Hi all,

My first post is not a happy one. I won a bid on eBay for a black 2000 E430 4matic advertised in "absolutely mint" condition. The pictures on eBay looked good, but weren't detailed enough to really get any closeups.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...&category=6335

Anyways, here's what I got...

1) There is a stone chip in the middle of the windshield (about 1/2 the size of a dime) with two separate cracks developing from it. This is unsafe and needs to be replaced.

2) There are several deep scratches (near the gas tank about 1.5 feet long, in the rear, on the trunk, and above the door). The one near the gas tank is the worst of the bunch. The cars finish is bad, with minor scratches all over the car due to someone washing it with a stiff brush.

3) There are NO heated front seats as advertised.

4) There are NO floor mats as advertised.

5) There were 276 additional miles than listed on eBay.

Problems 1 & 2 are listed in the Bill of Lading as pre-existing issues...

I havn't taken a detailed look yet as it is dark now, but from what I've seen, I'm not that happy anymore... There's some other gotcha's, but I won't go into more detail unless someone really wants to know...

I'll be calling the dealer/seller tomorrow. Anyone got any advice...

Thanks in advance,

Wayne

I hope you used an escrow service if this was a long distance purchase. Also, didn't you think to hire someone to inspect the car?

I couldn't bring myself to buy a car without ever seeing it.

Good luck getting this straightened out

Escrow wasn't warranted, as eBay does provide up to $20,000 coverage if someone takes your money and doesn't deliver. Plus, the seller/dealer had somewhat good feedback.

As to the inspection, I was going to have it done, but was convinced by the seller that it would be a waste of money since the car was in "mint" condition. Plus, the photo's on eBay looked good.. Little did I know

I definitely won't buy a "used" car sight unseen anymore, no matter how good it looks on the computer screen. I rationalized that it was so hard to find the color and the specific car, that I let me defenses down.

Hopefully, others won't follow in my path!! At least the car will have a better home here in California (purchased from Connecticut).

Wayne

The option list has phone and voice activation but I don't see the voice recognition stalk on the right side of the steering wheel column. And where is the phone? I hope you can get some money back. Is there a deep scratch on the rear left side of this car? If so, it hurts me to see it.

John

Hi John,

The car does have a phone in the console between the two front seats. I havn't played with it at all, but looking at the manual doesn't show it has voice activation/control.

Yes, there is a deep scratch on the rear left side of the car -- it's worse than in the picture (now that I see it)... It's not nearly as bad as the one across the gas flap...

Wayne

You can always add the voice recognition but the scratches kills me. How can they call the car mint if it got keyed!!!??? I am getting freaking **** off even though it is not my car. I hope you can find resolutions. Good luck.

John

I hate to hear these stories about ebay (or any of the internet auctions for that matter). The problem is that there are alot of dishonest people out there, not the least of which are used car dealers. I bought a '00 e55 recently after seeing it on ebay. I actually went to visit the dealer and did the transaction off of ebay. There were many major misrepresentations on the ebay advertisement. I eventually bought the car and feel that i got a pretty good deal but i am still pissed off at how someone could have been taken deep on this car. I also learned my lesson long ago after being hit for $5000 on another ebay scam which we wont get into here. Moral of the story is: don't trust anyone and do your homework. Especially on a major purchase like a car. Just read the papers. Every day you see a new fraud game on ebay.

My Ebay purchase luckily went smoothly, but I did not pay for the vehicle until I saw her myself....

My $.02

Are you sure about the ebay coverage?? Last time I had a problem getting delivery on $35 item, I was told ebay covers up to only 2 or 3 hundred, less a $25 "processing fee".

F ebay. F paypal too.

Or was I mistaken?

The $20,000 fraud insurance (for non-delivery) is specific to eBay Motors -- not to anything else on eBay that I'm aware of.

Anyways, looking at it now with more time and better lighting, the main "keyed" scratch extends from the gas tank flap, through the rear passenger door, and into the front passenger door. Took it to a body and detail shop -- they the need to repaint the three panels and spend 4 hours buffing/detailing the car. They believe 85% of the scratches will buff out, but some of the deeper ones will need touch up paint. A total of $1,664.97.

Replacing the windshield with no name glass is $329, using dealer glass is $700.

I don't know what the missing heated seats are worth, missing floor mats, nor the missing voice control for the phone. Also, I noticed the cupholder won't close all the way

I've offered the seller/dealer a way out -- I'd eat my shipping costs ($1,000) if he'd take the car back and pay for return shipping. His counter offer was to refund $1,000 back to me.

That's it for now!!

Wayne

Unbelievable! $1000 refund for all the issues?

I might suggest $1000 for two guys to pay a visit to the dealer.

The mats might run $100 or so for the set from benzbin.com.

The cupholder should be fixable with some light oil.

The seat heaters? Not possible to retrofit, and originally at least several hundred $$ for the option.

VOice activation? Not sure.

I'd get the dealer glass if I were you. Resale MB w/o the MB sticker stands out for some reason. I assume you don't have the rain sensor wiper option?
Or, try one of the glass repair franchises. I once had them repair a full dime-sized hole and for $50 (covered by ins), they did a nice job.

I live in Greenwich, 20 minutes away from Stratford and would have checked the car out for you for free. Sorry about your situation. I hope it all works aout for you.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RBrenton88
[B]Unbelievable! $1000 refund for all the issues?

I might suggest $1000 for two guys to pay a visit to the dealer.

The mats might run $100 or so for the set from benzbin.com.

The cupholder should be fixable with some light oil.

The seat heaters? Not possible to retrofit, and originally at least several hundred $$ for the option.

The Seat Heaters CAN Be Done ..as a retrofit! I Did Mine with multicontour and Seat heaters..Using all mercedes parts!
Its Not Cheap...But Yes It Can Be Done!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MARK CUMMINS

Quote:
[i]

The seat heaters? Not possible to retrofit, and originally at least several hundred $$ for the option.

The Seat Heaters CAN Be Done ..as a retrofit! I Did Mine with multicontour and Seat heaters..Using all mercedes parts!
Its Not Cheap...But Yes It Can Be Done!

Yes, I'd imagine a serious amount of work there, what with the heat elements, wiring up to the dash, switches, and of course a new wood veneer faceplate, right?

Makes my head hurt!

wlum;

For myself, I would never buy a vehicle from ebay or anywhere else sight unseen as there are too many people who just aren't honest and have no problem taking advantage of you or the situation.

I am interested in what recourse you have with ebay, if any. If the auction states that the automobile is 'mint', is there recourse with the seller and/or ebay or is it the buyers' responsibility to inspect the vehicle before bidding?

Clearly, buyers and sellers can have differing views on what 'mint' means but it seems that any body damage such as scratches in the paint and chips or cracks in the windshield eliminate that terminology in representing the vehicle.

I certainly hope you post the outcome as to what rights you have as a buyer through ebay...

Being an eBay expert, here's what I suggest:

Sounds like you got some estimates to what it would take to get it fixed. Get all the estimates on paper. Document all your dealings, telephone conversations, etc. Then add it all up and tell this guy pay for it. He'll probably give you some lame offer like the $1000 one.

Rebut with 1) threaten to sue 2) threaten to report him to the State Attorney General in his state 3) threaten to report him to the State Attorney General in your state 4) threaten to report him to the Better Business Bureau 5) threaten to report him to the fraud division within eBay's SafeHarbor department 6) give him some well deserved negative feedback on eBay

He'll probably tell you to **** off and think your bluffing. But for a couple hundred bucks (which is not very much in the grand scheme of things compared to the price you paid for the car), have a cheap/hacky lawyer file a civil suit. Also follow through with steps 2 through 6. As soon as he gets the notice he's being sued, a call from the BBB, calls from the offices of both State Attorney General's offices, a nasty email from eBay's Fraud Division -- I would be willing to bet he would pay your bills without actually having to go to court. Especially since he looks to be a car dealer and most likely has been through similar deals and knows he doesn't have a leg to stand on.

This will take some of your time. But it will be worth it. Otherwise, everytime you go outside to your car, you will be pissed each time you see thoses scratches and know you don't have heated seats, etc. Good luck.

Good advice....

but in reality, the BBB is a toothless icon which mostly caters to the businesses that pay the membership dues.

And I would be quite surprised if any AG even gave a nod of the head to a dispute over vehicle condition.
I hope they would, but I seriously doubt it.

I would never buy anything on ebay, simply because all they have is USED, PREOWNED, or however you wish to call it, and unless you are able to see the product in person, you don't know what you are getting.
A friend bought a two tone Rolex watch for $3,000, and when he got it, it was fake. The seller is nowhere to be find.
For online orders, always buy NEW.
For used, always buy locally.
Just my 0.02 cents.

The dealer won't take the car back as he's already got a few on his lot. But, he's continuuing to negotiate with me. Since last I wrote, he had offered only $1,000 to settle. He's now agreed to replace (with dealer glass) the windshield, and reimburse me for the missing floormats. As to the damage on the exterior paint -- he's offering $1,000 to take care of that.

For the missing heated seats - They first claimed that it wasn't listed as an option on eBay. Then they claimed Mercedes didn't offer it as an option. After I clarified both inaccuracies to them, their position is that it was mistakenly listed on eBay as an option, and that since I live in California, I'd have no need for them. I informed them that I specifically purchased the 4matic since I go to Lake Tahoe a lot and the heated seats are important. It also gets cold in CA as well. But that doesn't matter, cause it was listed and they owe for that. Still don't have any offer on this.

As to the voice control/voice activation for the phone -- should there be a stalk or is there a microphone by the mirror for it?

Anyways, the dealer is now calling up body/detail shops in my area hoping to find someone to fix it for less money -- as they claim dealers get lower prices than individuals..

I had offered to settle with them providing the Windshield, floormats, and $1500.00 (for the paint and heated seats).

That's where we are at now...

Wayne

I see that the dealer has another black E430 4matic (with less miles). His advertisement now replaces "mint" with "beautiful"..

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...&category=6335

Right now, he does seem to want to resolve this issue and he does have a good feedback rating (and wants to continue it). We'll see..

Thanks,

Wayne

Thats good that he's coming around, but I'd still slam him on the feedback when all is said and done. Attempting to make a claim about the heated seats is an insult and proof of their lack of integrity. Nobody should be subject to those types of business practices.

Another thing, he probably can get a good deal on paintwork, but being pessimistic, I'd guess he'll get you what he's willing to pay for...cheap paintwork.
If it's cheap, it'll call into question whether or not the car was in a wreck if you go to resell it someday.

I'm not sure about a stalk in the '99s or later, but I have a '98, and my phone has a small round mike right near the windshield coming out of the headliner.

I agree with you, however you could buy from ebay brand new things. For example, I bought absolutely new charger for phone in my car. But I had too low loss, if it wasn't new or working.

Regarding used stuff, I bought MB CD changer from ebay and it was out of order. However, I could fix it myself spending 4 hours, so I do not consider that as good deal, since I could earn a new one for this time.

lol that pic of the LHS is hilarious. Anyway, sorry to hear about your bum deal on ebay. Car dealers are amazing sometimes with the things they try to pull. I'd make that guy pay the exact retail value for everything that wasn't on the car. RAPE him on the feedback afterward.

First, I can emphathize with your frustration. It sucks when something isn't what it seems. However, you did pay $30,400 for a car that retails for 37K. Furthemore, windsheilds can be repaced and scratches buffed out.

I am not justifying that guys actions. Just be realistic. A used car is - used. I have a chip in my front windshield as well. It suck, but that's pretty normal for 3 years of use.

Ask the guy to kick back $1000 or so for the heated seats and such and then fix the damages. Its not the end of the world dude. You still got an okay deal.

Also, you can always tell if a E-class has heated seats by the console. Its why when I browse Ebay I always look at the console. Unless there are two black switches on the ends above the HVAC - there are no heated seats. And that is clearly shown in this photo.

http://ebay-images.autotrader.com/im...J0YX031093.jpg

Andrew Plato

I was going to let this thread die, unless interest peaked. It's been very frustrating to say the least.. We finally reached a settlement, but the dealer hasn't performed so far -- its been over a week now.

My point being was the car was advertised in "Absolutely Mint" condition inside and out at least three times. It was also advertised with specific features. When advertised as "Mint", it should be "Mint" without regards for age or mileage. Mint is Mint.

If it was advertised as great condition for a 2000 Mercedes E430 with 53,635 miles, then I would have lowered my expectations and bid accordingly. Even at that, I wouldn't expect a cracked windshield, being keyed across 3 panels, and scratches all over with rock chips etc.. It was also missing some other minor things..

If a feature/option is listed -- they ought to have it.. It shouldn't matter whether I would use it or not. I paid with the expectation that its there and increases my resale value -- that's the bottom line..

I forgot to add that whoever owned the car before me let a dog ride in back. Apparently the dog chewed on some of the door upholstery in the back. Thats probably why they didn't show the interior of the back doors like they did the front doors. Dog hair still on the non-floormatted carpets. Good thing they detailed the car before shipping


Wayne