K-A

Lol. I'm fortunate I guess to be going back to a Dealer that gives out stripped C300's, as the last one I went to gave out boring Japanese commuter Sedans.

I'm in my second C300 in a week (Loaner), I used to dread them, with that crappy interior, but now I don't mind tossing them around (well, for me at least, I'm not a really aggressive driver) a bit, as it feels so little, durable, and nimble. A well composed almost-"Sport Sedan".

K-A

Well said. I never feel like I'm starving for power in my 350, but again, I'm no speed racer. The motor is actually very solid and torquey for a V6, and has a solid powerband, with peak Torque available down low, not requiring the motor to wind up much to get going. The last part is put perfectly, the 350 can be a fun motor if you want it to move you a bit more enthusiastically, you just have to know how to get it there, and the paddles I've found are instrumental in that.

FEGELEIN

And we do the swap in my driveway!

FEGELEIN

not selling it short, just feel that MB should have some more to that engine. W/ a car of this quality, cost, etc. once should have to "learn" to push it, it should be at your fingertips!

K-A

The 302 HP V6 will probably fix any power concerns with the motor. It won't be catastrophically faster, with just an additional 30 or so HP, and not much more torque (with peak torque at a higher RPM than the current V6), but it'll most certainly add that extra oomph. Also, I don't think that 268 HP is low enough to cause the common E demographic to find it hard to push, or find it unacceptable to have to "learn" to push it to dangerous or illegal levels. After all, it's not like the car can't haul a$$ on public roads.

In Europe, most E's are 4-Baners, and low HP models. In fact, I guarantee, if they sold a 205 HP 4 Cylinder E-Class in the U.S, it would be the volume leader for the E, proving that 268 HP is more than enough for this cars common buyer (I hope they don't bring a 4-Banger E to the States though.... Please!). The new W204 facelift, and 2012 F10 5-Series are both getting 4-Cylinder Turbo's with decreased peak HP from their outgoing entry level motors, and they will surely be the volume leading sellers for both respective models.

ngerstman

I drove a 2000 e320 4matic for 11 years. That engine had no ***** what so ever and no torque to speek of. I generally liked the e320, it drove well enough, but that was an engine one could complain about!! Mercedes gas peddles have always required a bit more aggression than other cars and many people never quite get over that issue. Mash it a bit and it will respond. The engine won't mind, it can take it. Regards. Ned.

ngerstman

I also enjoy my time driving the c300 loner cars. Clearly a more sporty drive than the e class. I like the feel of the suspension on the c300 and would prefer an "e" version of it over the airmatic in my e550!! Regards. Ned.

ngerstman

Good for you for sticking up for our birth rights!! I had no choice but to leave in the Altima that smelled like Ratso Rizo had been chain smoking in. Regards. Ned.

park423

I'm sure 268hp is fine for daily driving, but when you're paying equal or more money than the E350's competitors who are all offering 300+hp, I don't feel one is getting their money's worth. As for me, driving the E350 and E550 back to back was like night and day, the 550 was just smooth and effortless, I didn't feel like having to floor the 350 all the time. I could have lived with the E350, well actually, if I didn't get a great deal on the 550, I would have gotten the BMW 535i

ngerstman

While I found the e350 engine to be more than acceptable, I am not one to turn down a few extra ponies!!! Witness my 2001 e55 which I Kleemanned to 525hp from 350hp!!! Regards. Ned.

220S

Power output aside, the issue I have with a V6 is that they never seem nearly as smooth as a V8. I don't care what kind of extra balancing and cushioning they try to do, it's just an unbalanced motor from the beginning.

I had a new 2009 E350 and it felt coarse. Almost tractor-like. And it got coarser and noisier the high the rpms. This was a common comment on several of the reviews, too, when the W212 first arrived. "The E350 may be dressed to impress, but the engine never makes a truly favorable impression. The engine note is also displeasingly coarse under strong acceleration, and while the 7-speed automatic transmission helps make the most of the V-6’s limited power, it consistently vetoes runs to the redline."

Sure I agree that it's decent for a V6. But it still has that V6 characteristic which makes you say, "I shoulda had a V8."

I'd like to see Mercedes go back to an IL6 and just turbo charge it. I realize they went to a V6 a while ago because of limited engine bay space and the needed displacement increase, but why not an inline with forced induction. Both BMW's current and MB's previous IL6 motors are super smooth.

park423

Nice, how does that E55 compare to the E550, is it for the track? My next mission is to find a decent used car for the track in the 25k range

RJC

The new 2012 DFI V6 should be inherently smoother due to its new 90 vs 60 degree configuration

ngerstman

I have never taken it to the track. I just enjoy the the feel of the power of the engine. It's definitely a beast, much faster than the e550. In addition to the Kleeman compressor, it has Kleeman headers, the ECU mod and LSD. I had the work done in 2006 when the e55 had around 30,000 miles on it, it now has 54,000. It was not money well spent from an investment perspective, but I do get attached to my cars and it has a $10,000 audiophile quality stereo which I love. The Kleeman mods cost $23,000 installed. So I have $100,000 invested in the car(yikes!!). It's still in near showroom condition and a lot of fun. There is also something very classic about the 210 body style as it was the first modern design that harkined back to old glory days of Mercedes. As for the drivetrain, it has more of that effortless muscle car feel of power with less exhaust back pressure, very breathy feeling. I don't love first gear, it feels a little soft, but the intermediate and high end power range is incredible. Great going 50 to 110!! You could probably find great deals on 210 body Kleeman modded e55's but it may not be worth it over getting post 2002 e55 with the stock compressor. Servicing a modded car can also be an issue. But there is price for everything and if your willing to deal with a modded car, you could be getting a lot of neat performance toys that you won't find on a stock car. You could look around on the e55 forums for cars for sale and maybe find one at a give away price. Regards. Ned.

ngerstman

This a complete aside, but as I was reading your post, I was drinking a v8!! My mother, who was one of the original health food nuts back in the 1960's(listened to a guy on the radio named Dr. Carlton Fredricks), always tried to force v8 on me to no avail. Now I actually like it and take a bottle to work every day. Imagine that!! Regards. Ned.

220S

Used 993 C2 or a 964. Built for the track. Or E36/E46 M3. Or a Miata.

Just my opinion but heavy sedans aren't fun on the track. It's not so much about speed but picking your line and learning the apex that makes the track fun (I'm assuming your talking about a road track.) A lighter weight car that is BALANCED is what I want to look for, imho. Speed is kinda secondary, unless one is racing competitively but then that's why they have different classes. Anyway just my 2 cents.

I haven't really read about the new V6 but that should def help improve it.

That's funny. I wasn't sure if anybody knows where "I shoulda had a V8" came from. I love vegetable juice and actually make my own concoctions every day with a juicer. Yum. And in the evening you can add vodka.

park423

E46 is one I have my eye one but still hard to find a good used one as most M3 owners seem to really hold on to their cars. The power is comparable to a E92 335i which there are plenty of but probably lacking the braking and cooling abilities plus various issues they have. P 993, still pricey and worried about the maintenance, would probably look more at a newer Cayman. Hoping to look at a used E92 335is in a couple years.

park423

Wow, very nice, sounds like a car you keep forever... yeah the W210 was pretty eye-catching with the round lights when it first came out.

hyperion667

hehe, I always hated those round headlights.....so happy they did it up....

220S

I have a 15 year-old 993 that is the most reliable car I've ever owned. Maintenance costs are minimal.

But there is one thing that 993s have an issue with: valve guides. But not all motors will necessarily need a top end job. I've seen 993s with 100K miles plus on the same guides. The problem is the SAI port (due to US emissions regulations/OBDII) that can get clogged from the worn guides. A CEL will happen and that prevents it from getting successfully smog checked. But there are many work-arounds for the SAI issue aside from a $7k top end job. The 993 used a soft guide material just like the older BMWs (I had a 2002tii that had guide issues.) I haven't had a CEL ever and I pass the smog tests easy every time.

There are a couple of other little niggling things on 993s but easy to address. In the end, there are almost truly bulletproof. Truly the last of the hand-built, dry sump, air cooled sports cars left. My was around $75k MSRP and is still worth around $45k today. But you can find a C2 (not the S or the 4S) for $30-35k. So yeah, more than $25k but not that far off. A great thing is that the PCA (P Club of America) is very track oriented and there are loads of opportunities for members to track their cars. There's even Porsche Club Racing (with licensing levels) if you get serious (and have the $$)

I agree the Cayman is a great option, too. But about the same $$ as a nice 993 sample. The Cayman would be a much easier car to learn with and more instantly rewarding. I love driving them, they're so incredibly glued.

ngerstman

Wow. You were never a fan of the 210 body? It was love at first sight when they first came out for me. By the way, when is the e63 due in and are you selling the e550 to buy it. Regards. Ned.

ngerstman

I would agree that an e55 would be great on the staightaways, but certainly not a handler. I think that the Caymans are stunning cars and the price point seems great for what you are getting. Do you agree and are they in fact good cars, a "best buy"? My e55 would have to go to travel down that road, but it is tempting. I've never owned a true sports car. How hard on the body is a Cayman? Is the suspension harder than my e55? Appreciate your thoughts. Ned.

K-A

Ngerstman. There was a cool lowered 2000 E55 with chrome rims (oddly enough, it looked clean and not cheesy, considering the mentioned mods) at some Used Car lot, with about 100K miles, in Silver, going for just under $9K.

It looked SO awesome, and indeed had a Muscle Car, unrefined (to todays standards) feel to the motor, when I started it up.

If I didn't need my second car to be so economical, reliable, and able to handle massive mileage, I would have bought it on the spot. Would be very cool to have alongside my W212.

220S

In my opinion, absolutely a "best buy" in a true sports car. Sure, the suspension is stiff but I probably have a different take on that. I think "stiff" does not have to mean insufferable. The rebounds are quick and precise. There's no sloppiness (which I think feels worse in a chassis than 'stiffness.') The Cayman is comfortable. It doesn't bang around; just quick little rebounds that allow for the feeling of total control. Sometimes in a Mercedes I feel like I'm on rubber stilts. And with the Cayman the steering is very precise and you know exactly where the wheels are pointing at all times. In fact it's ergonomic to the point where I find myself physically leaning my body into the corners like you would on a motorcycle or bicycle; as though my body weight will make a big difference. You really do feel like you're driving your body and the car itself is just an extension.

But cruising long distance could tire one out a bit, relatively speaking (I could fall asleep easy driving a Mercedes, it's so relaxing.) Plus there's the sound and heat from the motor right behind your head. And it's small. It's definitely a sports car yet it feels like a Rolls Royce when you compare it to something like a Lotus Exige. It's nothing at all like a hardcore old school sports car, in fact it's very mild-mannered when you're just out cruising. I wouldn't hesitate at all to drive one across country, it would be a fun road trip adventure. And there's more storage space in a Cayman over the 997 (there's a storage space in the rear and there's the front trunk.)

You should drive one and see if it fits you. It's definitely a weekend car in my mind, but I know several people who use one as a daily. Fit and finish is superb and you can option it out (like any Porsche) with all the amenities you want or get the lightweight Cayman R instead.

The old story about Porsche not wanting to put a higher performance motor in them because people might stop buying 997s has some validity. The Cayman doesn't have prestige or iconic value that the 911 variants hold, but they could easily be argued to be a better over all handling sports car. They are just so perfectly balanced that it's scary. Mid-engine design really makes sense, just ask Ferrari.

ttoE550

Ha, ha! I think Vettel could make any car sporty! There was a news story about Michael Schumacher making a minivan sporty when he was late to the airport:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...port-dash.html

I remember another anecdote in a biography of Gilles Villeneuve about how he routinely drove rental cars until they were smoking heaps. The story I remember was funny -- the story teller (forgot who) rode shotgun, while Gilles' wife got in the backseat. She immediately dove for the floorboard -- "I can't watch!" Gilles proceeded to drive so fast that he bounced off of parked cars.