EQE Loaner
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From: Louisville, KY
2023 EQE350 4MATIC, 2023 EQE 350 4MATIC SUV, 2015 E250 BlueTEC 4MATIC, 1995 E300 Diesel
I'm not making fun of you at all and didn't mean to pick on you. Just took your justification as an example. I'm simply pointing out that projecting one's own anecdotal experience onto the rest of the population isn't gonna make EVs work any better for them, and is completely irrelevant to OP being an elderly widower. Gotta know your audience if you are trying to convince anyone.
But yes, you're absolutely correct. YMMV applies to everything. I'm not here to tell everyone they must switch to an EV. I *love* a good MB combustion engine as much as the next MB enthusiast (I've been an MB fanboy since my dad bought his first W124, a 260E in 1988), but for me and my purposes, EVs are the better buy today.
Last edited by bytemaster0; Dec 16, 2024 at 07:15 PM.
Out Of Control!!
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From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
Oh, I know, I was being a bit facetious for humor, lol. I agree. Anecdotes don't make for a statistical representation. Extremely important in my field of work! However, enough anecdotes do start to add up as statistics. I do know that in some areas, infrastructure, apartment charging options, commute distances, etc., just aren't ready. However, in others, I'm surprised about how fast it's expanding. I live in Louisville, KY. You'd expect a state like Kentucky to be one of the literal last places on earth to have competent EV infrastructure. However, that is very much counter to the reality. As an example, there are over 40 new DC fast chargers approved or in construction around major corridors, in a state of 4.5 million. Many of those NEVI. Add to this the explosion of non-NEVI sites in cities like Louisville, where I see new DCFC stations coming up every month. I just found two brand new sites - across the interstate from each other! (BP Pulse - they are Tritium units, which is a bit scary given their reliability quirks, but still, they're there, and they work for now). EA reliability has gone way up from just a year ago, and the stats reflect it. We now have over 11 DCFC stations in Metro Louisville alone, which is up from less than 3 a year ago.
But yes, you're absolutely correct. YMMV applies to everything. I'm not here to tell everyone they must switch to an EV. I *love* a good MB combustion engine as much as the next MB enthusiast (I've been an MB fanboy since my dad bought his first W124, a 260E in 1988), but for me and my purposes, EVs are the better buy today.
But yes, you're absolutely correct. YMMV applies to everything. I'm not here to tell everyone they must switch to an EV. I *love* a good MB combustion engine as much as the next MB enthusiast (I've been an MB fanboy since my dad bought his first W124, a 260E in 1988), but for me and my purposes, EVs are the better buy today.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,030
Likes: 492
From: Louisville, KY
2023 EQE350 4MATIC, 2023 EQE 350 4MATIC SUV, 2015 E250 BlueTEC 4MATIC, 1995 E300 Diesel
I'm also very interested to see how MB HPC and Ionna's networks build out. I've charged at MB HPC at Buc'ee's in Richmond, KY and it was a great experience. Hopefully more like it.
As always, a good discussion!
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GLE 580
Absolutely, and there's a good reason for them, which is to jump-start growth. I know that a lot of people favor "eliminate subsidies and let the winner be dominant" but it's a bit different than that. There are strong arguments to be made that all domestic oil production is subsidized, as an example, to the tune of about $36bn/year or so, give or take $10bn. Tax breaks, subsidies, loans, grants, it all falls roughly in the same ballpark. I don't know the history of gas stations as well as I should, so I don't know how much they were subsidized (if at all) by the government in early days. But I do know that the oil production currently is, and has been for a long time. So, there's no real level playing field either way.
I'm also very interested to see how MB HPC and Ionna's networks build out. I've charged at MB HPC at Buc'ee's in Richmond, KY and it was a great experience. Hopefully more like it.
As always, a good discussion!
I'm also very interested to see how MB HPC and Ionna's networks build out. I've charged at MB HPC at Buc'ee's in Richmond, KY and it was a great experience. Hopefully more like it.
As always, a good discussion!
https://www.imf.org/en/Publications/...37281?hl=en-US
"Globally, fossil fuel subsidies were $7 trillion in 2022 or 7.1 percent of GDP"
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From: Cincinnati
2010 E350 4Matic
Don't forget, there are $7.5 billion to be had from Biden's infrastructure act to build EV chargers. That's jobs and money for states to grab, so not much of a surprise that Kentucky wants a slice of that money. Incentives are a huge factor when it comes to EVs. We pretty much already know what happens when the incentives go away. Germany did that and for the first time, EV registrations dropped by 14%. Like I always half joke about outlet stores. They sell the stuff nobody wanted until there were financial incentives and everybody thinks they got a deal.
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From: Occupied Palestine
2025 Maserati Grecale Folgore and 2024 Jaguar F-PACE SVR
There's a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs and people still believe they're living in a free-market society? Bwahahaha! 
People in China will be living like The Jetsons in 10 years and Americans like The Flintstones. EVs outsell ICE vehicles on the other side of the planet RIGHT NOW. And they have things like battery swapping that takes 5 minutes and you don't even have to get out of the car. That might help if, say, you were handicapped and couldn't. So all you old farts better get with the program. There's no stopping this revolution.
People in China will be living like The Jetsons in 10 years and Americans like The Flintstones. EVs outsell ICE vehicles on the other side of the planet RIGHT NOW. And they have things like battery swapping that takes 5 minutes and you don't even have to get out of the car. That might help if, say, you were handicapped and couldn't. So all you old farts better get with the program. There's no stopping this revolution.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 11,432
Likes: 5,342
From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
Absolutely, and there's a good reason for them, which is to jump-start growth. I know that a lot of people favor "eliminate subsidies and let the winner be dominant" but it's a bit different than that. There are strong arguments to be made that all domestic oil production is subsidized, as an example, to the tune of about $36bn/year or so, give or take $10bn. Tax breaks, subsidies, loans, grants, it all falls roughly in the same ballpark. I don't know the history of gas stations as well as I should, so I don't know how much they were subsidized (if at all) by the government in early days. But I do know that the oil production currently is, and has been for a long time. So, there's no real level playing field either way.
I'm also very interested to see how MB HPC and Ionna's networks build out. I've charged at MB HPC at Buc'ee's in Richmond, KY and it was a great experience. Hopefully more like it.
As always, a good discussion!
I'm also very interested to see how MB HPC and Ionna's networks build out. I've charged at MB HPC at Buc'ee's in Richmond, KY and it was a great experience. Hopefully more like it.
As always, a good discussion!
I have no issues with subsidizing and securing our energy supply and level the playing field for everybody, but I have issues with stacking the market with my tax $ in favor of a few companies and specific products. I'm all in with decarbonizing our energy supply. The products will naturally follow, but I take issue with giving people money to buy specific products.
Last edited by superswiss; Dec 16, 2024 at 10:47 PM.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 11,432
Likes: 5,342
From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
EVs are not designed to save the climate. They are designed to save the car. Smartest thing I've heard so far somebody say. It was James May who said it in a recent interview. He's an EV proponent by the way.
Last edited by superswiss; Dec 17, 2024 at 01:26 AM.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: Louisville, KY
2023 EQE350 4MATIC, 2023 EQE 350 4MATIC SUV, 2015 E250 BlueTEC 4MATIC, 1995 E300 Diesel
This is exactly on point. I agree, there are far better climate-conscious ways to have transportation than a car, that is clear. Same for a house, or anything else. I think there will always be a pressure of individual liberty and choice versus the common good. No question about that. However, there *are* clear benefits to EV proliferation beyond just feeling like you're doing something for the climate. We power our cars only on solar energy save for the occasional road trip, which definitely has cut most of that part of the carbon cycle. Also, as batteries are recycled, 95% of raw materials can be extracted, which dramatically lowers the per-vehicle production carbon footprint. But yeah, they're definitely not the most carbon-conscious transportation method.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 11,432
Likes: 5,342
From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
This is exactly on point. I agree, there are far better climate-conscious ways to have transportation than a car, that is clear. Same for a house, or anything else. I think there will always be a pressure of individual liberty and choice versus the common good. No question about that. However, there *are* clear benefits to EV proliferation beyond just feeling like you're doing something for the climate. We power our cars only on solar energy save for the occasional road trip, which definitely has cut most of that part of the carbon cycle. Also, as batteries are recycled, 95% of raw materials can be extracted, which dramatically lowers the per-vehicle production carbon footprint. But yeah, they're definitely not the most carbon-conscious transportation method.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: Louisville, KY
2023 EQE350 4MATIC, 2023 EQE 350 4MATIC SUV, 2015 E250 BlueTEC 4MATIC, 1995 E300 Diesel
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 11,432
Likes: 5,342
From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
Net-metered, no battery. While your statement is technically correct - energy going to the charge port at night is coming from 100% fossil fuel sources, load reduction during the day is still load reduction during the day. Less CO2 is generated, and mathematically, it's a wash. If were the only customer using power with a power plant, then the argument makes no sense. However, when I generate excess, there are consumers for it; it's not just wasted as heat. The net result is still a carbon emissions reduction. Less CO2 will have been generated, net, by driving an EV and generating excess PV power. We also tend to charge a lot during the day, so that helps the supply/demand adjustment curve anyway.
On a related note, what I like to do these days is look at the clean electricity forecast in the Apple Home app. It's been enlightening to see when clean electricity is actually available. Often when I think the electricity should be clean, it's actually not. I also keep an eye on my usage. As you can see I'm currently at 14 kWh average per day, and it's higher this week due to the colder weather. For context the US daily average is around 30 kWh. During the summer I'm around 10 kWh, because where I live I don't need to run an AC all day. So even though I still drive an ICE, albeit only for about 4000 miles a year, I save in other areas. I guess the point I'm kinda trying to make is unless one measures their energy usage and is conscious about it, it's more virtue signaling than anything.
Last edited by superswiss; Dec 17, 2024 at 02:23 PM.
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GLE 580
That is not necessarily true what you say about excess energy. Here in California we actually now produce more renewable energy than we can use during the day, so it literally gets wasted or we have to pay other states to take it off of our hands and then at night we have to bring the dirty plants online, because all that excess energy is gone. There is work going on to build central battery storage, so we can store this excess energy, but it's still gonna take a while.
On a related note, what I like to do these days is look at the clean electricity forecast in the Apple Home app. It's been enlightening to see when clean electricity is actually available. Often when I think the electricity should be clean, it's actually not. I also keep an eye on my usage. As you can see I'm currently at 14 kWh average per day, and it's higher this week due to the colder weather. For context the US daily average is around 30 kWh. During the summer I'm around 10 kWh, because where I live I don't need to run an AC all day. So even though I still drive an ICE, albeit only for about 4000 miles a year, I save in other areas. I guess the point I'm kinda trying to make is unless one measures their energy usage and is conscious about it, it's more virtue signaling than anything.
On a related note, what I like to do these days is look at the clean electricity forecast in the Apple Home app. It's been enlightening to see when clean electricity is actually available. Often when I think the electricity should be clean, it's actually not. I also keep an eye on my usage. As you can see I'm currently at 14 kWh average per day, and it's higher this week due to the colder weather. For context the US daily average is around 30 kWh. During the summer I'm around 10 kWh, because where I live I don't need to run an AC all day. So even though I still drive an ICE, albeit only for about 4000 miles a year, I save in other areas. I guess the point I'm kinda trying to make is unless one measures their energy usage and is conscious about it, it's more virtue signaling than anything.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2018
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From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Louisville, KY
2023 EQE350 4MATIC, 2023 EQE 350 4MATIC SUV, 2015 E250 BlueTEC 4MATIC, 1995 E300 Diesel
Totally understand. We measure with two smart meters, one in the mains panel and one at the meter. All sub circuits monitored and consumption reduced as much as possible. We try to make good on what we do, and not be the virtue signaling type. I can certainly say that in KY, where combined residential and utility scale solar is less than 1% of production capacity, we have no duck curve, and that all our excess is used. Were we in a high-solar proliferation state, we'd definitely have a battery.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 11,432
Likes: 5,342
From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
Totally understand. We measure with two smart meters, one in the mains panel and one at the meter. All sub circuits monitored and consumption reduced as much as possible. We try to make good on what we do, and not be the virtue signaling type. I can certainly say that in KY, where combined residential and utility scale solar is less than 1% of production capacity, we have no duck curve, and that all our excess is used. Were we in a high-solar proliferation state, we'd definitely have a battery.
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From: Cincinnati
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Interesting comment but you didn't answer the question. Here I will give you the answer. It won't. And why not, because it's incentivization is not the well being of the planet.
Last edited by MBNUT1; Dec 17, 2024 at 06:28 PM.
Out Of Control!!
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From: San Francisco Bay Area
2019 C63CS
I didn't answer because your question was not related to EVs. As said, they won't solve the climate issues. To answer your question, we have to incentivize the global energy market to steer energy production into the right direction and not the products that consume said energy. As long as it's cheap to operate coal plants, anything we do here is gonna be offset by India and China building more and more coal plants. Climate is a global issue and anybody who thinks they can solve it locally by incentivizing EVs doesn't understand that.
Last edited by superswiss; Dec 17, 2024 at 06:44 PM.
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I have to pretty much disagree with this assessment. Subsidizing oil doesn't directly subsidize car purchases. It subsidizes a large part of our entire energy supply. Transportation is only like 10-15%. Electricity is equally subsidized. From fossil plants burning subsidized fossil fuels to plants themselves getting tax breaks, nowadays renewable energy source plants especially. Cheap and reliable energy is the backbone of our economy and the whole nation. It benefits everybody, not just for driving our cars. It takes lots of energy to build and produce stuff, heat/cool your house etc. The USA wouldn't be the rich economic powerhouse it is w/o cheap and reliable energy. We'd be a third world country like India. That's why they are building coal plants like mad now. Energy security is the envy of every third world country.
I have no issues with subsidizing and securing our energy supply and level the playing field for everybody, but I have issues with stacking the market with my tax $ in favor of a few companies and specific products. I'm all in with decarbonizing our energy supply. The products will naturally follow, but I take issue with giving people money to buy specific products.
I have no issues with subsidizing and securing our energy supply and level the playing field for everybody, but I have issues with stacking the market with my tax $ in favor of a few companies and specific products. I'm all in with decarbonizing our energy supply. The products will naturally follow, but I take issue with giving people money to buy specific products.
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Past 03 SL500,03 C240, 07 E350, 07 ML350, 10 ML350,11&14 E350 X2 2017 E300, 2017 C350e & 2000 S500
https://www.plugshare.com/
Once I figured out where all the free chargers were my range anxiety went down considerably. I can get free two hours of charging in front of Target from Chargepoint and Volta has free chargers at the mall. Nobody is handing out free gas... just sayin'!
Once I figured out where all the free chargers were my range anxiety went down considerably. I can get free two hours of charging in front of Target from Chargepoint and Volta has free chargers at the mall. Nobody is handing out free gas... just sayin'!
