nicosusername

and the G wagen isnt? us G wagen owners usually get people telling us our cars are ugly but hey..its not like they can afford it

they are both ugly but having them is a pleasure.

the 05 cayenne turbo comes with 450hp stock but you can buy the option which is the performance package for $20k just for 50hp which I find- and same with the salespeople-a ripoff.

nicosusername

Ummm...we didn't buy it just for that...*sigh* communists (joke joke)

pinoyamg

Pinoyballer, since uv got a g55, what do you think of the new body styles comming out. My wife is totally into driving trucks and I can't convince her otherwise. I think if they come out with a beefier engine setup for the new G I could convince her to drive one and ditch the escalade. The beefier engine of course is for me when I do the honey do's and milk runs for the kids on the weekends

sprins

One is definitely uglier than the other.

Can't argue with that.

nicosusername

I havent seen the new body styles yet ('06 and up) but your wife will enjoy the G55. We switched from a 2001 G500 and the drive is waaaay different. You would think it would be a little more rough since its an AMG model but its actually better and the steering is way more responsive. I can't really say much but whatever you do just dont get an escalade. Too many people have them and i dont find them classy at all and the engine doesnt even compare to the G55 at all. im sure your kids would want their food, etc on time .its actually funny too because whenever we are in either of our suvs, the escalade owners look at us like they are better then us, while at the same time the SUV we are in is way better. SUVs in our family are range rover,G55,cayenne turbo, and a H1 (but i dont think H1s count as SUVs :p )

rguy

The BMW X5 is in no way, shape, or form an SUV. Even BMW acknowledges that it isn't an SUV it is a Sports Activity Vehicle to them. They never designed it as an SUV, but rather as a Sports Utility Car (SUC). Anyone who swallows that BS is full of it by now. That U is quite questionable save for cargo room though. You want to talk about something that will get stuck off road? The X series in general is rotten in the muck. The cayenne is as competent as a Range Rover, the Gwagen is as competent as a range rover with lockers, and they cayenne form becomes very lovable when you figure out how quiet it is inside and how aerodynamic it seems to be. The whole function before form thing is definitely working on the Cayenne. For looks, I don't think you can beat the Gwagen, but I think the throttle tip in and weighty feeling of the vehicle are horrid. The off road ability of the car is great, but the tires the car comes with would mean off road ability similar to that of a BMW X5 with all-terrain tires. So the point of off-roading the G is fairly moot if you are on Z or even H rated rubber.

nicosusername

^^agree...both the cayenne and X5 are SAVs

jimmyg

Not true, the stock tires on the G500 and the G55 can be used off-road without much hassle. They might not be as durable as true off-road tires, but they seem to handle various terrains pretty well:

E55 RUSS

No Rubicon (crap) or any other American (except H1) or other stock 4x4's keep up with G-wagen off road...But Defender will definately give a run for it's money...

With stock tyres G is still very capaible...55 engine is too powerfull for dirt...good in sand...

X5 is best on Road, G best offroad...Cayenne is best compromise good on and offroad...

In Europe stock 2005 Cayenne Turbo makes 500HP + bigger brakes...and upgrade from 450 HP cost around 12k EURO...It dont see any reason to pay that money...Just chip Turbo C and will have 500-510HP...and this would not cost you more then 2k...then of course you can always chip G55K...

Gemballa the Porsche tuner still makes most powerful SUV Cayenne 750HP...and most powerful G-wagon is G V12 610 HP by Brabus and Kleemann has 600HP version of G55K...

I doubt that many of you G55 owners take their Monsters for real offroad...I would't...for offroad I take Defender...H1 is too big for woods...

rguy

The H1 accels at tackling unbelievably challenging fairly open spaces. It is undoubtedly the toughest stock off-roading vehicle, provided there is a roughly 8.5 ft width of open space. The hummer is roughly 8.5 ft wide mirror to mirror.

Jimmy G, I would like to see you tackle ice and snow with z-rated rubber. Sand with proper air pressure in the tires is not that difficult of a surface, especially with the G's horrid throttle tip in it is nearly impossible to mire yourself in the sand with too much torque. Take a Jeep Wrangler with lightning quick throttle tip-in and you get stuck in the sand every time, I don't care what tires you have. I also think you might have more than a bit of trouble with steep ledges, mud, and anything else that requires gripping a slippery surface. The Z-rated rubber has little difficulty moving when the car is flat, but when you are trying to climb stairs or a steep colorado mountain, the z-rated rubber isn't going to cut it.

I applaud that you are testing the limits of your rubber, but I was speaking in terms of maximum capability and stand behind what I said.

silversurfer

Wrong...

http://www.sportec.ch/index.htm

E55 RUSS

hehe...NOPE you are Wrong!!!

Sportec Cayenne has only 700HP... and Gemballa most powerfull Cayenne has 750HP!!!

http://www.gemballa.de/indexe_bak.html




Sportec has officially made a world record with their 700 HP Cayenne, if I remeber right it's 1st SUV passed 300km mark and runned around 308 TOP Speed...OK...

Gemballa quotes that thier Cayenne runs TOP 318km...but it does not matter anyways...

silversurfer

if Gemballa tries to prove it like Sportec did.

I have spent some time around and ridden in a Gemballa Biturbo Cayenne (just before it lost it's second transmission). It's a beautiful truck, but they couldn't get the power to the wheels without breaking transmissions left and right.

So for now, I'll give you the most powerful SUV on paper but not on the road.

Speaking for myself, I'd rather have a 700hp truck that could be driven than a 750hp truck that spent it's whole life getting repaired.

E55 RUSS

Yeah I've heard about transmisson failure on 700Hp Gemball Cayenne on Gumball...Since then Gemballa introduced their special transmission which can handle 1200 torgues...

Sportec is good company and if not talking about reliability, every car can brake down and I've seen blown 5.8 Brabus motors on G-class...

Still on paper or NOT Gemballa 750HP Cayenne is most Powerfull SUV...

Mr.PS

Wrong a stock Jeep Rubicon or Grand Cherokee WJ 99-04 would easily get through tougher terrain then the G55, the g55 has solid axles just like the other two, with its tires, body kit and rest of the stuff it wouldnt get very far. The G500 is about equal to those, but still a slightly modifyed rubicon or GC off-road, a G series won't have a chance.

BTW, if you have those pictures in high res, the g55 off-road pictures can I get them ferrarislave@exotixboard.com is my email, thanks. That desert looks incredible.

silversurfer

Why wouldn't you talk about reliability I could put a turbine engine on a Cayenne and try to get to the stated 318km/h right before the car blows up. But, short of holding the record, what's the point?

Call me biased (it sounds like you are too) - I have a 500hp Sportec Audi that has been trouble free for a long time. Although Gemballa makes beautiful widebody Porsches, I think I'd have to go with the tuner that actually accomplishes their stated numbers rather than just stating them.

Regardless, the Gemballa conversion on the Cayenne was around $200k on top of the price of the car...I don't know how much the Sportec Cayenne would cost... but, for over $300k, I could think of a lot of better things to spend my money on.

p.s. my Brabus 5.8 G has been trouble free from day one (even with the addition of a Kleemann supercharger).

sprins

That all depends on how you modify your G:

Mr.PS

I forgot to mention that, there are alot of modified G's but not very many new G's 2000-2005. The g is no doubt a serious off-road but stock compared to others its mostly equal if not at a disadvantage because of its body and other moldings that would get waisted off-road. Im talking true off-road mud, rocks, the real deal not just sand.

sprins

Perhaps in the states, but here in Europe the G is still sold in a variety of outfits (stock): short/long, gas/diesel, etc. Not just the fancy & fashionable version.

jimmyg

Here are some pics of the three completely stock G-wagens I have owned being used off-road. First picture is of my 1991 300GE (Brabus 3.6) in the desert outside Dubai. The next four are of my stock 2002 G500 in Death Valley somewhere on the border between California and Nevada.

jimmyg

More pics.

jimmyg

Last few...hope these get the point accross about the capability of the stock G-wagen. Other than the Land Rover LR3 or new Range Rover, there is no other stock SUV as capable. Don't knock it till you try it.

rguy

I don't think anyone is knocking the Gwagen's capability. There are just other things out there that are as capable. The terrain pictures you have shown, while cool, are not very difficult. To truly test the capabilities of a Gwagen with sport rubber you would need to do something more challenging. I think that it is awesome that you actually use your Gwagen, which makes you an infinitely better person in my book. I know that if I had decided to get one, as I was about two milliseconds from doing, I would be using it too. I still think you are rubber limited and dirt and sand really aren't all that bad as long as the throttle response is terribly slow, which yours is. I hope this clears up that nobody needs you to prove anything, we are just talking about cars here, not people and not their egos. So don't feel as if though we are attacking your choice of ride. We obviously post here, so we obviously support your choice of ride. I hope this helps, and I do think you drastically, drastically underestimate the off-roading capabilities of a stock cayenne turbo...or any v8 cayenne for that matter. But, that doesn't make you a bad person, it just makes you have a different opinion that most likely isn't backed up by personal witness or experience. I have never seen a Cayenne fail at something the Gwagen does. I do think that the Gwagen is more capable upon ultimate modification, and perhaps slightly more capable than the cayenne, but the difference very suprisingly isn't too much.

jimmyg

Oh, I missed that part of the discussion. I thought the comparison was with the various Jeep products with the "Rubicon" label which really aren't that impressive in real life. The Cayenne is a very capable off road vehicle and only has one major drawback which is durability. I live in a place where there are more Cayennes than taxis, and I have a few friends who take them off road. The biggest complaint is that when they are working they are a lot of fun...but they break easily. Many owners are gun-shy because damage from off-road use is not being covered by the warranty.

I'm not saying my G-wagen doesn't have problems (electrical and other minor problems are frequent), but it's built like a tank. It can take the abuse of being used off road by an amateur and in most cases just keep going. There is a lot of respect in this part of the world for Porsche's 4x4 experience as many desert rallys were won by 911's over the years...but the kings of the desert are the Land Cruiser, the Nissan Patrol, and the Wrangler. None of these are great in rocky terrain and there the RR, LR3 and G-Wagen are tops.

The new ML looks good on paper and will probably give the Cayenne and Toureg a some competition. Surprisingly, the Range Rover Sport is also supposed to be quite a capable off-road vehicle. Improvements in air suspension technology and traction control systems will make many of these newer generation 4x4's as capable as the G-wagen, but none of them are built as tough as the G-wagen or H1. I'm not afraid to take my $100k g-wagen off road, but I would think twice about doing it in a Cayenne Turbo no matter how many features it has.

jimmyg

Just remembered that the April 2005 issue of Top Gear magazine has a cover story on the 2006 Range Rover Sport testing it in the deserts of Dubai. They took along a Cayenne Turbo and an X5 4.6 and they found that the Cayenne was a distant second to the RRS in off-road ability, and that the X5 was a better on-road vehicle than the Cayenne and RRS.