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Need Help...
I went to change pads and rotors on my 2008 e350 Sport and had a lot of issue because I didn't realize the Sport package brakes were different from the base E350. Anyway, after I got everything up to speed with the correct pads and rotors, I fell into project #2: upgrading to E55 Calipers. I picked some up for the rear and now I want to do the front.
WILL 03-05 E55 CALIPERS BOLT-ON THE FRONT OF MY 08 E350 SPORT?
the caliper mount hole needs opening to fit bigger bolt
yeah you need new rotors
Really? I see that its only a 30 mm difference in diameter, which is only 15 mm regarding the calipers. 15mm smaller rotor doesn't seem like a deal breaker to change rotors.
Really? I see that its only a 30 mm difference in diameter, which is only 15 mm regarding the calipers. 15mm smaller rotor doesn't seem like a deal breaker to change rotors.
15mm won't make a difference UNLESS that pad hangs over the edge of the rotor.
I know of few properly designed brakes that have 15mm of spare rotor, . . .
As mentioned above the front calipers are bolt on.
You will need the larger 14mm bolts and to drill out the front spindles from 12mm to 14mm.
Honestly with how cheap the front rotors are why would you not want to just replace with new? Seems half *** way of doing it if you are going to the trouble of putting on better calipers, change the rotors...
Attached picture of stock rotors e350 sport and e55.
Also attached just for size comparison on how the e55 calipers make the sport calipers look like babies...lol
As mentioned above the front calipers are bolt on.
You will need the larger 14mm bolts and to drill out the front spindles from 12mm to 14mm.
Honestly with how cheap the front rotors are why would you not want to just replace with new? Seems half *** way of doing it if you are going to the trouble of putting on better calipers, change the rotors...
Attached picture of stock rotors e350 sport and e55.
Also attached just for size comparison on how the e55 calipers make the sport calipers look like babies...lol
Great pic of the caliper comparison. Well my reason for not wanting to buy new rotors is because I just replaced the rotors and pads prior to finding out I can upgrade the brakes to e55 or e63. Just trying to get buy if I can for now and maybe do the rotor upgrade at a future time. Also, I went thru a couple of online orders and returns because I had parts that wouldn't fit (rotors), not knowing that sport rotors are different...they have a bigger hat on them than base e350.
Yep that's true. The e350 sports are 12.3" compared to the base e350 which are 11.8". E55 were 14.2" (fronts)
Rears were all the same at 11.8" minus e55 which were 13".
If you just changed rotors and pads I'd either sell them on ebay or on here. If you are upgrading to the mammoth calipers there is no reason not to do the rotors since that is what they are designed for.
I bought the majority of stuff fro FCPEuro, who is a sponsor on here and actually answers many questions. Their CS is fantastic. I went through 2 or three front rotors because each one was warped when I received it. Not their fault at all but crappy manufacturing via MB or lack of quality control.
My take is if you are going to do something, do it right. Don't half *** it. I try and do things so that I don't have to come back later because I did something to compromise or have it cost me more money down the road...lol
Hope this helps. The e55 front oem rotors are cheap at $140. Compare that to e63 two piece rotors which are $700+ a pop. I think the e55 8 piston front rotors look better than the 6 piston e63, EVEN though more than likely the e63 front rotors are lighter (because of less pistons), and the rotors are lighter via the two piece/aluminum hats.
These aren't track cars. If you are doing this for looks and stopping power I can assure you that the stock 4 piston sport brakes are MORE than enough. I wasn't happy with how much space there was from the inside of the wheel to the sport caliper so I swapped to the e55 brembos. Looks way better and stopping power is nice as well. I will take some pictures this weekend once the snow is gone and update. Fills the wheel gaps nicely and looks VERY very similar to an actual AMG. I'm completely happy with how the car looks now after doing it.
Last edited by NewShockerGuy; 03-14-2017 at 09:56 PM.
I appreciate your help, NewShockerGuy. I'm going to agree with you and get the e55 rotors and calipers all around. I guess I'm just paranoid because I had figment issues when I tried to install (by mistake) e350 base rotors instead or sport rotors and I saw that there was a big difference in rotor hat height size. They weren't interchangeable at all. Do you happen to remember your part numbers to the e55 front rotors you bought? I see 2 different part#s depending on with or without AMG Performance pkg and I'm not sure how that relates to our e350 Sport pkg.
OEM Part numbers that I used are the following:
*Mercedes Disc Brake Front - Genuine Mercedes: 221421181207
*Mercedes Disc Brake Rear - Genuine Mercedes: 2114231112
The front rotors will bolt right up. Zero issues there. You will have to trim/cut the existing front brake dust shields. It's quite easy and as soon as you attempt to bolt the caliper on or hold it in place you just take a sharpie and draw a line, cut on the line and the re-test the caliper until it doesn't touch the dust shield.
The longest part of the entire thing was enlarging the 12mm holes on the spindles to 14mm. I used my dremel and it took some time. If you have access to a vertical mill then it would take no time at all. I don't have access to that so I just slowly ground the hole until I could fit the bolt, then continued all the way around until I could fit the shoulder of the bolt through. It's perfect. Might actually be a hair smaller than the AMG spindles since the bolt has a nice snug fit instead of loose and wobbly. Just take your time regardless of this step. It's WAY easier to take more metal off, since you can't add metal if you grind too much.
The part numbers are for e55 calipers. The ones I have pictured above using 8 piston fronts/4 piston rears. IF you are doing e63, 6 piston fronts then the rotor part numbers will be different. Like I said before I did e55 only because I wasn't about to drop $1500 in front rotors on a non performance track car that will not benefit from having two piece rotors.
OEM Part numbers that I used are the following:
*Mercedes Disc Brake Front - Genuine Mercedes: 221421181207
*Mercedes Disc Brake Rear - Genuine Mercedes: 2114231112
The front rotors will bolt right up. Zero issues there. You will have to trim/cut the existing front brake dust shields. It's quite easy and as soon as you attempt to bolt the caliper on or hold it in place you just take a sharpie and draw a line, cut on the line and the re-test the caliper until it doesn't touch the dust shield.
The longest part of the entire thing was enlarging the 12mm holes on the spindles to 14mm. I used my dremel and it took some time. If you have access to a vertical mill then it would take no time at all. I don't have access to that so I just slowly ground the hole until I could fit the bolt, then continued all the way around until I could fit the shoulder of the bolt through. It's perfect. Might actually be a hair smaller than the AMG spindles since the bolt has a nice snug fit instead of loose and wobbly. Just take your time regardless of this step. It's WAY easier to take more metal off, since you can't add metal if you grind too much.
The part numbers are for e55 calipers. The ones I have pictured above using 8 piston fronts/4 piston rears. IF you are doing e63, 6 piston fronts then the rotor part numbers will be different. Like I said before I did e55 only because I wasn't about to drop $1500 in front rotors on a non performance track car that will not benefit from having two piece rotors.
Hope this helps.
No, no...im following your sound advice. E55 brakes seem very logical choice for me as well. Can't wait to see a picture of your finished brake set-up.
I do have a dremel, but wouldn't it be easier to use a power drill to get to 14mm?
I like your rotors better than e55 with regard to the triple drill hole pattern in the rear...but when I searched for the part, details say it's not for a e55 and that it doesn't work on sport pkg. I know this is custom mod, but was also wondering which car it's meant for.
This is a nice project you've embarked on. There is one statement in this thread that requires correction.
"The part numbers are for e55 calipers. The ones I have pictured above using 8 piston fronts/4 piston rears. IF you are doing e63, 6 piston fronts then the rotor part numbers will be different. Like I said before I did e55 only because I wasn't about to drop $1500 in front rotors on a non performance track car that will not benefit from having two piece rotors."
The W211 E63 and E55 front rotors are dimensionally (sp) identical. The E63 rotor is six pounds lighter per side as a result of the 2 piece design w/ the aluminum hat. You can run E63 six pot calipers against E55 single piece rotors.
No, no...im following your sound advice. E55 brakes seem very logical choice for me as well. Can't wait to see a picture of your finished brake set-up.
I do have a dremel, but wouldn't it be easier to use a power drill to get to 14mm?
I like your rotors better than e55 with regard to the triple drill hole pattern in the rear...but when I searched for the part, details say it's not for a e55 and that it doesn't work on sport pkg. I know this is custom mod, but was also wondering which car it's meant for.
You could use a power drill. I didn't have a bit that large to go up to and I did use the highest bit I had then used the dremel to finish. It would be easier. However with a power drill and if you are holding on to it while drilling especially with that large of a bit what will most likely happen is that the bit will "grab" the metal and it will twist/yank the drill. That's why having a vertical mill is best because it's stationary and or clamped down and you can gradually make the hole larger so the bit doesn't grab on and yank you about. Another thing to keep in mind doing it free hand with a drill is you do not want to wallow out the hole so that it's not round. This can be very easily done if you are not perfectly straight and for whatever reason you are drilling at a slight angle.
So the rear rotors are OEM MB off an e55. Bought from FCP Euro. Don't worry about the sport package or anything like that. For all intensive purposes after you do this mod you will have e55 brakes. Everything associated with them. What that means is you no longer put in e350 sport package when buying brake components. So if you ever take it to a dealer or indy shop and they ask for your VIN or make/model for brakes it will pull up what SHOULD be on the car, not what you replaced it with.
It's nothing major, but something to remember when or if you ever have to replace things in the future to always remember you now have e55 brakes.
I didn't add this above but since you are doing it you might as well replace the stock rubber brakes lines with s/s brake lines. I went with Stoptech since they are on everything I own. Probably not needed but for $80 front/rear for s/s lines it's worth it to me. You already have to take the calipers off, so why not change to better lines that you never have to worry about again...etc.
Kyle is correct. I did more research and found several conflicting threads in the beginning but the rotors are the same size. I read that some people wanted to put e63 rotors on their e55 but wasn't sure about the aluminum hats possibly hitting the calipers since those are different sizes. Again you can go that route but to spend $700 to save 5lbs per rotor isn't worth it. (although eliminated unsprung mass is ALWAYS good, in this case it's just not cost effective to me).
Hope all this helps. It seems like a big task but it really isn't. My biggest thing was finding parts that I was missing. As far as the rear rotors, 100% bolt on, rear calipers 100% bolt on. Fronts will take a little more time for calipers, but front rotors 100% bolt on.
Thanks Nigel,
I was able to find the parts online. I appreciate it because I like your rear rotors. Other e55 rotors only have 2 cross-drill holes versus 3. I'm working on finding E55 front spindles. And bought new brake sensors and M14 bolts. I will look into the stainless steel brake lines too. Wife is kinda upset, because, again...I just bought new rotors and pads all around. Atleast this time nothing will be seized lol
-Mark
Good luck on the amg front spindles. Cheapest I could find was $300 a pop and at $600 total was more than I wanted to invest in this project. There is a thread on here where the guy shows how to install the spindles. It's not difficult. Keep in mind when you replace the spindles you will need a front end alignment, so budget that in as well.
Your brake sensors would have worked with the e55 brakes. I just reused mine.
Post up some pictures/updates once your are all done.
Good luck on the amg front spindles. Cheapest I could find was $300 a pop and at $600 total was more than I wanted to invest in this project. There is a thread on here where the guy shows how to install the spindles. It's not difficult. Keep in mind when you replace the spindles you will need a front end alignment, so budget that in as well.
Your brake sensors would have worked with the e55 brakes. I just reused mine.
Post up some pictures/updates once your are all done.
Sorry, that's was a typo. I meant "calipers", not "spindles". I just bought some front calipers tonight online.
When searching for brake lines, should I look for E55 kit or E350? I wouldn't think it would matter until I saw some asking me to specify.
I will keep that in mind in case I mess up drilling.
Can't wait for the rest of the parts to come in later this week...front e55 calipers, ss brake lines, front brake pads, and e55 rotors for front and back.
Finally recieved my e55 front calipers. So happy. Front and rear Rotors are due tomorrow and I can finally begin install. Starting cleaning, and rebuilding calipers.
Breakdown of my "05 E55 Calipers for my E350
I saw in your other post that you had a ripped boot?
These are super easy to tear apart. Take a small pick or a pointed object and insert it into the boot edge and pry up. The dust boot will pop off. Then just pull the piston out. It might be hard but since the pistons are so large you can use two flat head screw drivers to gently nudge it up and out. Once you get it going you can usually pull them out.
Then there is a seal on the inside that you just take a dental pick and pull it out.
I got my rebuild kit from rockauto. It's the centric kit and it was cheap at like $15 I think. Keep in mind however they are not OEM Brembo quality. The dust boot covers are a tiny bit thinner. The internal seals appeared to be fine.
If you are looking for OEM brembo seals check eBay. Be forewarned that they are about $25 a seal, which I think is crazy...
Other than that make sure after rebuilding them you pull the pistons out enough so you can JUST slide the pads in.... if not you will have a case of piston over return. There is a thread on it and I posted on it because it's what happened to me.
IE: Pushed the pistons in all the way after rebuilding them and then had everything hooked up to the car... used the fluid to push the pistons up against the pads but what ended up happening was that the pistons would return past by about 1-2mm off the pads, so engagement when pushing the brake pedal wasn't happening until the very END of the travel. I had to pull all the pads out, manually put each piston out so I could barely fit the pads in (IE: TIGHT FIT) then bleed the entire system over again. Now the brakes are fantastic but it was a PITA because I didn't know that.
Also note when bleeding the system to pressurize it up to 2bar (29psi).
There's also a thread/post about proper order and procedure of bleeding the 8 piston/4 piston calipers.
Thanks Nigel,
I actually edited that post about the torn boot since I was able to figure it out. The thing was the boot was really adhered to where it sits on caliper. And eventually, yes I pried it out with a pick set I bought by chance.
I also read the over-return link previously thanks to something i seen you advise someone else here in forum.
I did have one piston (OEM piston) which had its hat pop off. Looks like it's held by friction grooves. Not sure what I should do. I imagine it's okay, but the fact that it actually came off bothered me. I'd like to use a little thread lock or something. I can't seem to find the replacement pistons online. Either they are different diameters or different design without a hat in the picture.
other than that...using compressed air to move the pistons...everything seems good. Some move slower on the inner chamber of caliper (car side) but i think because there's less brake fluid there.
Yep the pistons in our calipers are two different sizes. Same with the rears. What do you mean exactly that the hat popped off? Are you referring to the dust boot? Or are you saying the entire piston came out? If it came out that's OK, just push it back in. They are held in by the internal seal/oring.
Good luck finding the actual pistons for our calipers. Everyone else makes the standard looking ones that you are referring to, the pistons in our calipers aren't bad, I believe they are metal and ceramic. I can see why the design for the e66 changed to eliminate some of the pistons for weight and more likely to address the slow pistons. But overall these are fantastic brakes.
Post up pictures once you start installing everything!
I started drilling out the first spindle hole to 14mm. Made sure caliper was vertical and kept my drill horizontal. Seemed successful, however when I stuck in the 14mm E55 caliper bolt...these bolts have a shoudler near the head. I'm not sure if I should drill my hole larger?
Nigel, is this where you used your dremel to grind on the inner part of the spindle hole?
03-08-2017, 11:07 PM
Front and rear Rotors are due tomorrow and I can finally begin install. Starting cleaning, and rebuilding calipers.
