220S

A sliding wood door in my new house came off its track last month and an electrical outlet failed. I'm pissed. This should have never happened. The house cost me $3.2 mil. I'm going to kill my realtor and sue everybody in sight. This is an insult. Nothing should ever happen to me. Death to those who are out to betray me.

K-A

On the subject of the horn. Mercedes owners have every right to be P'O'd. This is a Mercedes after all, and a lot of what you pay for is the little details. Having it honk like a cheap Dodge is ridiculous. If M-B cost cuts the most initially audible and stereotypical "Luxury Car" effect ("Chirp Chirp"), then who knows what they're gonna cost cut next. The sky's the limit at this point.

Pntblnk

This is really about what one expects from an iconic brand such as MB. These cars should never be cost cut into mediocrate. I'm sure your $3.2m house came with granite counters and not some cheap laminate counter tops... when you pay for a luxury item, you expect it to be just that.... luxurious. The water thingy doesn't bother me, just didn't know what the heck it was. The horn...well that ticks me off to the point I have disabled the audible lock confirmation all together until I can sort out how to add a chirp to the car.

MCF

Give me a break on the honk. My wife actually prefers it over the chirp. Damn. EVERYONE knew that the cost of the W212 was reduced. Did you actually think you were getting a better car for less money!?!?

K-A

A- Your Wife certainly has a unique taste when it comes to the E-Class (preferring a raunchy honk over a sophisticated chirp, and the Luxury edition over the Sport edition).

B- You on the rag again MCF?

MCF

A- Yes. Interesting tastes Which is why I love my wife, unlike your fat ***** bore of an *** eating wife like yours.

K-A

Ah yes, on the rag indeed. What would we do on this Forum without MCF's Mr. Hyde side.

Still taking it out on us since your Wife wouldn't let you pick the Sport aesthetic model I see.

Arrie

With this last post from you this forum managers should remove you from the whole site, period!

peeta123

i didnt know there are 2 versions? i guess canadians only have 1 version to choose from.

Pntblnk

Agreed, that was completely uncalled for. I do however applaud KA for his restraint and sense not to roll in the mud with a pig. That was a small comment from what is obviously a small man.

K-A

Thank you, and indeed. Someone needs to be of importance to get under my skin. Our little friend with the big chip on his shoulder here, certainly isn't that!

petee1997

I don't believe MB went from a chirp to the horn to save money. Like most companies they do focus groups and from that input they make changes.
The conclusion of the research was overwhelming: the focus group preferred the horn because the average E owner is so old and hard of hearing,therefore the necessity of the horn.
Those of you complaining are not quite "old" enough for the E. It would be best to find a CHIRPING CAR until you are.


PS In my case,I'm so old, the horn didn't do it either so I have no sound and I wait for the mirrors to fold to let me know the car is locked....no chirp....no horn. This is a really,really foolish thread and getting nasty.

petee1997

I have been reading K-A for a long time and don't always agree with him, but I must admit that he is always civil no matter how the argument goes. It's certainly more than I can say for one ignorant poster who has shown himself to be a very little man.

Tjdehya

That sounds like you made that up, but if so then doesn’t the S-class cater to an older crowd than the E? Did the S get the wonderful and highly coveted "Honk"?
What focus group was this? A bunch of 90yos? I don’t know the factual #'s but I would venture a guess that the average E buyer is 30-50. I don’t think many people go deaf at 50?!?

I have seen people get banned for less. Right Hyperion? Hyperion667? You there? Oh thats right.
Miss you buddy! Pour out some liquor for my homie.

rovermark

Agree. The best response to personal attacks is no response.

The truth is that both the "honk" and "chirp" are socially unacceptable in my view (I am talking outside of the U.S.A.). Why do you have to create noise at the expense of other's displeasure? I am just like you - flashing lights and folding mirrors are my signal that doors are locked. That is the dignified way of locking your car.

K-A

Yes, we go loong ways back. Thanks Peete, I appreciate that.


I think he was mostly joking. And I think ALL Benzes get the honk (can you believe that?). I heard even the SLS gets it!

I heard one the other day, and not only did it startle me when I was on the phone and walking, but I was assuming I'd see some '99 Tercel beep-locking at me, to notice it was a new Benz!

I had correspondence with someone from MBUSA, and brought the subject up, and they said that they're aware that it is a customer issue, and are working to get it back to appropriation. So you guys with the '11's might end up being the only unlucky ones (we can only hope).

BTW, about the net. I never use it, but it certainly can be considered one of those nice "Luxury Car" amenities/details, as I'm sure it comes in handy in ways, and is something that you'd expect from Mercedes. Props to them for that, but I think keeping the horn would have been better.

And wtf happened to Hyperion anyway? Pouring some hot tea (treating for this flu) out for a homie as we speak.

K-A

I respectfully disagree.... With the second part, the first part is spot on.

Especially with Keyless Go (not standing at the rear or front of my car when I lock or unlock it), I depend on the sounds to tell me if it is locked. We don't have folding mirrors in the U.S, and even if we did, for those who would find it unnecessary and disable it, they'd need something audible.

Also, that 80's "Luxury Car" bird-chirp (that cheap aftermarket companies still use, as they're obviously dated in terms of what says "fancy car unlocking") is indeed cheesy. M-B, BMW, etc. all have sophisticated and maybe to some, "high-tech" forms of "beeps" or "chirps", and initiate you to the Premium car that you're about to get into.

Audio is a major part of my business/life, and sound is very important to me. I'm not even talking about sound systems here, but even the smallest of details. Cars are engineered with "sound quality" in mind when they hit a certain price point (or are supposed to be). I.e, you know when you knock on a plastic dash? Sometimes you can "feel the quality" based on the sound you hear. Same with door thuds, the sound and tactile feel of pressing a button in the car, pulling the door handle, etc. etc. Are are small, but significant audible details that tell you what kind of product you are using. A car alarm is no different, and is always the initiation to the car your'e about to experience.

petee1997

[quote=Tjdehya;4490038]That sounds like you made that up, but if so then doesn’t the S-class cater to an older crowd than the E? Did the S get the wonderful and highly coveted "Honk"?
What focus group was this? A bunch of 90yos? I don’t know the factual #'s but I would venture a guess that the average E buyer is 30-50. I don’t think many people go deaf at 50?!?


Of course I made it up. I'm just having a little fun with some of you.

ImInPA

I have been reading this forum for quite a while and have only recently begun contributing. I have read a lot of posts about MB cost cutting the new E and in fact the $4K price reduction would certainly seem to point to that. The primary reason for the E's reduced cost is due to platform sharing. Unlike prior E's that were predominantly on their own unique platforms, the W212's platform is mostly shared with the C-class. This greatly reduced the cost in developing the new E. Factor in the shared 3.5 litre gas engine and the shared tranny, and you have quite a bit of cost savings. This allowed MB to make the W212 more cost competitive. Most reviews I have read on the new E state that evidence of cost cutting are not apparent. Now, the cargo net thingy and the "honk" might account for a few dollars, but, in all honesty, I find this a trivial grievance in this day and age where the lowliest Hyundais "chirp" like an S-class.

Not having to develop the E from scratch and being able to stretch, widen, and reinforce the C platform to create the new E is what afforded MB the opportunity to lower prices a bit. Little things like cargo nets and "chirps" are not likely to save very much.

K-A

Well said, and very true (accept for the justifying of the horrendous Benz "Honk" part ).

BMW uses the exact same platform on practically its whole line, which saves them tonnns. M-B is just started to get into that business.

The only areas in my E (I have a 2010 MY, so the honk is a non issue as it doesn't exist) that I find cost cut are in certain materials, and some little detail elements here or there (interior). At the same time, who knows which materials cost more, i.e, do they cost more because they're soft and carpety (W211), or more because they're rigid and durable (W212).

Aside from that, the W212 is a technical improvement in about every way, and has a lot more to offer, of course, as it's a newer model, so objectively, it better.

However, things like the honk, and some of those other little things that I mention that I noticed, are just cheap shots by the brand. I'm shocked that a brand like Mercedes, who hold themselves up to such a high and premium regard, would bend over to allow their cars to "honk" like the cheapest of fleet cars. It's not even about who else "honks", it's about the sound, sounding literally "cheap" and raunchy. It makes me question who's in charge right now, i.e, a "big picture" mentality.... As opposed to a supremely important "it's the little things that count" mentality, which should be prevalent as well.

ImInPA

I had a 2005 VW Passat TDI. it had two horns. The one in the front...and a separate and different sounding horn for the alarm. A fantastic car BTW. I disabled the horn (as I have on my W212). Seeing the lights flash is good enough for me. Of course if I get really ****, I can always lock it via mBrace and the iPhone. Then it calls me to let me know it is locked. Much classier than either beeps or chirps IMO. I do hope, in all seriousness, that the the "honk" and "cargo thingy" are my biggest gripes with the car. I am so far very pleased with the car overall. I just found it interesting that of all the threads I read regarding the alleged de-contenting of the w212, i never came accross a thread that mentioned the platform sharing with the C. Also the move to a 3-link front suspension from the w211's multilink would also cost less to produce. All in all, probably enough savings in those two areas alone to maintain the same (or better/durable/$$$/??? as you correctly pointed out) interior materials and overall "Mercedes-ness." Nice to meet you and I guess I will be seeing you around the parking lot.

K-A

Agreed. There is little mention about the change in suspension, and platform sharing. Those alone knock out the $4K price difference easily (and then some).

I have always been curious about the change in suspension. As it is always noted that M-B went to a more simple, cheaper form of suspension VS the W211, but then they spin it with "for safety, and added comfort reasons". I wonder what is really what here. Was the Multilink pointlessly complex, and holding the car back, allowing a simplified suspension to be perfected to make for a better, and safer (?) ride? Or is this what M-B would like us to think.

I do know that the W212 rides better than the W211.

ImInPA

I am sure that could be a point of much discussion. To me, I find the ride of my E350 Luxury to be about perfect...a very compliant ride that stiffens up nicely when needed. The suspension feels very good to me. The car as a whole has the "traditional-mercedes-carved-from-a-single-billet-of-steel" feeling. BMW, until the current 5, has always used this type of suspension in the 3 and 5 series. When it comes to suspensions, it is my belief that they either work or they don't. The w212's suspension definitely works in my opinion. I have no doubt that it also reduces their manufacturing costs as well. Let me ask you, as a former w211 owner, how does the w212 compare in ride? I never owned a w211 but ride in a few. I truly believe the w212 is better in the ride category. Would like to know your opinion.

K-A

I had the AMG Package on my W211 as well, so comparing both of those, I'd say that the W212 simply feels like a W211 done better, which is exactly what I wanted.

The W212 truly has that "bomb proof/granite" Mercedes feel back, which the 211 lacked. From the way the doors on the W211 "slapped" shut, to the fairly flexable feel of the chassis, etc. I found that car to ride great when the roads were good, but get a little rough when they got bad. One Magazine put it best with the 212, when saying "It's hard to put into words, but it's like the car knows where you're going to go, before you do". I.e, it's just a confident, and secure ride.

The W212 just feels like they screwed it together more strongly, and it feels like an iron bull when cruising along good roads. My only complaint is, that the Sports suspension gets a bit messy when you get on rough roads, and you can hear the wheels and suspension, and chassis getting upset underneath you. It's enough to be intrusive into the cabin for a Luxury car. Then again, it's a steel suspension, Sport Package E-Class, so that's the "Sport" part I guess. The Airmatic I'm sure eliminates a lot of that, and probably does't ride as "sportily".

All in all, it has a more dynamic ride than the 211. It "floats" better, and also handles better. Just a more confident, and competent ride, but very much from the same family, and with the same bloodline.

ImInPA

Interesting that you mention the sport suspension feeling a bit messy over rough roads. My standard test drive route has a section that is very bumpy and definitely reveals this as well as the potential for creaks and rattles. I noticed this "messiness/busyness" in the Sport during a test drive and noticed the Luxury took this particular road noticeably better. Of course, the Luxury also leans a tad bit more in turns as well.