Question for an/all of you out there. I just had the front struts replaced on my wagon, but there is a 7 inch gap between the bottom of the fender and the top of the tire.....

I was wondering if any of you guys could measure that gap to see how far mine is off....

Thanks in advance. Justin.

 

what spring pads are you running? shouldn't be too hard to check, with that wheel gap you could climb into the wheel well...!

 

Well, my car is lowered so I can't tell you what my gap is... but I can definitely tell you that's not normal.

If the only thing you changed is the struts, something is wrong. Are you sure they are the right part for your car?

 

I encountered a 124 sedan at one time when we replaced the front shocks and as soon as we're done it did have a very wide gap like what you've described. We suggested that the car be used for a couple of days, something like breaking-in the shocks, and after some time it achieved a "normal" height (just a little bit higher than when it still with a busted shocks).

I'm not saying it usually happens when you replace the shocks but I guess its worth trying this one out before doing anything else.

BTW, new shocks are Bilstein HD.

 

Post pics...for shats and giggles

 

G'Day to you all,

Not to take away from the ongoing discussion but, I have a similar query. here are the parameters:
1993 400E, 225,000 km, 225/45Z17 tires on AMG rims w/ET37. 500E swaybars front and rear.

At the risk of sounding too long-winded - Just replaced the stock suspension with H&R lowering springs (1.3-in front and rear) and Bilstein Sport shocks/struts. 13-mm spacers all around. Done alignment to find that only right front fender was seriously rubbing. Spent the weekend contemplating solutions (body shop suggested that with fender already touching the tire, rolling would be a mute point). This morning, replaced the shims with 18-mm for both rears and Left front, and with 23-mm for right front. Less rubbing, but it looks like the right wheel is out more than the left. Do any of you had any experience similar, and had any solutions? It looks like my choices may be limited to either ordering and installing the Euro-spec MB springs all around for the firmer ride quality I have been seeking at first place, or get another set of rims with a different offset. Puzzling part is why only the right front, even after staggering the shim thickness? Am I overlooking someting? Could there have been anything wrong with the installation (Evertything was installed at a shop that specializes in MB service/repair).

Appreciate any feedback. Cheers,

 

Recheck your camber....possible right side too positive ??

I'm running 225-40/18 on 8" ET35, similar drop with no problem.

 

RBYCC,
I will get that check asap. In the meantime, I just went back and took some measurements again, and found out that the right fender is still about 1-cm lower than the left one. Is there a way to establish either the new springs or the struts are defective on one side (i.e., just swap the components from the right- with the left-side in the front). I purchased all components from authorized distributors directly, so I would expect them to be on spec (dreaming?).

Cheers,

 

First, confirm that you installed 400E-V8 springs, not M103/M104 I-6 springs.

Did you install new shock mounts, along with new boots and buffer stops?

Were the buffer stops installed correctly seated to the strut?

Was the stop ring positioned properly?

 

I believe I have the right set of springs - H&R Catalogue # 29569-2 specified for W124 1993 400E/ 1994 E420. I even called H&R Tech support before I placed the order to confirm that I would not get a drop beyond 1.3" since I was not going for the real low-rider look at first place. THe springs were shipped brand new to a local distributor for pickup, and were not modified before installation.

New mounts, boots, buffer stops were installed (all original MB parts from local MB parts department.

The answer to the last two questions is "I certainly hope so" since the whole installation was done professionally at a shop that specializes in MB. Since the shop is closed till after Labour Day, do you think that there is anything that I can check for on my own?

Cheers,

 

At this point the best thing would be to wait until you can get it back to your installer.

You would have thought that they would have checked the height at all four wheels to see how it compared side to side.

Post the results...

 

I cannot put a finger between my fender and my tire...but I suspect THAT'S not normal either hahahaha

 

You don't know what you're missing.......

 

ZorroAMG,
I have few questions:
1. Did you have the fenders rolled (I can still see the definition of the fenders from the photos of your car, but I cannot tell if you had the flange/lip on the inside rolled)
2. Are you running at a negative camber setting on the front?
3. Is "Enzo the Benzo" 300E/E320 or 400E/E420?

Cheers,

 

1. No fender rolling
2. Rear, major neg camber. Front, nothing really big...
3. 300E

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't most car always higher on the driver's side(EURO or US)?

This being measured without any passengers, this is due to the compensating factor of a single driver weight?

That's what I was always told. When I use to lift and lower trucks or cars, I always measured the height and have always known the driver-side of any vehicle to be higher... Most alignement shops are also familiar with this.

 

It is reasonable that the driver side of a passenger vehicle may sit higher to compensate for the weight of the driver (and frankly it is very rare that I have a passenger in my car anyways). Also, MB maintenance document for W124 does state that there may be a difference of upto 15 mm between the right and left. What bothers me is that my 400E may very well be the car that is right at the edge of allowable tolerance for the height differential

To make things worse, when I increased the shim thickness on the right side from 13-mm to 23-mm, I may have caused a camber shift to positive, and that is probably what led to the fender damage (even though it was rubbing with basically no clearance it did not at least caused and serious damage). I was just too disappointed to see that the car did not raise as much as I projected, and cancelled the alignment appointment. Well, live and learn.

Tuesday morning, I will be going back to the shop. First I will have the right and left springs swapped (to rule out that one of the springs by a long shot out-of-spec), put the 13-mm shim back on the left side, and have the 4-wheel alignment redone. If this does not work, I will probably just order a set of Euro spec springs for E420 and forego the H&R route.

Thanks for listening/reading and the "Dime"

 

Well, just spoke to my mechanic and he says he did everything he could with the ride height, but it looks like the main cause of rubbing is the fact that my right front wheel is sticking out more than the left side. We verified that the springs are the same, and there does not appear to be any damage in the spring perch. Although he cannot measure, he believes that my right control arm might be damaged such that my right front wheel is sticking out. Once he told me this I recalled falling into a monster storm drain two years ago so hard that I bent my right wheels. The front wheel (a 17x8 Rondell #53, AMG replica) was damaged so badly that it was a write-off. The rear was repaired but not to my satisfaction). I even went back to my regular MB service and had the car checked out. Nothing was evident then. I am thinking if somehow the control arm was bent/damaged during that incident, it was not noticed because the car was riding high anyways. Now that it is low, it is obvious, and causing grief.

Any idea how one can tell if the control arm is damaged? Could there be anything else that may cause my right wheel to stick out (all four wheels are identical, and we swapped them around to test as well)?

I get a wheel alignment done on an annual basis, and I never noticed any uneven tire wear. How come a problem such as this can go unnoticed for so long? Also, my car tracks/drives straight and true, and it always did.

Finally, do I replace the control arm (I am told that a new control arm is about $1,000, but if there might be other factors causing this problem I will be throwing good money after bad) or say heck with it and go back to OEM springs (though even with the rubbing the car now drives so nice )?

Appreciate all the feedback as always.

 

I have read many times that some W124s can only run 215/45/17 tires on their 17” x 7.5” ET35 rims. Your ET37 doesn’t help much. In general, some cars seem to be able to run the wider tires and some cars cannot. The guys with 17”x 7.5” ET42 wheels seem to have the most success running with the wider tires. I don’t think it really is that uncommon to have some rubbing with 225 size tires. There are guys with even bigger tires and they swear they don’t rub, but it still is not uncommon to get some rubbing with the 225 size. I only have 205/55/16 tires on 16” x 7.5” ET37 wheels and I even had some rubbing with one set of new tires. The new tread was thicker and I would get a slight rub on the lower plastic cladding. By the way, my car is a 1995 E320.

I have also read on multiple occasions that the H&R springs drop the front more than the rear. It is not uncommon to run bigger pads in front and smaller pads in the rear. I would definitely not run different pads from side-to-side.

I have the Eibach springs. They drop the rear more than the front so often bigger rear pads are used. I have 1-bump front with 3-bump rear. My car is typically about ¼ of an inch different from side to side in the back and/or the front. My driver side front is a little higher and my passenger rear is a little higher. It is more noticeable now that it is lowered, since the smaller gaps make it easier to see the small differences, but I think it was always a bit different even with the stock configuration. I didn’t do as much measuring before the mods, but I did take measurements as a reference and the same differences were apparent before I installed the lowering springs. Just for the record, I also added the K-MAC bushings for rear camber adjustment when I had the rear pads increased to the 3-bump pads. My camber was -3 when the rear was too low with the 1-bump pads.

Depending where you are rubbing on the fenders, the AMG spacers might help. The spacers are more for rubbing at the lower plastic cladding, however, so it may not help if you are rubbing on the top of the fenders.

Final thoughts -
I don’t think you should go crazy with all kinds of tricky solutions. I bet it is more or less a normal situation and you just have to do a little tweaking to get it right. It is probably normal to have bigger front pads, by a 1-bump or 2-bump difference, with the H&R springs. I would go for a symmetrical drop in the front and rear. As I said, I have a 2-bump difference with bigger pads in the rear with my Eibach springs. I went crazy when my car came back too low in the rear with 1-bump pads at all for wheels, but it all worked out when I put on the bigger rear pads. It cost some money, but it worked out. I think you should also think about getting 215/45/17 tires. The 225s may just be too big for your car. Remember, some guys can and some guys can’t run the fatter tires.

I have just a little bit more to add, just in case you want to play with the pad thickness. I was told that a 5mm difference in the pad (1-bump) may translate to about a 7mm difference at the fender lip due to the geometry of the suspension.

 

I have also noticed that my 93 400E is lower on the front right than on the left. OE springs, nothing fancy. I thought there was soemthing wrong but it appears as though that is normal. Pretty strange though.

 

Brian, I found about an MB-sanctioned way to compensate for the difference in level, and actually implemented (it does work). However, the problem is that although both rear wheels and the left front wheel are well within their respective fenders, the right froint seems to be sticking out ever so slightly. We have checked the alignment a number of times, and the car rides great, straight, true, whatever you want to call it. I am just geting a new right lower control arm that will be installed probably in two weeks, and my mechanic believes that an unfortunate encounter with a monster pothole two years ago may be the ultimate cause. If this does not fix it, I will be going back to Euro-spec springs before I get the fender fixed and the car painted.

Thanks for the input. Cheers.