
Second:
Has anyone ever thought about, what happens if you load properly, with the flap closed? Yes, the flap stays closed.
n my opinion, the flap should automatically open again after a certain load. And closed again.
Know a Flap control module that not have both disruptive factors.
It is activated using the stock ESP button.
(Exchanged ideas with the company owner. Nice guy. Better and now possible : Limiter switch)
Open / closed via the stock flap button.
When the flap is closed, the module opens automatically at 4000 rpm.
No remote control. Everything controlled via existing control elements.
And it's plug in.
No, I don't get any commission. This module convinces me.
I did not install this module. Since I need more functions, for other and secret reasons :-) have to build my own.
If I bought one, it would be this one.
Best regards.
Stenzel
Link:
CETE flap control
Translation:
Our flap module is connected plug & play in your vehicle and can be retrofitted at any time without leaving any residue.
Exhaust flap control via the original switch.
The following functionalities are given via the Agility Select menu:
You can still use the flaps via the button for your exhaust system, but with the addition:
When the button is activated, the flaps are now permanently / fully open and not only when the engine is running high.
If the button is not pressed, the flaps are completely closed. This also applies to the cold start phase.
This means that you can also drive off in the morning if necessary, without having to bother the roommates.
Innovative features Protection of the motor (safety function) Full load journeys with closed flaps can lead to damage, so our module opens both flaps for safety from a speed of approx. 4000 RPM in order to relieve the engine.
Temporary module deactivation using the original button. Would you like to temporarily activate the factory control for the upcoming trip?
No problem: Hold down the ESP button until the ESP-OFF message appears in the speedometer, then press the ESP button again without delay to deactivate the module.
The operating status, whether the module is active or inactive, is saved and is retained even after the car is restarted.
Remote flap Controlls. Two things bother me. I don't like extra remote controls. You have to find it first, if necessary. :-)
Tip:
If you have homelink in the rearview mirror (3 buttons on the underside) you can also teach it in permanently.
Should also go in the USA with European remote frequencies.
Operation via existing switches would be nicer.
Most just want something louder "sometimes". :-)
The very quiet mode would also be important for me. (Cold start in the middle of the night in the parking deck, bank robbery, heir aunts, :-))
That would also be feasible here.
Second:
Has anyone ever thought about, what happens if you load properly, with the flap closed? Yes, the flap stays closed.
n my opinion, the flap should automatically open again after a certain load. And closed again.
Know a Flap control module that not have both disruptive factors.
It is activated using the stock ESP button.
(Exchanged ideas with the company owner. Nice guy. Better and now possible : Limiter switch)
Open / closed via the stock flap button.
When the flap is closed, the module opens automatically at 4000 rpm.
No remote control. Everything controlled via existing control elements.
And it's plug in.
No, I don't get any commission. This module convinces me.
I did not install this module. Since I need more functions, for other and secret reasons :-) have to build my own.
If I bought one, it would be this one.
Best regards.
Stenzel
Link:
CETE flap control
Translation:
Our flap module is connected plug & play in your vehicle and can be retrofitted at any time without leaving any residue.
Exhaust flap control via the original switch.
The following functionalities are given via the Agility Select menu:
You can still use the flaps via the button for your exhaust system, but with the addition:
When the button is activated, the flaps are now permanently / fully open and not only when the engine is running high.
If the button is not pressed, the flaps are completely closed. This also applies to the cold start phase.
This means that you can also drive off in the morning if necessary, without having to bother the roommates.
Innovative features Protection of the motor (safety function) Full load journeys with closed flaps can lead to damage, so our module opens both flaps for safety from a speed of approx. 4000 RPM in order to relieve the engine.
Temporary module deactivation using the original button. Would you like to temporarily activate the factory control for the upcoming trip?
No problem: Hold down the ESP button until the ESP-OFF message appears in the speedometer, then press the ESP button again without delay to deactivate the module.
The operating status, whether the module is active or inactive, is saved and is retained even after the car is restarted.
Thank you,
Foo
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
Likes: 453
From: Germany
AMG GTR
Sorry, I don't understand the question. Do you mean can-bus protocols?
If so, I have absolutely no idea about it.
But I don't think you can address this directly.(No bus, on the Flap aktuators)
Note: Not yet tested on GT!!!
As far as I know, the flaps are controlled direkt by the ECU (1 wire -> ECU -> Flap aktuator, and its not a LIN Bus)
The flaps are controlled from ECU by pulling the control signal, against ground, via PWM.
PWM 100Hz
10% duty cycle = open
90% duty cycle = closed
In principle it works exactly like the input of an RC servo
Best regards
Stenzel
Last edited by Stenzel-Germany; Nov 25, 2021 at 05:45 PM.
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Joined: Aug 2008
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AMG
How does it work compared to ASR ? ASR is one time activation then forget about it. For this one , do you have to open the valves everytime ?
Real life scenario , I want "silenced" startup to get out of the house , then fully open on highway. But at the next startup I am at the track so I want loud startup.
How do you do this scenario with both controllers ? Do they differ in their use ?
Many thanks
Real life scenario , I want "silenced" startup to get out of the house , then fully open on highway. But at the next startup I am at the track so I want loud startup.
How do you do this scenario with both controllers ? Do they differ in their use ?
Many thanks
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2016
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From: Brooklyn, NY
2018 GT R; G82; M340
Exhaust is always ON and flaps are 100% open by default now. If you want a quiet start up you can press the Start Engine button once without touching the brake pedal, push the Exhaust button to turn it OFF and then proceed with firing up the car.
Junior Member
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 55
Likes: 15
From: Buda TX
GTS, GLE63S, G55
As far as I know, the flaps are controlled direkt by the ECU (1 wire -> ECU -> Flap aktuator, and its not a LIN Bus)
The flaps are controlled from ECU by pulling the control signal, against ground, via PWM.
PWM 100Hz
10% duty cycle = open
90% duty cycle = closed
In principle it works exactly like the input of an RC servo
Best regards
Stenzel
The flaps are controlled from ECU by pulling the control signal, against ground, via PWM.
PWM 100Hz
10% duty cycle = open
90% duty cycle = closed
In principle it works exactly like the input of an RC servo
Best regards
Stenzel
Foo
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
Likes: 453
From: Germany
AMG GTR
How does it work compared to ASR ? ASR is one time activation then forget about it.
That would be so, if you always wanted to be loud. And you have chosen or programmed the right setting.
For this one , do you have to open the valves everytime?
If the Cete module is activated, it remains activated. Whether loud or quiet is only dependent on how the org. flap-button is.
Real life scenario , I want "silenced" startup to get out of the house , then fully open on highway. But at the next startup I am at the track so I want loud startup.
How do you do this scenario with both controllers ? Do they differ in their use ?
Sure, the operation differs, a summary in detail. Now you can decide for yourself, what to press and when.
Remote flap control:
Find remote control. :-) :-) :-)
Press Loud Button -> Always Loud, flaps 100% open
Press original button -> original, controlled by MCU, inkl. cold start, flaps opens variable.
Press the Quiet button -> Always quiet, flap 0% open = full closed -> note ->
Driving under engine load with closed flaps is not recommended due to the high exhaust back pressure.
Be sure to switch back, with the remote control, to loud or original.
Cete, flap control:
Make a decision, once: :-) :-) :-)
Deactivate module permanently. -> press the limiter button twice --> original flap control by MCU, inkl. cold start, flap opens variable.
Activate module permanently. -> press the limiter button twice -->
If the original flap button is on loud -> Always loud flaps 100% open
If the original flap button is on quiet -> quiet 0% open = full closed -> up to 4000 rpm, then the flap control by MCU, like original, flaps opens variable.
Best regards
Stenzel
That would be so, if you always wanted to be loud. And you have chosen or programmed the right setting.
For this one , do you have to open the valves everytime?
If the Cete module is activated, it remains activated. Whether loud or quiet is only dependent on how the org. flap-button is.
Real life scenario , I want "silenced" startup to get out of the house , then fully open on highway. But at the next startup I am at the track so I want loud startup.
How do you do this scenario with both controllers ? Do they differ in their use ?
Sure, the operation differs, a summary in detail. Now you can decide for yourself, what to press and when.
Remote flap control:
Find remote control. :-) :-) :-)
Press Loud Button -> Always Loud, flaps 100% open
Press original button -> original, controlled by MCU, inkl. cold start, flaps opens variable.
Press the Quiet button -> Always quiet, flap 0% open = full closed -> note ->
Driving under engine load with closed flaps is not recommended due to the high exhaust back pressure.
Be sure to switch back, with the remote control, to loud or original.
Cete, flap control:
Make a decision, once: :-) :-) :-)
Deactivate module permanently. -> press the limiter button twice --> original flap control by MCU, inkl. cold start, flap opens variable.
Activate module permanently. -> press the limiter button twice -->
If the original flap button is on loud -> Always loud flaps 100% open
If the original flap button is on quiet -> quiet 0% open = full closed -> up to 4000 rpm, then the flap control by MCU, like original, flaps opens variable.
Best regards
Stenzel
Last edited by Stenzel-Germany; Nov 27, 2021 at 02:40 PM.
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AMG
Can do the same thing with the remote options (ASR,Renntech), I have my garage door buttons on my mirror programed to swap modes when needed, which is almost never.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
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From: Germany
AMG GTR
Thanks to confirm my post Nr.1. Much appreciated.
Its a benefit. No need/search for extra Remote.
But it also has the disadvantage that the homelink is occupied. I use it for my doors.
And the main problem (for me, absolute a "no go"), with closed flaps under load, remains.
Best regards
Stenzel
Last edited by Stenzel-Germany; Nov 27, 2021 at 02:39 PM.
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
Likes: 453
From: Germany
AMG GTR
Hi Foo,
I am in the process of building my own valve control.
Target: flaps controlled by MCU > 60 km/h (38mls/h) and > 3000rpm
We don't have to "invent" the same thing twice.
So far I have also worked out the necessary wiring and procured the required parts.
Let's exchange.
Best regards
Stenzel
I am in the process of building my own valve control.
Target: flaps controlled by MCU > 60 km/h (38mls/h) and > 3000rpm
We don't have to "invent" the same thing twice.
So far I have also worked out the necessary wiring and procured the required parts.
Let's exchange.
Best regards
Stenzel
Last edited by Stenzel-Germany; Nov 27, 2021 at 06:34 AM.
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Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 1,184
Likes: 891
From: Arizona
Bentley Continental GT; AMG GT
Hi Foo,
Sorry, I don't understand the question. Do you mean can-bus protocols?
If so, I have absolutely no idea about it.
But I don't think you can address this directly.(No bus, on the Flap aktuators)
Note: Not yet tested on GT!!!
As far as I know, the flaps are controlled direkt by the ECU (1 wire -> ECU -> Flap aktuator, and its not a LIN Bus)
The flaps are controlled from ECU by pulling the control signal, against ground, via PWM.
PWM 100Hz
10% duty cycle = open
90% duty cycle = closed
In principle it works exactly like the input of an RC servo
Best regards
Stenzel
Sorry, I don't understand the question. Do you mean can-bus protocols?
If so, I have absolutely no idea about it.
But I don't think you can address this directly.(No bus, on the Flap aktuators)
Note: Not yet tested on GT!!!
As far as I know, the flaps are controlled direkt by the ECU (1 wire -> ECU -> Flap aktuator, and its not a LIN Bus)
The flaps are controlled from ECU by pulling the control signal, against ground, via PWM.
PWM 100Hz
10% duty cycle = open
90% duty cycle = closed
In principle it works exactly like the input of an RC servo
Best regards
Stenzel
I would like to follow too, what you do for a control.
I am interested in the PWM, can you share the wire number out of the ECU?
If I am understanding the above duty cycles you mention - if 10% duty cycle is open, is any cycle needed, maybe for a startup test circuit?
I have worked with PWM signals in the past on other cars to control fan speeds.
All the Best,
Member
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 220
Likes: 89
From: Chicagoland
Schwinn
I am one of those guys that can work on basically anything on a car being that I did it full time for a while, but ask me to program a Home Link button and it takes me 20 minutes.
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AMG
Thats what I am saying, for me at least i dont need to program the home link buttons or anything. Plug and play, as long as i have "I" selected before i start up it makes instant smile at first bark.
I am one of those guys that can work on basically anything on a car being that I did it full time for a while, but ask me to program a Home Link button and it takes me 20 minutes.
I am one of those guys that can work on basically anything on a car being that I did it full time for a while, but ask me to program a Home Link button and it takes me 20 minutes.
Member
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 220
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From: Chicagoland
Schwinn
Now...if i can get off my lazy bum and find out why my right exhaust valve sounds like its actually "passing gas" that would be great, but I do have all winter to mess with it.
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
Likes: 453
From: Germany
AMG GTR
Hi Stenzel,
I would like to follow too, what you do for a control.
I am interested in the PWM, can you share the wire number out of the ECU?
If I am understanding the above duty cycles you mention - if 10% duty cycle is open, is any cycle needed, maybe for a startup test circuit?
I have worked with PWM signals in the past on other cars to control fan speeds.
All the Best,
I would like to follow too, what you do for a control.
I am interested in the PWM, can you share the wire number out of the ECU?
If I am understanding the above duty cycles you mention - if 10% duty cycle is open, is any cycle needed, maybe for a startup test circuit?
I have worked with PWM signals in the past on other cars to control fan speeds.
All the Best,
Due to the completly rebuilding my daughter's apartment, I will unfortunately not have the time to work on the GT, even in the near future.
The flap control runs a little drop by drop. So far I've only collected or searched for information and parts. That goes by the way.
Sure, I'll share my informations.
Info: Wiring , Flap Aktuators > MFD 05.2016:
Right:
Pin 1: 12Volt = wire 0.75mm² red/black -> front SAM, plug 9G, pin 5 = fuse f34 = 7.5A
Pin 2: Control = wire 0.75mm² white/black -> ECU, plug F (Car side), pin 54
Pin 3: Ground = wire 1.00mm² brown -> Ground point W48/1
Left:
Pin 1: 12Volt = wire 0.75mm² red/black -> front SAM, plug 2I, Pin 1 = fuse f35 = 5A
Pin 2: Control = wire 0.75 mm² white -> ECU, plug F (Car Side), pin 52
Pin 3: Ground = wire 0.75 mm² brown -> Ground point W6/1
Control is a PWM signal, pulled to ground. (Frequenz = 100Hz, duty cycle: 10% = open and duty cycle 90% = closed)
The PWM information is not verified. Will check with an osscyloscope, if build that in the car.
My plan, shown here in simplified form, is this:
Looping the two canal PWM controllers (switchable, open, closed) into the control lines.
In order not to produce an error message, the control output of the MCU should be terminated with a 1KOhm (should match) resistance to + 12V.
Provide the speed thresholds and engine speed thresholds with a Can-Bus converter and this switch them on or off.
The whole thing with 2 way relays. I understand that and find it reliable.
Tapping the org. Flap button via the LED control input.
Thanks to Hendrik Koster . He measured this signal for me. (9V to ground)
It still has to be checked to. Maybee there is a current loop.
Buy this parts:
2-channel 12V PWM controller. Very small. 1" x 1,5". With 3 Buttons and 3 Digit Display. Very comfortable.
MOS FET switch/Amplifier with opto coupler, 12V and 9V 2 x 2 Way Relais.
Also buy a special Can-Bus converter with 2 near free programabel 12V outputs:
1. > 60 km/h (38mls/h)
2. > 500 - 3000 rpm
(6 outputs would be possible, but can not programabel by myself. Can only send in, nice guy, friendly and fast)
The 2nd channel only starts at 500 rpm. My thought behind it: The hole circuit only starts to work, when the engine is running.
This gives the actuators time to check themselves. (They certainly do) and until the engine starts, the MCU is connected to the actuators.
Sure, buy the cete module and you're done.
But this way, can set the parameters myself and also expand them. -> Switchable blow-off valves. a.s.o.
Plan for blow-off valves is ready, parts are here, no time..... :-)
Suggestions, improvements, ideas, let's go ...:-)
Best regards
Stenzel
Last edited by Stenzel-Germany; Nov 27, 2021 at 04:58 PM.
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 564
Likes: 453
From: Germany
AMG GTR
Sorry, forget.
According to my informations, the actuator checks itself independently.
The control input wire is probably also used, as a feedback signal to the MCU.
Apparently by short-circuiting? The current is probably also monitored by the MCU.
This is reason for the 1K Ohm resistor to 12V.
I hope you understand me.
It is really difficult and exhausting to explain technical things, in not your mother language.
And certainly often, funny to read ..... :-)
Best regards
Stenzel
