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A dongle based scanner worth a look for now - Xtool A30M
Gents,
This is the Xtool A30M bluetooth based scanner, which you use your own tablet or smartphone as the screen.
Its review been very good so far, and I mean even for MB cars.
I just ordered one. End of month it should arrive.
Why did I buy this ? Now is only US$179 instead of US$250 ish.
01. Surely it has to be bi-directional and work well on MB cars and other cars too.
02. Now I want a wireless version like my Autel MS906BT.but using my own 10" tablet, so save me money but I can be under the car or at engine bay and still can access the screen to do bidirectional command.
03. NO UPDATE FEE EVER ( even if Xtool screwed me up in 5 years and charges update fee, 5 years is a long time and this US$179 unit is too cheap to ignore for its capabilities )
My Autel subcription is expiring this August and they wanted US$683 for 2 years...no way I will pay for that, because my car is a 2014 and there is no use to update anything anymore.
Xtool seems to be using also Launch based software. Same as ThinkCar and TopDon. I will confirm when I mess with it.
Similar capable bi-directional bluetooth based wireless unit without a screen, the worthy competitor now are from :
- Topdon
- ThinkCar/ThinkDiag
Of which both will demand US$100 a year subscription fee and if you don't pay, the apps will not even work so I read. That is so evil.
So they lock user from the Apps side and not the hardware side.
I believe the hardware is sold cheap, maximum US$100 for the mentioned 2 with 1 or 2 years free use before update.
Today all these Chinese scanners are getting better and better and they are killing each other using price war or sales incentive free update X years or unlimited.
Its a good time to enjoy their war
I already have :
01. Autel MS906BT - mid range was US$1,500 ish with 2 years free update and Indonesian based price and support by the Indonesian distributor. Now much cheaper.
02. Xentry high quality super duper fast C4 and Benzninja lifetime paid support. Provide our own laptop no 2.
03. Xentry cheapo passthru version using OpenPort 2.0 genuine (US$180) and clone one (US$30). Provide our own laptop no 1.
04. Cheapo wired type but VERY GOOD Launch Creader Elite for BENZ only ( US$165). I really love this baby scanner, but its screen too small my eyes hurt. This generally can beat the Autel for my car.
05. Junk icarsoft MB v2.0 wired type , which was US$150 I think and that was my very first scanner in 2018 or 2019 which by today's competition price-capability standard this is a piece of SH-iet in function and capability and non bi-directional
If a newbie use icarsoft MB v2.0 they can miss a lot DTC and get confused too. Its just the software is so primitive. Difficult to explain unless you own it and compare it to say a Launch Creader Elite for BENZ.
Oky doky, that is the update on scanner for today.
I think you are wrong about demand for $100 subscription.
I have AP/Ht200, who cost me $49 and the annual payment is for updates, when the scanner still works without it.
I bought license for Sprinter, when additional for sedan would be $20.
$179 is a lot for scanner those days. It better had adaptations possible and good troubleshooting pages?
Your Autel AP200 US$60 today is not bi-directional. That is a different pricing level compared to one which can do bi-directional.
Autel AP200 is US$21.99 per 1 extra car brand software if you want to add on top of 1 free car brand software you get.
Yes, 1 time software fee only, so no update fee ever.
Why I want Xtool A30M is because its has all car brands included in its price and no update fee like ThinkDiag or TopDon similar capable unit. I want all car brands capability, like my Autel MS906BT.
AA. US$179 / US$22 = 8 cars software equivalent in Autel AP200.
BB. Can do bi-directional command, this alone worth a lot of money. I place this capability as a US$100 at retail.
CC. Adaptations, I have to test it when I get it. Its not important the Adaptation for me as I have other scanners which can do that.
Not able to do bi-directional command is a big waste of time and money* ( *when you need to visit a workshop eventually ) for a DIY troubleshooter if this capability cost us this cheap , today.
I give you an example :
Let say : Your headlight high beam won't turn ON, what do you do with an Autel AP 200 which can not do bi-directional command ?
01. You check the bulb, assuming the car is not yet a facelift with ILS LED code 640/641. Bulb is OK. What next ?
02. You check the fuses, also OK. What next ?
03. You then tear down the steering column because that is where the headlight high beam command stalk is, hoping you find a cut wire or damaged wire or whatever. What do you see ?
Nothing to see, the high beam command is not a true mechanical switching, it is a soft or signal switching using data bus.
You have wasted so much time and could have done more damage by tearing up the steering column. Hopefully the steering airbag did not explode by accident
With bi-directional command you can command the high beam using the scanner, to see if this is a power supply issue or a command issue ?
You can verify the headlight stalk command is working or not using bi-directional scanner button/switch/stalk test feature, so no need to teardown the steering column.
How about VVT solenoid, how do you test it with Autel AP200 ?
That power to VVT solenoid is PWM type, you can't simply jump a 12V into it, here is where bi-directional comes handy and priceless.
Our cars to operate almost everything, are commands via software or data bus, no more truly mechanical like the old days where we can troubleshoot simply using a DMM or test light.
Since trouble on devices are mainly caused by 4 possibilities :
- The command to the device is 25% of the problem. This command may be direct to the actual target device data bus or re-routed to other modules data bus before finally arriving to the actual target device.
- Power/ground is the other 25% of the problem
- CAN-BUS which is where the command is "carried by" is the other 25%,
- The other 25% is when the device is actually defective.
Scanner need to be able to do bi-directional so that we can COMMAND the device without tearing open anything yet and confirm is the command part OK or not ?
Gasline, Fuel filter change, 3 phase type fuel pump. No bi-directional capability means you can not DIY the fuel filter replacement safely.
- Need to empty/reduce the tank fuel level to the safe level at the saddle side with the fuel pump, as you need to open it too to access the hose towards the fuel filter.
- You can prime the fuel line into the engine and not damage or wound your HP fuel pump plunger from short duration fuel starvation.
- One can not jumper a 3 phase fuel pump using 12V, no way, it will burn and cost you high $$.
Our cars are aging, there will be more maintenance to do which can be done with better safety and/or faster and/or do-able only when and if using a bi-directional scanner.
If you ask me to get only 1 scanner under US$200, which one I will get for my MB car ?
The Launch Creader Elite for MB, this I will choose over anything else, at this point in time in 2023 July.
However, if one really want to go deep into our MB cars DIY, I highly suggest to also get the Xentry Passthru version using the Chinese cheapo Open-Port clone OBD interface.
With your own laptop already available, getting the hacked Xentry passthru program and the Open-Port clone OBD interface is under US$60 for sure.
Why would you need one ? One can not troubleshoot electrical/data-bus issues without MB WIS documents and the wiring diagram , in Ebay it is cheap this knock off MB WIS version , maybe US$20 at the most.
Only Xentry describe or name modules as per the MB WIS documents and wiring diagram. Well they both belong to MB.
There will be a time when using an aftermarket scanner will misled you big time because the modules name are not accurate and the DTC description is not a 100% accurate and you will spend days
wasting your time trying to find which is the correct modules or the correct wiring diagram from the MB WIS to use. I will post such case studies soon. I got two interesting ones.
For the level you are saying, other choice I know is MaxiEcu
They do everything on cars, short of SCN coding and I think they are working on it as well.
I have older MaxiEcu and it is way above my software skills, so each time I use it, I have to spend time figuring it out.
But free updated for life and site showing all supported modules is hard to beat. Bad part of it -being European scanner they are slow to support modules installed on US models.
True is that my Bluetecs run perfect lately and I have extended warranty on them due to Bluetec settlement, so can't complain.
None of those scanners fit on my 1922 Ford T though.
Unlike Launch which totally does not want to show LIN buses, Xtool tried to show them like Autel, but this version of MB Sotware V12.40 of Xtool seems to have bugs and was not able to
display 4 LIN based modules , but at the same time made 1 mistake at module no 42 - Analog Clock hahahah.
Autel had once also showed 1 extra LIN based module which made total 48 modules on my car, instead of 47 the actual number of modules as per Xentry.
However, Xentry does not show all 100% of the LIN based device too, but you can access them and do get DTC when thing goes wrong with those devices.
LIN based modules I know not shown on any scanner inlcuding Xentry during a full scan are :
1 - LIN connection to alternator. I forgot what is the name or its ID.
2 - LIN connection to a small board N135 at steering wheel, where the tranny UP/DOWN and all switches on steering are managed by.
3 - LIN connection to N89 AUX Tranny oil pump if Start-Stop car.
THE FUEL PUMP MENTIONED HERE IS A 3 PHASE FUEL PUMP
The fuel pump activation is a total failure for this software version MB V12.40 Xtool.
The fuel pump will not RUN when I use actuation/bi-directional.
The FUEL Pump menu also has a bug, when you press BACK-PAGE, it sometimes go to engine page but still retaining screen or page title as FUEL PUMP. Below :
When software is not in cuckcoo mode, it will go to BACK-PAGE of the correct one, the Fuel Pump page.
=================
The Launch will run the fuel pump, but the Amperage and Volt data always zero. So must use our ears. MB software version V50.16
======================
The Autel once went cuckoo to for fuel pump activation by not showing amperage and voltage but fuel pump will run, on one of its previous updated MB software, but the latest version today v18.76 is good.
Below is MB software v18.76 the good one.
So what is my personal take on the Xtool A30M ?
I like it and it is worth the money because it is multiple cars and NO UPDATE FEE ever, bi-directional able to do actuations and is wireless.
My android Samsung tablet is 2019 model and only 32GB memory..
So I did not download all cars, I only downloaded some and I maintain my Android tablet to be at 30Gb full only, allow net of 2Gb for its other operation.
If only for MB car and under US$200 budget and I can't buy other scanners, will I choose this over baby Launch Creader Elite for MB US$169 ?
NOPE, I will STILL choose Launch Creader Elite for MB for now, 19th July 2023 if a single brand use, regardless that this baby Launch is a wired version.
Getting more scanner time with this A30M little unit.
The moment I got the issues as posted on post number #5, they got back to me fast.
In fact they created a beta version within a few days, but it did not solve the fuel pump bi-directional control which this A30M simply can not command.
They did fix the issue on the intermittent error of how the Fuel Pump test page could jump into Engine Computer test page.
This A30M did well on my cousin's old Mitsubishi SUV of 2008, where my Autel can't even connect to it.
Back to MB, my E400.
Because I replaced the 4 of the footwell bubs with LED, at times when certain condition are met, the Front SAM which is the controlling module will detect the bulb is no more an incan bulb by seeing
a very low power consumption and will trigger a DTC. Usually STORED one and not CURRENT, because as I said, only when certain condition are met....the Front SAM deemed this as a problem and then next door opening
everything deemed OK by Front SAM.
So the DTC would be below :
.
================
Now, when I saw the result of the full scan, I saw 3 other DTCs at 3 other modules. These 3 modules are LIN based modules and not a CAN BUS type modules.
HHmmm, what the hell are these DTC ?
So need to enter into each module one by one. I got a surprise.............
.
.
LOL......... the same DTC belonging to Front SAM are echoed at these 3 modules.
This wont be the case with Xentry , because this DTC belongs and will only be to/for Front SAM.
This DTC is not a shared information type which is needed by other modules. I don't know the exact terminology , sorry.
Let me explain : What do I mean by This DTC is not a shared information type
Some important information which a few modules will also need, that is a shared information type of broadcast or correct working state.
Example, if say one of the wheel speed sensor went bad, this DTC is automatically echoed by modules where by design needing this shared information, example Instrument Cluster, ESP system and Engine Computer and probably Tranny computer too.
So it wont be an anomaly if many modules will report the same DTC of a failed wheel speed sensor.
I think Xtool MB software is not "mature enough" , as such it has this harmless but waste of time screw-up.
My baby Launch Elite Creader has similar issues too, but it will report a DTC which is not true, regarding parking light ...LOL. It is actually worse, if it is your only scanner. You will be chasing phantom DTC.
However, I am pleased that Xtool responded fast and willing to be honest and accept reported issues.
Big name like Launch and Autel won't respond so fast or may not respond at all, depending on which country the Autel/Launch is sold too by by whom.
Autel MS906BT for me in my 2 years ownership, like 5 version of MB software, also has their screw up too. Since I bought it locally, I report to their Indonesian distributor but the actual fix took so long,
like 6+ months later.
I am not saying Xentry is perfect, Xentry has its own quirks on the SPECIFIED value which may not be actually suitable for your engine version, but your actual value maybe shown as RED color
meaning it is not within SPECIFIED value..... but actually it is not true....
One example for M276 3.0 Turbo is the duty cycle of the vacuum control solenoid for the turbocharger wastegate controller. A healthy solenoid % value shown as RED or under the SPECIFIED value.... LOL.
07-10-2023, 02:31 AM
