Randy B

The car had been doing so well, and semed to out grow it's gremlins. Full brake failure last evening. Made it into a parking lot and turned the car off and went outside to yell and scream. After five minutes of that, I re-started the car and everything was gone on the dash. Not a single fault code anywhere and the car performed as usual. Went to the dealer this morning out of fear of more failures. Technician brought up complete history from the car and turns out the car had brakes fail twelve times in it's full history. Main SBC pump had failed and needs complete replacement. I was told Germany had the part and this would be about a week to get it and one day to install it. We talked about the whole Shamu thing and FEDEX. After three phone calls and a couple of E-Mails the part will be here Thursday from Germany. After all that was settled I asked for an estimate of total charges. SBC Pump is normally $1900.00 plus labor. Since MB has been having problems with the system they offered to cover 75% of the failure cost for repair. Mind you I have 61500 on the odometer. Final cost to me will be $600 + or - a few dollars plus rental car for the week. Warranty on the work will be twelve months and unlimited mileage. I spoke with the girl at the Enterprise counter and she informed of a MB rate of $26.99 per day for a Chevy Cobalt. I called AVIS on my corporate account and they offered me a Taurus at $22.75 per day. Since Enterprise heard me on speakerphone they met teh price and gave me a Taurus as well for the same price Avis would. So now as I leave the Dealer, I am contemplating whether to keep the car and get something Japanese or maybe another German, or whatever. I then realize though this is the first out of pocket expense in 61500 miles I have had other then maintenance costs. I guess let's see what happens the rest of the year while the part is under warranty and go from there.

Randy B

C43AMG

I am renting one now.......$38.98 a day - manual windows,locks,mirrors, no floor mats,no trunk release.

sosh

No MB loaners at this dealership?????

SAguirre

Randy,

I am sure glad that you are OK and nothing was damaged. I do have a few questions though:

1st, How did the car stop after the warning showed up? Was the backup hydraulic system adequate or was it like everyone else described (underpowered)?

2nd, Did you have time to think of downshifting and/or using the parking brake?

3rd, When you said the SBC had multiple records of failures, was this stored on the onboard computer of the car or was it recorded at the dealer? Did these failures happen while you had the car but you never noticed, or did you buy the car used and it probably happened to the previous owner?

4th, Did this car have all the recalls preformed?

If you get to it would be nice to hear some of the answers to these questions since you do have a 2003 model and they seemed to be more trouble prone.

Thanks again,

Steve

StapleGun

I think I would blow a gasket if I had COMPLETE brake failure and had to spend a dime. I would write to MBUSA and explain the cost of a lawsuit if injuries had occured if the brakes on the vehicle they manufactured failed - especially if the dealer had these "issues" on record, just my opinion....

SteveBC16

Glad to hear that you are OK.

You might want to consider registering a complaint with the Feds. This the kind of information that should be compiled by the NHTSA.

Here is their link.

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

Jakpro1

Yeah, can you give us all the info you can on what it felt like. Wow, I am scared....this is a trip.

So no brakes at all or was it the hydraulic real week thing?

Man, was thinking of keeping mine long term, but I just don't know now.

Wow.

cte430

Jesus, this is scary ****. Especially seeing how I routinely will take my car out to some roads that are pretty devoid of traffic and hit 160 and above

Jim, I was also thinking long term but I don't know anymore. the more brake issues the more this car's resale will drop like a stone. I'm also thinking long term won't happen seeing how I stopped by my local Aston Martin dealer and saw the new Vantage V8 !! LOL Very nice. A little short on power. AAh, who am I kidding. My wife would freak if I got rid of this car. One of the ways I got her buy in in the first place was that it was a keeper and I would "never get bored of it".

CE750

So I have to ask the following...

A) How long have you owned the car?
B) Did you ever get the SBC recall performed on it?

DWP

1. Is the parking brake on the W211 mechanically operated, with cable connections to the rear wheels only?

2. Is the reason that they call it a "parking" brake, and not an "emergency" brake, because it's not safe to use for actually stopping the car? Seems I heard something like that about step-on-a-pedal "parking" brakes like the W211 has (and unlike the T-handle in my Datsun, or the the pull-up-lever in, say, a BMW 5-series). And in the event of SBC brake failure, what will stepping on the "parking" brake pedal do that's worse than running into the car in front of you?

... not that I would think to step on the parking brake if I experienced total brake failure. I would be 'way too busy crushing the brake pedal (seeking the magical elixir of non-SBC reserve braking) and soiling myself.

SAguirre

The main reason that the brake might be called parking brake instead of Emergency Brake might simply be that in German it is only ever referred to as a parking brake since most cars are stick-****.

As far as I know, there has only been one MB since the 1980s that has had a regular pull up brake like my Audi and BMWs have. That was the 190E. Either way, all MBs that I know of have a little cable operated drum brake in the rear rotors. So the rear wheels have two brakes each. Once is the regular SBC disk rotor and the other is a totally independent drum brake that is linked via cables to the parking brake pedal.

There is nothing you would damage if you stop with this brake. You do run a chance of overheating it and maybe even warping the drum/rotor, but that is about it. Both my 1991 300E and my 1988 190E2.3-16 specifically stated in the owners manual to routinely make a “gentle” stop using the parking brake to clean the friction track on the drum of any rust. The procedure on the 300E stated that you should drive at speeds around 30 MPH and then (with the release lever pulled) softly apply pressure to the parking brake pedal and use it to come to a stop. This will ensure that the shoes and drum will be clean and will grab well when you use it.

I suggest you give it a try when you are in a good place to try it. Also, start at about 15 MPH and remember to keep the brake release lever pulled so that the pedal will come back up when you release pressure off of it. This was recommended in the past, but I don’t know if it still is. Either way, you will notice that this brake is quite weak and you will clean the inside of the brake up.

Steve

GLOCK36

Glad to hear that you're alright. I would be "BS" if the SBC system failed on the car knowing all the talk, reports and lawsuits "pending" with Mercedes. I wouldn't pay a dime for any repair that was caused by there negligence to providing a breaking system that works or a fix for a known problem. This has been ongoing now for 2 years + and they have failed in a number of ways, one being that they haven't notified all those owners whos' cars are affected and those cars are still on the road. Ah.. Hello we are talking about human life here.. duh. 2. All owners of any of the models with SBC systems should be check out free of charge and if needed replaced with fixes that make the car safe to drive.

I for one had to go to my MB service center and ask in person if my car needed the fix, I was told it was and that I needed to schedule an appt. I was not sent a recall letter and If I didn't inquire, I would still be driving around with a faulty breaking system.. I have a 4 year old, a 2 year old and a wife.. MB to this day has yet to realize the impact of what this problem has on people's lives.

I still enjoy the car and find it to be a safe car but it is the little things like this that always make me think about what my next car will be.


2004 E320, Brilliant Silver, Driver Dyn, Heated Seats, Logic 7 MP3, NAV, Ingrated Phone, Voice Control, Split rear seats, 6 Cd Changer, Debadged

GearHead

I am so glad that nothing bad happened to you with this brake failure.

This is really scary .... at least to me and my family when it happened.

To this day, even though my car drives well, because of my brake failure experience, I refuse to take my car for long trips.

Can you have your MB dealership list you the time and date of the previous 12 failures? Maybe you have a recourse to recoup the cost for this repair

Good luck

Randy B

To answer your questions and others:
The dash turns an evil red and chimes and bells start squawking at you. The transmission goes into the next lowest gear and continues to do so as the speeds allow it, until finally you are in first gear. The transmission will not let you get out first gear after it makes it down to that gear. The hydraulic backup sucks! You will go unervingly straight to the fireawall to get the car stopped. Best to pump the brakes as you are now the power assist and vacuum buildup. When I pumped them they performed as old brakes would without a booster (Some of you may not know what driving without power brakes is like). All Brake recalls have been performed as checked by MBUSA and the local Dealer. The 12 failures were receorded in the cars blackbox, and not on the dash MFD. Parking brake worked fine, just remember you have set it so you do not burn the brakes after you finally get to a low speed.

I have never experienced a failure before this. The technician explained that if the system had a failure for a nano-second and then reset, it would record the failure in the blackbox only.

Randy B

CE750

WOW! So this car failed WITH the recalls performed?

Maybe it's something totally new?

Also, did I understand you correctly, that the transmission automatically downshifts thru the gears until it's in first to slow the car? That's pretty smart if so!

ATS

The new B Class has a pull up brake. Just so you know. I have rec'd that car as a loaner twice when taking in my C class. Although the outside is kinda' cute - it really should not be a Mercedes. The brakes I honestly honestly are unsure if they are anti lock. I had to stand on the brakes and I slid... and slid... and slid.. Awful.. Now in my E-Class I would have stopped instantly and safely.. It is awful to hear that this is happening with people here in the forum..

GearHead

When mine failed, didn't recall the transmission shifting gear. When the dash lit up and I realized that the backup brakes was PIECE OF JUNK with repeated forceful pumping to no avail, I started downshifting manually w/o over-reving the engine.

If you can, try to get the date stamp for the previous SBC failures from the 'blackbox'. Hopefully that can be use for your reimbursement for this repair.

Spartan

Welcome to the MTD club.

You knw what that is? Mercedes Test Dummies. We even paid for that exalted prevlidge.

You know what, when I decided to get a new replacement, I thought it was an extremely rare event. Now I am not so sure. I'll tell you one thing, I wouldn't do it today.

Glad your okay......

Spartan

When mine failed all I remember is going to extreme panic for half a second and then driving around pedestrians and light stands. It wasn't "fun".

FlintCDI

If an event is recorded in the Black-Box and is not substantial enough to cause an error on the MFD is this something that the dealer check for when doing routine service? Could a print out of the recorded events (not just SBC events) from our BB be generated? If so this may be a precursor to an eventual failure of the SBC (or other components) and the repairs could possible be made before a tragic event takes place.

On a side note I purchased this http://www.mercedestechstore.com/w211.htm and it provides a comprehensive description of the entire SBC system, error codes, and demonstrations; also has a wealth of information the vehicle as well. It is FS as it doesn't have any information in regards to the CDI