55fanatic

hmm isnt the lexus competitor to the E class a FWD, HAHAHAHA HAVE FUN WITH YOUR OVER PRICED CAMRY

tbone

What options and condition?

tbone

I think the GS is a closer competitor to the E-class. The GS comes either RWD or AWD. The ES, IMO, is a competitor to the C-class.

VTBenZO

The 2003 E500 options:

Sport package
Voice command
Telephone
Xenon


No Nav, sensors.

45k miles
Asking price : $28k

Good deal?

jangy

I'd stay away from the '03s, unless you just can't afford a newer one. If you go with an '03, check into all the records and make sure it was not a lemon that was traded in rather than sold back to MB.

tbone

Assuming the car's in good condition, looks like a good price. But make sure the car isn't having any of the electrical gremlins that many owners of the '03 model year experienced. Keep in mind that your warranty runs out in another 5K miles.

NCE500

Roybenz,

Not sure what part of the country you live in, but in North Carolina $34K would be your car in "average" condition with no options and around 35K miles. "Clean" is $37K, "XClean" is $38K, these values are all without options.
This is right out of this week's wholesale "Black Book" used by dealers at auctions.

You don't state what condition your car is in, the mileage, or options, but $34 is probably on the lower end. I would try to get the "clean" number if you are trading for a new car. I also agree with the other posts that the retained value on the E is above average for the industry today. Yes it depreciates, and the $$ number drops are higher because it costs more than the average car, but proportionately it is better than the norm. Lexus does not hold it's value any better, it is actually worse for most of the product line, particularly the glorified Camry edition.

Sorry you are so unhappy with your 04; for what it's worth my 05 has been flawless in it's 1st year. While I am considering trading up to an E550 or E63 later this year, it will be because of how good my 05 has been and my love of horsepower and torque.

I definitely think the E cars have gotten better. You might want to reconsider and try a newer one.

Best of luck.

jangy

Since he "claims" a sticker of $64ish, it must be loaded??

boylston

I see that my dealer is now selling 06 E500's for $10,000 off sticker. The E500's have depreciated more than E320/E350's. Just look at the residual values on the leasing thread.

I've seen 2004 Maybachs being offered for under $200,000. That's $50,000 per year- now that's a big hit.

I've leased my last three cars. I'd rather pay as I go than take the big hit upon tradein.

zoink

Not always true... Hyundai also lost quite a lot... LOL

Beat this (in terms of percentage, not absolute dollar ). Bought 1989 Taurus in 1996 for $1700 out the door... 1.5 years & 30K miles later sold it for $2900.... no maintenance incurred other than oil change 3x & a set of used tires $10 each

Now, that's one hell of an investment, right? ROI = 71% from a CAR!!!! LOL.

Roybenz: I think you should try to find one like that.... not a Benz for sure... but it's a good investment either way.

slk55lvr

I had an acura tl that I bought used for 16k and proceeded to drive for 6 years and 135,000 more miles. Even at 163,000 that car traded in for 3k so it cost me about a dime a mile in depreciation. never needed anything but oil, tires, and plugs and still felt like a great drive at 165.

Will a Mercedes, BMW or Audi give you the same reliability/ value experience? Not a chance, but I'd still buy both tomorrow over another acura or (god forbid!) Lexus. They aren't even close to the same in driver enjoyment.

ajm0824

I don't think anybody has mentioned about some of the reasons that the dealer offers so much less then private sale. Varies greatly, but your trade in amount will knock down the purchase price on your new vehicle and lower the amount of taxes paid on your new. I don't know about anywhere else but here in NY taxes on 35,000 is over 3,000 of tax savings. Plus its been my experience dealers scrutinize much less on the condition then the private buyer. Just have to ask yourself if its worth the time money and effort to prep & sell yourself or just trade in. Often dealers will work with you on the trade in to make the sale, so never take the first offer either.

revstriker

This is a good point and should be considered. Here in Texas, the state tax is 7.5%. If you "trade in" your car, they deduct this amount from the purchase price of the new car, and that is the taxes you owe.

So using the beginning example of 60K car with a private value of 38.5K and a trade in of 34k, and considering the purchase of another new car at 60K, here is the difference:

Sell privately and get $4,500 more for you car but owe taxes on the total 60k (at 7.5% this would be $4,500). Trade in and owe taxes on only 26k (at 7.5% would be $2,550). So the true value of the private sale over the trade in would only be $1,950.

One other thing to note is that state taxes paid on your car may be tax deductible on your federal taxes.

CombatBenz

Im in the car business.. and thats just the way it is..


Trade in Value sucks on ANY car.. period.

from GM - Saturn- Aston Martin


thats just how it is..


cars dont hold value.. even if in prestine condition.


PParty is the way to go, if u want to get rid of it.

roybenz

I did not post to whine. It never ceases to amaze me how personal these replies and responses get.
I posted for mutlitple reasons.
1.
Many check these boards before purchasing cars. I wanted to post to a public forum essentially how MBUSA has simply refused to handle a problem car as it should have.
2. To see whether other owners have had similar experiences and could poossibly give some tips in dealing with this.
3. It is important for big companies to know that when they do something like this it will be reported in public forums.

I am quite aware that members of these boards are MB enthusiasts and therefore will be 'protective ' and supportive of the marque. This is not a 'my country - right or wrong' issue. This is an issue about a car company that advertises itself as a great one that makes the best cars and then fails to back it up when they make a bad one. I said this before -any car company can produce one that is a ' lemon'. It is how they back it up that makes all the difference. My personal experience with MY CAR and the reputation MBUSA has with lemon law attornies under these conditions is lousy. This should be made public. I have been and currently am an active member on other car boards. This one seems to have the least tolerance for anything negative said about it's brand. Like I said before , if yours is a good one and performs as advertised- then you are happy. For those with experiences like mine- you are not. I still do not see the reason for personal attack. But, for those who do so, if it makes you more secure in your car buying decision- then- have at it. At the end of the day nothing will change the fact that MY PARTICULAR car is a lousy car. And the way MBUSA is handling this IN MY CASE is lousy as well. Flame avway if it makes you happy.

CombatBenz

I agree with you.. each to his own.. get rid of the thing if you dont like it.. I personally love my benz.. wouldnt think of trading it in for the world.

revstriker

Well, you've got 21 posts, and every one of them is an attempt to blast the Mercedes brand. You also attempt to "make public" claims that are completely false, such as the topic of this thread; that the depreciation value of Mercedes is high. You have to expect that when you make a claim on a board which is really just your opinion, it will be countered. I think it's clear when one reads this entire thread that your initial claim about depreciation values has been debunked.

As for your issues with MBUSA, well again, I have seen the same complaints made with every car company. Every car company will fight a lemon complaint. That's why they have lawyers. It's unfortunate that your car turned out to be a lemon (if that's the case), and it's fine to post info about the status of your case. But when you start making bogus claims, such as repeating your lawyer's opinion that Mercedes is the worst company to deal with, they will be countered.

And again, believing a lawyer is not really smart considering that they pretty much lie for a living. There are countless ambulance chaser ads on TV all the time, and they all claim that they are the best at getting the most money. Now they ALL can't be the best, can they??

zoink

Never have any intention to take this personally... but you certainly confuse some members. From your original post, it appears that you were complaining about depreciation, not the quality.

Depreciation vs. how MB backs their cars for potential lemon is two different stories.

Depreciation:
This is not determined by MB. It is affected by the quality of the car but most of all the demand. It's econ 101. Let's say you buy a trouble-free car that has zero maintenance but no one wants it because it's ugly looking. For sure, the depreciation will drive you crazy. No demands... the price will go down until someone thinks it's good enough to buy.

On the other hand, if you have a car w/ lots of problems... but somehow everyone wants it.... the depreciation will be minimal.

Of course, in reality, it's in between... but the basic is still the same - supply and demand. All MB could do is to make a desirable car - quality & image. This is merely to keep the demand for both used and new car up but MB or any other companies cannot directly influence the demand. Consumers dictate the used car price, not the manufacturers.

Lemon:
Been there done that.... when I was in your position, I also went through hell. But it is somewhat understandable. If MB always buys back any cars w/ minor problems, it will go bankrupt pretty soon. So naturally, there will be tremendous resistance from MB.

Now, it seems that you are complaining both. Dealers are not stupid... they know if cars have gone through repeated warranty work. They would of course try to minimize the risk (put yourself on the dealer's shoes). Private party on the other hand may not know it, hence, higher price.

Plus, if you think you can get MB buy your car back, why would you trade it in? Why don't just hang in there and let your lawyers do their job?

If you think you won't win, well, just consider it as bad luck. You'll get some of your luck back next time.

avb777

That is not true. I've lemoned 2 of my cars with no problem with MB. Didn't even have to go to trial.
MY buddy had the same thing.
You are just mad at the world my man.
If you had the best law firm and a case you would be driving your lexus by now.

2K6E55

boylston

Make sure you get the extended warranty.

DavidNJ

34k for a 65k sticker is 52%, low for a luxury car, where closer to 60% would be hoped for. However, MB has been hammered on reliablity, especially important in the used car market where your car will soon be out of warranty if it isn't already. The Lexus has an excellent reputation for reliablity, a benefit in this market. Also, a pointed out, down around $30k, mileage becomes important. We are now talking about cars that cost $6k per year instead of $10-12k per year.

A not on mileage, an '05 CDI is worth about 10% more than '05 E320. 3-4x what difference in price was then.

johnlovescar

Cut your lost and move on. Stay away from GM, Chrysler, and Ford "Junks " You will be much happier with MB, BMW, or Lexus.

This is just my $0.02.....................

revstriker

Yes, but he paid 59k for it. It was never worth 65k so his depreciation based on trade in value is -42% or closer to 58% of what he paid. Remember that we are talking about trade in value. Depreciation would be less based on a private sale value.

DavidNJ

Residuals are calculated from MSRP. Also note, options are worth very little on a trade. A $60k car with no options may be worth $33, the $60k car with $10k options may be worth $35. Ditto mileage, which can reduce the price 35-50¢ per mile. For example, the trade-in on a $51k list E320 is maybe $28-29k.

A heavily optioned car or a high mileage car is better leased where the options are (usually) fully residualized and prepaid mileage is 15-25¢ per mile.