2013 E550 (w212): buy from dealer or private owner?
12-05-2015, 07:44 AM
#26
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
E550 2013
I looked up your old thread. You're going to buy this from an MB dealer right?
I'm not sure what happened in the previous thread, but in the US you could have gotten the extended warranty from MB and they sell a 7 year/100k mile warranty which could be bought from any dealer. I'm guessing it's the same in Canada. That would have avoided all the CPO problems. The US rules is that if you buy it from an MB dealer, it has to be a CPO in order to buy a couple extra years otherwise it won't qualify. If it's not an MB dealer, you can buy the extended warranty. The $3500 CPO is to make sure it qualifies, there's things they have to do like put new tires on if the current ones are below a certain tread depth, brakes, etc.
As for your original questions, in the US we have nadaguide and KBB which are used for pricing. Most sellers and dealers will quote KBB so KBB tends to be on the high side. The car is really only worth what the book says it is, the classifieds are filled with ads from people who are looking for more than book because they always feel their car is pristine. But it won't come with any service or support that you would get from a dealer and there are certain things that even a warranty won't cover, but you can get the dealer to do as part of regular negotiations like getting them to do brakes or tires if needed. A private seller probably won't do those or have the resources to get those done.
What it really boils down to is that these cars have great depreciation and you won't have much luck trying to minimize it when you're trying to sell it. You have to charge less than the dealer or no one will be interested. Because of the sales tax in the US, many owners end up trading the car in instead of selling it privately which is why there are few private sales. For instance if you trade in the car for 30k and buy a new one for 60k, you just pay the sales tax on the 30k difference instead of the entire 60k. So in some states, you'd have to get at least 2k over that as a private seller to match what a dealer offers. Maybe they also can't be bothered trying to make a little extra over what the dealer offers.
I'm not sure what happened in the previous thread, but in the US you could have gotten the extended warranty from MB and they sell a 7 year/100k mile warranty which could be bought from any dealer. I'm guessing it's the same in Canada. That would have avoided all the CPO problems. The US rules is that if you buy it from an MB dealer, it has to be a CPO in order to buy a couple extra years otherwise it won't qualify. If it's not an MB dealer, you can buy the extended warranty. The $3500 CPO is to make sure it qualifies, there's things they have to do like put new tires on if the current ones are below a certain tread depth, brakes, etc.
As for your original questions, in the US we have nadaguide and KBB which are used for pricing. Most sellers and dealers will quote KBB so KBB tends to be on the high side. The car is really only worth what the book says it is, the classifieds are filled with ads from people who are looking for more than book because they always feel their car is pristine. But it won't come with any service or support that you would get from a dealer and there are certain things that even a warranty won't cover, but you can get the dealer to do as part of regular negotiations like getting them to do brakes or tires if needed. A private seller probably won't do those or have the resources to get those done.
What it really boils down to is that these cars have great depreciation and you won't have much luck trying to minimize it when you're trying to sell it. You have to charge less than the dealer or no one will be interested. Because of the sales tax in the US, many owners end up trading the car in instead of selling it privately which is why there are few private sales. For instance if you trade in the car for 30k and buy a new one for 60k, you just pay the sales tax on the 30k difference instead of the entire 60k. So in some states, you'd have to get at least 2k over that as a private seller to match what a dealer offers. Maybe they also can't be bothered trying to make a little extra over what the dealer offers.
After talking to the great staff at MB Laval, they accepted to leave it out of the inventory so that I can take some time to decide if I want to buy it. Otherwise, once it's flagged as returned from lease, it could be transfered to any MB dealer around the country through a bidding process...
CPO works the same way here in Canada that's why I refused it. I will most likely purchase an extended warranty before the manufacturer's ends (in a year or 80,000 KM).
I have sold many cars in my lifetime and hae used the black book monthly market value for my cars. It's a good starting point for selling your car, but you have to keep in mind that the local market you're selling in may want to pay less than black book, this is where good negotiation skills are handy.
I'm starting to believe that private selling for these cars is lenghty, and the seller may have to go fareley lower than market value to sell...
Because of the emotional value I atribute to this car, this forum helps me be more objective... thanks guys!
12-05-2015, 07:46 AM
#27
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
E550 2013
Form RUT 50 (if anyone wants to look it up) establishes the tax due on private party sales in Illinois. As I said earlier it is capped. The maximum tax is $1,500 no matter how valuable the car.
If I buy a $50,000 car from a dealer I will pay approx. $5,000 in tax. Same car from a private party is a $1,500 tax bill.
If I buy a $50,000 car from a dealer I will pay approx. $5,000 in tax. Same car from a private party is a $1,500 tax bill.
12-05-2015, 09:41 AM
#28
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 4,920
Received 1,616 Likes
on
1,186 Posts
2014 E550-sold 😩
Yes, and it's funny because I have friends who have bought high valued exotics from private parties($100K and up) where the tax is $1,500 as opposed to $10,000 and higher if they bought from a dealer. These are usually cash sales. My good friend has a used Gallardo coming in this weekend from Oklahoma that is a cash private party sale for over $100K. The tax at title transfer will be $1,500. A big savings.
12-05-2015, 05:56 PM
#30
Super Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Cleveland OHIO
Posts: 638
Likes: 0
Received 35 Likes
on
34 Posts
01 ML55AMG 04 ML500 03 ML350 08 ML63AMG
tell me if I'm wrong here?
12-05-2015, 06:06 PM
#31
Super Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Cleveland OHIO
Posts: 638
Likes: 0
Received 35 Likes
on
34 Posts
01 ML55AMG 04 ML500 03 ML350 08 ML63AMG
Yes, and it's funny because I have friends who have bought high valued exotics from private parties($100K and up) where the tax is $1,500 as opposed to $10,000 and higher if they bought from a dealer. These are usually cash sales. My good friend has a used Gallardo coming in this weekend from Oklahoma that is a cash private party sale for over $100K. The tax at title transfer will be $1,500. A big savings.
Iguess that's why rich get richer and poor get poorer lol. So, that means if a person buys a Kia they will pay more tax than a rich crook will buy a exotic car. That is just WRONG!! anyone agree?
Last edited by IgorE350; 12-05-2015 at 06:15 PM.
12-05-2015, 07:19 PM
#32
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
E550 2013
You can get financing at any bank these days. Dealer there to make $$$ on people and I mean lots of it!!! they r there to rip you off, suck you dry... Privet seller can take a loss, if they really need to sell. America brainwashed everyone now, everyone walk the line they want you to walk lol its funny. tell me if I'm wrong here?
tell me if I'm wrong here?
12-06-2015, 10:18 AM
#33
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 4,920
Received 1,616 Likes
on
1,186 Posts
2014 E550-sold 😩
If you buy a $30,000 used KIA from a private party in Illinois, you pay the same $1,500 max tax instead of the $3,000 you would pay if you bought from a dealer. What is your point again? Rich crook? You are funny.
12-06-2015, 11:38 AM
#34
MBWorld Fanatic!
12-06-2015, 12:05 PM
#35
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 4,920
Received 1,616 Likes
on
1,186 Posts
2014 E550-sold 😩
Rich crook I guess.
12-06-2015, 01:30 PM
#36
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: MA
Posts: 6,077
Received 1,467 Likes
on
1,148 Posts
2008 E350 4Matic, 2011 E350 4matic
He probably meant a higher percentage in taxes than a more expensive car. The point is someone who pays 30k for a car and pays $1500 in taxes isn't getting as much of a tax break as someone who pays 60k for a car and only has to pay $1500. A max tax of $1500 is really a tax break for the rich. And of course we all know that the rich need as many tax breaks as they can get so they can get richer while the poor get poorer.
12-06-2015, 01:40 PM
#37
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Redding, CA
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
94 LSx RX7, 05 C230 Kompressor
For any questions regarding transport of your new vehicle, please give us a call. You can email us direct at sales@angelsmovingautos.com. Transporting vehicles since 2003!
12-07-2015, 09:37 AM
#38
Senior Member
He probably meant a higher percentage in taxes than a more expensive car. The point is someone who pays 30k for a car and pays $1500 in taxes isn't getting as much of a tax break as someone who pays 60k for a car and only has to pay $1500. A max tax of $1500 is really a tax break for the rich. And of course we all know that the rich need as many tax breaks as they can get so they can get richer while the poor get poorer.
12-07-2015, 10:51 AM
#39
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 4,920
Received 1,616 Likes
on
1,186 Posts
2014 E550-sold 😩
Not sure how my point about a tax cap for everyone benefits the purchaser of a higher value car in Illinois, got turned into a rich man/poor man discussion. How does this work if you live in a state with no tax? The poor guy pays no tax on his used Yugo and the rich guy pays no tax on his used Bentley. I assume the rich guy benefits more as well in that case.
12-07-2015, 12:21 PM
#40
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,800
Likes: 0
Received 12 Likes
on
10 Posts
1953 300 Adenauer, 1971 300 SEL 6.3, 1975 600, 1978 450 6.9
It is very simple.
Some states tax cars no matter where they are bought equally
Some states tax private party and dealer sales differently
Some states tax only the difference in value between the new car and a trade
Some states tax the full amount at the regular sales tax rate
Some states tax cars at a different rate
Some states have no tax
The bottom line is that the tax situation in each state is different and a wise consumer needs to educate themselves.
Some states tax cars no matter where they are bought equally
Some states tax private party and dealer sales differently
Some states tax only the difference in value between the new car and a trade
Some states tax the full amount at the regular sales tax rate
Some states tax cars at a different rate
Some states have no tax
The bottom line is that the tax situation in each state is different and a wise consumer needs to educate themselves.
12-14-2015, 10:41 AM
#42
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Southeastern USA
Posts: 2,572
Received 143 Likes
on
102 Posts
2010 E350 Luxury Sedan, Engine 272 (V6)
S.C. super generous
It is very simple.
Some states tax cars no matter where they are bought equally
Some states tax private party and dealer sales differently
Some states tax only the difference in value between the new car and a trade
Some states tax the full amount at the regular sales tax rate
Some states tax cars at a different rate
Some states have no tax
The bottom line is that the tax situation in each state is different and a wise consumer needs to educate themselves.
Some states tax cars no matter where they are bought equally
Some states tax private party and dealer sales differently
Some states tax only the difference in value between the new car and a trade
Some states tax the full amount at the regular sales tax rate
Some states tax cars at a different rate
Some states have no tax
The bottom line is that the tax situation in each state is different and a wise consumer needs to educate themselves.
S.C. also has 2nd lowest gas tax in nation.
12-14-2015, 10:47 AM
#43
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 4,920
Received 1,616 Likes
on
1,186 Posts
2014 E550-sold 😩
But the rich guy just gets richer and that's not fair. 
