the dealership will ignore it til they can't anymore, and thats usually when suspension pieces are falling off. if they'd told you that you needed $10K of rust remediation, would you have paid for the $5500 in other repairs?

 

I have a 2010 E3504atic with 136K miles I live at the opposite end of Ohio from Pierrejoliat and things rusting out on my car in the next 3 years is the least of my concerns. My car drives like new but the engine has a slight hot engine idle knock that has been there for a couple of years. Is it going to worse? I don't know. Is the transmission going to give up the ghost? Right now it is working fine. I do know if it does I can afford to walk away from the car and write off what I have in it as my final Mercedes experience. If not great it's a nice car that is about depreciated out.

What Pierrejolliat, myself and others are saying is that this is not a Honda or a Toyota. It's an reasonably well built and accordingly reliable but expensive car that is not Toyota reliable in the sense that you aren't going to put 200k miles on it with just oil changes. Unless you are able and willing to turn your own wrenches you will have ongoing expenses with this car ranging from $500 to $2500 / year depending on how lucky or unlucky you are. For example somebody mentioned replacing the transmission fluid which should be done every 40k miles. That is in the neighborhood of $400 to 500 service. Tires are $900. etc

I think that odds are in your favor that you can get a couple of years more out of it but it is definitely a risk. Only you can answer whether you can afford the risk.

 

I would definitely get that rear subframe checked.. the car is close to mechanically totaled now, and that would certainly push it over.

If the car isn't close to a rust emergency underneath, you probably have some time left to get your finances in order. I mean this chassis is a taxi in some countries, and not everyone keeps (or desires to) their car in pristine condition like some of us do on the forum. They're expensive to maintain properly but they are not inherently fragile.

How long do you think you need to get straight financially and get out from under it?

 

It depends how well you maintain your car. I always take my car through the car wash a few times during the winter and get the under carriage wash which gets out the salt. I suppose if you never do that, the salt will be there to rust up everything faster. Brake lines rusting out is not that common with these cars but can happen with any car. You could keep this car for a while and not do every maintenance that the dealer suggests, some of that is to just pad their profits. I have had them suggest 4-6k worth of repairs every time I've gone in which isn't that often. Of course some of that is for tires and brakes which are still fine. They did tell me that there was some rust on a power steering line once which they wanted to replace about 4 years ago and it's still fine today. Suspension parts still wear out but those are more gradual, if they haven't been flagged now, you could probably get away with the existing setup for 1-3 years or more. I've also done the rear shocks and the front springs/struts. Haven't done ball joints or tie rods yet. Axle boots can go any time but haven't had to do it on mine yet. There are other issues that will come up later, but that's going to be over the next several years. You don't have engine or transmission problems so no reason to dump it right away. You basically need to be able to do some DIY to cut down on costs or be able to call around to other indys to get competitive prices. No way a car of this vintage should be inside a dealership. The job at the dealership is to find at least 2-6k worth of stuff to do. If there's way more than that, they're probably only going to spot the easy stuff. If there's no easy stuff, they'll look harder. They probably spotted all the easy stuff, don't assume that there isn't more stuff to be found, but if you took it to an indy they might be able to notice other stuff. They can inspect and tell you if it's good or bad, but they can't predict when it will go bad.

 

Leave it up front at the gas station running with the windows down. It won't last long. That's how I got my Benz.

Anyone know how to disable LoJack?

 

Hell no. And this is part of the reason I'm so pissed at this dealer. They called me 3 different times to add additional repairs only after I approved the previous repairs.

Maybe I'm reaching here.. but at a certain point does this start to transition into unscrupulous business practices, etc? Or do we all just give the dealers a free pass to screw over whoever is dumb enough to go to them.

..and all this time I thought that stereotype of the shady mechanic that creates problems to fix was from a hole-in-the-wall shop not a dealership smh.


I feel like part of my decision has already been made for me at this point. What I mean by that, is I don't think the dealer will take the car and waive the repair bill, which means I am likely $5k+ into this vehicle for repairs.

To invest $5k into this car and then turn around and sell it for $5k (right after doing all of those repairs that I don't think increased the value of the vehicle at all) would mean that I literally threw $5k out the window. I mean, am I wrong that I probably could have sold this vehicle for about the same price either before or after all of the repairs that I just did?

Obviously when I take it to an indy, if he says parts of my car are horribly rusted or certain parts are on their way out, then it would be a no-brainer to try to sell it and deal with my outstanding loan but at least I wouldn't have to worry about losing even more money to this sinking ship. But I'm thinking, if I take it to an indy and he says that nothing looks horribly rusted or ready to go, then I should give it at least another year or two?

Would this vehicle really depreciate much more than it already has after another year or so of driving? Is it pretty much at a stable point of low value?



Are you thinking months or years when you say that I have some time? My loan will be paid off after about 2.5 years. Being able to get through even another year (or 2) on this car without having to try to pay off a $10k loan out of pocket would make life a heck of a lot easier.

If I take it to an indy and he tells me parts of my car are severely rusted or that it's hanging on by a thread, I would definitely bite the bullet and sell it, pay off my loan or see about rolling it into another loan with the original bank for a new, cheaper make of car.


Man I really wish I thought to do under carriage washes, that's such a smart and cheap thing that probably goes a really long way.

And I am sorry to beat a dead horse here but, if the indy looks at a part, are the only conclusions good or bad? I know I'm the newbie here but it would seem logical to me that it would be based on more of a spectrum of condition such as brand new, great, good, worn, broken, etc.

The only reason I'm even asking this is because I feel like this is exactly the type of information that would help me make the optimal decision. I think you guys probably get what I'm saying but for example, if the indy were to say a.) my break lines look perfect and show little wear, b.) they look like they are very worn with some rust, or c.) saying they look like they are about to go, etc. I just thought it would be more of a spectrum of condition versus only good or bad. Not trying to make this overly complicated, just looking for a way out of this by hopefully using as much specific information as I can get from an indy to try and make the most educated decision I can. I already found an indy that offered to look at my car for free in NYC (obviously I would still pay him something for his time if I ended up not getting any repairs done). Thank you again for everyone who has taken the time to reply, it is beyond appreciated.

 

Have you given any thought into becoming a life coach?

 

The rusting issues mentioned earlier are not that common. Can't really say it's fine but with the dealer already looking at it, there's a good chance there's nothing wrong. Normally what you want is called the PPI, the pre-purchase inspection but you already own it. Normally you just take it to the dealer and ask for the PPI and they go through it and charge you for an hour of labor. At this point, you have nothing wrong with it aside from what was already pointed out. If they're telling you to replace the muffler because of a dent, it doesn't sound like they could find much else wrong with it. So I wouldn't go too crazy that its on it's last leg, it's not like the car is making some funny noise or you can't get it started. I'd take it to an indy that can change the fluid cheaply and ask if there's anything else wrong. Your main issue was that you were having the dealer maintain it. These cars don't have that many issues. Granted any car can have issues any time, but this one is not as bad as the previous generation W211. There are many problems mentioned in the various threads, some are very common and some are very rare, don't get hung up on the ones that are rare. Haven't had any issues with rusting, brake lines or other suspension issues or transfer case issues. Most complex so far was a leaking axle seal, but if you had that, the dealer would have mentioned it.

 

Thanks that is very reassuring to hear.

From what you're saying, it sounds like if I take it to an indy and he doesn't find anything majorly wrong, I should hopefully be okay holding onto this car for the time being.

Are you saying that the muffler doesn't really need to be fixed? Or just that it's not really urgent? Is there any issue or further damage that driving with a damaged muffler can cause to other parts of the vehicle? (yes, I am that inept at car anatomy)

If there is literally no other problem that continuing to drive with a damaged muffler would cause, then I wouldn't bother fixing it but if there is any potential damage or issue that could arise from the muffler I think I'd want to get it taken care of with the flush.

 

My take:
Stop worrying. Just drive it. If something breaks, fix it. Maintain the fluids and wearable parts (brakes, wipers, tires)
It really is that simple.

 

I tend to keep old cars forever and pour money in only when absolutely necessary. I wouldn't replace a muffler on an old car until it rusts out and makes noises or falls off. i don't understand what kind of flush is being recommended, but flushes are usually preventive medicine and not something "necessary" to me.

You owe what you owe. It's water over the dam. In the future look for a good indy, as many others have suggested. Go to a few and ask about the muffler. If they recommend replacement, ask them to show you why. Rust and holes are easy to see even for mechanical incompetents like me.

You don't say how many miles per year you drive, but that is a big factor in whether problems will crop up, which absolutely no one here can predict. It's always a risk. It's likely that the dealer has overstated, not understated, the repairs the car needed, and you're already indebted for those repairs. More water over the dam.

It it were me, and I still liked and enjoyed driving the car, I would take the risk and drive a MB (or any car) with 133K miles, as is, for the next 2.5 years until the loan is paid off. After that, you can decide whether to sell the car or keep it even longer, maybe until it dies.

 

Yes, there's nothing wrong with the car. No engine or transmission problems and you haven't mentioned anything else. Dealers always find stuff to fix but some of it is borderline like the muffler. If it doesn't sound loud at all, no need to fix it. It's not even that common for those to go, can't even find an aftermarket one. Mufflers these days are stainless steel and last a pretty long time, usually about the lifetime of the car. A big dent might restrict the exhaust flow, a little one probably not at all. Post a pic if you can see it. Right or left muffler? Looks like you can get the left or right on eBay for $100. Muffler shop could probably toss it on for a hundred or so. Probably even cheaper at a local junkyard. Way less than $1500 at the dealer. But as mentioned earlier, probably don't need it. Key to repairs is to look up the part number and then search to see if you can find aftermarket or used parts or even new parts cheaper from some other vendor. I haven't actually used EPC to look up to see if those are the correct part numbers. Always verify the part numbers before ordering, just wanted to give you an idea how cheaper things can be if you do a little work instead of letting the dealer do everything.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2010-2013-M...e/264647554484

https://www.ebay.com/itm/08-12-Merce...1/284170381873

 

Post a pic or two of this beast already! Let's see what we're dealing with.

 

If I have to take my car to a dealer (any brand dealer), it's for a reason I've identified myself. I listen to what they suggest be fixed -- knowing that they will ALWAYS troll me for dollars -- and I pick what I want fixed. I always expect them to find additional work needed. But I remind myself to simply say NO to items I don't think necessary. Afterall, I took the car to them knowing what needed to be fixed, not what they find to "fix" in addition.

Bottom line, they won't -- can't -- fix something they "find" if you tell them, "just fix what I've agreed to fix, and can the rest."

Lately, I've had a tire dealer refuse to rotate my tires on my E350 unless I replace all the tires instead, because one tire of the four had a small curb blemish in the sidewall. (I had already driven the tire for 2-years without incident, knowing the blemish was there since I acquired the car... the tire had 9/32" tread and was almost new.) I told them I wasn't buying tires today, and that if they wanted to sell me four new tires six months later, they'll rotate the tires as I requested. They refused. I chuckled, and left. They are not the only tire store in town. And that store did NOT have my business six months later, either.

 

I could work on your car, "accidentally" poke a hole in the fuel rail, boom, engine fire. Toasted the whole thing by the time (we call 10-15 min after the blaze starts) the fire department showed up. Happens all the time...

 

As Cetialpha noted, the exhaust system is Stainless Steel. The SS exhaust system in my 2001 C320 is now 20-years old, and sounds factory new -- as I bought it -- whether it has a dent or not (I haven't bothered to look).

 

ok, and then the insurance company settles for the $8,000 (generous) that the car is worth and he is stuck with the remainder of debt and now no car. Plus, you have insurance fraud jail time. Sounds legit.

 

You should always get a second opinion on dealer recommended repairs. For example, I had my 2010 e350 in there last week to get my windshield washer reservoir replaced. I have an aftermarket warranty that covered it. While there, the dealer told my my right front axle boot was looking and as a result the front axle needed to be replaced ($2k). Knowing I had the warranty, they called and tried to get the repair approved by the warranty company, but since the boot was ripped, they wouldn’t cover that b/c that is a sign of neglect (basically they would cover if there was some clicking noise or something). So, I told the dealer to hold off on the repair of the axle as I didn’t want to spend the 2k on that. I went to my local indy the next day, we put the car up on the lift and did not see one rip on any of the boots or anything leaking from them. Everything was in great shape and did not need any repair.
bottom line is they were trying to milk the warranty company. So, never trust the dealer and always get a second opinion.

 

Thank you. A little ironic coming from someone named rapidoxidation, only because I will first be having an indy check my car for any issues that the dealer may have missed - including any rust issues. Then, if no major issues are found, hopefully I will be able to follow your advice.

Thank you, I will definitely be taking this car to an indy.

For the flushes, wouldn't it always be better to do them as preventative medicine though, rather than waiting until they become necessary? Wouldn't waiting until something becomes an issue only cause more potential problems? Or does it not work like that?

I would say, between my GF and me, we put about 10k miles on the car each year.

This post might have just saved me tens of thousands of dollars going forward for any car I ever own. Thank you for that. I can't believe how simple it is. I literally paid the dealership an arm and a leg just to click an order button a few times... man..

Are there usually certain types of shops that are more cool with me ordering parts and having them shipped to them to put on or is it more of a crap shoot?

I will try to post pics as soon as I am near the car, GF has the car right now.


Man that's crazy. That tire dealer must have a lot of customers to turn you away, or they just refused to take you based on principle (that they couldn't rip you off)

I can't believe how naive I was before all of this happened. I thought the dealership of all places would have SOME sorts of standards or regulations to follow so they can't be this loose with repair recommendations


Let's just hope nobody dies or gets severely injured.

I'll have an indy check to see if the damage warrants replacing it. At some point if the damage is bad enough then it would need to be replaced right?


Yea I don't want to go to jail if I can help it. Any solutions that don't involve potential jail time are what I'm looking for.

So the dealer f'd up their little scheme to milk the warranty company by making up the wrong type of issue that warranty doesn't cover? Man.. HOW can these dealers just get away with this kind of stuff. It's like the wild west with no standards. I get the reason they do it is probably either greed or survival but either way, I still don't understand how they can get away with some of this stuff.

 

I think you may be right. Plus, a huge car fire would probably attract a lot of unwanted attention. OP, do you happen to live near a large body of water?

 

Not all dealers are scummy and not all indys are saints... so let's not paint with a wide brush. Unless you have a trusted relationship, I would always get a second option/price on any high-tickets items. No different than bidding a contractor or company to perform work at your house.

 

Spot on. Why is this thread still a "thing"

Enough coddling. Figure it out, OP. Time to grow up. Good luck.

 

Yes I agree, I don't think all dealers or any group of people are scummy. I was just asking how the dealers that are scummy are able to get away with recommending unnecessary repairs, etc. I thought there must be some type of regulatory body or standards that they must adhere to. Obviously I was wrong about this but that was why I trusted them in the beginning and didn't think they would lie to my face. Lesson learned for sure.


LOL if you wanna call people taking the time to respond to my post with actual helpful information and support instead of offering ridiculous insurance fraud scenarios, "coddling," have at it.

All of the valuable input I received from everyone that replied helped me figure out a way out of this mess (or at least what I initially thought was a mess).

Guys, maybe this didn't come across in my posts, maybe it did.. but I was losing sleep, stressed and panicked, in a nightmare scenario basically, at least for me it was. Thanks to everyone here, I now have an actionable game plan; visit an indy for more information and hopefully keep the vehicle instead of trying to just sell it in a panic while being out the $5k+ in repairs. I really can't thank you guys enough (yes even you Senecan for lightening the mood). I did not expect to get so much support as a first-time poster on this forum. You guys really helped me out here. THANK YOU

 

There's lots of indys out there, you don't have to use one that specializes in MB. Most of the stuff is pretty basic like transmission fluid changes. Looking around most indys want anywhere from $200-$350 for the fluid change job, maybe less if you can bring your own fluid as they seem to throw in $70-$100 for the fluid and filter and as I just mentioned, it's much cheaper if you can get the fluid from a shell distributor and just buy the filter online. You'd have to call the indy to see if they allow that when pricing out the job. Strangely Mercedes typically allows it as long as it an MB part. Just search around, here's a couple sites that will refer you to local shops, check their reviews on yelp. Some places like Firestone and Aamco get bad reviews, but that varies from shop to shop, some are loved and some are hated, check the reviews first.

https://repairpal.com/estimator

https://app.openbay.com/

https://www.yourmechanic.com

 

What makes this forum invaluable is the willingness of lots of members who to share their considerable skills and knowledge with other members. This forum combined with a willingness and some skills to do some work yourself plus a good indy render these cars a tremendous value proposition for people that truly enjoy them.