PHML

Any upper stb out there for the w212 sedan?

Busta Riles

I haven't seen one since i drove a Civic.

thekurgan

Are you looking for just cosmetic or structural integrity improvements for a stiffer strut setup?

K-A

That took me back as well. I remember how happy I was that my '96 Mustang GT had one.... STOCK!!

I don't think M-B's require those unsightly things above the motors. They've stiffened these chassis' up in all the right ways, the W212 has a torsional rigidity figure of about 30K, I don't think a little bar up there would do anything but add weight.

PHML

Who would put one on just for cosmetic?

thekurgan

Lots of people

PHML

Not me...if you see my Lexus..i got braces, links, and bars up the YING YANG!!!

thekurgan

And the strut braces do nothing for rigidity, the cross area is not where structural forces are contended with cornering or otherwise. braces, links and bars are more like "bling bling"

PHML

are you running braces, links, and bars? if not, you shouldn't comment and give bad info.

I run all these on my Lex for years...my frame is rigid as hell because of them.

Also, most of these items are under the car ...not viewable to the general public...not considered bling bling if you cant see them.

bigigg

I think its personal opinion if some people think the upper strut bar is "ugly".. I had one on my c300 as you can see in my avatar, A nice powder coated strut bar to dress up the engine bay doesnt hurt. Looked good when the hood was popped at car shows, I think it gives the car more character. Unless your racing on a track I dont find it necessary tho.

thekurgan

I've had a lot of cars whereby the chassis needed them, this one, however, does not. I've not been many lexus and honda vehicles where the chassis didn't creek while ascending a driveway, so they probably do. My last car, the Z4M Coupe, was extremely stiff and needed nothing whereas my previous E30 and E36 needed x-braces and a triangular firewall-to-strut brace, as well as rear shock mount x-braces. Bending and twisting resistance in the engine bay does little to nothing across the engine, it must be a fully integrated triangular piece. Think about it, when will you have forces on opposing sides of the strut towers that high up? Forces occur against the strut and the control arms.

RobertG

maybe this will help?
http://www.uucmotorwerks.com/STB/wha..._bar_more.html

thekurgan

Doesn't really help, but it is a kick *** description of their product(s) . E36/E46 had minimal strut reinforcement bracing from the factory (even the convertible models, just had an x brace) whereas the E class has two extending from the firewall itself, and appear to be pretty beefy. E class isn't going to have 1g subjected to its chassis.

RobertG

I know that not all cars are built the same and maybe the e-class doesnt need it, I was only refering to the comment in post #8.
Strut tower braces are functional devices on some cars and on other vehicles they are just a conversation piece.

PHML

thekurgan...make up your mind...you are contradicting yourself.

By this statement...you are acknowlegding to does provide "...structural integrity improvements for a stiffer strut setup".

Then you contradict yourself saying "...strut braces do nothing for rigidity...", and that "...braces, links and bars are more like 'bling bling' ".

Then you go off topic ...you now questioning whether our chassis need them or not...which I perceive that you acknowledge again...they do help rigidity.

Get off your soap box bro, and stop muddying up the topic.

Whether they look good or not, that's subjective.

STBs, braces, links, and bars do stiffen up the body/frame...that's the fact!!

PHML

Great info...thx for sharing.

I agree...the question was NOT whether a car needed it or not...which for some reason it was being steered in that direction.

thekurgan

I said they do nothing for this vehicle in terms of rigidity, you spoke of Lexus and their need for added structural enhancements ... who was off topic???

You're constipated over this ...

ImInPA

I noticed the other day that my Bluetec has a strut brace on only the driver's side front strut. It attaches from the top of the strut to the firewall of the car and is a very strong piece. Interesting that it is only on one side. Anyone have any idea why the Bluetecs would have this on just the one side? Do the Gassers have this (350's, 550's, AMGs?). I am wondering if it is to add additional strength for the extra torque. Just a wild assed guess.

PHML

Not really...I just hate ppl who think they know *****...when they really don't know.

thekurgan

And you're right, I don't know Lexus at all, braces are probably needed on those platforms, especially with aftermarket suspension bushings, springs, shocks, etc. They are more tossable on the streets. I only know BMW and Merc. BMWs come setup pretty good from the start, but it really depends on the model and the needs of the driver. Mercs don't seem to be driven in the same manner as BMW, so maybe that's why there isn't a lot of aftermarket chassis add-ons for them.

If you find a machine to measure the twist before and after your braces on the E, that would be some sweet data.

Green E-300 DT

Perhaps you do and can tell us . . .

What rear end gears are in your Bluetec?

I had heard that MBZ raised the ratios because, as someone said,
the late diesels are heavier than models that came before.

If you know or can discover, please tell us, and then I can figure what your overall gear ratios are
when you are in seventh speed and be able to ascertain how many revs you turn at 60 mph, etc.

Your answer is appreciated.



Derrel

thekurgan

http://www.edmunds.com/mercedes-benz...st-specs1.html

Transmission and axle ratios (x:1) I=4.38; II=2.86; III=1.92; IV=1.37; V=1.00; VI=0.82; VII=0.73; R=3.42; Final=3.07

Green E-300 DT

Thank you sir! Much appreciated.

You have 2.2411s overall and my old CDI has 2.1995s. Yes indeed. MBZ did resort to lowering
the overall gear ratio to give the diesel some beans, and that cost 'em Fuel Economy.

No wonder many are complaining about lost performance.
That makes all the older common-rail diesels not only faster but more efficient.
A step backwards perhaps?

Now, who knows which rear end gears are in the 2007 - 2009 Bluetecs? Perhaps 2.82s?

The next day . .

NoFoolyn posted that his '07 Bluetec has 2.64 gears. He got that right out of his owners manual.
Makes his rearend ratio the same as my 2005 CDI, except his overall ratio is higher by ten (10) percent
because the 7G has a 0.73 seventh gear. So overall, 2.64 X .73 gives him a 1.9272 top gear.
Now you can see why I wish my old hotrod had the 7G tranny.
Doing the math, I figure only 1553 revs per mile. He says 1622 rpms at 60 mph.



Derrel

PHML

We all have that machine...its called the BUTTMETER!!

dwamn

My E350 4MATIC does not have any sort of strut brace