Barry45RPM

All of what you mention were nifty little bragging features. None of them are important other than to note the fact that they have been deleted. "Climate controlled console"? Puhleze! Were you really planning on keeping a Tuna sandwhich in there? It is a feature only as a bold type line in a brochure. Yeah, there's "less" in the car for more money, but they haven't made less of a car of it. Less decorations on a wedding cake doesn't make it not a wedding cake.

You KNEW there would be these deletions on the '05s. How could you sound this angry? They HAVE to raise the price of these cars due to international monetary comparisons. Germany adopting the Euro is largely resopnsible for this. Not deliberate cheapness on their part. In '06 after a year of enjoying your car these deletions will not be missed. Hell, if you read these posts, you'll see that most people never could figure out how to use the center blue thumbwheel or what it did. How can it possibly be missed? I have the cooled console...It keeps my car wash coupons cool.

Don't be on a rant. Enjoy the car!

levind

The MBUSA website still lists the REST feature for the '05 CDI. The website seems to be pretty up-to-date on options and features.

As for the changes mentioned on the motor-talk user forum, we have seen or heard of all of them. There is no mention of the REST feature, and no mention of the center air vent.

I remember looking up "niegungsferstellung" and I recall it being one of the seat functions (lumber?). For '05 it is electric instead of manual.

DavidNJ

- CD changer can play MP3 with Comand

This could be no-US only

- SBC function now only works with SBC Hold, not SBC Stop
This is the function that was supposed to give a smooth final stop. Reports from some that it felt like a jerk instead. The hold feature is still there.

- "Twin" genuine leather portion is gone

Probably not a US issue. The Leder Twin was a €400 option and was the standard US interior. What is the standard US interior now? MB Tex?

- Parking heater now sends return signal to the key

- WAP telephone only with Teleaid

Irrelevant for US cars

- Prewire for mobile phone gone. Replaced by UHI

Really? Standard? Could mean the phone is reduced to a cradle installation at the dealer. What does the US '05 brochure say?

- No ashtray in front as standard (still available as option), but with plug socket

The rubber mat and cigar light is gone and the rubber mat is standard?

- The Cruise control will engage brakes for the reduction of the speed downhill

Now, finally, something usefull. MB cruise control supposedly downshifted for hills (our E39 doesn't), and now it apparently also applies the brakes. This was a Distronic feature before and is a software only sort of thing.

- The cooling/heating in the armrest console is gone

Old news.

- The covers below the seats (the old plastic cover) is now covered by imitation leather

This would be a covering for the hard plastic piece. It has been rather ugly.

- Neigungsverstellung now electrically (not sure about this translation)

The standard seat had an electric height and backrest adjustment. This looks like the seat inclination is now also electric.

- Some rims are only silver painted

My translation is different. Alufelgen is aluminum wheels. Are all the wheels painted now? Previously, the standard wheels where machined first (glanzgedreht). What do the wheels look like in the '05 brochure?

DavidNJ

DavidNJ

Barry45rpm:

Why angry? Because these individually "little" features are why we spend $60k for a car rather than $30k. They are want makes life a little more pleasant. They are what support our lifestyle.

Ventilated seat? I am wearing a suit for long drives in the summer. I end up hot and perspired at the end of the day. And uncomfortable. I wanted the ventilated seat to reduce that issue.

Heated steering wheel? My wife has mild arthritis in her hands and finds the heated wheel very soothing.

Valet lock on trunk? I am an amateur filmmaker (top 250 qualifier in Project Greenlight) and I don't want my equipment stolen (filters are over $100 each, tripod over $1500, the camera more).

Charcoal filter with auto recirc: In NYC you wait in huge delays at the tunnels. Often next to diesel trucks a lot dirtier than a CDI. This makes fiddling unnecessary. Before this feature we didn't remember to turn off outside air until the interior smelled, and forgot to turnoff recirc until the windows where clouded over with humidity.

And of course the hot/cold upper vent wheel: The feature I liked most about the 5-series. On colder winter days, I could keep my face cool and myself alert while the interior was heating. And on summer days, I could cool myself without freezing out the whole interior. During a drive, I could quickly make adjustments to keep myself comfortable. After the steering wheel, throttle, brake, and, maybe, turn signal indicator, it is the interior control I use most. BMW's movement of this control to the iDrive was one reason to get the E-class.

For '04, at least early '04, and E320 could be ordered with all of these features. Now, none of them. We sucked it in and dealt with the first group. This last one is just a little too much.

David

Barry45RPM

So how much more do you want to pay for the car to retain these featurettes? P.S. They can no longer afford to include them due to the dollar free-falling against their currency. So now you have to pay more for a Benz. How much you got?

The features you mention above were never meant as cures for illness. I live where you live & breathe the same air. The crappy charcoal filter in my car isnt gonna extend my life 9 seconds. Sitting next to a deisel truck & you feel its stinky? Hit the Recirc button as I do untill they pull away.

Have you noticed how much a "1 lb" can of coffee weighs these days?
I do agree with you about the trunk valet lock however.

Oslo

I tend to agree with you, Barry45RPM, but the price increased 2% in Germany as well, and Germans pays in EURO. And those minor options are gone in Germany as well.

levind

I think I keep missing something.....

Why all the discussions about missing charcoal filters and climate control vents?

THERE IS NO PROOF!!!!

Until I read from the factory workers on the assembly line in Sindelfingen that the charcoal filter, REST feature, and air mix valves are missing on '05 US spec cars, I consider this thread to be nothing but rumor.

If I read the reports, I will be the first to post the news.

alewifebp

First, a clarification of the SBC features. SBC Soft Stop is what you are thinking of, DavidNJ. And true, that is not always that soft in my opinion, but does seem to work when doing major braking events. SBC Hold and SBC Stop are non-US features. SBC Hold, which I would love to have in the US, but can understand how the typical MB driver would be confused, is it allows you to hold the car in place, without shifiting it out of gear or holding your foot on the brake. After applying pressure to the accellerator, it will release the Hold of the brake. SBC Stop was the feature that during stop and go traffic, after you would release your foot off the accellerator, the car would come to a stop automatically.

And I do tend to agree with you DavidNJ, also on the decontenting. We do spend a premium, and while I didn't expect to see these features in my car, knowing that I have it gives that much more value to the extra expense paid.

And I was just reporting back from what was in the brochure. Why would they suddenly show pictures that are not true to form, when they have pictures from the previous years that are the same?

DavidNJ

I thought the US cars had SBC Hold. My mistake.

The charcoal filter was only in the 4-place climate control which is absolutely not available on an E320 for '05. If it were, we would have ordered it.

I don't know about the E500, however the dealer did say it was deleted and I will check further on Monday. What does the '05 brochure say in text?

Double Eagle

I use it to store power bars on long trips through hot country. This feature has been on all of my E's since '97 and is another take away I will miss. It's nice to have a cool candy bar or power bar on a hot day.

DavidNJ

I now have an '05 brochure.

levind...the Nile is a river in Egypt. All of these things are true. In black and white (actually a slight beige) in specs. No REST. No charcoal filter anywhere.

scorchie

This is actually available in most cars, it is just called different things (like "bi-level" in GM cars) or is activated different ways (buttons with an up/down arrow, with a filled arrow one direction and an open arrow the other).

I think there will be a way to do it.

Older Mercedes (like my 190E) only ever have cold air coming out of the center vents, so you either open them or close them. Then the warm air comes out of the sides.

Also, other Mercedes have the "REST" function combined with another button (since the button is used one function with the car on and another function with the car off). So the separate REST button may have disappeared without necessarily the function being gone.

-s-

DavidNJ

scorchie, it is actually gone. Not a mention of the feature, which was clearly indicated in prior years. Note, it is not on C-class either.

ToyCollector

David,

If you are sold on a high end diesel, this car is your only option. I checked with BMW and Audi dealers locally and none will have anything here until 2007 model year. If you haven't driven a CDI Benz yet, trust me, you will be glad you bought it when you drive it. I myself had a 2000 E430 Sport and felt that it was a Benz built for the accountants and not the engineers, but sadly many cars are now like that, and the W124 was the last of the great ones in my book.

Otto

understand david's anger. the problem is he has a e39, he knew the prior w211 features.

my wife often compares our w211 with e39, she can find a lot of issues in w211. ("1-2-3-4-5-6 cd channel swith buttons" is one of them. ) as I said before, mbusa should provide all options for US customers instead of making the decisions for us. (I definitely will buy sbc-hold to shut my wife mouth up but it is not available in US models.) after having digital climate control in my e39, there is no way for me to go back to accept a cheap dial style climate control even functionally both styles work the same -- this is why e60 never comes to my shopping list. (I have recived a letter from my bmw dealer who offers a good trade-in price for our old e39 and a good discount on new e60 but "I am too old to enjoy e60 taste".) however, the buyers seem have no choice these days -- banglized rear butt becomes popular now -- see the maybach, w221 (next version of s class), and next version of lexus L430 -- all of them have raised butts -- no matter you like or not.

my sugguestion is, do not upset, enjoy your euro vacation and your new car.

Wolfman

REST is actually a nice feature when I used it 2 times in the last 8 years...

The point is that carmakers will continously evolve the cars during which certain features will be dropped while others are being added. Often these changes occur as research results shows that certain options are not considered "value-added" by the majority of customers, sometimes they simply become unnecessary as a result of design improvements or changes or ultimately cost control.

Now what I find interesting is that so many of you are complaining about the costs of these cars.
So here are my 2 cents...
I remember that my 94 S500 costs $98k new, which is about $15K+ more than a 2004. In 1997, an E320 base sticker was only $4K less than an 05 E320. Along with calculated inflation, Mercedes' have never been cheaper...

In the meantime, the cost of a Lexus LS400 (at the time of introduction to now, a LS430) increased by 100% and nobody is complaining.

Since German labor rates aren't going down to Asia or US standards anytime soon, these cars will always cost more than a Japanese car built in the US.
Unfortunately, MB quality suffered during these years. I have only endured these for one reason; most of these complains about quality are nuissance issues not involving the safety or long-term durability of the cars.

Wolfman

nyca

most manufacturers are increasing content and holding the line on prices. read some reviews of the new 997 911 - what its got, what it costs, its built in germany, same stuff with the euro exchange rate, etc.

part of what is happening here is that content is being removed because MB can't get it to work reliably, and including it in the car is wrecking their quality surveys. what's the end game for that philosophy?

they are also removing stuff they feel people won't notice until after they buy the car (if ever) - like the climate controlled storage compartment, the puddle lights on the mirror, etc. after all, who really knows they are breathing air that hasn't been charcoal filtered? how many people bring a test kit into the car with them?

the people on this board are well informed, the typical purchaser isn't.

it will be interesting to see what happens on the new S class, what the content philosophy is going to be with that.

ToyCollector

A German Toyota Corolla?

kort677

04 CDI???? did you import it?

MB-JIM

Sorry it isa 2005

moa4r

Why don't you just relax and get a pre-owned 2004 or 2003 e320 if those features are so important to you??!!! It isn't difficult to find one that has the options/colors you want in new condition from a mb dealer and you'll probably save yourself a little $$ while your at it. You can't have everything on CDI, so you'll need to get an e320 if you absolutely NEED the stuff thats not available on 2005 diesel.

DavidNJ

Three reasons.

First, couldn't find one. We insisted on xenon lights, premium package, Parktronic, fold down rear seats. We also wanted a heated steering wheel, 4-place climate control, and tpm. The phone and sat radio are or can be dealer installed at MB.

Second, we found the E320 wanting. It wasn't quick. And when pushed, which it needed to be a lot, it wasn't particularly refined. So we were looking at an E500 with $1300 gas guzzler tax.

Third, price. An E500 with that equipment is around $67k. Versus less than $60k on the CDI. And with ED (and a discount from ED) it is less than $54k.

That said, a week after we ordered the car I found an used E500 with everything except the heated wheel for $58k with less than 2k miles.

However that is not only $4k more, but also has an extra year of depreciation (in October '08 that is 4 model years old vs. 3 years for the diesel. About 8% in MSRP. And an old style (port injection) V-8 vs one of the few used diesels when everyone has new diesels is probably another 2-4% of MSRP. So we are talking $4-5k up front, plus maybe $6-7k at the tail end, about $10-12k more. 20% more.

This is just decontenting a useful feature that worked, wasn't hurting anyone, and whose cost of removal is probably higher than the long term maintenance costs of having two different configurations. It was unexpected. It was unwanted. It takes away a feature I counted on.

ATS

I would go for the E500 if it has the features you want.. Just my opinion..

DavidNJ

Unfortunately the E500 now has the same problems. An '05 E500 does not have a charcoal filter, does not have the hot/cold upper air flow wheel, does not have auto recirc, does not allow you to buy a heated steering wheel with ventilated seats, does not allow you to by solar powered ventilation with a Panorama roof, does not have a valet lock for the trunk, does not allow you to buy Distronic, does not have a Pacific Blue interior option.